04-02-12 08:47 AM
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  1. Searzy's Avatar
    Apple files for trademark for new notification icon | Mobile - CNET News

    I've been SCREAMING this for the longest time: RIM needs to start playing like Apple, to beat Apple!

    Patent EVERY damn piece of device and software you got!

    RE: Apple

    Notification ICON for patent - COME ON! WTF?!?!!
    04-01-12 09:51 AM
  2. Chrisy's Avatar
    RIM should patent the LED with colors!
    llllBULLSEYE likes this.
    04-01-12 09:54 AM
  3. Bilaal's Avatar
    I agree, but getting patent a fricken icon is ridiculous.
    04-01-12 09:54 AM
  4. grover5's Avatar
    Apple blows. That is ridiculous. They have no concept of choice.
    04-01-12 09:56 AM
  5. axllebeer's Avatar
    Good Lord. For an icon? Why would anyone want to make it look the same anyway.
    04-01-12 10:01 AM
  6. grunt0300's Avatar
    Apple blows. That is ridiculous. They have no concept of choice.
    I'm not an Apple fanboy. I rock Android. However, it's attitudes like yours that have made Apple the corporate giant that it is today. Don't protect what you've designed, just scream that the other guy "blows", while watching him steal your stuff, and make a fortune.
    04-01-12 10:13 AM
  7. ichat's Avatar
    ooohhhh looks so original... Havent I seen this before on my BB? So what if number replaces the star. I hate these guys.
    04-01-12 10:13 AM
  8. Searzy's Avatar
    SO, I guess RIM should patent the "little envelope" icon for mail, and the "little red star/circle" for apps updated icon?

    Sometime earlier this week Kevin posted a main blog about some patent infringement that RIM was being accused of - something to do with swiping. (i think)
    04-01-12 10:17 AM
  9. Hyphenation's Avatar
    Holy overreaction. It's a trademark application, not a patent application.
    TGR1 likes this.
    04-01-12 11:00 AM
  10. Searzy's Avatar
    Holy overreaction. It's a trademark application, not a patent application.
    What's the difference?

    To my knowledge trademarks are associated with the name, or company logo, i.e. Apple tm, the Apple, BlackBerry tm, the Berry.

    Why would a visual notification require a trademark? It doesn't identify the trade.
    04-01-12 11:06 AM
  11. TGR1's Avatar
    What's the difference?

    To my knowledge trademarks are associated with the name, or company logo, i.e. Apple tm, the Apple, BlackBerry tm, the Berry.

    Why would a visual notification require a trademark? It doesn't identify the trade.
    You just answered your own question. A trademark is for whatever is intimately associated with the brand. You do know the company is Research in Motion and not Blackberry?

    Visual design cues in particular impact us very strongly; for example, when I see cute golden retriever pups I do get reminded of the Dirt Devil ads. It's well-known that marketing using cute baby animals, particularly puppies, positively impacts sales. Of course I am not talking trademark here but take it a step further to a design element linked to a particular brand. The logo is an excellent example. Another would be all the visuals for iOS and Android OS version: the specific depictions of certain cats, the honeybee. Apple's Map icon came up last year or so because someone (oh, I want to say Samsung )copied it just a little too closely. The icon is not only very recognizable, it's a map pointing to 1 Infinity Loop, Apple's home.

    Apple has a new icon it wants to use and doesn't want too close copying of it when they do start. Completely common behaviour. I bet HTC has trademarked a lot of its Sense UI, because it distinguishes that brand from all other Androids, just as I am sure that RIM has trademarked visuals and words for things linked to Blackberry as well as RIM.

    BTW, sound is also a very powerful association and can also be trademarked.

    And yeah, patents are completely different from trademark.
    Last edited by TGR1; 04-01-12 at 01:05 PM.
    04-01-12 12:48 PM
  12. Searzy's Avatar
    Thanks for that explanation, particularly the Google Map icon example. However, isn't that icon part of the Google Maps (specific) logo?

    I think the notifications is a little to broad to justify the protection.

    Is your example of the puppies something that has been trademarked, OR is it an association of the brand based on marketing efforts. I totally understand the effects of visual association, but there must be some standard of what is accepted as a trademark or simply a visual cue.

