12-20-11 10:18 PM
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  1. reeneebob's Avatar
    Can't say that anything said in the article is wrong, to be honest. It's all so hard to believe but they let it happen


    Sent from my iPhone 4 using Tapatalk
    12-19-11 02:08 PM
  2. loneweasel's Avatar
    Again I agree with your points.

    But will you bet your life savings that RIM's efforts will be useless and they will come up to nought?. If you are that sure, short RIMM for every penny you have and any leverage you can get. You will make a ton of money.

    My point here is simply that you cannot count RIM out till the shutters have been brought down in Waterloo. Till then its wait and watch. Maybe your scenario plays out or maybe it doesn't.
    No, that would be foolish. RIM does have assets. Somebody's going to buy them out for the patents after couple more earnings calls. I'm not shorting them now.

    But I am dead sure that the company is finished. The BB10 delay was the last nail in the coffin.
    12-19-11 02:12 PM
  3. Economist101's Avatar
    The point I'm trying to make here is that a leader eventually stops innovating because they are afraid to rock the boat. In a way its good that Apple was nearly dead, and wasnkt afraid to explore areas which MS considered beneath them. Today MS is trying to claw back in a shifting computing market where they have little presence. Will MS bring out the next Magical product in Win 8? Who knows.Are they trying ...yes. And that try is simply because Apple and Android forced them to. Otherwise we would still be struggling with Vista.
    That's all true. But if Apple were a company prone to this classic trap, we wouldn't have the iPhone or iPad. Even Microsoft, with some huge failures, keeps pushing. Vista was in many ways a disaster, and not what you'd expect 6 years after XP, but then MS quickly turned around and delivered W7. As a general rule, all products are eventually replaced; RIM's biggest struggle thus far has been making sure that it replaces its products with more of its products. Where might RIM be right now if it's QNX phones had been released in summer 2009, when Verizon and other telcos were looking for an iPhone fighter? It might be a different game entirely.
    12-19-11 02:15 PM
  4. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    You don't know what you're talking about RIM has the playbook and bbm. People in Zaire love their blackberrys.
    One market isn't enough to survive especially when that market is a very small percentage of the pie.
    12-19-11 02:26 PM
  5. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    That's all true. But if Apple were a company prone to this classic trap, we wouldn't have the iPhone or iPad. Even Microsoft, with some huge failures, keeps pushing. Vista was in many ways a disaster, and not what you'd expect 6 years after XP, but then MS quickly turned around and delivered W7. As a general rule, all products are eventually replaced; RIM's biggest struggle thus far has been making sure that it replaces its products with more of its products. Where might RIM be right now if it's QNX phones had been released in summer 2009, when Verizon and other telcos were looking for an iPhone fighter? It might be a different game entirely.
    How many people worked for Apple in 2006-2007? How many were specifically assigned to develop the iPhone?

    I wonder if RIM just does not have enough resources and personnel working on QNX/BB10 development.

    I would suspect that RIM is definitely small potatoes in size, compared to Apple and Microsoft.
    12-19-11 02:27 PM
  6. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    And it has a bridge to connect you to your bb.
    erhh i think he would know that bbloverboy
    I'm a she first of all and secondly, what does bridging have to do with this? Bridging is nice if you have something to bridge to like a PlayBook.
    12-19-11 02:30 PM
  7. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    There is no place for women in the smartphone world.
    Excuse me. I'll put on my apron and gingham dress and heels and get back to the kitchen. What kind of sandwich do you want?

    oh i am sorry pardon me coldsunshine! nah i was also dazzled by his answer.
    didn't know where he was pointing to, since this isn't a topic about briding.
    so you can pretty tell i'm also a bit
    You and me both. Apparently, someone forgot their brain juice this morning.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    12-19-11 02:38 PM
  8. 1magine's Avatar
    Not really. BestBuy closed down in China and was a laughing stock there.

    Same goes for Walmart.

    Countries are different with different cultures. No one follows the so called "first World".

    What works in USA doesn't necessarily work elsewhere. AT&T is not even a player in India. Amongst the top fifteen global GSM carriers American carriers are not there. The most in the top ten are Indian and Chinese carriers. How long before AT&T and verizon are taken over? They have a stagnant user base of only 360 million and no hopes of growing. Their policies make them uncompetitive in the so call third world.

