[RubberChicken76]

Working at a Verizon dealer and also a proud owner of a Z30, one of the biggest reasons verizon reps respond the way they do to blackberry devices is the lack of training. Most reps are not refreshed on the newer features. That and the Q10 and Z10 are normally the lowest profit device for commission, we actually get paid better to sell a flip phone over a blackberry device.

Posted via CB10

And there's the real issue ...

[RubberChicken76]

Y
your hatred should be directed towards BB for being too incompetent and CHEAP to educate the public and the salespeople about their product.

While the end is accurate, I think a lot of people don't have a sense of how difficult and expensive if it to do training at a retail level successfully. I doubt it's a question of "incompetence" as much as it's a question of it's really bloody expensive. If BlackBerry has people on staff responsible for channel distribution and sales, they more than likely know what they need to do ... but they also know how expensive it is to get done and what some of the hurtles are.

When you walk into a Best Buy and you see the Apple branded area, staffed by someone in an Apple shirt, with the merchandise being placed just so, how much do you think that costs? Retailers almost never do anything for free. EVER. They view their store shelves and customers as a hot commodity and if you want your product on them vs. the thousands of others, they have you by the shorts and know it. Want our reps to push? Pay. Want placement on the shelves? Pay. Want to be featured in the flyers? Pay. Want a sign? Pay. Plus, you do the work - send in the staff to train, clean the shelves, hang the signs, stack the product boxes. Want a sale in store? Pay.

- Oh yeah, and if it doesn't sell, we're sending it back for a full refund.

[anon(5828343)]

While the end is accurate, I think a lot of people don't have a sense of how difficult and expensive if it to do training at a retail level successfully. I doubt it's a question of "incompetence" as much as it's a question of it's really bloody expensive. If BlackBerry has people on staff responsible for channel distribution and sales, they more than likely know what they need to do ... but they also know how expensive it is to get done and what some of the hurtles are.

So BB really should get out of the business of selling smartphones then. If it can't afford to train the sales staff and simply places its sales efforts on "hope" (and the tens of Crackberry fans who will serve as a free training team to go out and confront otherwise ignorant sales associates at the literally thousands of retail outlets worldwide) then BBRY should not be in the business of selling smartphones. Period. If what you're describing is accurate, then BBRY has absolutely zero chance of ever making it in the hardware business in the face of well-funded and sophisticated sales efforts by its competitiors -- and I'm not just talking Apple and Samsung but also HTC, LG, etc etc.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

So BB really should get out of the business of selling smartphones then. If it can't afford to train the sales staff and simply places its sales efforts on "hope" (and the tens of Crackberry fans who will serve as a free training team to go out and confront otherwise ignorant sales associates at the literally thousands of retail outlets worldwide) then BBRY should not be in the business of selling smartphones. Period. If what you're describing is accurate, then BBRY has absolutely zero chance of ever making it in the hardware business in the face of well-funded and sophisticated sales efforts by its competitiors -- and I'm not just talking Apple and Samsung but also HTC, LG, etc etc.

Pretty Much....

It's sad, but true... they might have started the smartphone revolution, but they allowed it to grow far beyond them. The critical moment was when they were at 50% marketshare, that's when the alarms should have gone off. Unless they "invent" something totally new and different that changes the smartphone from what it is now.... they don't have a chance.

A pretty good OS on the same old hardware that everyone else has (or they have better) that is mostly leaching off of the Android ecosystem is not going to impress the average smartphone sales clerk, much less a consumer. Never mind all the perks that the big boys can throw at these sales people to get them on board selling their devices.

Never mind BlackBerry official hasn't said much about Andorid Apps, or done much in the way of Marketing or Advertising in MONTHS.

[RubberChicken76]

So BB really should get out of the business of selling smartphones then.

Or resign themselves to traffic other than retail, the most notoriously expensive of all. Or perhaps segment.

If what you're describing is accurate

It is

[kevets]

Let's hear more about those flip phones!

