10-18-13 10:20 PM
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  1. CDM76's Avatar
    BB10 doesn't need better specs to deliver better user experience than other OSs (let's say that's true), but better specs will help BB10 to deliver better user experience than it can deliver on current specs.

    So what's wrong to request better specs from BBRY again?

    People (including me) don't criticize Z30's specs because BB10 needs better specs, people criticize it because BBRY needs it.

    When you are an underdog in the market, you need to do way better than others to survive, not just do as good as others. Either sell the same experience cheaper than the competitors, or sell WAY better experience at the same price point as competitors.

    You can't argue against LOGIC.
    And what are the specs on the iPhone? Yep "outdated " as well......

    Posted via CB10
    10-13-13 10:01 AM
  2. Highcroft's Avatar
    And what are the specs on the iPhone? Yep "outdated " as well......

    Posted via CB10
    Did you even read his post?
    10-13-13 10:04 AM
  3. garnok's Avatar
    And what are the specs on the iPhone? Yep "outdated " as well......

    Posted via CB10
    because iPhone doesn't need gimmick specs to sell their phone, but BB need it...they are lack behind on marketing, brand perception, apps, value for money, carrier support etc . at least having comparable specs will help them even if only just for a little...android vendor using specs to attack iPhone and they are quite succeed

    besides isn't most BB10 apps are coming from android that need huge resources at least to run same as other flagship samsung, LG, Sony phone ?

    plus iPhone processor from benchmark test are destroying almost all high end android quad core phone because apple design it themselves. while Z30 only using processor that same as last year / mid end android phone.
    10-13-13 10:14 AM
  4. PauloPImenta's Avatar
    I've Z10 and now Z30. My wife has an iPhone 5. One word: Z30 is just amazing. Great hardware, battery life I cannot comment as I'm using it full charged from this morning, but after 8 hours battery is 78% charged (moderate use). Software 10.2 is fine and better in my opinion than droid or iOS, but that's just my opinion. With this battery, amazing keyboard and software, if properly advertised it has to be a huge success. I don't know what device reviewers have reviewed, but so far no random reboots so please review it again with a really Z30 instead of just copy and paste from other reviewers probably from initial z10 with 10.0.0.

    Posted via CB10
    10-13-13 11:00 AM
  5. hazarder's Avatar
    A lot of people talk about the iPhone, but tend to forget that Apple does not publish specs like processor speed and RAM size, among other things. This information comes from benchmarking apps and tear downs. They do not market in specs. They market capabilities and user experience. Samsung has been doing much of the same lately (e.g. their S Beam commercials, etc.).

    Specs are too good to be that huge ofba selling point outside of certain niches.

    Problem is, in the consumer market BB10 is no more capable than other OSes and even less so than some.

    Think about it. Things like retina screens, zero shutter lag, 4G connectivity, and (aside from BB) integrated cloud services are commodity these days.

    Specs matter mostly to future proof the device so that performance is largely consistent throughout the devices lifetime, not simply to get good performance out of it.

    Sent from my Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
    Wow, good stuff. Great point of view.


    Posted via that z10!
    10-13-13 12:02 PM
  6. hazarder's Avatar
    No you don't understand what I am saying there. I am going to highlight it for you:

    *BB10 OS* doesn't need better specs, *BBRY (as the company)* needs it.

    BBRY needs it because BB10 devices don't sell well. To make it sell, you either drop the price or pack more value into the device without dropping the price. If BBRY wants to maintain its status as premium device maker, they probably want to keep the price tag but pack more value into the product. One way of doing this is to pack better specs into the device, regardless these devices or user need it or not.
    Okay, excuse my rudeness. I did understand fully what YOU said, and I fully I understand your point of view, there is logic to it. But unlike you, others just constantly bash the Z30 for having low specs with no thought process behind their bashing.
    You made an extremely good point, and that will help BlackBerry sell themselves and their phones.
    Thank you for being civil with me lol

    Posted via that z10!
    CDM76 likes this.
    10-13-13 12:06 PM
  7. nemo7's Avatar
    The problem is that BlackBerry build cheap Hardware ( dual core, bad 8 mp camera etc..) and want sell it for 700$. If they sell it much lower that would be acceptable.

    Posted via BlackBerry Z810
    10-13-13 12:49 PM
  8. hazarder's Avatar
    The problem is that BlackBerry build cheap Hardware ( dual core, bad 8 mp camera etc..) and want sell it for 700$. If they sell it much lower that would be acceptable.

