05-18-11 06:35 PM
36 12
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  1. Economist101's Avatar
    My Belief in the Retail stores would be for more than JUST selling the products, Apple "Geniuses" though they truly devalue the term could be a useful tool IF Apple products had depth, RIM products DO have depth
    Ah. So no "depth" in the Mac? No "depth" in any of the iOS products? Honestly, is that a fair characterization? While it's true you don't have to like anything that doesn't interest you, at least be fair in what you write; it makes your argument more powerful. Put another way, lines like what's above don't make your points about RIM any stronger, and they actually lead readers like me to think you have a bit of a blind spot.

    Also, as written, you suggest that the "Geniuses" aren't useful to Apple because the products lack "depth." I got news for you; even if your opinion of the products is dead-on accurate, the Geniuses have a tremendous value to Apple. If you can't see this, then you really do have a blind spot.
    05-16-11 09:55 PM
  2. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Ah. So no "depth" in the Mac? No "depth" in any of the iOS products? Honestly, is that a fair characterization? While it's true you don't have to like anything that doesn't interest you, at least be fair in what you write; it makes your argument more powerful. Put another way, lines like what's above don't make your points about RIM any stronger, and they actually lead readers like me to think you have a bit of a blind spot.

    Also, as written, you suggest that the "Geniuses" aren't useful to Apple because the products lack "depth." I got news for you; even if your opinion of the products is dead-on accurate, the Geniuses have a tremendous value to Apple. If you can't see this, then you really do have a blind spot.
    Depth MAY have been a poor choice of words, but the "beauty" of a Apple product is their simplistic nature, the fact that you do things one way, and one way only. the Apple "Geniuses" do have a value to Apple as Sales people, that can not be denied, Apple has an excellent model, and I think the model for products with more complexity(better word?) would see greater value from the model of dedicated reps.
    05-16-11 10:03 PM
  3. john_v's Avatar
    Great read! I'd love to see a lot of that implemented. The healthcare field could be a huge market if they went that direction.

    Derusset, next time you are that bored, can we get you working on the national debt?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-17-11 07:25 AM
  4. BBThemes's Avatar
    My Belief in the Retail stores would be for more than JUST selling the products.
    i know what your saying, and yes in principle i agree, however how effective and useful that would be to RIM from a return basis would be debatable. for example the apple geniuses can be afforded to be there because as i said no matter where you put an apple store the diverse range of products always gives it `something` that the shop nextdoor doesnt have. RIM with a tablet and phones (and granted some accessories) dont really have that range of a product portfolio for it to work. the store would have to turn a profit, and that wouldnt be an easy thing. as far as i know there arent really any other purely phone manufacturers out there with a decicated retail shop segment, its far easier to use the network shops, you may increase the risk of being overshadowed, but you minimise the inherent risk of setting up a store(s) and incurring costs from leasing premises, insurance, all the way to salarys and addition supply chain changes to incoporate deliverys to the store.

    like i say maybe a few select stores, such as they already have, would be the most viable route, or alternatively operate the stores in a franchise manner. more an `authorised dealer` than a manufacturer store, that way the risk is then shifted to the dealer.
    05-17-11 10:26 AM
  5. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    @BBThemes

    Currently any of the Blackberry Stores on the market are "authorized dealers" as RIM doesn't currently do Any direct to consumer sales.

    RIM makes a 25% Margin average on their smartphones to distribution lets say
    so at a build of cost $200 they currently sell the device to the Distribution channel for so RIM makes $66 per device, and remains profitable. at the Retail end of things they get to sell the devices at MSRP, as they can't undercut their distribution network, so a direct sale from a $200 cost would range in a 399-599 sale, being a 50% to 66% Margin, which is a considerable sale. for them to maintain open doors.

    These stores would have to be opened in key high populated areas with a strong business sector to support the Trainers salaries doing the training. possibly supporting kiosks in Major air ports supported by a branch store to supply inventory.

    While driving today I put more thought into my vision of a RIM retail store,

    in addition to what I previously mentioned in terms of inventory I do believe RIM as well as apple could support a minor apparel line within their stores, it would be exclusive to the Corporate stores giving people reason to come in, Margins on clothing are fantastic, AND clothing can increase brand awareness, so in addition to Products FOR blackberry RIM would authorize and distribute "BBM me" "Got BBM" "Blackberry _brandname_" etc tshirts, hoodies, and baseball caps, they would also make a few neck ties, have a BB inspired dress shirt partnered with quality brand ( Hugo Boss maybe?), Wallet, Money Clip, Coffee mug, etc, kind of the Blackberry "gift centre" the focus is the Blackberry "culture" so to speak, the BBM "culture" and to try and grass root push it back into the consumers minds/faces.

    a realistic square footage of a location like this would be in the 20' x 40' location with the centre isle being phones, the tablets having a eye catching pedestal containing product, and the clothing/accessories taking up the perimeter wall space.

