07-15-13 11:14 PM
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  1. Dan Lam's Avatar
    After being tunnel-visioned into the group-think "BB IS BACK" mentality prior to the June 28 ER, I think people (myself included) need to be a lot more realistic when it comes to Blackberry as opposed to showing #BBPRIDE or whatever. Let's be real.

    The leaked specs are obviously underwhelming for a flagship product. If the A10 is supposed to be another catalyst that brings Blackberry back into the game, then it needs to have far better specs than what's be leaked. I sincerely hope the leaks are wrong.

    SCREEN RESOLUTION:
    To everybody saying that the BB devices are optimized for 720p, and that 1080p makes no difference so who cares... how do you think that plays into public perception? Public perception is the KEY driving force for a turnaround. People want the best specs available these days when it comes to their phones. They want their devices to be future proofed (at least for the short term). I'm pretty sure everybody who says "720p is just fine" has a spot deep down where they KNOW 1080p is what BB needs. At the end of the day, not many people are going to want a phone with 2012/2013 specs.

    APPS/DEVELOPERS:
    For those who argue that 720p is necessary to make it easier to scale apps and to keep developers happy... don't you see how small of a thought that is? Think bigger. Better specs = more subs = more opportunity for developers = more apps. It's simple really. Does Instagram care whether 720p is good enough? No. They care about the consumer base and whether it's financially worth their time or not. The same can be said for other large and small app makers out there. At the end of the day, everything comes back to public perception and consumer base again.

    BEZEL:
    Let's be honest, the bezel is huge. Obviously some people can deal with it, and that's fine. Good for you. But what would the general public think when they compare the A10 with another (cheaper) alternative like the new Optimus? The bezel is thin and beautiful, sleek and pretty. Compare that to the bulky and think, ugly and dated bezel on the A10? You have to remember, we're not trying to sell to only the die-hard BB lovers here. If the public thinks it's ugly and there are cheaper/sleeker looking phones out there, the A10 will be DOA.

    -

    At the end of the day, if the A10 were to be released today, it would already be underwhelming... let alone having it be released at the end of the year. Consumers will find prettier and cheaper alternatives. Developers will still be looking for reasons to build native BB apps. Blackberry really needs to up their game here if they want to get rid of the "BB is dead" mentality that everybody is trying to pretend doesn't exist. It exists. Talk to anybody without a BB right now and that's what they're thinking. To break that mentality, we need a reason to build up some hype, and a good place to start would be having AT LEAST comparable specs to the competition. 1080p, quadcore snapdragon, sleek minimalistic features (*ahem* the bezel)... that would be a good start for a turnaround.
    07-14-13 06:12 PM
  2. Djlatino's Avatar
    Lets start judging it once it's actually released.

    Z10 had the same BS speculations of specs and what not and only 40% was actually accurate.
    07-14-13 06:14 PM
  3. xBURK's Avatar
    I have to agree with the OP here. I think they could have gotten away with these leaked specs if the company didn't have such a grim reputation. Yes, we should wait. That does not mean we can't speculate and drive some sense into BlackBerry. Probably too late whatever we say though. Time will tell, but it is not looking good if this is the final result.

    Posted via CB10
    agp101 likes this.
    07-14-13 06:22 PM
  4. STV0726's Avatar
    I have come to think overtime BlackBerry needs to play the spec game for just one device only. This is their shot.

    I don't care about 1080p screen. Consumers need to educate themselves that 99% of the effect of having such a screen on a handset device is reduced battery. BlackBerry could find a way to market around that.

    But everything else should be upped.

