09-20-13 09:28 AM
167 1234 ...
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  1. zeeten's Avatar
    Small minded people won't understand your post, and will still complain. Its the "MOMMY I DONT WANT THE $100 JEANS WHEN THATS ALL I NEED, I WANT THE $300 PAIR OF JEANS BECAUSE EVERYONE ELSE HAS IT". These people are spoiled.

    Its funny when they speak about specs they only mention 5 android devices, that proves 1080p and quad core are not standard.

    I always ask where's Microsofts, Apples, and Googles "Motox', 1080p quadcore phones? There smart enough not to join a pointless spec race, and the A10 burping the only 5" none android device is a plus as well.
    The problem here is that BlackBerry will be selling the "$100 jeans" for same price as the "$300 jeans".

    The 1080p and quadcore are not standard (yet), but for "flagship" devices it is standard. The MotoX is actually being referred to as a midrange device.

    If BlackBerry sells the A10 with the rumored specs and markets it as midrange for the price of a midrange, nobody will complain about the specs.
    They will question (rightfully so) the purpose of selling a midrange device when they are trying to bring people over from other platforms.

    Posted via CB10
    07-17-13 11:46 AM
  2. RECOOL's Avatar
    Guess we'll find out soon enough.
    07-17-13 11:46 AM
  3. zeeten's Avatar
    This analysis really proves nothing as you are preaching to the converted. Ask your average consumer to detail the specs of their or any other phone and they will stare back at you with a "fix me Jesus" look on their face.

    Specs are not what sell phones and the only people who care about them is tech geeks like us.

    It's true that the average consumer doesn't know the difference. The problem is that when they are shopping for a phone and they read the little paper next to the display that has some specs on it, they will see some with 720 HD and some with 1080 full HD. If they understood that it makes no difference it wouldn't be a problem. The problem is that they don't know, and therefore will buy the one that looks better on paper if it's the same price.

    Posted via CB10
    agp101 likes this.
    07-17-13 12:10 PM
  4. MPF94025's Avatar
    You're right. The specs are a blessing and a curse.While the lack of "top end" specs is ultimately meaningless, there is nothing compelling to make others transition from Samsung devices. This could change if Android emulator makes a major leap forward, but even with that, there is still nothing I can see (and as a Z10 user) that will make people drool over the A10, let alone break contract with existing device to purchase one. Am I missing something? As a Z10 user, I can pretty much see the strengths and weaknesses of the BB10 system. I also use iPhone 5. I'm not hearing a compelling story yet.
    07-17-13 12:14 PM
  5. letmein13's Avatar
    A message to people who don't think specs sell your phone,

    Why do you need to rethink your position?

    Since the first release of iphones and android phones, we haven't seen many OS updates OR upgrades for iOS and android OS. However, phone hardware is getting better every year. In fact, every new iphone or android phone is slightly better than the old ones in term of hardware while iOS or android OS doesn't get any major update or upgrade in the same period. During these periods, all apps and games for iOS and android OS have been written to take the advantage of improved phone hardware. New phone hardware allows you to do things with your phone that you couldn't do before.

    When you spend 600 or 700 USD or sign a 2 or 3 year contract for a new phone, you would not do it because of your phone's OS. You pay this premium price for improved phone hardware. If you think phone specs are not that important, you need to think again. Every recent iphone or android phone has the same OS with different hardware.

    Furthermore, your phone costs less than mine because of our phone hardware, NOT the OS. Why is the price of q10 and z10 different when both of them have the same OS?

    Yes, phone specs is an important factor in determining the sales.
    07-17-13 12:16 PM
  6. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    It's true that the average consumer doesn't know the difference. The problem is that when they are shopping for a phone and they read the little paper next to the display that has some specs on it, they will see some with 720 HD and some with 1080 full HD. If they understood that it makes no difference it wouldn't be a problem. The problem is that they don't know, and therefore will buy the one that looks better on paper if it's the same price.
    Think about what you just said and you'll see that it wasn't the specs that sold the phone. It was perception.
    wincyUt likes this.
    07-17-13 12:17 PM
  7. slade632's Avatar
    I must say you have put some great arguments there. I for one would like to see an increased camera, so at least they are ahead of the curve instead of behind.

    Also I am not sure if this is confirmed or not but I think the A10 only has 16 gigs internal. I would like it to come standard with at least 32 as many people do have a lot of apps on their phone (like me) and running out of room
    07-17-13 12:22 PM
  8. LWKING's Avatar
    8 MP camera is more than optical resolution of such a small camera, on any smartphone. Even entry level DSLR can not utilize 14 MP resolution sensor. Perceptional quality on most phones is improved by image processing algorithms, which I think is poorly implemented on current BB10. I'm convinced that Apple puts very high post processing on their camera. I have some experience with image processing and cameras, and it seems like BB10 devices simply get row picture from the camera without any processing. In small sensor cameras processing is essential to improve sharpness, color, gamma and of course noise reduction. As I have found many Nokia cameras use noise reduction algorithms on their cameras. So, its natural to use 41MP so you get much more data to get better picture by post processing.