    REALLY! I care most about the dedicated sales staff and contract trainers to maintain the BES user base and ensure they are getting the most out of the blackberry experience, so that the middle manager user misses his blackberry features when he tries another phone, as much as us Crackberry users miss the little things when we switch.
    05-17-11 02:41 PM
  6. CanuckBB's Avatar
    Stores still don't make a lot of sense. You're talking about 800sqf of retail space, so about 900sqf total. In the areas you'd want those stores, rent will easily cost you $50-$100sqf. Taxes will add another $10-$15sqf. average it out, and you're looking at say $80sqf. That's $6K per month for your space. It's not heated or lit yet. The build will be around $100K-$150K.

    So before you open the doors, you're down $100K of capex and $6K per month. Heat, light, phones, internet is another $1K/month. Salaries, $200K/yr.
    Tht's $16K per month. You need to clear $23K per month to keep operating. At that level, you haven't turned a profit, and you haven't started to repay the build cost. You gross $400 per device. You need to sell 60 devices per month to break even. That's a tall order. As a consumer, what's my incentive to go to a RIM store as opposed to a carrier store?
    05-17-11 04:07 PM
  7. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Stores still don't make a lot of sense. You're talking about 800sqf of retail space, so about 900sqf total. In the areas you'd want those stores, rent will easily cost you $50-$100sqf. Taxes will add another $10-$15sqf. average it out, and you're looking at say $80sqf. That's $6K per month for your space. It's not heated or lit yet. The build will be around $100K-$150K.

    So before you open the doors, you're down $100K of capex and $6K per month. Heat, light, phones, internet is another $1K/month. Salaries, $200K/yr.
    Tht's $16K per month. You need to clear $23K per month to keep operating. At that level, you haven't turned a profit, and you haven't started to repay the build cost. You gross $400 per device. You need to sell 60 devices per month to break even. That's a tall order. As a consumer, what's my incentive to go to a RIM store as opposed to a carrier store?
    Nice Break down.

    60 device, we'll round up to 90 device, so between phones and tablets to break even 3 units must be sold a day average, that is a far cry from a tall order, as a dedicated shop, those coming in are coming in for a purpose, they are coming in for RIM product, not to browse various lines, the sales people are selling RIM product, same way Apple Stores sell Apple product you go in to the store thinking maybe, you leave with product due to positive sales and education.

    use Toronto as an example, running a Store in the GTA could realistically expect 30 people a day to walk in, 10% you need to close a sale, with just walk in traffic, that is without your sales staff calling corporate customers to Blackberry renewals, and hardware maintenance, small business accounts of 10-15 devices, dealing with school districts, and factories, and dealing with the company's that already have BES in place. you also get to alleviate the help calls to RIM corporate as in your heavily populated areas they have a local place to call.

    I stand by my conviction that it could be made to work in Toronto, New York, Chicago, L.A., Washington DC, at the very least, and that it would prove profitable especially as RIM continues to push into the Tablet market.
    AND keeping in mind my suggestion for additional RIM products like a projector, presenter, and business card scanner.
    05-17-11 09:17 PM
  8. Daniel Ratcliffe's Avatar
    Also, one of the ways they could do it is build RIM Stores in places where there are only authorised Apple Resellers / nothing at all, rather than in direct competition with Apple Stores. Leeds for example would be a top-spot, we are one heck of a busy bustling city. No Apple Store. Why didn't Apple take advantage of that chance? They left it to a "Premium Reseller" called KCRS. An official RIM store would give that store a nice big slap in the face, and would work really well. Sheffield has an Apple Store, so I would say a RIM store would be futile there.
    05-18-11 02:36 PM
  9. CanuckBB's Avatar
    Nice Break down.
    Thanks.

    I'm still not convinced. If I know I want a BB, why go out of my way to a RIM store when a carrier store may be closer?

    And to really work in the large cities, you'd need to be downtown, and that just doubles my rent figures.

    It would be intersting to know what percentage of iPhones are sold at the Apple store as opposed to a carrier store. I would suspect that the bulk of the Apple store revenue comes from everything else.
    05-18-11 04:39 PM
  10. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Do note, that the store is MORE than just the Blackberry hand helds,

    With the Tablet sales, why NOT go to the RIM store, for the same price, deal with the person trained to show you the product, we are educated so we don't really see the value in having a properly trained sales person.

    BUT as a technical sales person, I can tell you that people choose to buy from the more educated people over the less educated people when buying products, the dealers who sell my product that know my product sell it better, AND for more money than those that just have it on the shelves. those that run training seminars see return customers due to the training seminar.

    I don't think RIM retail outlets could go breaking any records, BUT they certainly could support the entire RIM network, by putting a face to the brand that currently doesn't exist, a location to show case, products, and a training area for sales people.
    05-18-11 05:55 PM
  11. grover5's Avatar
    I was loving the BB store in the Minneapolis airport the other day. They had tons of phone models as well as playbooks and every case you could want for each. I couldn't stop playing with the 9000. What a great keyboard.
    05-18-11 06:35 PM
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