09-23-08 10:19 AM
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  1. 2020's Avatar
    I understand that a data package is required, but your explanation of why is irrelevant to my previous post. It's completely presumptuous to infer that the desire for a blackberry without data is due to a lack of funds or intelligence.
    08-12-08 02:54 PM
  2. WackBerry's Avatar
    I can certainly understand wanting to stick with the family plan, saves a buttload of money all the way around.....

    and as far as "littered with clueless presumptuousness....and bad analogies"

    I take it you're a user not a sales or support rep, try looking at it from another angle, if your job consists of trying to explain to people why their phone doesn't do what they think it should do without the data package, and why they're required to have it. Aside from that, whether it's a line we as reps are told to get customers to buy it, or whether it's true, we're told that the data package is a requirement from RIM, and is part of the contract signed between the carriers and RIM when the phones are purchased. I'm not sure how sprint and verizon work, but, I do know that alltel has an automated system that checks ESN's active in the system, when it finds a blackberry, if it doesn't have either the BIS, BES, or BIS/BES feature added, it automatically adds the BIS/BES feature. My understanding (which may be wrong, I admit, I've only got what I'm given by the carrier I work for to go off of) is the reason that GSM users can get away with not having the data package, is because the ESN of the phone isn't tracked in the billing systems, only the SIM card, and since there's no difference in SIM card between a blackberry or a RAZR or any other phone, they can't track whether a blackberry is being used, to enforce the feature being added.

    If what info I'm given by my carrier is right, the data package truly isn't OPTIONAL, it's just not enforcable on the GSM networks like it is on the CDMA ones. Verizon or Sprint customers, speak up, do you have the choice in whether you have the blackberry feature, or do you not? I know verizon's website before they went to the bundle setup they have now forced you to have the data feature if you were ordering a blackberry, but, I don't know if you're required to have it if you get it in the store.

    I dont think I understand how your response has anything to do with what alot of people posted in this thread?

    Yes I agree, if I remember correctly Data package is not optional...but then again I dont know for sure b/c regardless I would have gotten the data plan.

    I think what 2020 meant was people were making comparisons that had nothing to do with the topic at hand...going to a benz dealership and getting a kia~this is the one that sticks out in my head at the moment but there were plenty of others~they are mostly ALL bad analogies. Not everyone needs data or the unlimited for that matter. I think people saying that they are upset or angered or annoyed by people who dont have the data is a little child-ish...let them learn their lesson for themselves if they dont want to save money. If someone does something and it doesnt affect me why should I care? Or laugh about it? Most of us are adults and some are acting like children. Just because someone doesnt get data doesnt mean they cant afford it or that they drive a kia so to speak~it just means they dont care or they dont need it.

    That is just my opinion, I think the OP worded the topic wrong and meant it in a different way and of course is sparked a silly debate and its one big circle

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Last edited by WackBerry; 08-12-08 at 03:06 PM.
    08-12-08 02:55 PM
  3. cousinb's Avatar
    Agree with WackBerry, the thread has gone off on a tangent. I don't think OP worded it quite right, but he has said a couple of times he was refering to people who want data without paying for it, not those who choose not to have data for whatever reason.
    08-12-08 03:30 PM
  4. CurveBerry's Avatar
    Well, not all of us are able to afford a data plan at the moment. That's not to say that I won't eventually get a data plan, but right now I'm a student and I don't have money laying around to pay for a plan. I do not use the browser on my BB...I have a laptop and I use wi-fi at school. Once I've graduated and I'm settled in my career then I will get a data plan. That doesn't mean I'm dumb or that I shouldn't have a BB in the first place. I use the phone for PHONE CALLS and TEXTING and I use the camera. But I mainly rely on it for the calendar. I refuse to ask my parents to pay for my service, so I pay my little phone bill every month and go along on my merry little way. If that makes me less of a BB user then so be it. And by no means am I lacking in intelligence!
    <end of rant>
    Last edited by CurveBerry; 08-12-08 at 03:54 PM.
    08-12-08 03:50 PM
  5. dhyde79's Avatar
    I understand that a data package is required, but your explanation of why is irrelevant to my previous post. It's completely presumptuous to infer that the desire for a blackberry without data is due to a lack of funds or intelligence.
    It is a bit of a stereotype to presume that someone wants a blackberry, but isn't willing to pay for the data, due to lack of funds, or simply suggesting that they're lacking on intelligence for wanting an advanced device without the features that make it advanced, but, unfortunately, in order for a stereotype to exist, it has to have been shown to be correct a fair number of times. I've actually got a few of my friends personally that swear they want a blackberry, but they don't ever text, they have no need for the data features, or anything else, and the two most common excuses for not wanting that...."I'm not smart enough to know how to do all of that stuff" or "I can't afford the extra it'd make my bill go up". 99% of customers that get hooked on the phone's capabilities but turn the phone down fit one of those two reasons. So while yes, I agree that it's not fair to presume that someone with a blackberry but no data feature fits one, or both, of those two catagories, it's not entirely unreasonable.