    NOTE: IMHO.

    NOTE: Most image processing algorithms can be accelerated using GPU (fast matrix operations).
    Very interesting. Thanks for that. I didn't fully understand how it all worked.
    07-17-13 12:31 PM
  9. zeeten's Avatar
    Think about what you just said and you'll see that it wasn't the specs that sold the phone. It was perception.
    Thank you! That's exactly my point.

    The higher specs give the perception of a better product. The phones need to be marketed to the average consumer. Because the average consumer doesn't know, he will buy what he perceives to be better.


    Posted via CB10
    07-17-13 12:32 PM
  10. LWKING's Avatar
    I don't think that the new blackberry will be up against all those phones at the end of the year I'm pretty their will be more powerful phones to come out around that time that will really be competition for it later this year...so some of that maybe irrelevant later this year...Idk for certain but hey that's the way its usually is

    Posted via CB10
    Correct, I've forgotten about the HTC One Max, the Xperia Z Ultra, and the upcoming Galaxy Note 3. At 5.5" to 6", I'm not convinced they would affect A10 sales much though. If that were the case then the regular Xperia Z, S4, and HTC One sales would suffer from their own products. Let me know if I missed something.
    07-17-13 12:45 PM
  11. nah.uhh's Avatar
    The problem here is that BlackBerry will be selling the "$100 jeans" for same price as the "$300 jeans".

    If BlackBerry sells the A10 with the rumored specs and markets it as midrange for the price of a midrange, nobody will complain about the specs.

    Posted via CB10
    This I could agree with.. but who are we kidding? It isn't an a5, it's an a10. It isn't a midrange device. Even if it was a midrange device, BlackBerry idea of midrange is 8gb internal storage and still cost 400+$ (correct me if I'm wrong. Anyone know off hand how much the q5is in usd?). I don't see the a10 coming out at anything less than 550

    .. but I do hope you are right and there is a high end device coming at the same time. Maybe the a11 with 3gb of ram, because 2gb wasn't enough to run bb11. Lololol
    07-17-13 12:55 PM
  12. LWKING's Avatar
    It's true that the average consumer doesn't know the difference. The problem is that when they are shopping for a phone and they read the little paper next to the display that has some specs on it, they will see some with 720 HD and some with 1080 full HD. If they understood that it makes no difference it wouldn't be a problem. The problem is that they don't know, and therefore will buy the one that looks better on paper if it's the same price.

    Posted via CB10

    Who buys phones without looking at them in person?
    07-17-13 12:58 PM
  13. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    Say an average person goes into a store. Are they going to say, "which phone is smoothest?" No. Will the customer service person say "this S4 has better specs but the A10 is smoother"? No. Are they going to say "this one multitasks and is good for power users"? Hell no! Are they going to say "this screen is brighter even though the resolution is lower"? No.

    They'll mention specs - and all the specs people know or care about will be less on the A10.

    Most people don't spend a whole lot of time trying a device before buying either and if they do, they might discount the A10 altogether because they can't figure out how it works.
    07-17-13 01:08 PM
  14. zeeten's Avatar
    Who buys phones without looking at them in person?
    Of course they don't buy without looking at it. We're talking about people who don't know what they're looking at. They assume that although they don't see the difference there must be something different (especially when the sales rep tells them that 720 is old technology and 1080 is newer) .

    Posted via CB10
    07-17-13 01:11 PM
  15. pkcable's Avatar
    This analysis really proves nothing as you are preaching to the converted. Ask your average consumer to detail the specs of their or any other phone and they will stare back at you with a "fix me Jesus" look on their face.

    Specs are not what sell phones and the only people who care about them is tech geeks like us.
    Apple never discloses their specs (people usually find out SOME details, but you will never see the full specs) and yet they sell just fine. What is most important to the regular Joe's that AG is referring to is how the phone works. Is it intuitive and easy to pick up and use, does it have good battery life, AND lets face it can it run the apps I want.
    07-17-13 01:34 PM
  16. SDTRMG's Avatar
    The problem here is that BlackBerry will be selling the "$100 jeans" for same price as the "$300 jeans".

    The 1080p and quadcore are not standard (yet), but for "flagship" devices it is standard. The MotoX is actually being referred to as a midrange device.

    If BlackBerry sells the A10 with the rumored specs and markets it as midrange for the price of a midrange, nobody will complain about the specs.
    They will question (rightfully so) the purpose of selling a midrange device when they are trying to bring people over from other platforms.

