10-06-16 02:25 PM
66 123
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  1. Jonathank's Avatar
    Believe me I tried to explain it myself and in the end had my own self questioning why myself will continue to use BlackBerry.

    I started off saying BlackBerry is both a Software and a Hardware company and they are now going to out source the Hardware BlackBerry handsets to other manufacturers but
    BlackBerry will continue their support for their software (really?)

    Then I was told Ok so they give up making the device while apps give up support for the very software they r saying the company is pushing towards?....if Whatsapp and Facebook are discontinuing support for their software and blackberry is discontinuing their support for their hardware then where does that leave us? With an Android device made by BlackBerry but not really made nor design by BlackBerry? Am I missing something
    So in the End if another company is going to design and make the handset and we will probably never see another BlackBerry 10 phone made by BlackBerry then why stay? They have officially given up on this market. Now it's all about this GoodDynamics and all these company's deciding to use the BlackBerry software which I don't have a clue what it's about basically because it's company base driven and has nothing to do with the average user such as myself, it's good for the company but bad for the few that are still loyal normal consumers

    BlackBerry has completely given up on the regular customer
    What about the average Joe who uses BlackBerry because he or she feel safer with their personal information on a BlackBerry ?

    I will use my Passport until it no longer charges. After that I think I'll try the DTEK60 then that will probably be my last BlackBerry. Unless others have a better understanding and can better explain the situation that is going on over at BlackBerry
    ??

    Posted via CB10
    09-29-16 09:22 PM
  2. Ecm's Avatar
    (As this isn't really a standard "Ask a Question" type thread, it's been moved to the general discussion forum.)
    cribble2k likes this.
    09-29-16 10:06 PM
  3. donnation's Avatar
    You shouldn't feel safer with a non BES BB10 phone over another phone. You're just kidding yourself.
    shaleem, chain13, LazyEvul and 1 others like this.
    09-29-16 10:25 PM
  4. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Unless others have a better understanding and can better explain the situation that is going on over at BlackBerry
    ??
    I'm going to try to make this quick.

    Phase 1 - BB was a total solution provider - they designed the hardware (manufacturing was 95% outsourced, always) and they designed the software, they did the R&D, they purchased the components, they paid their contract manufacturers to build the phones, and they paid for distributing and marketing. And, to the extent that it existed, they were responsible for their ecosystem. This included the BBOS and much of the BB10 era.

    Phase 2 - Beginning with the Z3, then the Leap, BB tried outsourcing the design, along with the manufacturing, of their phones to other companies. There was still some overlap with Phase 1, where some of their phones were still designed in-house (Classic, PP, and Priv), and Phase 2 continued into the Android era with outsourced DTEK50 and soon DTEK60 phones. BB still paid for the phones up-front, distributed and marketed them themselves, and provided hardware support for them.

    Phase 3 - As of the end of the current fiscal year (which is Feb 2017 on the calendar), BB is no longer going to doing either Phase 1 or Phase 2. BB isn't going to design phones, they aren't going to pay to have phones manufactured, they aren't going to be involved in phone distribution, and they won't be providing hardware support. Instead, BB is going to make available for licensing their brand name, their custom builds of Android, their Android apps (Hub+, DTEK, etc.), their "enhanced security" software, and the patents for their PKB. OEMs can then go to BB and license some or all of these things (they can license the brand and the Android build without licensing the BB apps, PKB, or extra security, if they choose), and they can choose whether to pay for a global license or a regional license. A regional license gives them rights to use the licensed items only in a specified region.

    For example, Chen announced that they have a licensee: there is an Indonesian joint venture (a couple of Indonesian companies working together) who are going to license the BB brand and Android build (but not the security or PKB, in this instance - no info about the apps) and they're going to build affordable "BB" phones for the Indonesian market. BB will have NO involvement in the design, financing, distribution, or support of these phones, beyond providing software support for their Android build and (optionally) their Android apps. This JV is only licensed for Indonesia, and thus will only be selling these phones in that market. BB has reserved the right to buy and distribute phones from this JV if they choose, but Chen has already stated that it's highly unlikely that they'll do this, because they intend to be completely out of that business as of the end of the fiscal year.