    ~STV on Z10STL100-3/10.1.0.2025 TMO US
    jedibeeftrix likes this.
    07-14-13 06:27 PM
  5. cbfan10's Avatar
    i agree with the OP. BB should have no excuses - it must be 1080. Everyone's moving on to 1080, now i can see what critics are claiming blackberry is too little too late.

    i also agree with the bezel. a 5 inch phone is already too big and with the blackberry bezel it's going to be ridiculous. i don't like the bezels on the top and bottom of the z10. the phone would look much better, smaller and sleeker without them. unfortunately bb phone leaks tend to look like their launch model, so it's most likely those ugly bezels will be on A10 and that the A10 will look exactly like that.

    on top of your requests. i would want a premium camera in the a10, give me strong low light photos. an image stabilizer, nokia could do it with the 1020.

    finally make it watreproof like the xperia z.

    blackberry needs to go big or go home.
    07-14-13 06:46 PM
  6. radlink14's Avatar
    After being tunnel-visioned into the group-think "BB IS BACK" mentality prior to the June 28 ER, I think people (myself included) need to be a lot more realistic when it comes to Blackberry as opposed to showing #BBPRIDE or whatever. Let's be real.

    The leaked specs are obviously underwhelming for a flagship product. If the A10 is supposed to be another catalyst that brings Blackberry back into the game, then it needs to have far better specs than what's be leaked. I sincerely hope the leaks are wrong.

    SCREEN RESOLUTION:
    To everybody saying that the BB devices are optimized for 720p, and that 1080p makes no difference so who cares... how do you think that plays into public perception? Public perception is the KEY driving force for a turnaround. People want the best specs available these days when it comes to their phones. They want their devices to be future proofed (at least for the short term). I'm pretty sure everybody who says "720p is just fine" has a spot deep down where they KNOW 1080p is what BB needs. At the end of the day, not many people are going to want a phone with 2012/2013 specs.

    APPS/DEVELOPERS:
    For those who argue that 720p is necessary to make it easier to scale apps and to keep developers happy... don't you see how small of a thought that is? Think bigger. Better specs = more subs = more opportunity for developers = more apps. It's simple really. Does Instagram care whether 720p is good enough? No. They care about the consumer base and whether it's financially worth their time or not. The same can be said for other large and small app makers out there. At the end of the day, everything comes back to public perception and consumer base again.

    BEZEL:
    Let's be honest, the bezel is huge. Obviously some people can deal with it, and that's fine. Good for you. But what would the general public think when they compare the A10 with another (cheaper) alternative like the new Optimus? The bezel is thin and beautiful, sleek and pretty. Compare that to the bulky and think, ugly and dated bezel on the A10? You have to remember, we're not trying to sell to only the die-hard BB lovers here. If the public thinks it's ugly and there are cheaper/sleeker looking phones out there, the A10 will be DOA.

    -

    At the end of the day, if the A10 were to be released today, it would already be underwhelming... let alone having it be released at the end of the year. Consumers will find prettier and cheaper alternatives. Developers will still be looking for reasons to build native BB apps. Blackberry really needs to up their game here if they want to get rid of the "BB is dead" mentality that everybody is trying to pretend doesn't exist. It exists. Talk to anybody without a BB right now and that's what they're thinking. To break that mentality, we need a reason to build up some hype, and a good place to start would be having AT LEAST comparable specs to the competition. 1080p, quadcore snapdragon, sleek minimalistic features (*ahem* the bezel)... that would be a good start for a turnaround.
    I agree with some of your points, but about the bezel absolutely not. If you're really trying to argue something regarding the consumer, you would know that a consumer does not walk into a store and say "oh the bezel is too big." They probably don't even know wtf a bezel is or the term.
    DoktorFace and bigbmc26 like this.
    07-14-13 06:58 PM
  7. anon(3896606)'s Avatar
    OMG yeah, I hate those leaked specs, I'm sure that your brother's, best friends, sisters, cousin has an inside source at BlackBerry. Who has revealed to you that the leaked specs are real. /s
    Thanks for the laugh though, how about we save judgement until the specs are confirmed.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by r0v3rT3N; 07-15-13 at 08:16 AM.
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    07-14-13 07:00 PM
  8. cbfan10's Avatar
    a lot of people do care about the specs and how it looks. case in point, look at how the z10's are selling (not so well). so so specs, too much bezel and no apps.

    bb10 fans shouldn't settle for 'that's enough'
    07-14-13 07:16 PM
  9. nhanken's Avatar
    I agree with you and hopefully those rumors will not be 100% accurate because the majority of people seem to be shopping for specs these days.

