12-02-13 08:53 AM
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  1. Plazmic Flame's Avatar
    I'm interested to see how the A10 is going to be different from the Z10.

    A larger screen doesn't justify this product and a larger battery could have and should have been put into the Z10. So this device has to do something different... Hopefully revealed soon because I know BlackBerry isn't that dumb to be wasting resources given their current position. Especially when they could be making a larger Q10...


    Posted via CB Forums iOS app
    Last edited by Plazmic Flame; 07-14-13 at 02:41 PM.
    imcurved likes this.
    07-14-13 06:50 AM
  2. Martin Green's Avatar
    Guys you've got it wrong with the screen resolution. A Czech BlackBerry fan portal also showed this news from bgr but they also mention that they have it confirmed from a reliable source that it will be a 1080p display one of the best available on the market.
    Extremely unlikely. If the A10 really was going to be 1080p then the development guidelines page and the device simulator would have been updated by now since the new device is imminent. You can't throw a new device resolution onto the scene with out warning the developers.

    Posted via CB10
    kevinnugent likes this.
    07-14-13 08:59 AM
  3. imcurved's Avatar
    10.2 will be released for the z10 so in term of software, there won't be a difference between the Z and the A. Therefore, hardware difference will be the deciding factor for current and non current BlackBerry users to switch to the A10. I currently own a Z10 and won't switch to the A10 if it is just a large size Z10 because I already invested my money into the Z10 and I love the Z10. For non-current BlackBerry users, they will compare the hardware of the A10 with those of the SG4, LG, And HTC one.
    The fact is that BlackBerry 10 right now is not quite mature yet and the hardware specs of the A10 must be spectacular to be competitive to its Android counterparts. A10 will be BlackBerry high end device. High end means luxurious, spectacular, flashy, and bragging. Not practical, acceptable, or good enough.
    Remember people don't buy their BMW, ferrari, or Porche to drive 100 m/h on the road everyday. They buy these vehicles because of the status symbol, because it will make people turn their heads.
    At the end of the day BlackBerry makes A10 to sell and the objective is to sell as many as they can. So if this means they have to introduce another screen factor, then please do it. If I'm a BlackBerry developer, I'll be gladly add code to make my apps work with the A10.


    Post via CB Z10
    Plazmic Flame likes this.
    07-14-13 01:44 PM
  4. Martin Green's Avatar
    10.2 will be released for the z10 so in term of software, there won't be a difference between the Z and the A. Therefore, hardware difference will be the deciding factor for current and non current BlackBerry users to switch to the A10. I currently own a Z10 and won't switch to the A10 if it is just a large size Z10 because I already invested my money into the Z10 and I love the Z10. For non-current BlackBerry users, they will compare the hardware of the A10 with those of the SG4, LG, And HTC one.
    The fact is that BlackBerry 10 right now is not quite mature yet and the hardware specs of the A10 must be spectacular to be competitive to its Android counterparts. A10 will be BlackBerry high end device. High end means luxurious, spectacular, flashy, and bragging. Not practical, acceptable, or good enough.
    Remember people don't buy their BMW, ferrari, or Porche to drive 100 m/h on the road everyday. They buy these vehicles because of the status symbol, because it will make people turn their heads.
    At the end of the day BlackBerry makes A10 to sell and the objective is to sell as many as they can. So if this means they have to introduce another screen factor, then please do it. If I'm a BlackBerry developer, I'll be gladly add code to make my apps work with the A10.


    Post via CB Z10
    I have to agree with this. As a developer, my app is already resolution independent. All I'd need to do is add two more splash screens for the portrait and landscape modes of the A10, assuming it did wind up being 1080p. If 1080 is the current platinum standard for devices then that's what the A10 should sport.

    That said, apps that are bitmap heavy, such as games, will find it much harder to adapt to a screen size outside BlackBerry's published Roadmap. As others have said, except for things like patterned backgrounds, which can be 9-sliced, scaling upwards generates very undesirable artifacts. If we were going the other way things would be fine since you are removing detail, but to scale up you need to interpolate missing details best you can.