I cannot think of a time I've been "talked into" a cell phone. Ever? Every time I had just researched on my phone and made up my mind. The reps I would prefer to get rid of altogether! No offense to those in this particular profession currently.

IMO the only thing I want to see at a serious cell phone store are lots of working demo units. That and the usual case/charger/headset accessories.

[all3n7]

Reason of being is because, they want to sell whats on demand and what popular. I hate those Rep when they immediately turns you down. It shows that they were not properly train... Profesionaly

[anon(5061193)]

Honestly, my local Verizon store is good about Blackberries in my experience, but I think one of the managers uses a Q10. When I went in to check out the Z30, she was typing away on a blackberry and the sales staff was more than willing to direct me to the display even going so far as to say it was some "sweet hardware "

Posted via CB10

I have to agree... my Verizon store was very PRO-Blackberry

[extisis]

rep said you know they are going out of business and we had a lot of returns and lost a lot of money on them.

Posted via CB10

i could give less than a rat's @ss about these AT&T stores losing money (most likely due to their ignorance). don't misinform your clients and you won't have a bad rap. too many of these cases being publicized. It's why i never step foot in a cellular store. I think a quick consensus can be generated that if you want to buy a BB10 phone... DON'T go to an authorized dealer let alone a corporate store. You will keep experiencing the "don't buy the dead BB, buy the iPhone/Droid/WP" tactic. It's just too easy for them, so they'll continue to do it.

[olm]

It's less so the stigama, I think, but more so their refusal to market the brand.

[koalaberry]

I went in to ask about z30.... I asked rep a couple questions, he then asked me, what type of phone i wanted . I said BlackBerry z30 and his stupid reply was "ohhhhhhh you don't want to do that " I was why? That is what I want!. He said " no apps" I pulled out my z10 and showed him. I then walked away. No wonder BlackBerry does not sell. They try to make you get another type of phone

Posted via CB10

Flashing your Z10 then walking away won't accomplish anything. What you should've done was ask to speak to the manager then explain to his boss that this dou�hebag is refusing to properly answer some questions you have about a particular product. Then tell him you plan to escalate this to a higher level because his store failed to satisfy provide quality customer service.

[iN8ter]

i could give less than a rat's @ss about these AT&T stores losing money (most likely due to their ignorance). don't misinform your clients and you won't have a bad rap. too many of these cases being publicized. It's why i never step foot in a cellular store. I think a quick consensus can be generated that if you want to buy a BB10 phone... DON'T go to an authorized dealer let alone a corporate store. You will keep experiencing the "don't buy the dead BB, buy the iPhone/Droid/WP" tactic. It's just too easy for them, so they'll continue to do it.

So it's AT&T's fault that they rather sell more reliable devices after being burned by numerous software and/or hardware issues with the BB10 devices resulting in a ton of returns - which amounts to lost revenue?

Carriers already struggle to make any cash on device sales. They are not a charity. They're a business. They aim to boost their profits and increase customer satisfaction.

For every 1 person here who deride the sales reps in carrier stores, there are hundreds if not thousands of others per day thanking them for helping them choose a device.

The carriers do not exist to carry the torch for Blackberry. They have to put in the work or deal with the consequences. Microsoft is shelling out tons of cash for very little market traction in the US for Windows Phone, but that's what you have to do when the market is laid out the way it is these days.

Carriers and Carrier reps are not there to push the products of any floundering corporation simply because they are not doing well and cannot afford to properly advertise their own products. That's not how this industry works. They're Blackberry's partner, not Blackberry's sugar daddy.

[extisis]

So it's AT&T's fault that they rather sell more reliable devices after being burned by numerous software and/or hardware issues with the BB10 devices resulting in a ton of returns - which amounts to lost revenue?

Carriers already struggle to make any cash on device sales. They are not a charity. They're a business. They aim to boost their profits and increase customer satisfaction.

For every 1 person here who deride the sales reps in carrier stores, there are hundreds if not thousands of others per day thanking them for helping them choose a device.