    BlackBerry needs to set the prices more competitively to gain more market share. Once you acquire a large user base, the app developers will come knocking on your doors. Even if it meant to sell BB10 at costs or even at a loss, just think of it as money spent on marketing the products. There's no point of spending too much money on commercials when customers will just walk away from BB10 products when the prices are too high.


    Posted via CB10
    07-14-13 07:28 PM
  10. taylorblackberry's Avatar
    Smh

    Posted via CB10
    bigbmc26 likes this.
    07-14-13 07:29 PM
  11. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I agree with you and hopefully those rumors will not be 100% accurate because the majority of people seem to be shopping for specs these days.

    BlackBerry needs to set the prices more competitively to gain more market share. Once you acquire a large user base, the app developers will come knocking on your doors. Even if it meant to sell BB10 at costs or even at a loss, just think of it as money spent on marketing the products. There's no point of spending too much money on commercials when customers will just walk away from BB10 products when the prices are too high.


    Posted via CB10
    And how do you get a large user base selling a phone with no apps? Going 1080p means that there will be almost no apps for the A10. The ones that get released may look like crap. So why would you release a phone that won't attract users which won't attract developers.
    07-14-13 07:33 PM
  12. BrandonPBaby's Avatar
    And how do you get a large user base selling a phone with no apps? Going 1080p means that there will be almost no apps for the A10. The ones that get released may look like crap. So why would you release a phone that won't attract users which won't attract developers.
    Because the A10 will be able to run Android apps.....Pure speculation on my part, but given the capability is there, it would be disappointing if Blackberry wasn't at least considering bringing Google Play to the A10. The main criticism I have heard is security, which seems like a manageable risk.

    An added benefit would be that I would have 50% fewer threads to look over on Crackberry after all of the people ******** about Instagram, pinterest, and Netflix go away.
    07-14-13 07:52 PM
  13. notfanboy's Avatar
    I agree with some of your points, but about the bezel absolutely not. If you're really trying to argue something regarding the consumer, you would know that a consumer does not walk into a store and say "oh the bezel is too big." They probably don't even know wtf a bezel is or the term.
    Each customer has an upper limit for the size of the phone they are willing to carry. At the same time, customers want the biggest screen that the previous constraint will allow. Huge bezels are anathema to both.

    The Z10 has the smallest screen to phone size ratio of any full-touch phone on sale today. It is almost as big as a Galaxy S3 (about 5% smaller), but the screen real estate is smaller by a whopping 35% in surface area. In other words, you're paying all of the penalty of having a big phone, with out the benefit of a larger screen.
    agp101 and h20work like this.
    07-14-13 08:01 PM
  14. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Can someone tell me the point is to this thread?

    Agreed, if we're talking about a 720 screen and the same SoC as a Z10, there's absolutely no compelling reason to buy. Since we haven't actually had that confirmed (and there's been at least one rumor that we'll be looking at quad-core and 4GB RAM, so I'm not convinced myself), I don't see the point in slamming BlackBerry over specs that may or may not be accurate. Should we just start spreading better rumors?

    Wake me up when we get an actual spec release.
    07-14-13 10:22 PM
  15. cbfan10's Avatar
    Can someone tell me the point is to this thread?

    Agreed, if we're talking about a 720 screen and the same SoC as a Z10, there's absolutely no compelling reason to buy. Since we haven't actually had that confirmed (and there's been at least one rumor that we'll be looking at quad-core and 4GB RAM, so I'm not convinced myself), I don't see the point in slamming BlackBerry over specs that may or may not be accurate. Should we just start spreading better rumors?