    Posted via CB10
    1080p and quadcore are not standard.only android oems use it that doesn't make it standard.

    The rumoured iPhone 5s specs aren't any better then the a10, and just barley pass the z10. Also look at Nokias rumoured 4.7 inch phalabet. Nokia Lumia 625 Photos Leak, Revealing First Nokia Phablet | BGR

    This argment is pointless if the only phones you consider high end are android devices, in fact only android manufactures are in the spec race, its all they to compete with each other, as they are component/parts manufactures, no other os/company is using 1080p or quadcore. Not apple, Microsoft, or blackberry because its wasted money on unneed hardware.

    Wasting money is not a luxury blackberry can afford to do right now.
    07-17-13 01:49 PM
  17. bigjman's Avatar
    1080p and quadcore are not standard.only android oems use it that doesn't make it standard.

    The rumoured iPhone 5s specs aren't any better then the a10, and just barley pass the z10. Also look at Nokias rumoured 4.7 inch phalabet. Nokia Lumia 625 Photos Leak, Revealing First Nokia Phablet | BGR

    This argment is pointless if the only phones you consider high end are android devices, in fact only android manufactures are in the spec race, its all they to compete with each other, as they are component/parts manufactures, no other os/company is using 1080p or quadcore. Not apple, Microsoft, or blackberry because its wasted money on unneed hardware.

    Wasting money is not a luxury blackberry can afford to do right now.
    Thank you, somebody that gets it!

    Posted via CB10
    07-17-13 02:43 PM
  18. LWKING's Avatar
    1080p and quadcore are not standard.only android oems use it that doesn't make it standard.

    The rumoured iPhone 5s specs aren't any better then the a10, and just barley pass the z10. Also look at Nokias rumoured 4.7 inch phalabet. Nokia Lumia 625 Photos Leak, Revealing First Nokia Phablet | BGR

    This argment is pointless if the only phones you consider high end are android devices, in fact only android manufactures are in the spec race, its all they to compete with each other, as they are component/parts manufactures, no other os/company is using 1080p or quadcore. Not apple, Microsoft, or blackberry because its wasted money on unneed hardware.

    Wasting money is not a luxury blackberry can afford to do right now.
    Is it possible to sticky a single post? Because this should be.
    07-17-13 02:49 PM
  19. zeeten's Avatar
    1080p and quadcore are not standard.only android oems use it that doesn't make it standard.

    The rumoured iPhone 5s specs aren't any better then the a10, and just barley pass the z10. Also look at Nokias rumoured 4.7 inch phalabet. Nokia Lumia 625 Photos Leak, Revealing First Nokia Phablet | BGR

    This argment is pointless if the only phones you consider high end are android devices, in fact only android manufactures are in the spec race, its all they to compete with each other, as they are component/parts manufactures, no other os/company is using 1080p or quadcore. Not apple, Microsoft, or blackberry because its wasted money on unneed hardware.

    Wasting money is not a luxury blackberry can afford to do right now.
    You can't use the iPhone to compare because Apple can put whatever specs they want and it will sell like hotcakes. BlackBerry can't compete (yet) with Apple.
    Microsoft is starting to enter the specs race, they'll have 1080 screens very soon. The Lumia 625 will not be a flagship device, and will not be priced as one.
    Nokias flagship phone has a crazy camera to justify the flagship price. If the A10 is priced as a midrange that's fine, but they can't expect people to choose it over the other options.
    Right now Android has most of the marketshare and therefore they are seen as the standard. If flagship Android devices have high specs, anyone that wants more of the marketshare must compete with that.
    BlackBerry needs to target the average consumer that will be comparing the newest phones and will choose whatever is "PERCEIVED" to be the best.
    I'm not saying the A10 must have a 1080 screen, but it needs something that will grab attention (and marketshare).

    While I agree that the whole specs argument is pointless for many reasons, I'm also realistic about the market and what sells.


    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by zeeten; 07-17-13 at 04:02 PM.
    07-17-13 03:49 PM
  20. Dan Lam's Avatar
    I'm excited to know that the A10 will have better specs than the iPhone 5, Apple's flagship phone that was released last year.
    SDTRMG and kevinnugent like this.
    07-17-13 03:54 PM
  21. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    I think the A10 has the potential to be a modest success. Let's say it's there to validate the form factor.

    What I think I'd like to see next year is:

    1) A "Z10+" (and a corresponding Q10) that inherit the same 8960T chipset that's going in the A-series
    2) An "A10+" that moves to a 1080p screen and Snapdragon 800 (which would have been nice to see this year).
    SDTRMG and MasterOfBinary like this.
    07-17-13 03:55 PM
  22. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    With these specs the A10 will not sell period.

