[Thud Hardsmack]

From where I'm sitting the reason the KEY* series, and BlackBerry Android in general, didn't make a hit with the public can't just be laid at the feet of packing a keyboard and having a smaller screen. Consumers naturally don't like sacrifices, so there needed to be something tangible they could see that would make giving up anything they see as a want/added benefit worthwhile. BlackBerry and/or TCL never provided this in any shape or form whatsoever. It could be argued that the DTEK software is a plus, which it is, but the rest of the software package was extremely lacking. All devices sported improved battery life, and some have a keyboard. But going up against everyone else nowadays, they're either lacking or just as good. The KEYs have the only plus with the keyboard, but too many minuses to make people that don't want a keyboard to even try it. Priced too high, middling camera, decent battery (now), and a software experience that's basically sugarless vanilla - quite a few things removed, enough to the point where I have issues troubleshooting without having the thing in front of me. That's not going to win people over when everyone else is packing more features for a better price. BlackBerry and TCL tried to go too middle of the road, and now they're having trouble getting in a lane.

[idssteve]

I'm still having trouble adjusting to Steve sans 9900 lol

Haha... as are clients & co-workers... Lol. One client called to be sure it was really me and that I'm ok. Lol.

[Chuck Finley69]

Product End of Sales and Development End of Life
BlackBerry 10.3.X August 2018 December 2019
Android 5.X & 6.X - Priv October 2017 December 2019
Android 6.X - DTEK50 June 2018 TBA
Android 6.X - DTEK60 August 2018 TBA
BlackBerry 10 OS versions 10.0, 10.1 and 10.2.X Dec 2014 April 2018
BlackBerry 7 OS versions 7.0 and 7.1 Jul 2014 April 2018
BlackBerry 6 OS Dec 2013 April 2018
BlackBerry Device Software 5
Sept 2013 April 2018
BlackBerry PlayBook OS 1.0.X Dec 2013 April 2018
BlackBerry Smart Card Reader version 2.X Jun 2013 April 2018
BlackBerry PlayBook OS 2.0.x and 2.1.X Apr 2014 April 2018
TBA - To Be Announced; no dates have been announced to date.


END OF DEVELOPMENT

The date as of which BlackBerry will no longer provide fixes, updates, or security patches for the specified version of software. Technical Support will attempt to exhaust all options to provide a product resolution, but resolution cannot be guaranteed.


END OF LIFE

The product will no longer be supported by BlackBerry
There will be no new versions of software
No software patches, security fixes or workarounds will be generated to resolve any product issues
BlackBerry Technical Support will no longer accept or troubleshoot issues directly related to the OS or application

———————————————— —————————

The above is copied directly from the BB website.

Importantly, the EOL definition/explanation in writing is what has to be considered BlackBerry’s official position until BlackBerry officially changes.

Regardless of what anyone wants to believe or infer either way, it’s clear that BB doesn’t want any misunderstanding.

Hiya! I'm assuming you're referring to the posted BlackBerry 10 End of Life date of December 2019 here? https://www.blackberry.com/us/en/sup...ort-life-cycle

I'm not sure what has been planned for that time (I'm not in the loop for it, sorry). Feel free to tag me here if something goes awry though, especially before then. Cheers--

[joshualebowitz]

The piano in this ad for TCL's new Twitter account has a physical keyboard -- just like a BlackBerry. https://twitter.com/TCLMobileGlobal/...07987542253569

[the_boon]

ProductEnd of Sales and DevelopmentEnd of Life
BlackBerry 10.3.XAugust 2018December 2019
Android 5.X & 6.X - PrivOctober 2017 December 2019
Android 6.X - DTEK50June 2018TBA
Android 6.X - DTEK60August 2018TBA
BlackBerry 10 OS versions 10.0, 10.1 and 10.2.XDec 2014April 2018
BlackBerry 7 OS versions 7.0 and 7.1Jul 2014April 2018
BlackBerry 6 OSDec 2013April 2018
BlackBerry Device Software 5
Sept 2013April 2018
BlackBerry PlayBook OS 1.0.XDec 2013April 2018
BlackBerry Smart Card Reader version 2.X Jun 2013April 2018
BlackBerry PlayBook OS 2.0.x and 2.1.XApr 2014April 2018
TBA - To Be Announced; no dates have been announced to date.


END OF DEVELOPMENT

The date as of which BlackBerry will no longer provide fixes, updates, or security patches for the specified version of software. Technical Support will attempt to exhaust all options to provide a product resolution, but resolution cannot be guaranteed.


END OF LIFE

The product will no longer be supported by BlackBerry
There will be no new versions of software
No software patches, security fixes or workarounds will be generated to resolve any product issues
BlackBerry Technical Support will no longer accept or troubleshoot issues directly related to the OS or application

———————————————— —————————

The above is copied directly from the BB website.

Importantly, the EOL definition/explanation in writing is what has to be considered BlackBerry’s official position until BlackBerry officially changes.

Regardless of what anyone wants to believe or infer either way, it’s clear that BB doesn’t want any misunderstanding.

So... even THEIR spacebar is quirky?

[Chuck Finley69]

So... even THEIR spacebar is quirky?

LMAO, I’d like to blame their spacebar however it’s my laziness at copy/paste from the website and not adjusting......

[Bbnivende]

Haha... as are clients & co-workers... Lol. One client called to be sure it was really me and that I'm ok. Lol.

I think the following idea for a phone format originated with Steve - a couple of years ago.

Imagine a ordinary all touch phone and a keyboard similar to the PRIV.

The Keyboard when unused would hinge behind the phone flush with back using an indent.

In use, the keyboard would flip up and over covering the virtual keyboard portion of the screen.

I think the ergonomics would be better than both a slider and Key 2 device.

Obviously not going to happen.

[idssteve]

I think the following idea for a phone format originated with Steve - a couple of years ago.

Imagine a ordinary all touch phone and a keyboard similar to the PRIV.

The Keyboard when unused would hinge behind the phone flush with back using an indent.

In use, the keyboard would flip up and over covering the virtual keyboard portion of the screen.

I think the ergonomics would be better than both a slider and Key 2 device.

Obviously not going to happen.

Haha... my idea was as a slider but your hinge idea could maintain compact ergonomics while using keyboard and also while using screen! Screen controls similar to that Samsung KB case?

A win-win "dream machine" , imho. Fwiw. Take my money!! .

[RK_BB]

I think the following idea for a phone format originated with Steve - a couple of years ago.

Imagine a ordinary all touch phone and a keyboard similar to the PRIV.

The Keyboard when unused would hinge behind the phone flush with back using an indent.

In use, the keyboard would flip up and over covering the virtual keyboard portion of the screen.

I think the ergonomics would be better than both a slider and Key 2 device.

Obviously not going to happen.

You mean this? I wish these guys made headways...I think they were on to something:

[Bbnivende]

You mean this? I wish these guys made headways...I think they were on to something:

No . This idea is purely mechanical.

[idssteve]

You mean this? I wish these guys made headways...I think they were on to something:

Interesting concept but what I'm visualizing would be a permanently attached, swing away concept that, when retracted, might look reminiscent of this: (more refined with bold sculptured keys, etc). (Maybe call it a "Swinger" ... ??? lol)



???

[the_boon]

Imagine a ordinary all touch phone and a keyboard similar to the PRIV.

The Keyboard when unused would hinge behind the phone flush with back using an indent.

In use, the keyboard would flip up and over covering the virtual keyboard portion of the screen.

Say no more. Take my

Oh and the hinge mechanism would be spring loaded like the phone Neo holds in The Matrix??

Obviously not going to happen.

Ahhh sh... You're probably right

[idssteve]

Say no more. Take my

Oh and the hinge mechanism would be spring loaded like the phone Neo holds in The Matrix??



Ahhh sh... You're probably right

Haha... I'd originally visualize an always available pkb slider that looks & feels like a 9900 when retracted.... For optimal BB pkb typing experience & speed dial availability.

Then, when extended, it might approximate a KeyBerry whenever more screenestate might be desired.

A 9900 KB complete with trackpad seems a no brainer, to me. Lol.

Bbnivende added a caveat with a hinge at the bottom that would make for an even more compact slab experience?

Either way, a full time kb slider should cast a wider net than either candibar or conventional hidden kb slider... imo. Fwiw. Lol.

Fun to dream, at least.

[idssteve]

Hiding the PKB away in shame when retracted, like Priv/Torch, just seems a shame. Imo. It's a BlackBerry! PKB should be Boldly front, center, and ALWAYS available... imo. Lol.

[the_boon]

Hiding the PKB away in shame when retracted, like Priv/Torch, just seems a shame. Imo. It's a BlackBerry! PKB should be Boldly front, center, and ALWAYS available... imo. Lol.

I don't mind a hidden PKB. I think the Priv's design was the best to date and I really hope someone copies it like UniHertz copied the Passport.

[Invictus0]

I might have said that the overall viability of BBMo depended on getting back former pkb users.

I don't think the half million or so legacy users would change its fate a whole lot. And frankly, many of those wouldn't even consider Android if their lives depended on it.

Many of those millions of BBOS & BB10 users in BlackBerry's announcement... are already BB Android users as well - dual carrying. And few really believe there are millions... it doesn't match up to where SAF were and how much they have fallen.

There were millions of BBOS/BB10 users when BB Android launched in 2015 and still some substantial enterprise customers (like the Canadian government) when the KeyOne launched in 2017. I don't think BlackBerry ever had unrealistic goals for its hardware business or for licensees, it just required fans to buy in and do their part.

Ultimately though I think the problem is that BB Android never appealed to any critical mass of active and former BlackBerry users be they enterprise, prosumer, or consumer. I'm not sure it ever had its hail mary "Classic" moment to try and win them back.

[idssteve]

I don't mind a hidden PKB. I think the Priv's design was the best to date and I really hope someone copies it like UniHertz copied the Passport.

But pkb shortcuts & speed dials aren't available when kb is hidden.

[cgk]

It could be argued that the DTEK software is a plus, which it is

There is no evidence I've ever seen that consumers care a bit about this sort of stuff at all or rather that it provides no sales advantage at all - especially in a world that if consumers did care, samsung exists and provides phones with KNOX and better software...

[the_boon]

There is no evidence I've ever seen that consumers care a bit about this sort of stuff at all or rather that it provides no sales advantage at all - especially in a world that if consumers did care, samsung exists and provides phones with KNOX and better software...

Yup, I don't really think that the presence of the DTEK app helped increase sales for consumers.

[the_boon]

But pkb shortcuts & speed dials aren't available when kb is hidden.

True, unless you keep it open all the time lol!

[cgk]

Yup, I don't really think that the presence of the DTEK app helped increase sales for consumers.

It's long been a article of faith that security matters to consumers or rather that at some point tomorrow (which is always.... tomorrow) a massive security hack will have been returning to Blackberry in droves.

[Smokeaire]

It's long been a article of faith that security matters to consumers or rather that at some point tomorrow (which is always.... tomorrow) a massive security hack will have been returning to Blackberry in droves.

I doubt Blackberry will ever see droves no matter what happens.

[the_boon]

I doubt Blackberry will ever see droves no matter what happens.

Oh they saw droves...

... of people running to iSlabs!

[Thud Hardsmack]

There is no evidence I've ever seen that consumers care a bit about this sort of stuff at all or rather that it provides no sales advantage at all - especially in a world that if consumers did care, samsung exists and provides phones with KNOX and better software...

Yup, I don't really think that the presence of the DTEK app helped increase sales for consumers.

Which is what I was saying - yes, it's a good addition, but nobody cares (beyond those that know and do like it).

[i_plod_an_dr_void]

Whatever the conclusion about the BB OS being the best and most efficient, it didn't work out, and those of us who liked it and want it to continue are a minority, sadly.

A reason the new TCL Blackberries haven't been more successful are because of BB10 guys who haven't given the Key Series a chance. So, imagine, if TCL can't even persuade the BB10 users to buy the excellent Key devices, what chance has BBMo of placing any of their devices with Android or IOS slab users?

The fancy pants chattering classes somehow have it in their minds amongst themselves that bb10 user/owners are some kind of yokems' that aint never seen a modern smartphone in their lives. Big mistake. They came, they saw, they tried, they didn't like (ios/android), and they returned convinced more than ever about what they liked bb10. Now what you were really trying for is former BB users and Corp types who fled Blackberry after bbos for the eye candy (there are many many many millions of these) and didn't give bb10 a test drive back then. Its still a solid basic platform that needs newer hardware to run even snappier.

TCL or someone else should put out a bb10 phone or hybrid android/bb10 with an updated (and user controlable )android runtime and give that a serious whirl.