    Wake me up when we get an actual spec release.
    you're right, what's the point of voicing our opinions when BlackBerry won't listen to it's customers or the general public anyway. if they want to make big phones with big bezels, low specs and price it absurdly high then go right ahead.
    07-14-13 10:27 PM
  16. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Because the A10 will be able to run Android apps.....Pure speculation on my part, but given the capability is there, it would be disappointing if Blackberry wasn't at least considering bringing Google Play to the A10. The main criticism I have heard is security, which seems like a manageable risk.
    An added benefit would be that I would have 50% fewer threads to look over on Crackberry after all of the people ******** about Instagram, pinterest, and Netflix go away.
    No, the main thing is it would royally screw over the developers who had committed to developing for BB's own platform. For many devs the business case for developing native apps for BB10 is slim enough as it is. Implementing Google Play eliminates even that.

    Implementing Google Play into BB10 turns the whole platform into a de facto Android variant. Why would BlackBerry go to all the trouble and expense of developing their own platform when in the end they just adopt Android anyway?
    07-14-13 10:27 PM
  17. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    you're right, what's the point of voicing our opinions when BlackBerry won't listen to it's customers or the general public anyway. if they want to make big phones with big bezels, low specs and price it absurdly high then go right ahead.
    Nobody's making you buy it. In fact, you CAN'T buy it. Know why? IT ISN'T OUT YET.

    At this point we have absolutely ZERO influence on the final spec, because whatever that is, it's already been set. Or are you hoping that if we whine loud enough that they'll just decide not to sell it at all?
    ghundiraj, grover5, LWKING and 3 others like this.
    07-14-13 10:35 PM
  18. cbfan10's Avatar
    Nobody's making you buy it. In fact, you CAN'T buy it. Know why? IT ISN'T OUT YET.

    At this point we have absolutely ZERO influence on the final spec, because whatever that is, it's already been set. Or are you hoping that if we whine loud enough that they'll just decide not to sell it at all?
    Oh BlackBerry is in so much danger right now. they are desperate and they need people to buy their phones to stay slightly relevant. Even though the A10 isn't sold right now, how many people are reading the specs and saying? "720p, dual core? ok forget it, i'm not going to wait anymore and buy an android or an iphone"

    if you're right that the specs have been set and purchased, and that the a10 will only be getting dual core, 720p and that massive bezel, that just proves nothing has changed about BlackBerry besides it's name. what a near-sighted company that promised not to be stagnant.

    if they had put 2gb of ram in the playbook we wouldn't be crying about not having bb10 on it.

    1080p is a standard now, and soon to be an obsolete feature. handset makers are now moving on to the next big thing - waterproof phones.
    Samsung Galaxy Note 3 Active, Galaxy S4 Rivaled by BlackBerry A10 & Galaxy S3 Straight to Android 5.0 Key Lime Pie? - International Business Times

    it's important to look at your competitors and listen to your customers and acting quickly. look at xbox one, they got destroyed by sony and the ps4's plan. what did MS do? they observed and listened and now they're offering a competitive package. BlackBerry needs to do the same.

    BlackBerry needs to change their slogan from "keep moving" to "too little, too late", "a few steps behind" , "yesterday's technology, today", "who needs tablets?", "we hear you, but we're not listening"
    Dan Lam and mountainman like this.
    07-14-13 11:08 PM
  19. BrandonPBaby's Avatar
    No, the main thing is it would royally screw over the developers who had committed to developing for BB's own platform. For many devs the business case for developing native apps for BB10 is slim enough as it is. Implementing Google Play eliminates even that.