    Unfortunately we seem to be repeating the pixel count wars from digital cameras, unsophisticated buyers just assume that higher numbers mean better quality, but beyond a certain point increases make no observable difference. Same with screen resolution on any handheld devices under seven or eight inches. Nobody has eyes that can resolve smaller than 720p produces at that size. On a tablet I'll buy 1080p, on a 5 inch phone it is a waste of pixels, and money, since nobody can see the difference. Unfortunately though, given a choice between two top-tier handhelds, one 1080p, the other 720, even the knowledgeable among us is likely to succumb to the lure of extra pixels.

    For that reason, the A10 really does have to be 1080p to compete.

    Posted via CB10
    imcurved and MasterOfBinary like this.
    07-14-13 04:31 PM
  5. ofutur's Avatar
    07-14-13 05:22 PM
  6. ofutur's Avatar
    For that reason, the A10 really does have to be 1080p to compete.
    It won't...All OS assets are 1280x720
    07-14-13 05:23 PM
  7. Martin Green's Avatar
    It won't...All OS assets are 1280x720
    I didn't say it would be 1080p, just that it needs to be to compete at the top tier.

    Posted via CB10
    MasterOfBinary likes this.
    07-15-13 08:23 AM
  8. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I didn't say it would be 1080p, just that it needs to be to compete at the top tier.

    Posted via CB10
    1080p is a spec that is useless.
    07-15-13 09:46 AM
  9. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    1080p is a spec that is useless.
    And you going to every single thread, telling people that, is the definition of being useless.

    BlackBerry saves money, through saving manufacturing costs on cheaper Hardware?

    Then they have to pass those savings onto the consumer, if not, their device is uncompetitive, in terms of specs and price.

    That your reading comprehension still sucks so badly, after a month of different people telling you why either a 1080p display or a good price is needed, is astounding.

    Have you seen the poll on the CB frontpage?
    The majority is underwhelmed by the A10 specs.
    There must be a reason for it.
    http://www.google.com/url?q=http://c...FS2QyRls8B_ong

    The increasing number of posters, who say clearly that they want a 1080p screen on a flagship device in late 2013 have a reason for this wish.

    That every flagship device that you can buy with Android on it, uses a 1080p display, has a reason going for it.
    And that WP8 will support this type of display soon, has to have a reason as well.

    You think that 1080p is useless.
    And I think that your opinion is useless

    Posted via CB10
    kevinnugent likes this.
    07-15-13 10:44 AM
  10. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    You are confused about what makes up an app. Resources like icons, images, etc. Those are for the most part raster images and scaling WILL distort it.

    You also don't seem to understand how 9-slice SCALING works.

    Attachment 182135

    Only the corners are not stretchered. Almost everything else is stretched in one or two ways. It takes the correct image not to be distorted. You can't take a photograph and use 9-slice on it without affecting how it looks.

    P.S. You still haven't answered what vector formats are support in Cascades. You seem to know all about vector graphics and Cascades, why don't you simply answer the question?


    Let me quote what I originally said for you:

    1080p will not make the screen look worse except maybe if an app has images that are too small.
    I realize there are going to be raster images in an app, and no I don't think Cascades supports vector formats. Never said it did, I said the controls you make with cascades will scale to whatever resolution, images will be scaled.
    07-15-13 10:47 AM
  11. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    If it is not a vector format. Yes. It will blur. It has to. You cannot take an image that is 500 pixels across and add pixels that didn't exist before and not have it blurrier than before.

    PS What vector formats does Cascades support. I am waiting for your answer.
    So tell me this: how come you can see if an image is blurry but you can't even see individual pixels on the screen at 1080p? One of your arguments is invalid.
    07-15-13 10:49 AM
  12. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    Guys you've got it wrong with the screen resolution. A Czech BlackBerry fan portal also showed this news from bgr but they also mention that they have it confirmed from a reliable source that it will be a 1080p display one of the best available on the market.

    More here:

    PrvnŪ uniklŠ fotografie BlackBerry Aristo A10! | BlackBerryCzech

    Use translator if you don't speak Czech.

