[KAM1138]

Hello Everyone,

Something said in another thread started me thinking about this and I hope it hasn't been covered elsewhere.

It seems to me that Blackberry's position is "the business phone" and probably has been for a while.

I'm not sure how people would characterized Android: The mass market, free app platform?
Or iphone: The Hip, cool phone that you Can't live without.

Could RIM pull off Positioning BB10 Devices as the PREMIUM phone--the one that is for people that not only "Get things done" but can afford to go for "the best."

"Yeah, the iphone sure is great, but it lacks the high-end functionality of BB10."
"Android sure is popular, but if you want the top-end functionality, you need BB10."

Before any Marketing "experts" get their dander up, I'm not actually suggesting those as lines to use.

Will Appealing to people's desire to be "elite" (as if owning a phone makes one elite) work? COULD it work? Will BB10 have enough things to point to say "This is Superior."

Side Note: Obviously the whole "apps" argument needs to be bypassed, by making sure the bases are covered. Not saying play to "app fever" like Android or iphone, but have options. I say this, because this is outside of being "Superior" in my view.

Can BB become the Cadillac (or perhaps today the Lexus or Bentley?) of Mobile Devices again? Hey that Chevy or Toyota is Great...for when you're in college (Android). Hey that Nissan (iphone) is really nice, but when you're ready for the top end--come see us.

So, really two questions (And I don't know the answer--these are just opinions):
1) Will BB10 have the Power to legitimately claim "Superiority." and
2) Should or could RIM effectively position BB10 Devices as the "Elite/Superior" device that you REALLY want.

If they were able to pull this off, could a company succeed by being "elite" as opposed to popular (maximum users)? Would they price themselves out of the market?

KAM

[James Nieves]

I think you're thinking too black and white
the state of mobile right now already has it's top dog. it's iPhone. It is the premium device for most users at least the newer models, nothing out there feels as well built. That is a big reason why business has jumped to the iPhone and demanded developers give biz apps to suit their needs. Apple has morphed because of consumer/and business users wanting what Apple sells as the "best" Part of Apple's package is growing with its user base and delivering to everyone of them the same exact experience.

With BB10, I believe RIM is taking an entirely different approach to the market. Because they once occupied a space everyone seems so ready for them to jump back in and fill it. But RIM has learned from its past mistakes and knows that this is untrue. The latest iOS version which integrated Twitter is more along the lines of how BB10 will approach the market. Instead of not only buying a phone, but having to buy the apps you want to deliver the precise content experience you desire--BB10 will instead try to "package" as Apple has so famously done an Ecosystem/User Experiece.
The BB10 ecosystem and UI from what we've seen will deliver content "better" more efficiently, Blackberry believes this deeply as we;ve all heard the phones will allow people to DO. Out of the BOX RIM wants BB10 to be amazing without any 3rd party apps, and that is where it will flourish, because as a PHONE it will be the best we've ever seen. It won't just be a amazing app runner, with a phone. It will be a super phone, that runs apps. BB10 is trying to jump the curb entirely, and give people SOLID PHONES first.
*Which is what apple has been doing for years, yes*

That has always been their problem, great services, good hardware but bad phones often because of OS quirks. I'm on OS7 and love my 9900 way better than my iPhone 4 imo but OS7 is where the platform should have been @ OS5. Integration is definitely the future and BB10 is the base for which RIM will deliver what they consider "Done better"

It will be premium by design already, the question is, will people see it as such, with perception being reality and .

RIM has needed to pull ITSELF together more I believe, than its new OS. I'm sure QNX has got a good handle on the OS, but RIM has needed to get it's shiz straight, and BB10 TO THEM is will be a profession of, "Hey guys we got our heads out of our a$$e$ and are here to deliver" It's of course dog-eat-dog, but Blackberry wasn't even really in the backyard playing

[Laura Knotek]

I like what you mentioned. However, I believe you put too much emphasis on PHONE. This article is 2 years old, so the numbers of those who use data rather than voice have to be higher now.

[kennyliu]

I don't believe so. RIM needs to penetrate the market and gain the critical mass to attract developers' attention. It can't accomplish this by making BB10 a niche/premium platform.

[PineappleUnderTheSea]

"Yeah, the iphone sure is great, but it lacks the high-end functionality of BB10."
"Android sure is popular, but if you want the top-end functionality, you need BB10."

You will need to really define what you mean by "high end functionality" when referring to BB10. I'm not sure right now what "high end" features are coming on BB10 that would differentiate it from the other phones out there. So you can't just say BB10 is high end, you have to explain what features make it high end, and thus very different than iOS or Android.

Don't forget, sometimes a fancy Acura TSX is simply a repackaged Honda Accord from Europe...doesn't mean it's high end because of the name brand.

[kraski]

Side Note: Obviously the whole "apps" argument needs to be bypassed, by making sure the bases are covered. Not saying play to "app fever" like Android or iphone, but have options. I say this, because this is outside of being "Superior" in my view.

Can BB become the Cadillac (or perhaps today the Lexus or Bentley?) of Mobile Devices again? Hey that Chevy or Toyota is Great...for when you're in college (Android). Hey that Nissan (iphone) is really nice, but when you're ready for the top end--come see us.

So, really two questions (And I don't know the answer--these are just opinions):
1) Will BB10 have the Power to legitimately claim "Superiority." and
2) Should or could RIM effectively position BB10 Devices as the "Elite/Superior" device that you REALLY want.

If they were able to pull this off, could a company succeed by being "elite" as opposed to popular (maximum users)? Would they price themselves out of the market?

KAM

Interesting questions.