    Chen also stated that they are "talking with" a Chinese company about licensing, but that's the only other info we have as far as licensees go.

    It should not be assumed that TCL will choose to be a BB licensee - just because they built phones for BB when BB handed them a stack of cash does not mean that TCL has an interest in licensing the BB name (which costs money) and other components (which costs more money) and having to be responsible for all aspects of support and distributing. TCLs current deals has no downside - they're selling devices to BB for cash - but licensing has big financial risks.

    Really, any potential licensee will have to believe that they can market BB phones in a given region at a premium price or licensing won't make sense - because licensing COSTS money, and they could use stock Android and their own brand name without paying any license fee. In other words, if we DO see other regions making BB phones, they'll be regions where the BB name still has value to the general population.

    Thus, I personally believe that it's unlikely that we'll see a global licensee with global distribution - but, hey, you never know what might happen.

    Anyway, for the time being, it's still the current fiscal year until February, so BB is going to continue selling the phones they've currently made - which includes the DTEK60, as it's in production currently - but Chen has stated that he hasn't decided if he's going to produce the Mercury/Rome device or not. The design is mostly finished, but parts haven't been purchased and manufacturing time hasn't been scheduled. As it stands now, it could go either way. But what is virtually certain is that either the DTEK60 or the Mercury will be the last real BB phone ever produced. It's certainly the last one that BB is going to be financially responsible for. Chen made that quite clear.
    JeepBB, Uzi, zocster and 16 others like this.
    09-29-16 11:21 PM
  5. BB Adict's Avatar
    TLTR

    Dude, you said you would be quick.

    Posted via CB10
    Griffin2012 and anon(2313227) like this.
    09-29-16 11:36 PM
  6. jason9900's Avatar
    You don't work for BlackBerry, nor is BlackBerry paying you. It is there job to let the market know what their forward looking strategy is - not a loyal user such as yourself.

    Posted via CB10
    09-29-16 11:43 PM
  7. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    TLTR

    Dude, you said you would be quick.
    I did my best. I could have easily written 10 times that amount, added links and quotes, etc. But I tried to convey all of the relevant info - including answering the 10 most likely follow-up questions - without putting in too many details or too much history...
    09-30-16 12:59 AM
  8. AmritD's Avatar
    I'm going to try to make this quick.

    Phase 1 - BB was a total solution provider - they designed the hardware (manufacturing was 95% outsourced, always) and they designed the software, they did the R&D, they purchased the components, they paid their contract manufacturers to build the phones, and they paid for distributing and marketing. And, to the extent that it existed, they were responsible for their ecosystem. This included the BBOS and much of the BB10 era.

    Phase 2 - Beginning with the Z3, then the Leap, BB tried outsourcing the design, along with the manufacturing, of their phones to other companies. There was still some overlap with Phase 1, where some of their phones were still designed in-house (Classic, PP, and Priv), and Phase 2 continued into the Android era with outsourced DTEK50 and soon DTEK60 phones. BB still paid for the phones up-front, distributed and marketed them themselves, and provided hardware support for them.

    Phase 3 - As of the end of the current fiscal year (which is Feb 2017 on the calendar), BB is no longer going to doing either Phase 1 or Phase 2. BB isn't going to design phones, they aren't going to pay to have phones manufactured, they aren't going to be involved in phone distribution, and they won't be providing hardware support. Instead, BB is going to make available for licensing their brand name, their custom builds of Android, their Android apps (Hub+, DTEK, etc.), their "enhanced security" software, and the patents for their PKB. OEMs can then go to BB and license some or all of these things (they can license the brand and the Android build without licensing the BB apps, PKB, or extra security, if they choose), and they can choose whether to pay for a global license or a regional license. A regional license gives them rights to use the licensed items only in a specified region.

    For example, Chen announced that they have a licensee: there is an Indonesian joint venture (a couple of Indonesian companies working together) who are going to license the BB brand and Android build (but not the security or PKB, in this instance - no info about the apps) and they're going to build affordable "BB" phones for the Indonesian market. BB will have NO involvement in the design, financing, distribution, or support of these phones, beyond providing software support for their Android build and (optionally) their Android apps. This JV is only licensed for Indonesia, and thus will only be selling these phones in that market. BB has reserved the right to buy and distribute phones from this JV if they choose, but Chen has already stated that it's highly unlikely that they'll do this, because they intend to be completely out of that business as of the end of the fiscal year.

    Chen also stated that they are "talking with" a Chinese company about licensing, but that's the only other info we have as far as licensees go.

    It should not be assumed that TCL will choose to be a BB licensee - just because they built phones for BB when BB handed them a stack of cash does not mean that TCL has an interest in licensing the BB name (which costs money) and other components (which costs more money) and having to be responsible for all aspects of support and distributing. TCLs current deals has no downside - they're selling devices to BB for cash - but licensing has big financial risks.

    Really, any potential licensee will have to believe that they can market BB phones in a given region at a premium price or licensing won't make sense - because licensing COSTS money, and they could use stock Android and their own brand name without paying any license fee. In other words, if we DO see other regions making BB phones, they'll be regions where the BB name still has value to the general population.

    Thus, I personally believe that it's unlikely that we'll see a global licensee with global distribution - but, hey, you never know what might happen.

    Anyway, for the time being, it's still the current fiscal year until February, so BB is going to continue selling the phones they've currently made - which includes the DTEK60, as it's in production currently - but Chen has stated that he hasn't decided if he's going to produce the Mercury/Rome device or not. The design is mostly finished, but parts haven't been purchased and manufacturing time hasn't been scheduled. As it stands now, it could go either way. But what is virtually certain is that either the DTEK60 or the Mercury will be the last real BB phone ever produced. It's certainly the last one that BB is going to be financially responsible for. Chen made that quite clear.
    So the phones that will be built in Indonesia, won't have all the security features present in the Priv or DTEKs? (Hardware root of trust, injection of pin into processors)

    Z30STA100-2/10.3.2.2876
    09-30-16 02:11 AM
  9. JeepBB's Avatar
    So the phones that will be built in Indonesia, won't have all the security features present in the Priv or DTEKs? (Hardware root of trust, injection of pin into processors)

    Z30STA100-2/10.3.2.2876
    From what Chen said, and reports here of the low cost handsets that this Indonesian venture expects to make, "no".

    The security stuff won't be included. The licensee doesn't appear to want it.
    09-30-16 02:26 AM
  10. thurask's Avatar
    I'm wondering if licensing BlackBerry-flavored Android also allows for porting it to new platforms. So far all that BB has ever done with Android are four Qualcomm chipsets (MSM8952/8974/8992/8996), but moving it to some bottom of the barrel chipset (Mediatek, for one) should help position these new "BlackBerry" phones even further down the totem pole.
    09-30-16 02:47 AM
  11. khlover520's Avatar
    Here's a nice article to help you move on and realize the truth: https://www.wired.com/2016/09/blackb...hones/#slide-1

    Posted via CB10
    09-30-16 03:36 AM
  12. cgk's Avatar
    From what Chen said, and reports here of the low cost handsets that this Indonesian venture expects to make, "no".

