09-03-13 07:32 AM
166 12345 ...
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  1. bekkay's Avatar
    Hands down - BB10 is the winner.
    I own them both - no app/hack/custom rom can make Android multitask like BB10. Its just the way Android handles it - it will close you apps whenever it wants, dump the pages you loaded in the browser quickl; anytime you go back to some apps by hitting the shortcut (such as gmail) it will start over instead of going back where you left off.

    Posted via CB10
    1) Android does not close an app "whenever it wants". It closes apps just like BB10. By the way, Android can keep some apps running healdessly unlike BB10 (as of the most recent publicly available version)
    2) I am not sure what you mean by dumping the page quickly
    3) Go back to the app by using the multitasking list (press and hold or double click the home button) and you will get back to the app where you left it off (in most cases, where apps are written to work in the background. this is up to developers)
    08-24-13 08:01 PM
  2. avatsaev's Avatar
    considering that with PC you can do alot of sh!t ( but not necessarily elegantly), I would say android
    08-24-13 08:03 PM
  3. remmo's Avatar
    Android - Windows OS
    Apple - OSX

    BlackBerry - Ubuntu
    Windows Phone - Debian
    Windows Phone - Debian????
    No way!!!

    And you said "Apple - OSX", I think you meant "iOS - OSX"
    08-24-13 08:50 PM
  4. Rickroller's Avatar
    Hands down - BB10 is the winner.
    I own them both - no app/hack/custom rom can make Android multitask like BB10. Its just the way Android handles it - it will close you apps whenever it wants, dump the pages you loaded in the browser quickl; anytime you go back to some apps by hitting the shortcut (such as gmail) it will start over instead of going back where you left off.

    Posted via CB10
    If you own android..you certainly don't know how to use it lol

    Sent from my gesture controlled Nexus 4
    bekkay, Donvald, notfanboy and 3 others like this.
    08-24-13 08:51 PM
  5. last_attempt's Avatar
    If the Q10 gets USB OTG and can then access hard drives and printers it gets my vote as a true pocket pc with its nice keyboard and HDMI out
    08-24-13 10:14 PM
  6. notfanboy's Avatar
    Relevant: someone made a YouTube video which asks whether an Android phone could perform the functions of a PC. It can't replace a PC completely, but it shows how technology is getting us closer to that goal. Many, many things shown in this video from multiwindow to USB support are just not possible on BB10. To use BB10 as a PC there are a couple of bugs and features that need to be fixed. Landscape support for the home screen. Better mouse support: make it work in all apps, specially the scroll wheel. Better external keyboard support: support ctrl-c and ctrl-v. Have hotkeys in the keyboard to bring up the active frame dialog. There are dedicated function buttons on Android keyboards to bring up the app switcher, menu, browser, etc.

    Jump straight to 2:30 to skip the setup.
    08-25-13 08:39 AM
  7. mikeo007's Avatar
    To use BB10 as a PC there are a couple of bugs and features that need to be fixed. Landscape support for the home screen. Better mouse support: make it work in all apps, specially the scroll wheel. Better external keyboard support: support ctrl-c and ctrl-v. Have hotkeys in the keyboard to bring up the active frame dialog. There are dedicated function buttons on Android keyboards to bring up the app switcher, menu, browser, etc.
    A couple more:
    Resolution independence
    Ability to run more than 8 apps
    Ability to install drivers/kernel extensions
    Access to system signals for 3rd party apps
    Integration with desktop/homescreen

    And this would only make it "feel" like a PC. No idea how much more would be necessary to make it actually function like a PC.
    08-25-13 08:46 AM
  8. BerryPirate's Avatar
    A work colleague of mine has a Nexus 4 with a custom ROM, and all sorts of UI enhancements. He is very much a geek, and his PC work environment runs under Arch Linux (another linux geek's delight.) He spends an insane amount of time playing around with his Nexus, getting it to be just the way he needs it to be, or wants it to be. I'd have to concede that his completely customized Nexus is for all intents and purposes a pocket pc.
    08-25-13 09:51 AM
  9. djsvet's Avatar
    If you own android..you certainly don't know how to use it lol