The carriers do not exist to carry the torch for Blackberry. They have to put in the work or deal with the consequences. Microsoft is shelling out tons of cash for very little market traction in the US for Windows Phone, but that's what you have to do when the market is laid out the way it is these days.

Carriers and Carrier reps are not there to push the products of any floundering corporation simply because they are not doing well and cannot afford to properly advertise their own products. That's not how this industry works. They're Blackberry's partner, not Blackberry's sugar daddy.

No. it's AT&T's fault for their loss of revenue. and that would be corporate stores. Authorized AT&T dealers just hurt the bottom line even more. You make it seem like BB's are the only phones being returned, as if AT&T sold millions lol

Point is, just because a retailer tells me i shouldn't buy a product because it's hurt their revenue- doesn't mean I should care. A customer wants what they want; if they walk in a store and bring up a specific brand and model (BB Z10), then they're not usually wanting to be convinced otherwise. Especially not be insulted, like some crackberrians have reported.

[A895]

No. it's AT&T's fault for their loss of revenue. and that would be corporate stores. Authorized AT&T dealers just hurt the bottom line even more. You make it seem like BB's are the only phones being returned, as if AT&T sold millions lol

Point is, just because a retailer tells me i shouldn't buy a product because it's hurt their revenue- doesn't mean I should care. A customer wants what they want; if they walk in a store and bring up a specific brand and model (BB Z10), then they're not usually wanting to be convinced otherwise. Especially not be insulted, like some crackberrians have reported.

I'm not even sure these reports are insulting. I think they just get hurt when someone says anything bad BlackBerry and then report here. Insulting is demeaning someone, using bad language, or something like that. But saying a phone has no apps? Is that really insulting, or is the OP just taking stuff personal? Also you guys make it seem 6/10 customers who walk into a phone dealer is looking for a BlackBerry. Only people I hear of looking for a BlackBerry is the people who frequent here. At that you think those few missed BlackBerry sales opportunities are going to hurt AT&T or Verizon? The two biggest carriers in the U.S.?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[LibertyPhone]

If I were CEO, I would fire sale representatives for negative approach!

Posted via CB10

[A895]

If I were CEO, I would fire sale representatives for negative approach!

Posted via CB10

Negative approach to what? You have to teach someone how to do something first before firing them because they don't know how to do it. If BlackBerry took initiative and taught sales reps how to use their devices, then when these sales reps conflicts happen then it would make sense if you guys were mad. But BlackBerry didn't teach them so, when they have these conflicts they complain here when it obviously because the sales reps weren't taught about the device beforehand.

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[canuckvoip]

Negative approach to what? You have to teach someone how to do something first before firing them because they don't know how to do it. If BlackBerry took initiative and taught sales reps how to use their devices, then when these sales reps conflicts happen then it would make sense if you guys were mad. But BlackBerry didn't teach them so, when they have these conflicts they complain here when it obviously because the sales reps weren't taught about the device beforehand.

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

In my business, the people I manage are taught in person by me or online with a manufacturer. I then make sure the people I manage act professionally every day. It is not just up to the manufacturers of the goods we sell to train the employees of my business. We are a VAR for a reason.
What do you do with the people you manage?

[A895]

In my business, the people I manage are taught in person by me or online with a manufacturer. I then make sure the people I manage act professionally every day. It is not just up to the manufacturers of the goods we sell to train the employees of my business. We are a VAR for a reason.
What do you do with the people you manage?