    This guy knows what he's talking about
    This is what the A10 should be like!! This guy stole the words right out of my mouth

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...1/#post8841550

    I'd like it and thank it 1,000,000 times. Definitely the best thread on these forums at the moment.
    07-17-13 03:55 PM
  23. LWKING's Avatar
    You can't use the iPhone to compare because Apple can put whatever specs they want and it will sell like hotcakes. BlackBerry can't compete (yet) with Apple.
    Microsoft is starting to enter the specs race, they'll have 1080 screens very soon. The Lumia 625 will not be a flagship device, and will not be priced as one. If the A10 is priced as a midrange that's fine, but they can't expect people to choose it over the other options.
    Right now Android has most of the marketshare and therefore they are seen as the standard. If flagship Android devices have high specs, anyone that wants more of the marketshare must compete with that.
    BlackBerry needs to target the average consumer that will be comparing the newest phones and will choose whatever is "PERCEIVED" to be the fastest most powerful and the best screen.

    While I agree that the whole specs argument is pointless for many reasons, I'm also realistic about the market and what sells.

    Posted via CB10
    I agree and I disagree. I agree that the A10 should be priced as an upper midrange phone. This will give the A10 outstanding reviews which is HUGE in gaining traction. Even HTC doesn't price their HTC One as high as the S4. There's a reason for it.

    However, on a purely OS experience level, with 10.2, I definitely believe that Blackberry can compare to Apple. I don't see Apple as the exception here. I see them as the goal. This is entirely reasonable since Blackberry most closely resembles Apple out of all of the companies.
    SDTRMG likes this.
    07-17-13 04:00 PM
  24. zeeten's Avatar
    I agree and I disagree. I agree that the A10 should be priced as an upper midrange phone. This will give the A10 outstanding reviews which is HUGE in gaining traction. Even HTC doesn't price their HTC One as high as the S4. There's a reason for it.

    However, on a purely OS experience level, with 10.2, I definitely believe that Blackberry can compare to Apple. I don't see Apple as the exception here. I see them as the goal. This is entirely reasonable since Blackberry most closely resembles Apple out of all of the companies.
    I agree with you that Apple is the goal, that's why I said "(yet)", maybe I shouldn't have used ().
    I also agree that BB10 is comparable, even better than iOS. But people won't see that unless they are using it.
    BlackBerry might closely resemble Apple more than the others, but the perception on the street is not that way.
    BlackBerry needs to put out a phone that grabs attention. Once people are using and see how good it is, they will be able to leave the specs race.


    Posted via CB10
    07-17-13 04:12 PM
  25. SDTRMG's Avatar
    You can't use the iPhone to compare because Apple can put whatever specs they want and it will sell like hotcakes. BlackBerry can't compete (yet) with Apple.
    Microsoft is starting to enter the specs race, they'll have 1080 screens very soon. The Lumia 625 will not be a flagship device, and will not be priced as one.
    Nokias flagship phone has a crazy camera to justify the flagship price. If the A10 is priced as a midrange that's fine, but they can't expect people to choose it over the other options.
    Right now Android has most of the marketshare and therefore they are seen as the standard. If flagship Android devices have high specs, anyone that wants more of the marketshare must compete with that.
    BlackBerry needs to target the average consumer that will be comparing the newest phones and will choose whatever is "PERCEIVED" to be the best.
    I'm not saying the A10 must have a 1080 screen, but it needs something that will grab attention (and marketshare).

    While I agree that the whole specs argument is pointless for many reasons, I'm also realistic about the market and what sells.


    Posted via CB10
    You can use them iPhone because apple builds it's own os which allows them to optimize the os to run smoother, they same thing BlackBerry is doing with bb10.

    Microsoft is adding support in a few months and as I stated won't release quadcore or 1080p phones till next year. Nokia $299 dollar phone with camera still has z10 like specs some would say worse.

    1000's of oems choose to use the free os and not build there own, therefor they can barley optimize the os, and being components/parts manufacturer only have specs to compete with. This don't make quadcore and 1080p aren't standard no matter how you try to flip it or justify it.


    The z10 runs smoother then the HTC one and gs4 that verse just released, the a10 with a quad core gpu Wil out perform those devices.

    Samsung is the world's biggest components manufacturer, 80% of what goes in there phones they make themselves, along with many other Android manufacturers. Apple, Microsoft, and BlackBerry don't have that luxury, so they compete on a os level.
    If bb10 runs better on dual cpu with quad core gpu then most if not all androids on quadcore, 8 core whatever.

    Then what's the point in wasting money on pointless specs? As I stated BlackBerry doesn't have money to waste, or the luxury of building parts like Samsung.

    There's more to smartphones then specs, most android only users can't understand that.



    Posted via CB10
    bigjman likes this.
    07-17-13 04:14 PM
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