    Sky

    Posted via CB10
    Unfortunately everybody here seems to have inside information and that means nothing. Although I think it's a dumb idea for them to release it in 720p, I'm sure they will anyway because BBs have always had last-year's specs.
    07-15-13 10:54 AM
  13. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    And you going to every single thread, telling people that, is the definition of being useless.

    BlackBerry saves money, through saving manufacturing costs on cheaper Hardware?

    Then they have to pass those savings onto the consumer, if not, their device is uncompetitive, in terms of specs and price.

    That your reading comprehension still sucks so badly, after a month of different people telling you why either a 1080p display or a good price is needed, is astounding.

    Have you seen the poll on the CB frontpage?
    The majority is underwhelmed by the A10 specs.
    There must be a reason for it.
    Would you buy a BlackBerry A10 based on the rumored specs? | CrackBerry.com

    The increasing number of posters, who say clearly that they want a 1080p screen on a flagship device in late 2013 have a reason for this wish.

    That every flagship device that you can buy with Android on it, uses a 1080p display, has a reason going for it.
    And that WP8 will support this type of display soon, has to have a reason as well.

    You think that 1080p is useless.
    And I think that your opinion is useless

    Posted via CB10
    Interesting thing about that? This is a BB fan site. Imagine taking that poll anywhere else, the yes bar would be taller than it is wide.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    07-15-13 10:55 AM
  14. Martin Green's Avatar
    1080p is a spec that is useless.
    Are you purposely ignoring my point? I have stated in several posts that 1080p is worthless and indistinguishable from 720p at handheld screen sizes. What I am saying though is that this is irrelevant in the case of the A10.

    The top-tier android products are all 1080p. Unsophisticated consumers will look at a 720p A10 and conclude it to be inferior, even though in reality they would not be able to see a difference. The 1080p Android devices will need a higher performance CPU to render at the same frame rates, giving smoother video on the A10, but that buyer won't know all this.

    I say again, even though 1080p provides no visible improvement on a 5" device, the A10 MUST be 1080p if it is to compete with the cream of the Android crop.

    Posted via CB10
    imcurved likes this.
    07-15-13 02:33 PM
  15. marlowe9810's Avatar
    Are you purposely ignoring my point? I have stated in several posts that 1080p is worthless and indistinguishable from 720p at handheld screen sizes. What I am saying though is that this is irrelevant in the case of the A10.

    The top-tier android products are all 1080p. Unsophisticated consumers will look at a 720p A10 and conclude it to be inferior, even though in reality they would not be able to see a difference. The 1080p Android devices will need a higher performance CPU to render at the same frame rates, giving smoother video on the A10, but that buyer won't know all this.

    I say again, even though 1080p provides no visible improvement on a 5" device, the A10 MUST be 1080p if it is to compete with the cream of the Android crop.

    Posted via CB10
    Completely agree.

    The 5 inch screen is the realm of Android users. If BBRY is going after this market, they better release the best they've got. The Aristo is anything but the best.
    07-15-13 02:42 PM
  16. BigBuffBerry's Avatar
    I don't agree. 720p is still considered HD, so they can just market it with an HD screen and 9/10 people will not know the difference.
    07-15-13 02:49 PM
  17. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    I don't agree. 720p is still considered HD, so they can just market it with an HD screen and 9/10 people will not know the difference.
    And to ask the same price for the device, even though the hardware is inferior under every possible angle, would be considered as....

    A good $/performance ratio?
    Fair towards the consumer?
    The BlackBerry tax we pay because we love BlackBerry so much?

    Posted via CB10
    07-15-13 03:11 PM
  18. BigBuffBerry's Avatar
    And to ask the same price for the device, even though the hardware is inferior under every possible angle, would be considered as....

    A good $/performance ratio?
    Fair towards the consumer?
    The BlackBerry tax we pay because we love BlackBerry so much?

    Posted via CB10
    I don't think it is inferior at all. Put it this way - you cannot see the difference between 720p and 1080p on a 5 inch screen so would you rather have your games running at 30 fps at 720p or 20 fps at 1080p?

    Plus, the screen look very good.... so I hear
    07-15-13 03:30 PM
  19. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    Are you purposely ignoring my point? I have stated in several posts that 1080p is worthless and indistinguishable from 720p at handheld screen sizes. What I am saying though is that this is irrelevant in the case of the A10.