    Posted via BlackBerry Z810
    My point is, it works. But you are right, amongst many others. Just like Chris Umiastowski who also seems to believe that the BlackBerry phones should not be priced so high, as production costs should not be too far off from $300. Basically what they(BBRY) Are trying to do, is double their winnings and then some. Clearly that has not worked.

    Posted via that z10!
    CDM76 likes this.
    10-13-13 01:32 PM
  9. ciaoenrico's Avatar
    There's a definite appeal to the Z30 for me, and frankly it might have been the better launch device when BB10 was released. But I have to agree with those who've said the problem is the price. When you're on the ropes already, your goal should be increasing market share. You can't do that when you're selling a phone that costs $700. ESPECIALLY during a time when so many articles about it are asking if this is the last BlackBerry.

    And yes, I totally want one. But chances are good I'll get one the same way I got my PlayBook: two years later on sale at Amazon.

    "I don't mean to sound cold, or cruel, or vicious, but I am, so that's the way it comes out." Bill Hicks
    CDM76 likes this.
    10-13-13 02:26 PM
  10. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Yep, that new SoC and camera in the iPhone that let's you do 10 FPS burst shots and 120 FPS 720P is completely useless from a usage PoV.

    Wake up.

    Sent from my Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
    IMHO and personal usage, it IS 100% useless, if I want similar perfs BUT with decent images, I grab my Nikon and I go for a shooting. Having this is a gadget you'll use eventually when you just bought the device. Then you realise your battery is empty after 2hrs and your storage dry. And finally, if you have any photography notions, your figure these pics are barely average if you compare with a $100 camera.


    Posted via CB10
    10-13-13 03:27 PM
  11. iN8ter's Avatar
    IMHO and personal usage, it IS 100% useless, if I want similar perfs BUT with decent images, I grab my Nikon and I go for a shooting. Having this is a gadget you'll use eventually when you just bought the device. Then you realise your battery is empty after 2hrs and your storage dry. And finally, if you have any photography notions, your figure these pics are barely average if you compare with a $100 camera.


    Posted via CB10
    You can get a 64 GB iPhone. Not all DSLR can do 120FPS at that resolution or burst at that speed.

    Your personal opinion is a worthless crutch. I'm speaking objectively.

    And those pictures are better than a bottom barrel $100 camera. Stop stretching. You people are taking crazy to a new level.

    Yes. I will tote a DSLR into an ice rink, on the ice, to record video and then offload it to a PC (at the boards) to look at it when I can do that on a small phone, draw on the screen, scrub it, screen cap from the video, share or post it, transfer it via AirDrop or WiFi Direct, etc. Seriously just shut up. You're making literally no sense whatsoever.

    I'll take a 5S or especially a L1020 over a DSLR for that any day. I'd use a budget smartphone that only does 720p over a DSLR. It makes no sense to carry around two large/heavy machines when a smartphone is simply way more efficient at this.

    You people claim to have all this equipment. Do you have any idea how heavy those cameras can be, and you need a PC additionally to be as efficient at getting things done with then compared to even a budget Lumia 520 smartphone.

    You're talking all sorts of crazy. We have a camera phone that is better than the 5S already. Its called the Lumia 1020. We aren't limited just to Apples device, but in each case it's the SPECS which make it possible for those phones to perform as well as they do, not the software by itself.

    The battery doesn't die. When not in use plug it in. There are plugs in the facility. And WiFi as well so 4G isn't killing the phone. There are nothing but benefits to the camera innovation. Point and shoots are getting killed by smart phones, because the phones are so good - even better if you factor in video recording. You need a $500 camcorder to compete with last years flagships for video. The only immediate advantage dedicated cams have is OIS and Optical Zoom (the former being mitigated by recent flagship's).

    Entry level DSLRs are typically not all that great at video, and most DSLR are terribly connected on top of that. I will upgrade my phone before I spend that much on such a limited device.

    Sent from my Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
    Last edited by n8ter#AC; 10-13-13 at 04:01 PM.
    10-13-13 03:44 PM
  12. hazarder's Avatar
    There's a definite appeal to the Z30 for me, and frankly it might have been the better launch device when BB10 was released. But I have to agree with those who've said the problem is the price. When you're on the ropes already, your goal should be increasing market share. You can't do that when you're selling a phone that costs $700. ESPECIALLY during a time when so many articles about it are asking if this is the last BlackBerry.

    And yes, I totally want one. But chances are good I'll get one the same way I got my PlayBook: two years later on sale at Amazon.

    "I don't mean to sound cold, or cruel, or vicious, but I am, so that's the way it comes out." Bill Hicks
    Lol. I found humor in that

    Posted via that z10!
    10-13-13 03:45 PM
  13. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    You can get a 64 GB iPhone. Not all DSLR can do 120FPS at that resolution or burst at that speed.

    Your personal opinion is a worthless crutch. I'm speaking objectively.

    And those pictures are better than a bottom barrel $100 camera. Stop stretching. You people are taking crazy to a new level.

    Yes. I will tote a DSLR into an ice rink, on the ice, to record video and then offload it to a PC (at the boards) to look at it when I can do that on a small phone, draw on the screen, scrub it, screen cap from the video, share or post it, transfer it via AirDrop or WiFi Direct, etc. Seriously just shut up. You're making literally no sense whatsoever.

    I'll take a 5S or especially a L1020 over a DSLR for that any day. I'd use a budget smartphone that only does 720p over a DSLR. It makes no sense to carry around two large/heavy machines when a smartphone is simply way more efficient at this.

    You people claim to have all this equipment. Do you have any idea how heavy those cameras can be, and you need a PC additionally to be as efficient at getting things done with then compared to even a budget Lumia 520 smartphone.

    You're talking all sorts of crazy. We have a camera phone that is better than the 5S already. Its called the Lumia 1020. We aren't limited just to Apples device, but in each case it's the SPECS which make it possible for those phones to perform as well as they do, not the software by itself.

    The battery doesn't die. When not in use plug it in. There are plugs in the facility. And WiFi as well so 4G isn't killing the phone. There are nothing but benefits to the camera innovation. Point and shoots are getting killed by smart phones, because the phones are so good - even better if you factor in video recording. You need a $500 camcorder to compete with last years flagships for video. The only immediate advantage dedicated cams have is OIS and Optical Zoom (the former being mitigated by recent flagship's).

    Entry level DSLRs are typically not all that great at video, and most DSLR are terribly connected on top of that. I will upgrade my phone before I spend that much on such a limited device.

    Sent from my Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
    Divide the price by 2. And get nowhere matching perfs for zoom, motion speed, low light, mixed light, storage ... Oh, add a generic Fire wire or USB cable to multiply your transfer rates by an unknown factor.

    Please understand that I think it's cool to have vid/photo with great capabilities. But as far as I can use them for what they worth: testimony. Dedicated devices will forever be more efficient, yet less practical.

    You can perfectly prefer using your smartphone, whatever brand/model it is. But pretending it's as good as a modern dedicated device is just false.

    When I want to shoot my daughter in competition, I use my Q10/Z10/Z30 smartphone for her FB page. But for my collection, I use at least my Sony Bridge for photos or Sony HD camcorder for videos. And yes, I can upload them to my computer and do whatever my Adobe CC suite can allow. And yes, I have a bag for these, every time I believe it worth it.


    Edit: BTW I have no problem with my Z30 and my 64GB SD cards (actually, I have 3 of them) and the battery life is not a problem either: I don't carry a spare battery anymore. It's not against any device in particular. And even if it cam shoot 1080p movies with a great quality, it doesn't change my above response.



    Posted via CB10
    10-14-13 04:24 PM
  14. iN8ter's Avatar
    Divide the price by 2. And get nowhere matching perfs for zoom, motion speed, low light, mixed light, storage ... Oh, add a generic Fire wire or USB cable to multiply your transfer rates by an unknown factor.

    Please understand that I think it's cool to have vid/photo with great capabilities. But as far as I can use them for what they worth: testimony. Dedicated devices will forever be more efficient, yet less practical.

    You can perfectly prefer using your smartphone, whatever brand/model it is. But pretending it's as good as a modern dedicated device is just false.

    When I want to shoot my daughter in competition, I use my Q10/Z10/Z30 smartphone for her FB page. But for my collection, I use at least my Sony Bridge for photos or Sony HD camcorder for videos. And yes, I can upload them to my computer and do whatever my Adobe CC suite can allow.





    Posted via CB10
    When you get to a computer, sure. A DSLR us unnecessary and a waste of money for this and Samsung phones record better video than a blackberry smartphone phone so you are not really on the same page as I am.

    If I had a worse smartphone I'd proudly buy a point and shoot for the video too, but it would be a wifi/wife direct capable device not a super bulky/heavy DSLR that requires a trip to a Pc to get anything done.

    We use tech during training, not competitions. There are expensive high speed cameras there which put even DSLR to shame. Time is money in these situations as coaches are paid hourly as well as facility time. Wasting 5 minutes 3 days a week is like wasting a hundred dollars a month fiddling with a Pc and bulky camera.

    No coach in their right mind would use that equipment/setup. They're all uses iPhone, iPad Mini, Galaxy S III/IV, and Galaxy Tab 7/8.

    There are coaches that use Dartford Rigs, but that is not normally how training is done (used for specific things/skills/etc) as it would waste a ton of time, and thus, money. It's also prohibitively expensive (the software especially).

    You said a $100 camera. The iPhone outperforms that kind of equipment. Have you actually used one of those throwaway $100 cameras?

    Don't flip it to mean DSLR. The issue with those is cost bulk and work efficiency. DSLR are made for pro photos that do all their post processing on a PC. My comments are aimed more towards efficient Cy than quality. We don't take competition videos. People with equipment for that do it and we get it from them.

    During training everything you wrote is worthless. The smartphones and tablet win out every time in those use cases.

    Sent from my Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
    10-14-13 04:37 PM
  15. hazarder's Avatar
    That escalated quickly

    Posted via that z10!
    10-14-13 07:36 PM
  16. joshua_sx1's Avatar
    The only reason why I will buy Z30 is because of its improve GPU and battery capacity... which eventually part of "specifications"... and now, some folks claiming that "specs" are not important...

    Otherwise, I'll stick with my beloved Z10... they are both running BB10... and the "experience" is the same, only in a little bit smaller screen... not to mention that Z10 will also be officially upgraded to whatever Z30 current OS... right, BlackBerry?...

    And despite of (little) specs improvement, I'm still not convinced that it should be priced at premium... it should be priced a little bit higher than what Z10 current price - to commensurate the little specs improvement...

    Posted via Z10
    10-14-13 10:12 PM
  17. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    The only reason why I will buy Z30 is because of its improve GPU and battery capacity... which eventually part of "specifications"... and now, some folks claiming that "specs" are not important...

    Otherwise, I'll stick with my beloved Z10... they are both running BB10... and the "experience" is the same, only in a little bit smaller screen... not to mention that Z10 will also be officially upgraded to whatever Z30 current OS... right, BlackBerry?...

    And despite of (little) specs improvement, I'm still not convinced that it should be priced at premium... it should be priced a little bit higher than what Z10 current price - to commensurate the little specs improvement...

    Posted via Z10
    Add the screen size (and a best fitted keyboard for my fat fingers), the sound and the overall design and quality (felt). I had the chance I can afford another device (that's part of my job, so it's my soho budget) but I don't regret one second I bought it.

    Now, for the specs, the fact is that we can discuss paper specs V.S usage performance. On this last angle, my Z30 beats everything I had before or tried from friends' hands.

    Posted via CB10
    10-15-13 03:21 PM
  18. hazarder's Avatar
    Add the screen size (and a best fitted keyboard for my fat fingers), the sound and the overall design and quality (felt). I had the chance I can afford another device (that's part of my job, so it's my soho budget) but I don't regret one second I bought it.

    Now, for the specs, the fact is that we can discuss paper specs V.S usage performance. On this last angle, my Z30 beats everything I had before or tried from friends' hands.

    Posted via CB10
    Nice, I know I won't regret it either.
    Lucky you

    Posted via that z10!
    10-18-13 06:31 AM
  19. gatorboi352's Avatar
    What's with everyone in here defending this phone and downplaying the specs, while hyping up the 'experience' and OS?

    The phone is being universally panned in reviews BECAUSE OF the buggy OS experience.
    anon5398027 likes this.
    10-18-13 12:54 PM
  20. hazarder's Avatar
    What's with everyone in here defending this phone and downplaying the specs, while hyping up the 'experience' and OS?

    The phone is being universally panned in reviews BECAUSE OF the buggy OS experience.
    Got any links to back that up..?
    And not some garbage links. Legitimate sites

    Posted via that z10!
    10-18-13 01:18 PM
  21. skibnik's Avatar
    What's with everyone in here defending this phone and downplaying the specs, while hyping up the 'experience' and OS?

    The phone is being universally panned in reviews BECAUSE OF the buggy OS experience.
    Yeah right. 99% of the negative reviews out there are hardware based as they can't come up with a fair argument against BB10 other than its too difficult to learn or of course the so called app gap.

    Posted via CB10
    10-18-13 03:02 PM
  22. Jordan Gibson1's Avatar
    obviously the phone isnt any good without 10 MILLION JIGGAWATTS.
    skibnik and hazarder like this.
    10-18-13 03:44 PM
  23. hazarder's Avatar
    obviously the phone isnt any good without 10 MILLION JIGGAWATTS.
    I know right

    Posted via that z10!
    10-18-13 10:20 PM
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