    Well, not all of us are able to afford a data plan at the moment.
    I completely understand, and sympathize.

    That doesn't mean I'm dumb or that I shouldn't have a BB in the first place. I use the phone for PHONE CALLS and TEXTING and I use the camera. But I mainly rely on it for the calendar.
    not to be an @$$, but, with the fact that the data is a REQUIRED part of the contract between both your carrier and RIM, as well as your carrier and YOU, if you can't afford the data package, it does, unfortunately, mean that you shouldn't have a blackberry, there are plenty of phones that make phone calls, text message, have cameras, and calendars....infact, I can't think of any camera phone that I've seen in the past 4 or so years that doesn't have the calendar. I'm not suggesting you're unintelligent for not having the data package, merely suggesting that if it's a requirement to have it for the phone, you should either have it, or not have the phone at all.

    I refuse to ask my parents to pay for my service
    on a side note, that's very admirable, too few people with the same philosophy in the world these days.....
    Last edited by dhyde79; 08-12-08 at 04:32 PM.
    08-12-08 04:23 PM
  6. SevereDeceit's Avatar
    It doesn't make me mad, i just don't know why you would want a Berry with no data. That's like a corvette with a 4 cylinder engine...
    08-12-08 04:26 PM
  7. WackBerry's Avatar



    not to be an @$$, but, with the fact that the data is a REQUIRED part of the contract between both your carrier and RIM, as well as your carrier and YOU, if you can't afford the data package, it does, unfortunately, mean that you shouldn't have a blackberry, there are plenty of phones that make phone calls, text message, have cameras, and calendars....infact, I can't think of any camera phone that I've seen in the past 4 or so years that doesn't have the calendar. I'm not suggesting you're unintelligent for not having the data package, merely suggesting that if it's a requirement to have it for the phone, you should either have it, or not have the phone at all.



    Obivously its not required by their carrier if they have the BB and dont use the data and arent paying for it.

    I dont understand what the argument is. If someone wants a BB for texting and it isnt required by their carrier to have data then so be it...if its required then obviously their phone wouldnt work.
    You keep trying to make this point that its "REQUIRED" and you cant have a BB without data...if that was the case then why are there so many people using a BB without data?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 04:35 PM
  8. jenaywins's Avatar
    Obivously its not required by their carrier if they have the BB and dont use the data and arent paying for it.

    I dont understand what the argument is. If someone wants a BB for texting and it isnt required by their carrier to have data then so be it...if its required then obviously their phone wouldnt work.
    You keep trying to make this point that its "REQUIRED" and you cant have a BB without data...if that was the case then why are there so many people using a BB without data?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    You need to research, apparently. Certain carriers require data, others do not. Verizon, for example, DOES require data.
    08-12-08 04:38 PM
  9. SevereDeceit's Avatar
    You need to research, apparently. Certain carriers require data, others do not. Verizon, for example, DOES require data.
    Oh yeah! you are not walking out of Verizon with a Berry that has no data plan...
    08-12-08 04:40 PM
  10. jenaywins's Avatar
    Oh yeah! you are not walking out of Verizon with a Berry that has no data plan...
    Yup. In fact, if you aren't careful, Verizon will "accidentally" put you on BES instead of BIS, which is $15/month more.
    08-12-08 04:42 PM
  11. WackBerry's Avatar
    You need to research, apparently. Certain carriers require data, others do not. Verizon, for example, DOES require data.
    You need to read, i said some require it others dont! Im on my phone and cant see their carrier. Funny bc I am on verizon and remember the supervisor telling me it wasnt required but i would be paying for any data I did use.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 04:44 PM
  12. WackBerry's Avatar
    again, it seems like some get one answer and others get a different answer.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 04:46 PM
  13. jenaywins's Avatar
    Funny bc I am on verizon and remember the supervisor telling me it wasnt required but i would be paying for any data I did use.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Um. Yeah. Tell you what... Go down to a Verizon store right now, and attempt to purchase a Blackberry and activate it on their network without a data plan. Go ahead. I'll wait.
    08-12-08 04:49 PM
  14. WackBerry's Avatar
    Um. Yeah. Tell you what... Go down to a Verizon store right now, and attempt to purchase a Blackberry and activate it on their network without a data plan. Go ahead. I'll wait.
    I dont need to go to a store...my boss owns a VZW store and he said the same thing, everyone will say something different you dont NEED a data plan but its recommended b/c just about everything you do will use it.
    And your snide comments arent amusing to me, I know they may be to everyone else.

    There was no arguing or fighting going on until you decided to come and make smart comments for no reason. I was pointing out that a poster said they didnt have data and werent paying for it "ON THEIR BB" which would mean they have a BB and they dont have data right?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 04:57 PM
  15. jenaywins's Avatar
    I dont need to go to a store...my boss owns a VZW store and he said the same thing, everyone will say something different you dont NEED a data plan but its recommended b/c just about everything you do will use it.
    And your snide comments arent amusing to me, I know they may be to everyone else.

    There was no arguing or fighting going on until you decided to come and make smart comments for no reason. I was pointing out that a poster said they didnt have data and werent paying for it "ON THEIR BB" which would mean they have a BB and they dont have data right?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    No one is arguing or fighting, I am simply pointing out the flaws in your logic - plain and simple. Maybe this will make you feel better, here ya go:

    Better? Good.

    Anyhow. If your boss owns a VZW store, then does that make you a VZW employee? Data plans are required when activating a Blackberry on Verizon's network, period. There is no "everyone says different" in this instance. It is as black and white as it comes.
    08-12-08 05:00 PM
  16. dhyde79's Avatar
    again, it seems like some get one answer and others get a different answer.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    They do, and therein lies the problem.

    also, for the one who says "do research" I did, called both phone sales and the local retail store for AT&T Wireless, and they both told me that yes data is required, I'd call t-mobile but, they don't exist in my area, the same was done with sprint, and the same answer.

    the way you get a blackberry without the data plan is simple, as I said above, GSM networks don't have a way to track if the PHONE is a certain serial number, they track your IMEI which comes from the SIM card. so if you call their customer service and request the blackberry feature be removed, they can't tell if you have a 'berry or not, and, if you go and buy the 'berry on ebay, and put your SIM card in it, they have no way of knowing that you've activated a blackberry. on the other hand, the CDMA carriers (Alltel/Sprint/Verizon) directly put the phone's serial in, and their system can verify that if it's a blackberry, that it has the data feature.
    08-12-08 05:02 PM
  17. Laurlaur576's Avatar
    Wowzers. Total and utter WOWZERS. Is wowzers even a word? Furthermore, a word to be used with 'total and utter'?

    Here's the deal children - and the absolute black and bottom line: do not whine, b*$#ch and moan about 'why can't I check my yahoo/Gmail/facebook/MySpace/titsandass/whateverthefuk on my BB???' If you DO NOT have the data plan. Simple. Total and utter... Nevermind.

    Whether you do or do not IS completely up to you, the end user! If you wanna text your BFF Rose like Grandma, fine. I love the BB for calendar, txt, etc. Just don't complain like my lovely coworker when you will not have these services at your disposal if not paid for.

    Thank you all - much love!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 05:04 PM
  18. WackBerry's Avatar
    No one is arguing or fighting, I am simply pointing out the flaws in your logic - plain and simple. Maybe this will make you feel better, here ya go:

    Better? Good.

    Anyhow. If your boss owns a VZW store, then does that make you a VZW employee? Data plans are required when activating a Blackberry on Verizon's network, period. There is no "everyone says different" in this instance. It is as black and white as it comes.
    Im not a VZW employee, he owns a store and someone else runs it.
    Regardless that has nothing to with the topic at hand.
    Are there not a handful of posters on here saying they are running their BBs without data? We arent speaking about Verizon specifically its generally. You are saying my logic is flawed~it is if posters are lying and saying they dont have data when they do on their BB? It is if the SV that I talked to didnt know what he was talking about or the rep too? Correct or is that wrong? Many people have stated they didnt NEED a data plan to activate their BB.

    AND if the case was you had to have a data plan......why is the name of this thread "any of you get upset when people try and use a berry without a data plan" hmm that would insinuate that people can have a BB without a data plan. Yes I know he didnt mean it that way...but many answered that exact question so obviously there are people out there who DO NOT have a data plan on their working BB

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 05:06 PM
  19. gs warrior 88's Avatar
    Wowzers. Total and utter WOWZERS. Is wowzers even a word? Furthermore, a word to be used with 'total and utter'?

    Here's the deal children - and the absolute black and bottom line: do not whine, b*$#ch and moan about 'why can't I check my yahoo/Gmail/facebook/MySpace/titsandass/whateverthefuk on my BB???' If you DO NOT have the data plan. Simple. Total and utter... Nevermind.

    Whether you do or do not IS completely up to you, the end user! If you wanna text your BFF Rose like Grandma, fine. I love the BB for calendar, txt, etc. Just don't complain like my lovely coworker when you will not have these services at your disposal if not paid for.

    Thank you all - much love!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    WOW! Well put. I couldn't have said it any better myself. And thats the bottom line cuz....

    and yes it is true there are many many BB users out there with NO data plan. But when they come on here saying "how come i can't set up my email", "where is my browser icon", "I am doing email setup but there is no option to setup personal mail". Now you know why they need that data plan. But if you don't have it then thats your choice, i am all for it. Enjoy your phone while i enjoy my berry.
    Have a nice day
    Last edited by gs warrior 88; 08-12-08 at 05:13 PM.
    08-12-08 05:08 PM
  20. dhyde79's Avatar
    I dont need to go to a store...my boss owns a VZW store and he said the same thing.
    that's not a verizon store, that's an authorized dealer, and no offense to your boss, as he may try to run a very tight ship with proper info for his reps, but, if I had a penny for every time I've heard misinformation out of an authorized dealer, I'd be the owner of 5 ferraris 2 million dollar homes, and would never have to work again.

    the only place you get ACCURATE info from any cell company is corporate locations, and the company is the only one that owns those locations.
    08-12-08 05:08 PM
  21. jenaywins's Avatar
    If the fact that your boss owns a VZW store has nothing to do with the topic at hand, why did you bring it up? Hmm.

    I would like you to point out where I said that you simply cannot run a BB without data on any carrier. Period. I used Verizon as an example, as they do NOT allow you to activate Blackberries without data. End of story, and I won't point that out again.
    08-12-08 05:09 PM
  22. jenaywins's Avatar
    that's not a verizon store, that's an authorized dealer, and no offense to your boss, as he may try to run a very tight ship with proper info for his reps, but, if I had a penny for every time I've heard misinformation out of an authorized dealer, I'd be the owner of 5 ferraris 2 million dollar homes, and would never have to work again.

    the only place you get ACCURATE info from any cell company is corporate locations, and the company is the only one that owns those locations.
    And there it is, folks.
    08-12-08 05:10 PM
  23. WackBerry's Avatar
    If the fact that your boss owns a VZW store has nothing to do with the topic at hand, why did you bring it up? Hmm.

    I would like you to point out where I said that you simply cannot run a BB without data on any carrier. Period. I used Verizon as an example, as they do NOT allow you to activate Blackberries without data. End of story, and I won't point that out again.

    bc you were being a smart *** and told me to go to a store...when I had already asked him

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 05:13 PM
  24. jenaywins's Avatar
    bc you were being a smart *** and told me to go to a store...when I had already asked him

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Not being a smart ***, just driving my point home. Thanks. And again... You brought it up.
    08-12-08 05:14 PM
  25. WackBerry's Avatar
    If the fact that your boss owns a VZW store has nothing to do with the topic at hand, why did you bring it up? Hmm.

    I would like you to point out where I said that you simply cannot run a BB without data on any carrier. Period. I used Verizon as an example, as they do NOT allow you to activate Blackberries without data. End of story, and I won't point that out again.

    Which if I remember correctly is what I said? Did I not say some require it some dont? or am I just making that up in my head

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    08-12-08 05:14 PM
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