    The top-tier android products are all 1080p. Unsophisticated consumers will look at a 720p A10 and conclude it to be inferior, even though in reality they would not be able to see a difference. The 1080p Android devices will need a higher performance CPU to render at the same frame rates, giving smoother video on the A10, but that buyer won't know all this.

    I say again, even though 1080p provides no visible improvement on a 5" device, the A10 MUST be 1080p if it is to compete with the cream of the Android crop.

    Posted via CB10
    Only a few tech geeks even know the difference. The general public does not. A unsophisticated consumer as you said doesn't know about gpu processing, but they know about 720p v 1080p? What the BB10 platform needs is apps and marketing. A 1080p screen will make zero difference.
    07-15-13 03:36 PM
  20. Nathan Bael's Avatar
    I don't think it is inferior at all. Put it this way - you cannot see the difference between 720p and 1080p on a 5 inch screen so would you rather have your games running at 30 fps at 720p or 20 fps at 1080p?

    Plus, the screen look very good.... so I hear
    There are some inferior specs. Bare minimum ram and internal storage are sub-par. I wouldn't care except that apps will get bigger and better and need the better ram and storage. People on here talk efficient, yet we saw how efficient it was with the playbook fiasco. A10 needs to wow, not be a bigger Z10 that shipped half a year later.
    imcurved and kevinnugent like this.
    07-15-13 03:37 PM
  21. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I realize there are going to be raster images in an app, and no I don't think Cascades supports vector formats. Never said it did, I said the controls you make with cascades will scale to whatever resolution, images will be scaled.
    So why bring up vector formats if you don't think that they support them? And if you think that Cascades apps should be limited to just those default controls, people will scream that these are lower quality apps. Images will be scaled and made blurry. And 9 slicing only works on very limited images.
    07-15-13 03:40 PM
  22. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    So tell me this: how come you can see if an image is blurry but you can't even see individual pixels on the screen at 1080p? One of your arguments is invalid.
    If the original source is a certain pixel size and you stretch it, it has to make up pixels that didn't exist before. So the gpu is guesstimating what pixels to fill in. That creates a fuzzy or blurry image.

    You can't see the individual pixels, but you can see distortion when you screw around with the pixels in an image.
    07-15-13 03:45 PM
  23. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    I say again, even though 1080p provides no visible improvement on a 5" device, the A10 MUST be 1080p if it is to compete with the cream of the Android crop.

    Posted via CB10
    So you are trying to compete with useless specs. Are you demanding that the gpu supports 64-bit colour so it can have more colour bits than any other phone?
    07-15-13 03:46 PM
  24. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    So why bring up vector formats if you don't think that they support them? And if you think that Cascades apps should be limited to just those default controls, people will scream that these are lower quality apps. Images will be scaled and made blurry. And 9 slicing only works on very limited images.
    Did you read what I wrote? I was talking about vector graphics being used for Cascades controls so they can be resized in whatever way you see fit. Why do you keep going on about that?

    And why is an app any higher quality if the whole thing is stretched to fit a 5" phone with the same resolution but not if it's stretched to fit a 5" phone with a higher resolution?
    07-15-13 03:51 PM
  25. MasterOfBinary's Avatar
    If the original source is a certain pixel size and you stretch it, it has to make up pixels that didn't exist before. So the gpu is guesstimating what pixels to fill in. That creates a fuzzy or blurry image.

    You can't see the individual pixels, but you can see distortion when you screw around with the pixels in an image.
    The GPU is pretty darn good at "guesstimating", so I don't see that being an issue.

    Maybe you should try stretching, say, a 100x100 image to 120x120. Then look at them both at their original resolutions on the Z10. Does the 120x120 one look bad? According to you, you can't even see the difference between 720p and 1080p so how can you see the difference between a 100x100 image on a 720p screen and the 120x120 image on a 1080p screen where the physical sizes are the same?

    If you can't follow that simple logic there's really no use discussing this anymore. Cheers.
    07-15-13 03:56 PM
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