    And for your information, iPhone only has a 2% share of the Indian smartphone market. The 4s is doing abysmal business here. Following North America you say??
    Big box chains, have nothing to do with this. Their products are cheap b/c they come from the slave labor in the east. Those who suffer the ravages of decreased salaries as a result don't really see the savings in shopping there, as oppossed to shopping for knock offs and pirated materials. The afate of walmart is not nearly tied to the fate of mobile OS or any tech sewctor for that matter.
    12-19-11 02:39 PM
  9. E92Vancouver's Avatar
    Pretty sad. I am a die hard blackberry user. I have RIM stock because I was a believer. I have taken a bath on this investment. I should have known when I started buying Android phones 2 years ago. I had the HTC Dream, the Nexus One, the Nexus S and now the Galaxy Nexus.

    The features such as wifi hotspot, a front facing camera and apps such as Skype, Netflix, Teamviewer, FTP software etc., make this a wonderful device.

    If RIM comes out with a killer QNX device, I will buy it for sure. But for now, I am enjoying Android. I still have my 9810 but may sell it. I bet I could only get $150 for it.

    My friend is trying to sell his 9810 on Craigslist and like the stock, there appears to be no market for it.

    I have owned Blackberries since 2003 and if they can alienate their most loyal customers, they don't have a chance. Wifi Hotspot, a front facing camera and Skype would have kept me.
    12-19-11 02:42 PM
  10. sam_b77's Avatar
    That's all true. But if Apple were a company prone to this classic trap, we wouldn't have the iPhone or iPad. Even Microsoft, with some huge failures, keeps pushing. Vista was in many ways a disaster, and not what you'd expect 6 years after XP, but then MS quickly turned around and delivered W7. As a general rule, all products are eventually replaced; RIM's biggest struggle thus far has been making sure that it replaces its products with more of its products. Where might RIM be right now if it's QNX phones had been released in summer 2009, when Verizon and other telcos were looking for an iPhone fighter? It might be a different game entirely.
    I was thinking the same thing. Where indeed would RIM be if QNX was there in 2009.
    They slept at the wheel. No doubt about that. They came late to the party and forgot to bring a dessert at that.

    I tool feel that pushing the date for BB10 phones to late 2012 has and will hurt them pretty bad. Somehow the LTE chip issue sounds flimsy at best.

    Some would argue that its better to delay than launch a something that's not 100% ready. But they should have been 100% ready in 2010.

    The problem now is that the fight is for apps and app developers and not just the OS/UI anymore. The BB10 OS is very intuitive and well thought out, but without apps its nothing.

    With a horizon of late 2012, RIM is trying to attract developers with a promise of future earnings.

    I think this will even hit the development of apps for PB. The developers who were developing for PB in the hopes of selling to BB10 phones in March, would now jump to Android and iOS and make their money today.
    Not a good outlook for sure.
    12-19-11 02:44 PM
  11. sleepngbear's Avatar
    Excuse me. I'll put on my apron and gingham dress and heels and get back to the kitchen. What kind of sandwich do you want?
    They make you wear shoes?????!
    12-19-11 02:56 PM
  12. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    They make you wear shoes?????!
    Only when I'm not pregnant.
    moiselles likes this.
    12-19-11 02:59 PM
  13. sleepngbear's Avatar
    Well, there is 12/22/2012....
    I'll be sure to reserve the limo with plenty of time (and ice) for us to parlay the better part of a large bottle of Southern Comfort before the fireworks begin.
    12-19-11 03:03 PM
  14. omniusovermind's Avatar
    I disagree. If they were flavor of the month, they'd already have come and gone. iPhone is the #1 selling phone right now, closely followed by Android devices for all 3 major carriers (ATT, Sprint and Verizon).
    .
    quote your source please. Here's the numbers from Gartner Inc which gets used by pretty much every tech news website around:

    Worldwide Mobile Device Sales to End Users by Vendor in 3Q11 (Thousands of Units)

    Apple q3 2011 units: 17,295.3 and market share 3.9%
    Nokia 105,353.5 units and 23.9% market share.

    sammy and LG were also ahead of Apple, while Sony, Motorola and HTC were near the bottom. RIM was settled pretty comfortably in the middle, just slightly behind Apple as a matter of fact. None of those companies seem to be in distress.
    12-19-11 03:06 PM
  15. loneweasel's Avatar
    quote your source please. Here's the numbers from Gartner Inc which gets used by pretty much every tech news website around:

    Worldwide Mobile Device Sales to End Users by Vendor in 3Q11 (Thousands of Units)

    Apple q3 2011 units: 17,295.3 and market share 3.9%
    Nokia 105,353.5 units and 23.9% market share.

    sammy and LG were also ahead of Apple, while Sony, Motorola and HTC were near the bottom. RIM was settled pretty comfortably in the middle, just slightly behind Apple as a matter of fact. None of those companies seem to be in distress.
    "Mobile Device Sales" doesn't mean smartphones.
    12-19-11 03:09 PM
  16. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    quote your source please. Here's the numbers from Gartner Inc which gets used by pretty much every tech news website around:

    Worldwide Mobile Device Sales to End Users by Vendor in 3Q11 (Thousands of Units)

    Apple q3 2011 units: 17,295.3 and market share 3.9%
    Nokia 105,353.5 units and 23.9% market share.

    sammy and LG were also ahead of Apple, while Sony, Motorola and HTC were near the bottom. RIM was settled pretty comfortably in the middle, just slightly behind Apple as a matter of fact. None of those companies seem to be in distress.
    I said nothing about WORLD sales. I said the top 3 USA WSPs. Verizon, AT&T and Sprint.

    There's this or....

    If you prefer graphics:



    The ONLY reason iPhone isn't #1 with TMo is because TMo doesn't carry iPhones yet.
    Last edited by ColdSunshine; 12-19-11 at 03:18 PM.
    12-19-11 03:15 PM
  17. omniusovermind's Avatar
    "Mobile Device Sales" doesn't mean smartphones.
    I am aware of and ready for that rebuttal. My main point here was to argue the health of the actual company itself, not one of their particular product lines. Most of hyped up fear mongering claims I'm seeing on these forums deal with RIM "going down" and that's clearly not the case. They have enough of a foothold in the mobile technology market to afford some burps and stutters in the smartphone and tablet sector.
    12-19-11 03:16 PM
  18. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    They have enough of a foothold in the mobile technology market to afford some burps and stutters in the smartphone and tablet sector.
    They must still be burping up one **** of a meal right now then.
    12-19-11 03:20 PM
  19. omniusovermind's Avatar
    @ColdSunshine:

    well thank you for taking the time to find that, but are those worldwide sales? Also, those are only figures from 4 USA based carriers and not total worldwide sales by device (rather than by carrier)

    But insofar as you did actually only claim ATT, Verizon etc as the source for your claim in your prior post, I concede that you are correct in your figures in that regard

    PS: I can't link graphics for another few posts
    12-19-11 03:20 PM
  20. loneweasel's Avatar
    I am aware of and ready for that rebuttal. My main point here was to argue the health of the actual company itself, not one of their particular product lines. Most of hyped up fear mongering claims I'm seeing on these forums deal with RIM "going down" and that's clearly not the case. They have enough of a foothold in the mobile technology market to afford some burps and stutters in the smartphone and tablet sector.
    No they don't.

    They are not going to sell enough Curves in Indonesia to make up for their total collapse in the US.
    moiselles likes this.
    12-19-11 03:21 PM
  21. omniusovermind's Avatar
    They must still be burping up one **** of a meal right now then.
    c'mon. do you seriously buy into those DOOM for RIM posts knowing where they sit in the overall market? really...
    12-19-11 03:22 PM
  22. omniusovermind's Avatar
    No they don't.

    They are not going to sell enough Curves in Indonesia to make up for their total collapse in the US.
    "total collapse"? oh my...

    lol. sorry.
    12-19-11 03:23 PM
  23. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    @ColdSunshine:

    well thank you for taking the time to find that, but are those worldwide sales? Also, those are only figures from 4 USA based carriers and not total worldwide sales by device (rather than by carrier)

    But insofar as you did actually only claim ATT, Verizon etc as the source for your claim in your prior post, I concede that you are correct in your figures in that regard

    PS: I can't link graphics for another few posts
    You're welcome. It's widely known and stated that iPhone is the #1 selling device on all 3 major carriers. That's my point. Verizon, AT&T and Sprint are USA based only. I'm sure that combined, Apple isn't the #1 and neither is RIM.

    c'mon. do you seriously buy into those DOOM for RIM posts knowing where they sit in the overall market? really...
    If they don't get with the program, there's a definite possiblity that they can become the next Palm.
    12-19-11 03:23 PM
  24. qbnkelt's Avatar
    I'll be sure to reserve the limo with plenty of time (and ice) for us to parlay the better part of a large bottle of Southern Comfort before the fireworks begin.
    BABY!!!!!!!!!!!! With Southern Comfort I wouldn't want to parlay!!!!!

    Oooo, lest we get into trouble, we must say something Blackberry....

    let me see...

    PING ME BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    12-19-11 03:27 PM
  25. nyplaya610's Avatar
    I dont know how "dumb and dumber" (co-CEO's) are still CEO's. I just dont get it. But lets hope for the best, they got the wake up call now lets hope they work to achieve success again in the mobile industry
    12-19-11 03:43 PM
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