    I just think that this attempt by Apple is too broad.

    Also, this is Apples "thing", patenting / trademarking anything they can. One of the reasons why Google purchased Motorola.
    04-01-12 01:03 PM
  13. MobileMadness002's Avatar
    RIM should apply for a patent on the process of applying for a patent before Apple does.
    04-01-12 01:15 PM
  14. grunt0300's Avatar
    RIM should apply for a patent on the process of applying for a patent before Apple does.
    Too late. Apple applied for it already!
    04-01-12 01:22 PM
  15. addicted44's Avatar
    The posts on this thread are so off the mark.

    The headline reveals it itself. This is NOT a PATENT. It is TRADEMARK.

    Extremely different things. The difference is that Apple does not own the idea, however, they can legally pursue someone if they use the same icon in an attempt to confuse a user that theirs is an Apple product.
    04-01-12 02:46 PM
  16. TGR1's Avatar
    Thanks for that explanation, particularly the Google Map icon example. However, isn't that icon part of the Google Maps (specific) logo?
    It is not a Google Maps icon but for the proprietary Maps app used on Apple's iOS and is meant to tie that design to their product. In fact, I read that Apple is not using Google maps for the content.

    I think the notifications is a little to broad to justify the protection.
    I believe you are still thinking patents and operation. That is not what this is about. This is exactly along the lines of the BB logo or Macdonalds golden arches and purely for the design of that icon that Apple is showing.

    Why? Someone sees this icon and thinks, "Oh, I know that cute picture! It's for an Apple phone. I hear they are really easy to use and have great quality and the company treats their customers well. I need a new phone. Gotta check it out".

    Same idea as for the USB icon (multiarmed thingy) which appears on a gazillion devices. From the usb.org website:

    "In order to realize this opportunity, USB products must continue to enhance the consumers' experience through high quality and ease of use. That's why USB Implementers Forum, Inc. introduced trademark-protected logos for use with qualified products. To qualify for the right to display the certified USB logo in conjunction with a product, the product must pass USB-IF compliance testing for product quality."

    You see? It's about association with expectations (and of course money ). Apple has spent a lot of effort building their brand, which consequently has a very high reputation for certain things, and which consequently feeds into promoting sales. They do not want to:

    a) lose customers to rivals who piggyback on their work by copying
    b) risk having their brand diluted by identical designs everywhere
    c) risk losing their high reputation by poor quality knockoffs who fool customers into buying the copies

    The above holds for every reputable company out there. Trademarks can be very important.

    RIM has had its share of trademark issues: BBM as trademark conflict with BBM Canada. This is unfortunate for RIM because BBM really is understood in the vernacular as their messaging service so to be able to freely wave a trademark around would be powerful. Pity they didn't settle years ago before BBM took off and clearly became of great value and thus the sale price jumped.

    Is your example of the puppies something that has been trademarked, OR is it an association of the brand based on marketing efforts. I totally understand the effects of visual association, but there must be some standard of what is accepted as a trademark or simply a visual cue.
    As I said, that was not a trademark issue but an example of how strong visual cues can be.

    Also, this is Apples "thing", patenting / trademarking anything they can. One of the reasons why Google purchased Motorola.
    Again, you must separate patents and trademarks. Motorola was purely about patents, not trademarks. And as I pointed out above, people really shouldn't dismiss Apple's or any other company's attempts to protect their brand.

    What do you think of when you think Blackberry? Seems to me it is security. They really should have trademarked some phrase to promote that years ago. Now, with all the privacy stuff going around particularly with Google and FB, pulling out an old, well-known catch phrase about security would have been powerful, like a security blanket. It wouldn't matter that BB is also now associated with old, stodgy, lagging, etc. Seasoned can be good if marketed right.
    04-01-12 03:09 PM
  17. TGR1's Avatar
    BTW, that proposed icon is interesting. IIRC iOS doesn't currently have a dynamic screen update; they are essentially just screen draws so the icon is static and doesn't actually show live numbers (calendar would be affected too). Now this makes me wonder if Apple is going that route in iOS 6. I think I read somewhere that Android can show a widget on the screen that dynamically updates. True? If so, then I hope RIM is observing since that would mean the two major mobile OSs are setting a common path RIM has to match.
    Last edited by TGR1; 04-01-12 at 03:22 PM.
    04-01-12 03:20 PM
  18. Searzy's Avatar
    Mr.TGR1,

    Thank for your further clarification, I honestly didn't know how a "trademark" is determined. Yes, the BBM example, and subsequent BBX issue are examples of association with the companies.