    Sent from my gesture controlled Nexus 4
    I smell something...
    Oh I got it, smells like a troll wannabe

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 11:44 AM
  10. djsvet's Avatar
    Ya...just don't open a 9th app on BB10, lol.
    True, I was concerned about that but since the HUB replaces 4-5 apps for me I never ended reaching number 9

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 11:47 AM
  11. mikeo007's Avatar
    True, I was concerned about that but since the HUB replaces 4-5 apps for me I never ended reaching number 9

    Posted via CB10
    Lol, well I guess if you don't mind basically losing all functionality other than being able to post, then ya, that works great. That's what BB10 is best at: compromise!
    08-25-13 11:52 AM
  12. djsvet's Avatar
    1) Android does not close an app "whenever it wants". It closes apps just like BB10. By the way, Android can keep some apps running healdessly unlike BB10 (as of the most recent publicly available version)
    2) I am not sure what you mean by dumping the page quickly
    3) Go back to the app by using the multitasking list (press and hold or double click the home button) and you will get back to the app where you left it off (in most cases, where apps are written to work in the background. this is up to developers)
    1. Totally wrong. I run stock 4.0.3(I know, its a bit old) and although there is plenty of free ram it closes apps all the time, whenever it wants. So next time you go back to the app it just starts over.

    2. Open a full desktop page in the browser, then open gmail, music, navigation, gallery, go back to the browser and you will see the same page re-loading again because the "smart" kernel desided you don't need that anymore. And this is super frustrating when I have lost network services and I can't reload the page. In addition it increases data consumption. I have tried vertually any available browser and they all work the same way.

    3. While this works for some apps (gmail) it slows me down. And again, it doesn't work all the time

    Overall, Android is faking multitasking with the idea to "help" to user save battery power and resources but I can never trust it - it might work for others but it doesn't work for me as a mobile computer. Thats MY opinion if you don't like thats fine, but don't try to convince me that Android has true multitasking.

    Edit: Just tried going back to an email I have opened in gmail last night via the multitask window and while it did get there it definetely re-loaded the email. Total time waisted about 5-6 sec. Not cool.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by djsvetljo; 08-25-13 at 12:24 PM.
    08-25-13 12:05 PM
  13. djsvet's Avatar
    Lol, well I guess if you don't mind basically losing all functionality other than being able to post, then ya, that works great. That's what BB10 is best at: compromise!
    But I make the choice, I know the limit and I can controll it!
    Its my choice!

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:06 PM
  14. notfanboy's Avatar
    1. Totally wrong. I run stock 4.0.3(I know, its a bit old) and although there is plenty of free ram it closes apps all the time, whenever it wants. So next time you go back to the app it just starts over.

    2. Open a full desktop page in the browser, then open gmail, music, navigation, gallery, go back to the browser and you will see the same page re-loading again because the "smart" kernel desided you don't need that anymore. And this is super frustrating when I have lost network services and I can't reload the page. In addition it increases data consumption. I have tried vertually any available browser and they all work the same way.

    3. While this works for some apps (gmail) it slows me down. And again, it doesn't work all the time

    Overall, Android is faking multitasking with the idea to "help" to user save battery power and resources but I can never trust it - it might work for others but it doesn't work for me as a mobile computer. Thats MY opinion if you don't like thats fine, but don't try to convince me that Android has true multitasking.
    4.0 Ice Cream Sandwich. Sorry but your OS, and therefore your experience is out of date.

    This is well trodden ground on CrackBerry. Since the Playbook came out there have been many many discussions on "true multitasking". In particular there was this epic thread where a number of people tried to come up with scenarios of "true multitasking" (scenarios that are way more complicated than yours by the way). These posters were absolutely convinced that Android could not replicate those scenarios and I got called a troll and a liar so many times for saying it could. So I made videos to demonstrate those exact scenarios.

    On the flip side, I described a few Android only multitasking scenarios but sadly, no one took the challenge of replicating those.

    The whole thread is an entertaining mess, but let me point you to a couple of posts in particular.

