[bb9900user2018]

They were perfectly happy to just dump the business entirely, but decided to try and make a few bucks off its IP first.

I disagree, if they wanted to dumb the business they would have buy now. There's still brand name equity and a footprint in this space that creates pull through.



Posted via CB10

[Chuck Finley69]

I disagree, if they wanted to dumb the business they would have buy now. There's still brand name equity and a footprint in this space that creates pull through.



Posted via CB10

They already dumped it three years ago. BB licensees have been paying BB for the use. BB has been getting paid for very little risk. That’s why BB licensees have dropped out and stopped paying or probably will soon. BB licensing is just milking an old cow before it dies anyway.

[towngirl]

How many fewer TCL devices do you think they will sell due to unanswered questions regarding BlackBerry Mobile? Give me a number.

Zero

[bb9900user2018]

They already dumped it three years ago. BB licensees have been paying BB for the use. BB has been getting paid for very little risk. That’s why BB licensees have dropped out and stopped paying or probably will soon. BB licensing is just milking an old cow before it dies anyway.

... actually conite and I agree BBLtd haven't dumped the business, conite thinks they're milking IP and I believe they did not proceed on this basis, although they may have considered exiting the mobile space, however that's not what they did and are not doing with BBMo and BB10 (continued support EOD). With every significant sale of software and services BBLtd give away boxes of Key2 devices, that's the kind of stuff we do taking out clients to a $10k dinner, $300 bottle of wines at the Chicago Chop House after a large deal, and as a matter of fact I believe that's exactly what they do

[bb10adopter111]

There is a disconnect if the end users (in this case, us) are not considered the customers. Our business sells to stores and other retail outlets etc. not us directly to end users. In one way you could say we consider the retail outlets our customers. However, our customers really are the end users, and if we didn't consider them our customers, our business would not succeed. You cannot call the distributors your customers and at the same time not consider the end users your customers.

That's not the only model for retail, however. There are many products where the end user's primary relationship is with the distributor, not the OEM. That's one reason many people still shop at brick and mortar stores and buy phones through their carriers.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Sigewif]

All BlackBerry wanted to do was shed its responsibilities for its consumer-facing mobile handset business - design, manufacture, distribution, marketing, sales, support.

They were perfectly happy to just dump the business entirely, but decided to try and make a few bucks off its IP first.

TCL is not a distributor. They ARE BlackBerry Mobile. It is their device, and their device only. As a customer, your contract is with them.

Perhaps I misunderstood the post I was quoting but I was referring to TCL's BlackBerry Mobile. I read the post I was quoting as referring to them. You can go back and check for me if yo wish. For the record, BlackBerry Mobile had good customer service when my KEYone's screen came out almost 2 years after I got the device. They were responsive, and repaired it, no questions asked, in March 2019.

[Sigewif]

That's not the only model for retail, however. There are many products where the end user's primary relationship is with the distributor, not the OEM. That's one reason many people still shop at brick and mortar stores and buy phones through their carriers.

Posted with my trusty Z10

If, for any reason, a customer is dissatisfied with our product, they contact the retailer. The store will take the product back, but we then reimburse the retailer or replace the product. It is rare for us fortunately. Sometimes the customer will contact us directly. For us it is about making sure the customer is reimbursed. On a side note, there are also some scammers out there who try to be reimbursed for something that they haven't even bought. The retail resellers are often a good filter for that kind of activity.
We also do a couple of retail festivals a year which helps get direct feedback from customers. This is invaluable.

[Chuck Finley69]

... actually conite and I agree BBLtd haven't dumped the business, conite thinks they're milking IP and I believe they did not proceed on this basis, although they may have considered exiting the mobile space, however that's not what they did and are not doing with BBMo and BB10 (continued support EOD). With every significant sale of software and services BBLtd give away boxes of Key2 devices, that's the kind of stuff we do taking out clients to a $10k dinner, $300 bottle of wines at the Chicago Chop House after a large deal, and as a matter of fact I believe that's exactly what they do

Not sure where you think otherwise. They’re doing nothing in mobile hardware and mobile software appears to be over as well. BB isn’t supporting consumers. BBMo either pays it’s bills or it’s over. BB10 will be EOL at end of this year and has been EOD for three years as well.

[bb9900user2018]

Not sure where you think otherwise. They’re doing nothing in mobile hardware and mobile software appears to be over as well. BB isn’t supporting consumers. BBMo either pays it’s bills or it’s over. BB10 will be EOL at end of this year and has been EOD for three years as well.

I'm not sure what you're not understanding, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support. As much as you'd like it to be so, BB10 is not EOL at the end of the year. And I will not lay claim to this observation, TT first pointed it out, however we as a community lagged a little behind him, some more than most. What BBLtd also said was that there were millions of legacy users still on BBOS/BB10 which contradicts much of what is said in these forums, the claim often being a few thousand remaining. A simple glance on ebay will tell you the demand for BBOS/BB10 devices, in fact here Calgary I'm seeing a surge of these devices.

[bb10adopter111]

If, for any reason, a customer is dissatisfied with our product, they contact the retailer. The store will take the product back, but we then reimburse the retailer or replace the product. It is rare for us fortunately. Sometimes the customer will contact us directly. For us it is about making sure the customer is reimbursed. On a side note, there are also some scammers out there who try to be reimbursed for something that they haven't even bought. The retail resellers are often a good filter for that kind of activity.
We also do a couple of retail festivals a year which helps get direct feedback from customers. This is invaluable.

That's pretty much exactly what BlackBerry Mobile does, too. They work with the retailer, who works with the customer..

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Chuck Finley69]

I'm not sure what you're not understanding, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support. As much as you'd like it to be so, BB10 is not EOL at the end of the year. And I will not lay claim to this observation, TT first pointed it out, however we as a community lagged a little behind him, some more than most. What BBLtd also said was that there were millions of legacy users still on BBOS/BB10 which contradicts much of what is said in these forums, the claim often being a few thousand remaining. A simple glance on ebay will tell you the demand for BBOS/BB10 devices, in fact here Calgary I'm seeing a surge of these devices.

I understand the desire to believe the BB statement as something than semantics. When you look at the Playbook EOL is links to exactly the same page and statements for BB10 with asterisk for back end systems won’t die immediately etc.

However, the playbook backend has been sitting with people unable to connect with a factory reset for almost three weeks. The only reply from an official BB person was simple non-commital response after two weeks almost or so of no response. Last time it happened, in April 2019, 12 months after EOL, somebody did something, eventually. Follow similar logic for BBOS or BB10 and we could expect support maybe additional 12 months. Difference is now, BB is seeing the rest of it’s licensing business drop. Will BB decide it’s simply time for moving on?

The playbook and it’s situation will be a great litmus test. What does BB care about BBOS and BB10 hardware sold on Amazon, eBay, swappa etc? That doesn’t generate BB any revenue..

[conite]

I'm not sure what you're not understanding, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support. As much as you'd like it to be so, BB10 is not EOL at the end of the year. And I will not lay claim to this observation, TT first pointed it out, however we as a community lagged a little behind him, some more than most. What BBLtd also said was that there were millions of legacy users still on BBOS/BB10 which contradicts much of what is said in these forums, the claim often being a few thousand remaining. A simple glance on ebay will tell you the demand for BBOS/BB10 devices, in fact here Calgary I'm seeing a surge of these devices.

To me, all that last BlackBerry announcement did was bury the fact that two more services were shutting down in a pillow of fluff talk about the continuation of BB10 core services. EOL date remains the same on the website, so I'm sure that's just doublespeak as they had no intentions of literally hitting the off switch at midnight.

[bb9900user2018]

To me, all that last BlackBerry announcement did was bury the fact that two more services were shutting down in a pillow of fluff talk about the continuation of BB10 core services. EOL date remains the same on the website, so I'm sure that's just doublespeak as they had no intentions of literally hitting the off switch at midnight.

Again, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support.

[Chuck Finley69]

Again, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support.

Then where’s the playbook support? It links to same page...

[bb9900user2018]

Then where’s the playbook support? It links to same page...

Chuck, with all due respect (cough, cough), i'm done with you, now heat up the room will you

Posted via CB10

[conite]

Again, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support.

Honestly, what does beyond midnight on Dec 31st 2019 really mean to you?

And how does that differ from the previous statement which was "minimum 2 years from Dec 2017" ?

[Chuck Finley69]

Chuck, with all due respect (cough, cough), i'm done with you, now heat up the room will you

Posted via CB10

Here’s the pages for BBOS, PlayBook and BB10 with definitions and the asterisk explanations as well. Don’t shoot the messenger. You quoted the page so I looked it up.


https://www.blackberry.com/us/en/sup...ort-life-cycle

https://blogs.blackberry.com/en/2019...egacy-services

[bb9900user2018]

Honestly, what does beyond midnight on Dec 31st 2019 really mean to you?

And how does that differ from the previous statement which was "minimum 2 years from Dec 2017" ?

It means "more of the same" (in the words of Blaze) and "the same" includes general support, the same kind of support we saw with the certificate issue and where fixing a query doesn't require a large resource commitment (ie., rewrites). There is a BBLtd Support team in place, I think you acknowledge that. One thing that struck me from John@BB comments was that he wasn't sure what was happening beyond 2019 in regard to his duties - so there's at least some uncertainty there . However if you interpret BBLtd's statements strictly, as you often do (correctly) then you must interpret their statements thereafter in the same manner, you can't have it both ways.

Go back Blazes post regarding the announcement, he said this:

"Originally scheduled to reach End of Life (EOL) status in December 2019 after receiving two years of additional support back in December 2017, BlackBerry has now announced they will continue to support the critical infrastructure and services for BlackBerry 10 as well as network access for BBOS devices beyond 2019."

The key worked here is "Originally", even he acknowledged at the time that EOL had now changed.

We can expect BB10 to function as viable OS for the next 1-2 yrs sans BBW.

[bb9900user2018]

Just razzing you Chuck, you seem like a fun target and a good sport

[Chuck Finley69]

It means "more of the same" (in the words of Blaze) and "the same" includes general support, the same kind of support we saw with the certificate issue and where fixing a query doesn't require a large resource commitment (ie., rewrites). There is a BBLtd Support team in place, I think you acknowledge that. One thing that struck me from John@BB comments was that he wasn't sure what was happening beyond 2019 in regard to his duties - so there's at least some uncertainty there . However if you interpret BBLtd's statements strictly, as you often do (correctly) then you must interpret their statements thereafter in the same manner, you can't have it both ways.

Go back Blazes post regarding the announcement, he said this:

"Originally scheduled to reach End of Life (EOL) status in December 2019 after receiving two years of additional support back in December 2017, BlackBerry has now announced they will continue to support the critical infrastructure and services for BlackBerry 10 as well as network access for BBOS devices beyond 2019."

The key worked here is "Originally", even he acknowledged at the time that EOL had now changed.

We can expect BB10 to function as viable OS for the next 1-2 yrs sans BBW.

LMAO - where does BB say any of that ? Beyond it’s official pages ? It says nothing of 1-2 years...

[bb9900user2018]

LMAO - where does BB say any of that ? Beyond it’s official pages ? It says nothing of 1-2 years...

Chuck, I said we can "expect" BB10 to function as a viable OS for another 1-2yrs, perhaps LONGER! And I also said to turn up the heat! and quit burying my literary works of art with your gibberish.

[Chuck Finley69]

Chuck, I said we can "expect" BB10 to function as a viable OS for another 1-2yrs, perhaps LONGER! And I also said to turn up the heat! and quit burying my literary works of art with your gibberish.

Factual gibberish, thank you very much. I’ll stop now. ;-) I enjoy your optimism. The reason I’ve harped on the PlayBook is that people were actually buying them and couldn’t activate. Bad information no matter how well intentioned almost cost people real money. Not big serious money but real money. People do actually rely on CB for unbiased information sometimes. Remember, I still own a PlayBook and eight (8) actual BB10 devices. I paid the entry to get into the dance....

[conite]

One thing that struck me from John@BB comments was that he wasn't sure what was happening beyond 2019 in regard to his duties - so there's at least some uncertainty there .

This is the crux of it right here.

Even WITH the team in place, the Playbook sign in issue is still not working after a few weeks.

I honestly believe the intent is not to turn anything off explicitly on Dec 31st, but to not fix anything or to renew any other support contracts after that date. That both satisfies their "pledge" , and is in keeping with the current EOL date.

[Bbnivende]

I'm not sure what you're not understanding, BBLtd announced they would continue to support the critical infrastructure and services of BB10 and network access for BBOS beyond 2019 - in their words "Our Commitment to BB10" that by definition means EOD beyond 2019 not EOL at the end of 2019. The keyword here is Support. As much as you'd like it to be so, BB10 is not EOL at the end of the year. And I will not lay claim to this observation, TT first pointed it out, however we as a community lagged a little behind him, some more than most. What BBLtd also said was that there were millions of legacy users still on BBOS/BB10 which contradicts much of what is said in these forums, the claim often being a few thousand remaining. A simple glance on ebay will tell you the demand for BBOS/BB10 devices, in fact here Calgary I'm seeing a surge of these devices.

Living in Alberta as I do and often in Calgary, I have not seen a BB10 device in many years. A couple of Key sightings though.

[bb9900user2018]

Living in Alberta as I do and often in Calgary, I have not seen a BB10 device in many years. A couple of Key sightings though.

Good for you, "Living in Alberta as I do and often in Calgary" and what's that supposed to mean? As I said I've been seeing allot of BBOS/BB10 devices (mostly dual carry). I'm guessing you don't work in the DT and drive into town in your pickup and hang out at hill-billy heaven coffee shop at okotoks