    Implementing Google Play into BB10 turns the whole platform into a de facto Android variant. Why would BlackBerry go to all the trouble and expense of developing their own platform when in the end they just adopt Android anyway?
    Fair points, but aren't all of the Devs also making the same apps for Google play and BBW? In other words, don't they get paid either way? To your point about OS development, isn't there a distinction between an entire OS and APP access? How about Blackberry offers the top 100 android apps maintaining the same device security? That would solve 80% of the problem.
    07-14-13 11:13 PM
  20. grover5's Avatar
    Oh BlackBerry is in so much danger right now. they are desperate and they need people to buy their phones to stay slightly relevant. Even though the A10 isn't sold right now, how many people are reading the specs and saying? "720p, dual core? ok forget it, i'm not going to wait anymore and buy an android or an iphone"

    if you're right that the specs have been set and purchased, and that the a10 will only be getting dual core, 720p and that massive bezel, that just proves nothing has changed about BlackBerry besides it's name. what a near-sighted company that promised not to be stagnant.

    if they had put 2gb of ram in the playbook we wouldn't be crying about not having bb10 on it.

    1080p is a standard now, and soon to be an obsolete feature. handset makers are now moving on to the next big thing - waterproof phones.
    Samsung Galaxy Note 3 Active, Galaxy S4 Rivaled by BlackBerry A10 & Galaxy S3 Straight to Android 5.0 Key Lime Pie? - International Business Times

    it's important to look at your competitors and listen to your customers and acting quickly. look at xbox one, they got destroyed by sony and the ps4's plan. what did MS do? they observed and listened and now they're offering a competitive package. BlackBerry needs to do the same.

    BlackBerry needs to change their slogan from "keep moving" to "too little, too late", "a few steps behind" , "yesterday's technology, today", "who needs tablets?", "we hear you, but we're not listening"
    The moto X will be 720p with a dual core processor. If you look on the android forums most are defending it. Saying 720p and dual core is enough if the software is optimized to run smooth. I don't think 1080p will be the standard.

    Posted via CB10
    07-14-13 11:32 PM
  21. sentimentGX4's Avatar
    Agreed, if we're talking about a 720 screen and the same SoC as a Z10, there's absolutely no compelling reason to buy. Since we haven't actually had that confirmed (and there's been at least one rumor that we'll be looking at quad-core and 4GB RAM, so I'm not convinced myself), I don't see the point in slamming BlackBerry over specs that may or may not be accurate. Should we just start spreading better rumors?
    The source of these "rumors" is BGR. While I realize BGR isn't too reliable and is often biased against BBRY, I do believe that BGR would not intentionally lie to readers or state rumors/speculation as news. Furthermore, BGR has attained exclusive photos of upcoming Blackberry handsets and their access to exclusive information adds credence to their claims.

    BlackBerry A10 Astro, BlackBerry 9270 Photos Revealed in Exclusive | BGR
    BlackBerry A10 Revealed For The First Time In Exclusive Photo | BGR

    I would file the 720p display and dual core CPU innards higher up than mere "rumor". What is your source for the quad core CPU and 4 GB RAM? I wasn't even aware that current ARM chips could support 4 GB RAM.
    07-14-13 11:45 PM
  22. thecurryman's Avatar
    The moto X will be 720p with a dual core processor. If you look on the android forums most are defending it. Saying 720p and dual core is enough if the software is optimized to run smooth. I don't think 1080p will be the standard.

    Posted via CB10
    Except the motox will be half the price of the A10 off contract...lol


    Doesn't matter about what us cb useres really think. It's mid 2013 where every flagship phone, save wp8, has quad core 1080p screens etc.... this phone has to compete in the later third of 2013 which means quad core, 1080p, ir blaster, 4gb ram etc are neccesary, regardless of whether or not the bb10 needs high specs to operate. Consumers look at numbers before they even think about performance. Same mentality with the avg person thinking a car with V8 > v6...

    Remember, we DONT sell devices, but sales reps do, and these sales reps only look at the highest specd devices, sans iphone, to sell like the gs4 or HTC one. A quad

    Posted via CB10
    Dan Lam, agp101 and Djlatino like this.
    07-14-13 11:53 PM
  23. Dan Lam's Avatar
    The moto X will be 720p with a dual core processor. If you look on the android forums most are defending it. Saying 720p and dual core is enough if the software is optimized to run smooth. I don't think 1080p will be the standard.

