04-18-13 07:46 PM
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  1. Rob1's Avatar
    All this drama over an issue that BlackBerry said will be fixed in the spring update.

    If this is the level of defect that the Z10 has, I think it will do very well.

    Posted via CB10
    Do you have a link ???
    03-30-13 08:10 AM
  2. Drayk's Avatar
    All this drama over an issue that BlackBerry said will be fixed in the spring update.
    If this is the level of defect that the Z10 has, I think it will do very well.
    Posted via CB10
    I totally concur. It can't be all things to all ppl, but it's a fantastic start. I happen to be fortunate (in this particular case, anyway) to have gmail accounts. Yesterday I was in a meeting with an engineer and needed to shag an email from about 6 months ago. I had already bookmarked the gmail site so I jumped on it and got the email. It was about as fast as accessing the native email app. That's a work around for me, others may not have this option.
    ....although, if a person is feels committed, and can do it, setting up a gmail account (if nothing else temporary) to forward email to it, it could hold one over until BBRY fixes this limitation.
    Just a thought....
    03-30-13 08:18 AM
  3. FBA's Avatar
    I'm sure that's on the consumer side only. On BES you can manipulate so many things. Your company will regret it. Smh.

    Posted via CB10
    Wrong. Perhaps you should try before you post.
    03-30-13 08:24 AM
  4. lawguyman's Avatar
    Do you have a link ???
    Michael Clewley's tweet about this is somewhere in this thread that is already too long.

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 08:29 AM
  5. just_luc's Avatar
    I don't claim in any way to speak for everyone, but I am most definitely an email power user.. hundreds of emails per day.. and for me personally a 30 day would be fine IF the server side search worked with Google Apps over EAS, but for whatever reason it doesn't.

    As someone else posted above, I have also chosen to add a bookmark to the gmail mobile site to the home screen to dig up those emails which are more then 30 days old.. it's not ideal, but it is a functional work around for now.

    I certainly think the option to choose any time frame for sync that you want should be available.. but if the server side search ever becomes an option, I would probably choose to keep it at 30 days.

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 08:31 AM
  6. tlegend2012's Avatar
    Interesting...

    Would you mind sharing with the classroom what phone they've chosen to go with instead?
    About 60% will be staying with their bolds.. the rest might consider windows.



    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 08:34 AM
  7. tlegend2012's Avatar
    BlackBerry should allow configuration to change this default in 10.1. I will say, however, that I like the idea of a 30-day cap on device history as a way of promoting email best practices. Email retention for archival or discovery purposes beyond 30 days should occur on the server, not on the device. Email preservation for reference should use a system like Remember or Evernote or a law firm's internal document management system -- this can provide better structure, organization, sharing, permissions, and search. Ideally, users may be able to reach email-zero at least once a day. I think more than 30 days of offline client storage for all your messaging services could begin to negatively impact performance or unnecessarily bloat the phone given that (a) the hub is always on and you cannot close it to free resources and (b) I'm not sure about how the Hub uses ram for caching. Probably wouldn't be a problem in most cases, but I know some people who use as much email and social media in a month as I have in the last year.

    One reason why I suggest that BlackBerry change this, despite all of the above, is because gmail has directly challenged most of the best practices I outlined above. Many, many people have now learned to use email on a system that will store multiple gigabytes of email for immediate access by search and which uses tagging rather than offering more discreet organizational features. Still, when mobile devices are offline, I'm not sure whether mobile users are typically getting access to more than 30 full days of what is on the server on other platforms.

    Note: There aren't a lot of law firms with 1,500 lawyers. That's BigLaw extreme... or perhaps that includes non-lawyers, as well. I used to practice with a firm that was almost that big, Paul Hastings. You should contact a sales person at BlackBerry and get them in touch with your IT department. Given that large law firms in the U.S. and the U.K. almost always have a kind of trickle down prestige, BlackBerry should just make the change your IT practice suggests and promise to deliver it in 10.1 or maybe even deliver a custom patch for your firm until 10.1 arrives. (Someone at BlackBerry hates me.)

    When I was graduating from law school -- circa 2003 -- Vault and the other firm ranking sites listed perks in additional to base salary compensation. One of the perks that attracted top recruits was (I know this sounds impossible now) that associates received BlackBerry devices. It's a very good thing for the rehabilitation of the BlackBerry brand to aggressively pursue sales to BigLaw. I'm actually surprised that BlackBerry hasn't cut a deal with Westlaw and Lexis for at least Android ports of their apps and worked with top time-tracking and document management software developers to integrate. I'm also a little surprised that your IT department is looking at the Lumia 920 as integration with top legal support software is simply not there... just as it really isn't there on BB10, yet.


    The know that the Z10 keyboard kills the other phones . on the other hand, they don't like to be limited to one option, given that old devices can do better when it comes down to email retaining..

    They don't care about apps, they love the device, but this is the only reason.



    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 08:43 AM
  8. pgg101's Avatar
    I set my work 9780 for 15 days due to the amount of emails I get on a daily basis. I archive everything else on my laptop. Not an issue for my IT department.

    Looking forward to trying out my work Q10 later on this spring/summer.

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 08:49 AM
  9. Ramiro Arteaga's Avatar
    I would feel the same, pulling out a Galaxy II in public...so embarrassing

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 09:01 AM
  10. Ramiro Arteaga's Avatar
    felt it yesterday at the airport. Needed to pull out my ticket at airline check in counter. It was sent some six weeks ago. Could not on my Z10. Needed to pull out my Samsung S2. