1. 1812dave's Avatar
    UPDATE 1-RIM to allow India to monitor Blackberry svcs -report | Reuters

    that's some SERIOUSLY BAD news, folks.


    EDIT
    this just in: RIM reported to have agreed to snooping deal with India, says 'no way!' -- Engadget
    Last edited by dave1812; 08-03-10 at 12:24 PM.
    08-03-10 12:56 AM
  2. cherryjuice's Avatar
    That's completely whack!!!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-03-10 12:58 AM
  3. 1812dave's Avatar
    I'm beyond shocked, if that article's info is true.
    08-03-10 01:08 AM
  4. T
    I clicked on the link, but I can't find the article; it just goes to Reuters.
    08-03-10 01:48 AM
  5. 1812dave's Avatar
    I clicked on the link, but I can't find the article; it just goes to Reuters.
    the link works fine for me. maybe you have cookie issues?
    08-03-10 03:23 AM
  6. travelingfool's Avatar
    The U.S. won't be far behind. The DNI, Homeland Security, the CIA and the NSA will be crying foul. More to the point, Dennis Blair is going to want in on this action.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-03-10 04:03 AM
  7. CanuckBB's Avatar
    Then again, there's this statement from RIM

    RIM Tells BlackBerry Users Their Data Are Secure - WSJ.com
    08-03-10 08:18 AM
  8. coolguy78240's Avatar
    Who knows, im in wait and see mode.
    08-03-10 09:49 AM
  9. T
    "RIM said the BlackBerry network was set up so that 'no one, including RIM, could access' customer data, which is encrypted from the time it leaves the device. It added RIM would 'simply be unable to accommodate any request' for a key to decrypt the data, since the company doesn't have the key. The BlackBerry network is designed 'to exclude the capability for RIM or any third party to read encrypted information under any circumstances,' RIM's statement said. The location of BlackBerry's servers doesn't matter, the company said, because the data on them can't be deciphered without a decryption key. 'RIM assures customers that it will not compromise the integrity and security of the BlackBerry Enterprise Solution,' the statement said."

    Good news.
    Last edited by Tnis; 08-03-10 at 11:34 AM.
    08-03-10 11:30 AM
  10. 1812dave's Avatar
    "RIM said the BlackBerry network was set up so that 'no one, including RIM, could access' customer data, which is encrypted from the time it leaves the device. It added RIM would 'simply be unable to accommodate any request' for a key to decrypt the data, since the company doesn't have the key. The BlackBerry network is designed 'to exclude the capability for RIM or any third party to read encrypted information under any circumstances,' RIM's statement said. The location of BlackBerry's servers doesn't matter, the company said, because the data on them can't be deciphered without a decryption key. 'RIM assures customers that it will not compromise the integrity and security of the BlackBerry Enterprise Solution,' the statement said."

    Good news.
    NOT good news. that quote was made BEFORE the news came out of India.
    08-03-10 11:50 AM
  11. bushako's Avatar
    Sigh* Ohwell, atleast Etisalat is offering a free phone replacement with a data bundle package, its still better then nothing. The question is do we still get to keep the Blackberry handset or trade it in?!
    08-03-10 11:51 AM
  12. jlb21's Avatar
    NOT good news. that quote was made BEFORE the news came out of India.
    In addition, let's not forget a specific piece of data from that article (my bold added for emphasis):

    "RIM assures customers that it will not compromise the integrity and security of the BlackBerry Enterprise Solution,'' the statement said.
    So, RIM, what about BIS?
    08-03-10 11:58 AM
  13. dasDestruktion's Avatar
    Glad to see their ruining one of the last incredible things they have over all of the competition: their security! *sigh*
    08-03-10 12:01 PM
  14. jlb21's Avatar
    08-03-10 12:05 PM
  15. 1812dave's Avatar
    08-03-10 12:24 PM
  16. mark_rivers19's Avatar
    i'm taking this info with a grain of salt.. like anything else..
    problem is.. press releases are not the same with what happens inside board meetings..
    08-03-10 12:26 PM
  17. 1812dave's Avatar
    i'm taking this info with a grain of salt.. like anything else..
    problem is.. press releases are not the same with what happens inside board meetings..
    I agree. but the whole idea of RIM reducing the security of communications makes me queasy. I'm no spy, but I abhor the idea of others reading MY messages. When I want to say something in public, I'll do it on the internet, like here.
    08-03-10 12:57 PM
  18. jlb21's Avatar
    This will have a huge impact on the US too. How many US companies off-shore work in India? Tons. So communications from/to many US companies will be subject to snooping by India.

    This is said under the assumption that the way the snooping would work is that servers would be placed by RIM in India and all traffic to/from BB's on the networks/carriers in India must pass thru those servers.

    Which leads to my secondary assumption that the "weakening" of security would only be on communications passed through those servers.

    Which now also begs the question, if this does happen, will India not allow RIM to sell BBs that have wi-fi/hotspot browser, thus bypassing the RIM network???

    This is just one big cluster-frak waiting to happen......
    08-03-10 01:15 PM
  19. bushako's Avatar
    Which leads to my secondary assumption that the "weakening" of security would only be on communications passed through those servers.

    Which now also begs the question, if this does happen, will India not allow RIM to sell BBs that have wi-fi/hotspot browser, thus bypassing the RIM network???

    This is just one big cluster-frak waiting to happen......
    No when you use wifi you are surfing the web via your internet provider not RIM network and the wifi is mainly used for surfing and for certain applications but not for emails or bbm.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-03-10 01:59 PM
  20. 1812dave's Avatar
    Only BIS email is encrypted, correct? anyone?
    08-03-10 02:02 PM
  21. jlb21's Avatar
    No when you use wifi you are surfing the web via your internet provider not RIM network.....
    That's what my point is. A BB running on wi-fi would not be snoopable since it is not on the RIM network. Of course, the same countries that want to snoop may already have the ability to snoop on all wi-fi access points, so it might be moot.
    08-03-10 02:15 PM
  22. Exiled Bulldawg's Avatar
    Calm down, folks... there has been a way for law enforcement to read your web, voice, voip, and e-mail traffic for over 16 years, providing you are in the US and they have a warrant. Might want to read about CALEA. This law, passed in 1994, which would mean President Clinton and the Democrats did it. This law requires all telecom providers to allow for domestic wiretapping by either installing standardized software or "trusted third parties." I don't see how Blackberry traffic would be exempt from the law, as it specifically requires access to web traffic. RIM states their network doesn't allow for decryption by them, that seems odd: their servers have to be able to read the traffic to send it to a third party. Imagine a Blackberry e-mail sent to a Yahoo! client encrypted...

    So, this is nothing new, other than foreign countries want the ability to snoop on their citizens without warrants. RIM will either comply with those countries or they will turn off the service. Remember, the US Constitution doesn't apply outside the US. Nor does whatever charter Canada operates under apply, either.
    Last edited by Exiled Bulldawg; 08-03-10 at 04:40 PM. Reason: clarity
    08-03-10 04:21 PM
  23. Exiled Bulldawg's Avatar
    This will have a huge impact on the US too. How many US companies off-shore work in India? Tons. So communications from/to many US companies will be subject to snooping by India.

    This is said under the assumption that the way the snooping would work is that servers would be placed by RIM in India and all traffic to/from BB's on the networks/carriers in India must pass thru those servers.

    Which leads to my secondary assumption that the "weakening" of security would only be on communications passed through those servers.

    Which now also begs the question, if this does happen, will India not allow RIM to sell BBs that have wi-fi/hotspot browser, thus bypassing the RIM network???

    This is just one big cluster-frak waiting to happen......
    Actually, only traffic originating or destined to India would by sniffed. It is illegal in the US for customer proprietary network information, CPNI, to be accessed by third parties, which the Indian government would be. They will probably just set up monitoring on the servers that service India. Which would present an interesting problem - foreign nationals on BES using the service in India would probably appear to be in their home country to RIM...
    08-03-10 04:28 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD