03-10-10 03:07 AM
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  1. jd914's Avatar
    Being an owner of a Nexus One, an iPhone 3G and a dedicated Blackberry 9700 owner I have to agree with this commentary.

    03-07-10 10:06 AM
  2. Crucial_Xtreme's Avatar
    This topic isn't in direct correlation with the 9700 so I'm moving to General BlackBerry Discussion. TIA.
    03-07-10 10:08 AM
  3. anon(13322)'s Avatar
    I so agree with ALL 5. The OS needs a COMPLETE overhaul. Its 2010, Rim. All 5.0 OS did was add a skin overtop of the already outdated looking OS. Let's hope 6.0 look completely different than the rest. And I still get confused with all these BB models. I don't see how rim even keeps up with it...Tour, Bold, Storm, Pearl, etc. Sigh!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-07-10 10:16 AM
  4. GG1's Avatar
    I so agree with ALL 5. The OS needs a COMPLETE overhaul. Its 2010, Rim. All 5.0 OS did was add a skin overtop of the already outdated looking OS. Let's hope 6.0 look completely different than the rest. And I still get confused with all these BB models. I don't see how rim even keeps up with it...Tour, Bold, Storm, Pearl, etc. Sigh!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    By the time 6.0 comes out, the competition will still be way ahead.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-07-10 10:18 AM
  5. Reed McLay's Avatar
    1. Trash and restart the Operating System to look like the other guys.

    2. Reduce the number of models. The reviewer finds counting beyond three unacceptable.

    3. Keep track of quality control. "I have heard rumours ..."

    4. Build up BlackBerry App World. Bring on the developers.

    5. Expand what they can do.

    5a. Buy Palm.

    Gary Krakow is TheStreet.comcom's senior technology correspondent.

    I wonder if there may be alternate motives?


    Gary Krakow’s BlackBerry Is Broken And He Is Really Upset About It…

    Gary Krakow, Senior Technology Correspondent for the TheStreet.com, has a jammed up trackball in his BlackBerry 8820 that won’t allow him to scroll up or down and he is pretty upset about it.


    ...All the new BlackBerrys, with trackballs, have been coming back busted in 6 months ...
    03-07-10 10:51 AM
  6. LuckyBastad's Avatar
    As long as RIM keeps BB's in the hands of those who are comfortable with the system. I feel they will hold in place just fine. I am sure they will improve upon these things as time moves on.
    03-07-10 11:06 AM
  7. F0nage's Avatar
    If I liked the look and feel of other phone OS I would have bought those devices. They all suck, RIM just sucks less.

    I agree with Reed, model proliferation is bad, expensive, and I would add can be a little dishonest. As long as they sell most of their handsets through carriers and corp. deals I'm not sure if it matters though.

    I like the old Palm devices, but I don't know if many/any of the guys who made Palm so great in the early days are still around. What would RIM buy Palm for? If it's just a webkit browser, that seems like it's already in the works. The devices they sell now aren't for me and I don't think can add anything to RIM.

    From my discussions with guys who write code for BB devices, RIM needs to do a lot of work to clean up their interfaces and document things properly. RIM should make a point of positioning the 3rd party developers as partners to fill gaps in the app portfolio instead of just sortof tolerating them.
    03-07-10 11:12 AM
  8. CGI's Avatar
    I can agree with that list.

    RIM is still a leader and has good products, but they are losing grip; the OS, the device differentiation, the quality, the internet experience... all slipping to competition.
    03-07-10 11:53 AM
  9. rainor94's Avatar
    He's right. I hope they don't destroy palm though.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-07-10 11:55 AM
  10. Samuell's Avatar
    When he said buy palm I was like that is the best idea I have ever heard! With some blackberry design elements the palm pre could turn to be an awesome phone in a few generations.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-07-10 12:17 PM
  11. jd914's Avatar
    RIM tried going a different direction with the Storm and failed miserably. The Storm is a sub par touch screen device with the same Blackberry OS loaded into it. Along with a major software upgrade RIM also needs to do a major hardware overhaul. As much as I like my 9700 it's a faster version of a curve 8320 which I had a few years ago. Their hardware/software formula worked and kept them on top but the competition is coming out with better faster devices.
    03-07-10 12:19 PM
  12. jd914's Avatar

    Gary Krakow is TheStreet.comcom's senior technology correspondent.

    I wonder if there may be alternate motives?

    All he's doing is stating the obvious. I also returned a few Blackberries with trackball issues. That video is a few years old and it holds true today thats why RIM's is making devices with trackpads. Regardless of his motive he has valid points of what RIM needs to do to keep up with the competition (i didnt say stay ahead because their behind technology wise).
    03-07-10 12:45 PM
  13. Reed McLay's Avatar
    RIM tried going a different direction with the Storm and failed miserably. The Storm is a sub par touch screen device with the same Blackberry OS loaded into it. Along with a major software upgrade RIM also needs to do a major hardware overhaul. As much as I like my 9700 it's a faster version of a curve 8320 which I had a few years ago. Their hardware/software formula worked and kept them on top but the competition is coming out with better faster devices.
    IMHO, that is exactly the point of design evolution. You begin with a World Beating idea and continue to refine and develop it.

    Anybody can master the upgrade in seconds. There is no learning curve and that is critical when the senior level employees are the ones learning.

    Upgrading to the optical sensor is one more improvement, one that they hold the patent for.

    03-07-10 01:08 PM
  14. Masahiro's Avatar
    *Yawn* I hope this guy doesn't get paid for this. He sounds like he just spent a day on the CB forums and shared his findings.
    03-07-10 01:21 PM
  15. jd914's Avatar
    IMHO, that is exactly the point of design evolution. You begin with a World Beating idea and continue to refine and develop it.

    There's a difference between refining/redevelop and rehashing, RIM is rehashing the same idea over and over.

    My comparison to the 8320/9700 was to point out that in two years it's basically the same device. Obviously the 9700 is faster BUT what ground breaking cutting edge technology does it have compared to the curve 8320? A trackpad? That's just a quick fix to a huge problem that plagued previous Blackberries. Two years in technological time is an eternity and RIM simply isn't staying ahead.
    Last edited by JD914; 03-07-10 at 01:27 PM.
    03-07-10 01:25 PM
  16. Masahiro's Avatar
    There's a difference between refining/redevelop and rehashing, RIM is rehashing the same idea over and over.
    If that "same idea" is selling in droves, why change it?
    03-07-10 01:32 PM
  17. K Bear's Avatar
    IMHO, that is exactly the point of design evolution. You begin with a World Beating idea and continue to refine and develop it.

    Anybody can master the upgrade in seconds. There is no learning curve and that is critical when the senior level employees are the ones learning.

    Upgrading to the optical sensor is one more improvement, one that they hold the patent for.

    This is exactly why I stay with RIM products. No matter what the upgrade to the OS is, the learning curve is slight. Having to sit down and read a manual to figure out how to use your phone is a waste of time and money.

    Yes, RIM doesn't have all the bells and whistles that other manufactures have. So long as they remember to keep up on quality control and keep making steady progress in design and OS development, RIM will remain strong.
    03-07-10 01:32 PM
  18. anon(13322)'s Avatar
    If that "same idea" is selling in droves, why change it?
    Hmm, have you been living under a rock the past year or so? Apple and Android will eventually surpass Blackberry marketshare; well, Apple will next year if the iPhone is released to all carriers. And plus, you can get Blackberries for FREE, thats ONE reason why they are selling so well. Once Android and Apple catch up and appeal to business consumers, then Blackberry is pretty much in an awkward situation. Blackberry will be the new Palm in FIVE years if it doesn't make DRASTIC changes. Imagine -- Apple and Android will have everything the Blackberry has PLUS more in five years...security, e-mail, BBM (Well, it won't be called this, but something similiar) and etc. Blackberry needs to stop living off their name and this outdated OS! Its becoming ANNOYING!
    03-07-10 01:41 PM
  19. Masahiro's Avatar
    Hmm, have you been living under a rock the past year or so? Apple and Android will eventually surpass Blackberry marketshare; well, Apple will next year if the iPhone is released to all carriers. And plus, you can get Blackberries for FREE, thats ONE reason why they are selling so well. Once Android and Apple catch up and appeal to business consumers, then Blackberry is pretty much in an awkward situation. Blackberry will be the new Palm in FIVE years if it doesn't make DRASTIC changes. Imagine -- Apple and Android will have everything the Blackberry has PLUS more in five years...security, e-mail, BBM (Well, it won't be called this, but something similiar) and etc. Blackberry needs to stop living off their name and this outdated OS! Its becoming ANNOYING!
    Rawr! You're angry! Seriously though, I did not say whether RIM should or shouldn't make changes. I'm simply stating the obvious. If RIM has something that is currently selling well, they have no reason to "overhaul" their OS. Until they reach a point that PalmOS and WindowsMobile has reached (that is, single digit marketshare), RIM really doesn't have to lift a finger. They just have too much at stake right now to change up their OS and risk losing a large portion of their user base that prefers the "outdated OS" they currently have.

    But let's see what OS6 brings to the table.
    03-07-10 01:48 PM
  20. anon(13322)'s Avatar
    Rawr! You're angry! Seriously though, I did not say whether RIM should or shouldn't make changes. I'm simply stating the obvious. If RIM has something that is currently selling well, they have no reason to "overhaul" their OS. Until they reach a point that PalmOS and WindowsMobile has reached (that is, single digit marketshare), RIM really doesn't have to lift a finger. They just have too much at stake right now to change up their OS and risk losing a large portion of their user base that prefers the "outdated OS" they currently have.

    But let's see what OS6 brings to the table.
    I'm going to make a poll. I wonder what Crackberry users think about RIM OS.
    03-07-10 01:52 PM
  21. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Is Research in Motion serious about making BlackBerry the ultimate smartphone experience? Webkit, OpenGL, Adobe Air with Flash 10.1, expanded dev tools....

    .... and a slider.
    03-07-10 02:08 PM
  22. stuaw11's Avatar
    Some big misconceptions going on here.

    RIM sells a "lot" because they have what, 25 different models? So theyd only sell a million or 2 or each and they have huge sales. It doesnt mean any one model is great, they just have so many out there that theyre bound to make big sales eventually by sheer volume of devices.

    As pointed out, there's a big different getting a BOGO BB and giving them away with contract. Free is free is free in this world. Price is a big driving factor to choosing a phone. So of course people buy more, you buy one and get a 2nd free, 2 sales made. Or you get one for free with a contract, a lot more appealing then a $200 phone when you sign up. It doesnt mean BB is "better" or doesnt need to change a thing.

    Lets not forget about their large corporate and government contracts where the employees MUST use a BB. Is that really depicting the consumer's choice? I think it toally skews the numbers in terms of saying well BB has the biggest marketshare so people are ok with it how it is. Maybe so, if you subtract out the corporate and government contract where BB is mandatory and look at where people actually have a choice. THAT is the true test of do people actually prefer BB over other platforms.

    RIM thrives on quantity not on quality (of their ecosystem that is like the OS). They sell 2 dozen different models because they couldnt sell millions of any one model like an iphone, let alone over 1 week like Apple does. So they count on selling a few of every one out there and it all adds up.

    But it doesnt mean its a "better" product or that people are 100% happy with it, some its what they can afford in the times we are in who just want a smartphone but to pay as little as possible.

    Apple and Google are doing an impressive job for how many models they have out in retrospect. Apple is only on their 3rd model on one carrier and have a huge chunk of marketshare, and Android only has a few phones slowly getting out there in the US and is gaining steam too and marketshare. RIM CANNOT sit back on their heels and maintain anything more than their base corporate marketshare for very long.
    Last edited by stuaw11; 03-07-10 at 02:19 PM.
    03-07-10 02:09 PM
  23. reeneebob's Avatar
    If that "same idea" is selling in droves, why change it?
    Are you that okay with complacency in all aspects of life? Or just with your tech.

    That is the lazy way to do business and is why Android and Apple are chipping away more and more of the user base.

    I think people will see more realistically the market share Apple has once the AT&T exclusivity ends. I have seen an explosion of iPhones just in my area alone since all 3 major carriers got the iPhone. 2 years ago it was an explosion of BB's. There used to be 8 BB's in my office. I am the only one still using it from those of us that all got ours the same time. People hated the memory limitations, and the OS. Of those, there are 4 iPhones, a couple of Samsung Omnia 2's, and 1 who went back to a dumbphone talk and texter.
    Last edited by reeneebob; 03-07-10 at 02:19 PM.
    03-07-10 02:14 PM
  24. Masahiro's Avatar
    Are you that okay with complacency in all aspects of life? Or just with your tech.
    You're a cheeky little one, aren't you? Did I say whether I agree with where RIM's going? No. I just asked an obvious question. Even if I did support RIM, god forbid I be happy with my smartphone... I must truly hate everything cool and new... Seriously, making snap judgements of people you don't know is not a good habit to get into.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    03-07-10 03:07 PM
  25. EnergyPlus's Avatar
    LOL! How true, but at least he gets a bit more press than we do here, so glad to see it happen.

    I do think a major issue for RIM is the multiple model fiasco. Too much and too confusing. Personally, I think they'd do well with 3 good hard key models (small, medium and large) and one touchscreen model. Personally, I really like my S2, but it's not without its faults. Fewer models means a better opportunity for quality control and easier for developers to write apps for.

    *Yawn* I hope this guy doesn't get paid for this. He sounds like he just spent a day on the CB forums and shared his findings.
    03-07-10 03:20 PM
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