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...ml#post7678397

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...ml#post7688809
    08-25-13 12:23 PM
  15. donnation's Avatar
    I have android and z10 here and I use the z10 for more highend things., of things where I need to type because the Android keyboard is not workable.


    http://appworld.blackberry.com/webst...ntent/33163953
    Then you've never used Swiftkey. It's essentially the same thing as the Z10 keyboard minus swiping up and is in many ways better.
    08-25-13 12:30 PM
  16. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    1. Totally wrong. I run stock 4.0.3(I know, its a bit old) and although there is plenty of free ram it closes apps all the time, whenever it wants. So next time you go back to the app it just starts over.

    2. Open a full desktop page in the browser, then open gmail, music, navigation, gallery, go back to the browser and you will see the same page re-loading again because the "smart" kernel desided you don't need that anymore. And this is super frustrating when I have lost network services and I can't reload the page. In addition it increases data consumption. I have tried vertually any available browser and they all work the same way.

    3. While this works for some apps (gmail) it slows me down. And again, it doesn't work all the time

    Overall, Android is faking multitasking with the idea to "help" to user save battery power and resources but I can never trust it - it might work for others but it doesn't work for me as a mobile computer. Thats MY opinion if you don't like thats fine, but don't try to convince me that Android has true multitasking.


    Posted via CB10
    You're hitting hardware limitations, not OS limitations. Your phone's almost 2 years old or older, which means it probably contains about 512MB of RAM, or less. Stock Android's use of virtual memory is limited, thus it can't page all your open apps. Once the memory runs out, its starts closing apps. The simple solution of course.... add more RAM, alternatively, increase the size of virtual memory. There are apps I believe that will allow you to do the latter. Similar to using virtual memory on a regular computer (where it uses the HD or SSD), you'll take a performance hit. Depending on the speed of the flash memory on your smartphone, the performance hit could be really bad. There's a reason stock Android limits the use virtual memory. Use too much with too many open apps and the phone app might take too long to respond and you'll start missing phone calls. Too much virtual memory and the phone will lag all the time as it's constantly accessing the slow flash memory. There's a reason BB10 won't allow you to run more than 8 apps at once. BB10 also limits the use of virtual memory on the device.
    bekkay likes this.
    08-25-13 12:32 PM
  17. djsvet's Avatar
    4.0 Ice Cream Sandwich. Sorry but your OS, and therefore your experience is out of date.

    This is well trodden ground on CrackBerry. Since the Playbook came out there have been many many discussions on "true multitasking". In particular there was this epic thread where a number of people tried to come up with scenarios of "true multitasking" (scenarios that are way more complicated than yours by the way). These posters were absolutely convinced that Android could not replicate those scenarios and I got called a troll and a liar so many times for saying it could. So I made videos to demonstrate those exact scenarios.

    On the flip side, I described a few Android only multitasking scenarios but sadly, no one took the challenge of replicating those.

    The whole thread is an entertaining mess, but let me point you to a couple of posts in particular.

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...ml#post7678397

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...ml#post7688809
    Thank you for you effort but I don't need your help. I have my verdict - I use android as my media/entertaining device, I use my Q10 as mobile PC (work phone). I have lowered the use of my laptop since I got the Q10 (my first BlackBerry) significantly.

    I don't want a developer to decide when the app closes or stays in the backgroung - I am smart enought to make these choices my self!

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:32 PM
  18. djsvet's Avatar
    You're hitting hardware limitations, not OS limitations. Your phone's almost 2 years old or older, which means it probably contains about 512MB of RAM, or less. Stock Android's use of virtual memory is limited, thus it can't page all your open apps. Once the memory runs out, its starts closing apps. The simple solution of course.... add more RAM, alternatively, increase the size of virtual memory. There are apps I believe that will allow you to do the latter. Similar to using virtual memory on a regular computer (where it uses the HD or SSD), you'll take a performance hit. Depending the speed of the flash memory on your smartphone, the performance hit could be really bad. There's a reason stock Android limits the use virtual memory. Use too much with too many open apps and the phone app might take too long to respond.
    I am not hitting hardware limitiations - I have 1 gig of ram AND AGAIN THERE IS PLENTY OF FREE MEMORY but still the kernel doesn't seems to care. Also, my phone is 1 year old, dual core 1.5 ghz, 1Gb Ram.

