01-05-10 12:13 PM
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  1. F0nage's Avatar
    Well, Blackberry thinks they are up to match with iPhone. Really? Well in my opinion, its far apart. I do agree with people that Blackberry has a superior email system for "BUSINESS" users, and when i mean Business, i mean to exempt general "CONSUMERS".
    Nice rant but, get a clue.

    The iPhone is a yuppified toy, you can't multitask 3rd party apps, you have no flash support in your browser, you have a huge screen with crappy resolution and no external memory card support. That's a phone for non-technical people who just want to waste money in public.

    My lowly Nokia 5800 walks all over your iPhone. It multitasks, it has native flash support in the browser, it has a 640x360 screen resolution, and you can use it with external microSD cards up to 32G. It has 3G support and wifi built in. It has built in POP3, IMAP and SMTP clients. It's secure. And it costs about a 3rd of the money you wasted.

    You want to rant about your little toy, rock on dude. RIM is about business users and I don't really think they care if people want to waste money on iPhones, that's a toy that doesn't have anything to do with the smartphone business.

    BTW my next phone is a BB 8900. Because I need something for work, not a shiny toy with no capabilities.
    Last edited by F0nage; 01-04-10 at 08:30 AM.
    01-04-10 08:26 AM
  2. wojotiger's Avatar
    Lol, where did the OP go?! I think all the crackberry gurus scared him off. So is it time to close this thread now?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-04-10 09:02 AM
  3. Username00089's Avatar
    Since the iPhone really runs on media met I bet you my bottom dollar that the OP pays a $15 media net plan and is screwing AT&T. Just a matter of time before he gets caught.

    And enough of these threads with the same, tired facts and opinions that we've been reading for over a year. Ya callanse ustedes lol
    01-04-10 09:40 AM
  4. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Steve can spend it on his hockey love ...
    It is Jim. Steve is the Apple CEO.

    Research In Motion CEO Jim Balsillie Named Business Newsmaker of the Year for 2009 | CrackBerry.com

    01-04-10 09:49 AM
  5. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    lol, ya, I meant Jim.... I've got a busy mind today. lol
    01-04-10 09:58 AM
  6. se1000's Avatar
    1) BBM doesn't need to be rewritten. It can continue to work via RIM's NOC for all I care.

    2) Email capabilities need to have an option for either going through the NOC or not. (This will be a hard one to accomplish, but I'd love native ActiveSync support on BB... never going to happen though, lol.)

    3) Browser passing through RIM servers is bullisht and the new one better not need to do this. That is total hogwash and it's only good from the sales to carrier perspective for RIM. They can throttle back the data being sent/received by the browser to limit the amount the carrier pays for data to you.

    Face it guys, RIM's in business to tailor to the carriers first and then to the big companies that bought BES from them. Everything else is NOT a priority to them and this is how their business model was written from the very beginning. I'm not saying they should change the model to meet consumer demand for individuals, I'm marely trying to show you guys at how "old school" their infrastructure vision really is.

    Also, WinMo is far from being the most popular platform in the smartphone market right now. Sure, it's still widely used by companies that don't want BB or support BB at the same time, but that's because they want Push email capabilities with ActiveSync security policies. Up until recently, no other phone supported such policies. The 3GS now does and I'm hoping other smartphone OS devs will follow this same guideline if they want to succeed in the business market. I think the main reason why a lot of big businesses don't want to support other devices is because they are "comfortable". They have become complacent with lackluster designs and a tired UI that is BB. They don't care because they always go back to their overplayed record of "Email works on it.". That's not good enough anymore, people want more.... even those attached to BES. We want FULL Emails in rich HTML formats so we can read the SOBs like we would in Outlook. We don't want any more trucated emails because "it's good for the carrier's data revenue". We don't want our file downloads limited because "it's good for the carrier's data revenue".

    RIM need to come out of the 90's already. What they are still doing is bullisht and they know it. Unfortunately, they are no different then a drug pusher... they get people hooked and then they don't even have to keep selling you the good stuff, they can sell you cheap isht and you'll still buy it. (This being the case with current hardware QC standards we've been seeing out of them for the past couple of years. It's gone to isht because rather then making a handset of higher quality, they'd rather save that money and add it to the bottom line to make the investors happy and bring in more money so that Steve can spend it on his hockey love.)
    1. BBM would absolutely be re-written unless you just don't want it to work without a BB data plan. This would defeat the purpose of this whole discussion because again we'd be leaving things out of the picture if people decided not to have a data plan.

    2. Why would RIM allow integration with ActiveSync when BES exists? If RIM did, it would essentially be giving Microsoft a very large chunk of control over it's devices. RIM would have to be completely insane to allow this.

    3. Thier infrastructure isn't "old school" at all. Poll e-mail has been available since the first devices. Push e-mail was the newer technology RIM introduced and what made RIM successfull. Others have followed in making this available.

    I never said Windows Mobile was the most popular platform, I just said that although being feature rich and doing exactly what you want it to do (activesync integration, poll e-mail, etc etc), it does not have nearly the sales numbers that Blackberry or iPhone does.
    01-04-10 10:10 AM
  7. Username00089's Avatar
    2. Why would RIM allow integration with ActiveSync when BES exists?
    I'm going to assume that you were joking when you asked this. This is almost
    a rhetorical question.
    01-04-10 11:52 AM
  8. se1000's Avatar
    I'm going to assume that you were joking when you asked this. This is almost
    a rhetorical question.
    absolutely not. Let me be clear we're talking about ActiveSync services for MS Exhange.
    Last edited by se1000; 01-04-10 at 12:01 PM.
    01-04-10 11:57 AM
  9. Reed McLay's Avatar
    ... This being the case with current hardware QC standards we've been seeing out of them for the past couple of years. It's gone to isht because rather then making a handset of higher quality, they'd rather save that money and add it to the bottom line to make the investors happy and bring in more money so that Steve can spend it on his hockey love.)
    I support part of your position, but I disagree with accepting as conventional wisdom, that BlackBerry Smart phones are experiencing unusual quality control problems.

    The members of an online forum are not a representative cross section of BlackBerry owners. The vast majority have never experienced a hardware issue, as would be expected with modern manufacture quality control.

    International Organization for Standardization (ISO) came into being during the first World War. The mobilization of industry meant a lot of accidents happened in the munitions and munitions handling. The accident in Halifax Harbour was a result of "poor quality control".

    For a manufacture to adhere to ISO9001 standards, all phases of manufacture and handling are documented with measurable established. One of the key measurable is returns due to manufactures defects. There are professionals that monitor that on an ongoing basis, their feed back is incorporated in the manufacture process.

    The carriers on the other hand, couldn't care less. They are empowered to exchange handsets to resolve nearly any customer complaint.

    3) Browser passing through RIM servers is bullisht and the new one better not need to do this. That is total hogwash and it's only good from the sales to carrier perspective for RIM. They can throttle back the data being sent/received by the browser to limit the amount the carrier pays for data to you. ...
    We know the new Brower is under development, it is just a matter of time now.

    UK Mobile phone operator O2 apologizes for service problems caused by smartphones - Winnipeg Free Press

    However, when it does release, I hope the wizards at Research in Motion will have taken note what happen on Christmas Day in the UK. O2 was swamped with new Smart Phones coming on line, service was down all day and intermittent through Boxing Day. We all know which 50% of the Smart Phone market caused that.

    01-04-10 12:08 PM
  10. F0nage's Avatar
    1)3) Browser passing through RIM servers is bullisht and the new one better not need to do this. That is total hogwash and it's only good from the sales to carrier perspective for RIM.
    Surprisingly this is the direction with all of the new mobile browsers today.

    For example, Opera Mini proxies every request through their server. Opera Mobile does this too, but it's optional. Bolt, SkyFire, and I think Digia@Web also do this. They do it in the name of performance but I can't tell the difference and I really think a lot of people are being screwed thinking their SSL is working when it is only working between them and Opera's server or whatever.

    I don't like RIM's omniscent approach either, it may be secure but there are serious privacy issues with this kind of stuff. It's one stop shopping for anybody who wants to p0wn your phone. Then all that security did nothing but put all your fish in one barrel.

    Since they weren't smart enough to build in redundancy there are also performance and availability issues like we saw late in December.
    01-04-10 02:04 PM
  11. CanuckBB's Avatar
    A lot of the proxing is also done for compression. RIM compresses the HTTP data stream that goes between their NOC and your phone.
    01-04-10 03:27 PM
  12. roosk's Avatar
    Wow...

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-04-10 07:45 PM
  13. HollowPoint.357's Avatar
    OP?? Where'd you go??

    Guess I'd leave too if I was pwn3d in my own thread...

    Jus sayin'
    01-04-10 11:32 PM
  14. xgm541's Avatar
    so i read your post and page 1 of the replies and got tired.

    Basically you stated you are a phone reviewer. Where do you get your facts that a data plan is not for the general consumer? I can honestly say that I can afford the $30 per month data plan i am currently on and I am not a business person and it does not take a big toll on my money supply. I am a student in college.
    01-04-10 11:35 PM
  15. bluz's Avatar
    Well, Blackberry thinks they are up to match with iPhone. Really? Well in my opinion, its far apart. I do agree with people that Blackberry has a superior email system for "BUSINESS" users, and when i mean Business, i mean to exempt general "CONSUMERS".

    I am an iPhone user, and might be biased, but seriously..I was totally up for the blackberry. I bought my iPhone 3GS unlocked and can use it without a data plan. Then i bought a Blackberry 9700 unlocked but find myself a useless crippled berry. (I dont care about wasting the money buying the blackberry anyways, cause i review the phones so i have to buy them anyways) Not all consumers can afford data plans, well atleast i dont need or want one. Many people are around wifi alot ( i am around wifi atleast 95% + ). Data plans are just too useless and expensive for the general consumers.

    I myself love the blackberry 9700 and it would TOTALLY beat the iPhone 3GS, but considering it only works with a data plan, i hate it. I hate it alot infact. Even if the iPhone has totally bad reception, it has tons of useful apps and better yet, it has INTERNET for free. Can anyone see the difference?

    "The numbers showed that Apple sold nearly 6.9 million phones, while Research In Motion (RIM), the maker of the BlackBerry, sold 6.1 million." 2009 Statistics

    This is why you are losing sales RIM. or whomever. If you're targeted for general consumers (Which you are..because you publically said you wanted to target the consumers AND corporates through the blackberry storm..or i dont see why you need to create a touch screen and follow the trend) then make the device more consumer friendly. Atleast make the wifi more useful.

    That is my opinion..Does anyone else have something to say? This is just a random question about why general consumers rather choose an iPhone over a blackberry. Even if the blackberry can be as sexy as anything, it will never defeat the iPhone or steal more customers due to the fact that plans will be as expensive as over 50$ and probably 100$ too, whereas iPhone can have not only a Data plan and Voice plan, it can have only a voice plan as well.
    I simply don't understand this posts! If you love the Iphone , get one and be happy; why this urge to prove to us that the Iphone is superior to the BB?
    01-05-10 06:08 AM
  16. qbnkelt's Avatar
    WOW - I'm exhausted!
    01-05-10 12:13 PM
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