First, the app question can never be just a side note. Consider the Playbook. Even with OS 1.0, it was well ahead of everyone else for how it worked. The gesturing system is extremely elegant. But version 1.0 was missing some core functionality. Version 2.x brought most of that in. But many of us buy these things to get work done. Which is difficult when the apps to do it either are very limited or are nonexistent. It's a situation that forced me to add an Android tablet just to do my job. And hoping that the Playbook will catch up.

Second, before you can start calling something elite or superior, you need to have at least one of two things -- either a very exclusive market that doesn't rely on marketshare to keep your product line going or a record for stellar quality hardware &/or software. Only the Porsche design 9981 meets the first criterion. And, in the almost 2 years I've been using BBs, too many OS6 and OS7 models have had software or hardware quality issues at release. So, the BB10 models are now going to need to prove themselves before those claims can be made and believed by the buying public.

[KAM1138]

I think you're thinking too black and white

Hmmm, well I didn't intend to put any constraints on the conversation at all.

The BB10 ecosystem and UI from what we've seen will deliver content "better" more efficiently, Blackberry believes this deeply as we;ve all heard the phones will allow people to DO. Out of the BOX RIM wants BB10 to be amazing without any 3rd party apps, and that is where it will flourish, because as a PHONE it will be the best we've ever seen. It won't just be a amazing app runner, with a phone. It will be a super phone, that runs apps. BB10 is trying to jump the curb entirely, and give people SOLID PHONES first.

I really like the sound of this. I want my Mobile Device to be GREAT out of the box, NOT needing to depend on a bunch of (often questionable apps) to make it worth my while. That's exactly how I felt with my Android phone. "Wow, awesome free apps galore...oh wait, many work for crap, and others I really don't want or need."

That incidentally is why I chose BB recently--because it did the things I use a Mobile device for most out of the box. SOME apps are nice, but they are secondary to me.

That has always been their problem, great services, good hardware but bad phones often because of OS quirks. I'm on OS7 and love my 9900 way better than my iPhone 4 imo but OS7 is where the platform should have been @ OS5. Integration is definitely the future and BB10 is the base for which RIM will deliver what they consider "Done better"

Interesting.

It will be premium by design already, the question is, will people see it as such, with perception being reality and .

RIM has needed to pull ITSELF together more I believe, than its new OS. I'm sure QNX has got a good handle on the OS, but RIM has needed to get it's shiz straight, and BB10 TO THEM is will be a profession of, "Hey guys we got our heads out of our a$$e$ and are here to deliver" It's of course dog-eat-dog, but Blackberry wasn't even really in the backyard playing

Yes, well, that's my question. Can they be seen as "premium" and will it benefit them?

KAM

[KAM1138]

You will need to really define what you mean by "high end functionality" when referring to BB10. I'm not sure right now what "high end" features are coming on BB10 that would differentiate it from the other phones out there. So you can't just say BB10 is high end, you have to explain what features make it high end, and thus very different than iOS or Android.

Don't forget, sometimes a fancy Acura TSX is simply a repackaged Honda Accord from Europe...doesn't mean it's high end because of the name brand.

Sure, I agree. I'm ASSUMING that it will have "High end" functionality. One area where that is important for me is good multi-tasking. Coming from WebOS, it seems to me even years later EVERYONE else is behind (Playbook is almost as good, but a bit less agile in UI).

They seem to be staking a claim with their Gestures and the UI. A "back" button isn't really a stunning feature at this point, but that seems like all I did with ANDROID, and the iphone seems about the same (and honestly the Bold 9930 isn't a TON better). Again, compared to WebOS I think the UI on all current phones (Haven't tried Window Phone) is a joke. Make strides there--with a purpose, not just empty gestures, and that's a Premium feature in my view.

Some way to capitalize on the Security issue--not great for consumer marketing perhaps, but still important to businesses.

I'm not sure what else they have in store, but I would hope they have features that are legitimately "premium."

KAM

[KAM1138]

Interesting questions.

First, the app question can never be just a side note. Consider the Playbook. Even with OS 1.0, it was well ahead of everyone else for how it worked. The gesturing system is extremely elegant. But version 1.0 was missing some core functionality. Version 2.x brought most of that in. But many of us buy these things to get work done. Which is difficult when the apps to do it either are very limited or are nonexistent. It's a situation that forced me to add an Android tablet just to do my job. And hoping that the Playbook will catch up.

Second, before you can start calling something elite or superior, you need to have at least one of two things -- either a very exclusive market that doesn't rely on marketshare to keep your product line going or a record for stellar quality hardware &/or software. Only the Porsche design 9981 meets the first criterion. And, in the almost 2 years I've been using BBs, too many OS6 and OS7 models have had software or hardware quality issues at release. So, the BB10 models are now going to need to prove themselves before those claims can be made and believed by the buying public.

Well, as Jamezalexander mentioned above--I think that BB10 devices need out of the box functionality, with "Apps" from third parties being optional non-essential things, that each user will need to determine.

I agree--it is frustrating to have a great piece of hardware that is severely limited by lack of software. I think it is necessary to cover the basics out of the box. Hopefully, they will be able to cover a good range of optional 3rd party apps at launch, without needing 100,000 free downloadable items.

KAM

[James Nieves]

Blackberry will be partnering and licensing a lot to bring that out of the box functionality. TomTom and Scalado are great views into the RIM strategy. Theyre going to deliver the best they can and thats why their timing is everything. Out of the box BB10 phones are going to be "get it done" machines.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk

[xandermac]

Sure, it could be positioned that way but half the equation would be hardware. When there are beautifully designed aluminum/glass devices available it would be hard to push the "premium" of a predominately plastic device lineup.

RIM have already positioned themselves as going after the cheap emerging markets, wouldn't they have to reverse course to be the "premium" brand?