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:35 PM
  19. mikeo007's Avatar
    Thank you for you effort but I don't need your help. I have my verdict - I use android as my media/entertaining device, I use my Q10 as mobile PC (work phone). I have lowered the use of my laptop since I got the Q10 (my first BlackBerry) significantly.

    I don't want a developer to decide when the app closes or stays in the backgroung - I am smart enought to make these choices my self!

    Posted via CB10
    You are one of the (very) few smartphone users who actually finds one of BB10s biggest limitations to actually be a benefit to you. Sounds like it's the perfect phone for you, enjoy!
    djsvet likes this.
    08-25-13 12:39 PM
  20. djsvet's Avatar
    You are one of the (very) few smartphone users who actually finds one of BB10s biggest limitations to actually be a benefit to you. Sounds like it's the perfect phone for you, enjoy!
    Indeed.

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:41 PM
  21. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    I am not hitting hardware limitiations - I have 1 gig of ram AND AGAIN THERE IS PLENTY OF FREE MEMORY but still the kernel doesn't seems to care. Also, my phone is 1 year old, dual core 1.5 ghz, 1Gb Ram.

    Posted via CB10
    Use an app that lets you enlarge the virtual memory space, then it won't close your apps.
    08-25-13 12:43 PM
  22. Rickroller's Avatar
    Thank you for you effort but I don't need your help. I have my verdict - I use android as my media/entertaining device, I use my Q10 as mobile PC (work phone). I have lowered the use of my laptop since I got the Q10 (my first BlackBerry) significantly.

    I don't want a developer to decide when the app closes or stays in the backgroung - I am smart enought to make these choices my self!

    Posted via CB10
    I'm sorry..but your attempts to convince people about how Android multitasks are simply false. I can hit my multitask button (or actually swipe a gesture for it) and it currently shows me 11 recent tasks I've used..and some of those are from yesterday. None of them have been closed "randomly" on me by the kernel (not even my browser pages). .however I'm sure if I started opening 30+ apps it would end up closing some on me.

    Do you honestly think that there wouldn't be complaints about "true" multitasking amongst the Android community (which is very extensive btw) if it was an issue? The only places I see this being an issue is by uninformed users on other platforms *cough* Crackberry *cough*

    Sent from my gesture controlled Nexus 4
    bekkay and Etios like this.
    08-25-13 12:45 PM
  23. ARWestenberger's Avatar
    I would say Android is more open like a PC, but BB10 has the active frames which are like windows on a PC.

    BlackBerry Z10 | Verizon | 10.2.0.1371
    08-25-13 12:47 PM
  24. grover5's Avatar
    I swear the android users get so defensive in these threads. Both operating systems work as a pocket PC. Use the one that gets things done the way you like to get things done. Cue the misinformation victim police in 3...2...

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:48 PM
  25. djsvet's Avatar
    I'm sorry..but your attempts to convince people about how Android multitasks are simply false. I can hit my multitask button (or actually swipe a gesture for it) and it currently shows me 11 recent tasks I've used..and some of those are from yesterday. None of them have been closed "randomly" on me by the kernel (not even my browser pages). .however I'm sure if I started opening 30+ apps it would end up closing some on me.

    Do you honestly think that there wouldn't be complaints about "true" multitasking amongst the Android community (which is very extensive btw) if it was an issue? The only places I see this being an issue is by uninformed users on other platforms *cough* Crackberry *cough*

    Sent from my gesture controlled Nexus 4
    When did I tried to convince anybody? I stated my opinion and people started to convince me I am wrong, I never asked for it.

    I don't care what the Android comunity thinks, all I know is that the Android I have CONTROLS ME AND I DON'T LIKE IT! Unfortunetely, I still use it, but I hope Santa can bring me Z30 this year (I have to use 2 phones )

    Posted via CB10
    08-25-13 12:53 PM
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