I teach them how to do something. If BlackBerry wasn't bothered then why should the carriers? Why do THEY have to go out of their way to sell phones so few want? Hate to be so harsh but its true. OS7 phones sell more than BB10 phones. As a business do you want to push the phones that move the most or do you take the time to sell one BlackBerry phone out of every 200 customers you see?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[canuckvoip]

I teach them how to do something. If BlackBerry wasn't bothered then why should the carriers? Why do THEY have to go out of their way to sell phones so few want? Hate to be so harsh but its true. OS7 phones sell more than BB10 phones. As a business do you want to push the phones that move the most or do you take the time to sell one BlackBerry phone out of every 200 customers you see?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

If the carrier has signed up to sell BB phones then the carrier is responsible for doing it properly and professionally. The manufacturer is not responsible for someone else's employees doing their job properly.
The carrier expects to have product available, and warranty issues taken care of promptly, etc. The manufacturer is expected to fulfill these responsibilities. The manufacturer is not responsible for fixing the crappy attitude of poorly trained frontline staff. The employer of said staff is responsible for that.

[extisis]

I'm not even sure these reports are insulting. I think they just get hurt when someone says anything bad BlackBerry and then report here. Insulting is demeaning someone, using bad language, or something like that. But saying a phone has no apps? Is that really insulting, or is the OP just taking stuff personal? Also you guys make it seem 6/10 customers who walk into a phone dealer is looking for a BlackBerry. Only people I hear of looking for a BlackBerry is the people who frequent here. At that you think those few missed BlackBerry sales opportunities are going to hurt AT&T or Verizon? The two biggest carriers in the U.S.?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

no i mean downright insulting. laughing at the customer, telling them they made a bad choice, etc. you haven't read everything on this subject on this site. inform yourself. and if you're on this website, ALL you're gonna ready about is BB fans going into carrier stores. We don't make it seem like we're the only ones looking for phones at these stores... that comment didn't even make sense. and apparently you didn't read my post, i iterated that it's not as bad as YOU make it seem: that we should actually care if AT&T or Verizon lost money on the Z10 and that we shouldn't hurt them more by actually buying it. get real.

[A895]

no i mean downright insulting. laughing at the customer, telling them they made a bad choice, etc. you haven't read everything on this subject on this site. inform yourself. and if you're on this website, ALL you're gonna ready about is BB fans going into carrier stores. We don't make it seem like we're the only ones looking for phones at these stores... that comment didn't even make sense. and apparently you didn't read my post, i iterated that it's not as bad as YOU make it seem: that we should actually care if AT&T or Verizon lost money on the Z10 and that we shouldn't hurt them more by actually buying it. get real.

The last part of your post makes no sense, can you clarify?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[A895]

If the carrier has signed up to sell BB phones then the carrier is responsible for doing it properly and professionally. The manufacturer is not responsible for someone else's employees doing their job properly.
The carrier expects to have product available, and warranty issues taken care of promptly, etc. The manufacturer is expected to fulfill these responsibilities. The manufacturer is not responsible for fixing the crappy attitude of poorly trained frontline staff. The employer of said staff is responsible for that.

The staff have a crappy attitude about because no one is making an effort to fix it if it is so widespread. If its only to those who buy BlackBerry devices why aren't they telling management what's the problem instead of complaining here?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[extisis]

The last part of your post makes no sense, can you clarify?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

basically, you keep siding with the stores that they shouldn't have to pander to customers wanting BB's when they ask for it. clear enough?

[A895]

basically, you keep siding with the stores that they shouldn't have to pander to customers wanting BB's when they ask for it. clear enough?

I never said any of that though. I said if they have bad attitudes in the store you say something then to management. Not complain in the forums about it. I also said BlackBerry should putting in effort too if there is problems with selling BlackBerry devices.

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

[canuckvoip]

The staff have a crappy attitude about because no one is making an effort to fix it if it is so widespread. If its only to those who buy BlackBerry devices why aren't they telling management what's the problem instead of complaining here?

Sent from my XT1060 using Mobile Nations mobile app

I do. I merely add my voice to the frustration here. Nobody expects anybody here to fix anything. When I went to buy my son a Z10, the ***** sales rep said (and I quote) "most people want a smartphone". I calmly educated him (not my job but did it anyway because he's too unprofessional to learn for himself). I'm sure I didn't change him, but maybe his manager who I got involved did. Don't know. All I know is that I don't put up with that sh!t. Neither should anyone else... but they do...