    The security stuff won't be included. The licensee doesn't appear to want it.
    I think what the licensee is getting is access to whatever custom software generates their own keys (keys that generated to some methods that is unclear to security experts) because the other stuff is built into the hardware anyway and you could do the same with standard key generation methods.
    09-30-16 04:41 AM
  13. cgk's Avatar
    I'm wondering if licensing BlackBerry-flavored Android also allows for porting it to new platforms. So far all that BB has ever done with Android are four Qualcomm chipsets (MSM8952/8974/8992/8996), but moving it to some bottom of the barrel chipset (Mediatek, for one) should help position these new "BlackBerry" phones even further down the totem pole.
    Excellent point - especially if there is a Chinese licensee - I could see a Doogee Blackberry Securophone* using a mediatek.




    * Small print: Doogee does not guarantee this phone is secure as we didn't pay for that bit of the blackberry license.
    09-30-16 05:14 AM
  14. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    TLTR

    Dude, you said you would be quick.

    Posted via CB10
    Troy type of quick...

    It's OK! It's an effort...! :-D

      "Chenterprise. We are the future. Resistance is futile. Prepare to BBe... "  
    09-30-16 05:27 AM
  15. Griffin2012's Avatar
    Your response is well written and cogent.
    RobertP1 likes this.
    09-30-16 05:39 AM
  16. anon(3641385)'s Avatar
    Troy type of quick...

    It's OK! It's an effort...! :-D

      "Chenterprise. We are the future. Resistance is futile. Prepare to BBe... "  
    Oh Prem you're such a kidder .....

    (and yes, we've met before!)

    --Classic, 9700, Playbook, flip - posted using crackberry app --
    09-30-16 06:42 AM
  17. Skatophilia's Avatar
    I was really hoping for a white Priv.. so I guess that's not coming! Haha. Most of the people I talk to when I show them my passport are like "wasn't blackberry gone years ago?". It's annoying but I mean if you aren't into something, do you keep track of it? Nope

    Posted via CB10
    09-30-16 07:47 AM
  18. MikeX74's Avatar
    It's not your job to silence critics. It's BlackBerry's.
    09-30-16 01:05 PM
  19. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    The best known method for silencing the evil voices is to enter the fanboy echo chamber and repeat your favorite rhetoric over and over.
    09-30-16 01:28 PM
  20. early2bed's Avatar
    What about the average Joe who uses BlackBerry because he or she feel safer with their personal information on a BlackBerry ?
    Joe is going to have to find a different flavor of Kool-Aid to drink.
    09-30-16 01:36 PM
  21. blackmass's Avatar
    They wud b silenced once blackberry is acquired by some Asian company.
    09-30-16 02:00 PM
  22. Orange UK's Avatar
    A. Get a competent CEO who does not try to change the company to fit their previous employment experience/s but evolves BB as it was, a mobile manufacturer.


    Oppps we may have gone past that turn on a one way dead end road, bloody sat nav!
    FF22 likes this.
    09-30-16 02:27 PM
  23. conite's Avatar
    Get a competent CEO who does not try to change the company to fit their previous employment experience
    He was hired specifically by the BlackBerry board to do just that.
    eshropshire and Carjackd like this.
    09-30-16 02:56 PM
  24. Orange UK's Avatar
    He was hired specifically by the BlackBerry board to do just that.
    Hardly, because BBAndy would never have got past a interns laughable suggestion of such tie up. The lies BB keep throwing out there have been more damaging than the software or hardware, but 3 outta 3 compounds its whole public perception issue, and therefor sales.

    BB has become a government in itself, it will spin anything out there to get people to believe to come to them, but it will always fail to deliver because it was never interested in delivery in the first place, only itself.
    09-30-16 03:03 PM
  25. thurask's Avatar
    A. Get a competent CEO who does not try to change the company to fit their previous employment experience/s but evolves BB as it was, a mobile manufacturer.


    Oppps we may have gone past that turn on a one way dead end road, bloody sat nav!
    With the hand dealt by years of Mike/Jim/Thorsten, and without a time machine, what other path would the hemorrhaging-billions BlackBerry of November 2013 have other than retreat or bankruptcy?
    StephanieMaks and Carjackd like this.
    09-30-16 03:21 PM
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