    Posted via CB10
    But you also forgot to mention that's after the fact that they've accepted that the Moto X is a mid-tier device with expected mid-tier pricing based on the specs. And also, $500million in marketing is going to help the cause too.

    I think a lot of people forget the fact that BB is not Google or Apple. The public isn't on their side, so it's an uphill battle for sure. You don't win uphill battles by coasting. I don't see how Blackberry can convince the public that they're a legitimate third option to Apple and Samsung with continuously mediocre specs. This company needs a catalyst to swing public perception, and that's why 720p dual core just isn't going to cut it.

    For what it's worth, I'm a huge BB supporter, and I've been waiting for the A10 since the previous spec rumours of 1.9ghz quad core 1080p. But if the final product is anything close to the most recent leaks, I'm going to have a really hard time convincing myself to pick one up. Now be honest, do you think it's going to be any easier for somebody who doesn't already have a bias for Blackberry? I don't think so. Again, case in point, it's simply not good enough.
    agp101 likes this.
    07-14-13 11:57 PM
  24. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    The source of these "rumors" is BGR. While I realize BGR isn't too reliable and is often biased against BBRY, I do believe that BGR would not intentionally lie to readers or state rumors/speculation as news. Furthermore, BGR has attained exclusive photos of upcoming Blackberry handsets and their access to exclusive information adds credence to their claims.

    BlackBerry A10 Astro, BlackBerry 9270 Photos Revealed in Exclusive | BGR
    BlackBerry A10 Revealed For The First Time In Exclusive Photo | BGR

    I would file the 720p display and dual core CPU innards higher up than mere "rumor". What is your source for the quad core CPU and 4 GB RAM? I wasn't even aware that current ARM chips could support 4 GB RAM.
    BGR didn't give much indication what their source was for that rumored spec, or how old that information is. They could have been taking shots in the dark too. There has been NO OTHER SOURCE that has corroborated this in any way, so it remains speculative.

    Except the motox will be half the price of the A10 off contract...lol


    Doesn't matter about what us cb useres really think. It's mid 2013 where every flagship phone, save wp8, has quad core 1080p screens etc.... this phone has to compete in the later third of 2013 which means quad core, 1080p, ir blaster, 4gb ram etc are neccesary, regardless of whether or not the bb10 needs high specs to operate. Consumers look at numbers before they even think about performance. Same mentality with the avg person thinking a car with V8 > v6...

    Remember, we DONT sell devices, but sales reps do, and these sales reps only look at the highest specd devices, sans iphone, to sell like the gs4 or HTC one. A quad

    Posted via CB10
    Okay, let's assume for a minute that it's a worst case scenario, and that we're looking at a device that offers absolutely no benefit over a Z10. No better processor, no better graphics, just a bigger battery and a bigger screen with the same resolution. I'll totally agree with you, why would they bother? And who knows, maybe that's just the best they can do now. Maybe that's what they've been reduced to.

    If they're that bad off, why are they even still worth your attention? Why all this energy being wasted on complaining about RUMORS? I still don't get the point of this discussion.

    The A10 will either be good enough, or it won't. And we won't know for sure until it ships. This discussion is WAAAAAY premature.
    07-15-13 12:09 AM
  25. grover5's Avatar
    Except the motox will be half the price of the A10 off contract...lol


    Doesn't matter about what us cb useres really think. It's mid 2013 where every flagship phone, save wp8, has quad core 1080p screens etc.... this phone has to compete in the later third of 2013 which means quad core, 1080p, ir blaster, 4gb ram etc are neccesary, regardless of whether or not the bb10 needs high specs to operate. Consumers look at numbers before they even think about performance. Same mentality with the avg person thinking a car with V8 > v6...

    Remember, we DONT sell devices, but sales reps do, and these sales reps only look at the highest specd devices, sans iphone, to sell like the gs4 or HTC one. A quad

    Posted via CB10
    We'll see what it costs. I think you'll be surprised. But to correct your assertion it is every flagship android device that is quad core. Not iphone, windows or BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    07-15-13 12:11 AM
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