    Though, I still don't understand how notification icons reflect the company. Of the examples, such as "the golden arches" they are "things" that are visually associated with the company logo.

    Maybe if Apple begins playing commercials with the notification icons, then trademark can be applied?

    I find that especially in the last few years there is A LOT of legalities involved in smartphone (rapid growth) industry. Too many legalities make it super hard for competition to exist, which isn't good for us the consumer.

    I assume that "there's an app for that" can (and probably has) been trademarked by Apple?
    (its never been said before the Apple commercials)
    04-01-12 06:11 PM
  19. madman0141's Avatar
    This is what businesses do when they have successful products and what to protect them. I think this is great so I don't get confused and buy a piece of Apple junk.
    04-01-12 06:17 PM
  20. len5's Avatar
    We all love to tease Apple but they are kicking RIM's all over the court. Maybe RIM should stop hiring BB fanboys and hire someone away from Apple. They couldn't do any worse than RIM's past and present leaders.
    04-01-12 08:00 PM
  21. grover5's Avatar
    I'm not an Apple fanboy. I rock Android. However, it's attitudes like yours that have made Apple the corporate giant that it is today. Don't protect what you've designed, just scream that the other guy "blows", while watching him steal your stuff, and make a fortune.
    That's an oversimplification and pretty emotional. I don't agree with you and I do think apple blows. I guess we'll just have to live with not agreeing.
    04-01-12 08:39 PM
  22. Economist101's Avatar
    That's an oversimplification and pretty emotional.
    In light of your previous post in this thread, I think we can call you an expert on "oversimplification" and "emotional" responses.
    04-01-12 10:08 PM
  23. hootyhoo's Avatar
    I would almost bet the farm that RIM has their share of trademarks on icons.
    04-01-12 10:15 PM
  24. TGR1's Avatar
    Mr.TGR1,
    Ms, actually

    Though, I still don't understand how notification icons reflect the company. Of the examples, such as "the golden arches" they are "things" that are visually associated with the company logo.

    Maybe if Apple begins playing commercials with the notification icons, then trademark can be applied?
    Excellent example of where trademarked items are potentially valuable. Apple's current ad campaign focuses a lot on showing how easily people use the touchscreen for a gazillion purposes; and thus the viewer is exposed to closeups of the screen and thus the icons a lot. Repetition and exposure builds awareness and familiarity.

    Note, though, that it's not that the icon is used in commercials that makes it desirable to trademark but that it is a highly visible design element that is fundamental to iOS. The brand association is important.

    I assume that "there's an app for that" can (and probably has) been trademarked by Apple?
    (its never been said before the Apple commercials)
    Googling says Patently Apple: back in Dec 2009. Remarkably effective. Verizon's "Can you hear me now?" is another excellent one that simply and immediately associates Verizon's claimed strength (superior call quality) versus AT&T. And effective trademarks have longevity. Verizon's is from back in 2004 and to this day it evokes in me a strong association with call quality. Note I don't use Verizon so haven't a clue if it's true but if it weren't for being CDMA, I would be strongly tempted to check Verizon's phones out.
    Last edited by TGR1; 04-02-12 at 12:23 AM.
    04-02-12 12:18 AM
  25. PineappleUnderTheSea's Avatar
    I believe Apple is still the most sued tech company in the world--this began in 2008 right after the release of the iPhone.

    So maaaaybe it kinda makes sense that Apple is trying to trademark (and patent) everything it can to protect itself?

    You should see the non-sense crap that we use to patents at the companies I worked for, simply to defend ourselves from a couple of our competitors who were known to try to patent around our patents simply to block us from practicing.

    So I'm not surprised at all that Apple feels to need to protect itself.
    04-02-12 08:12 AM
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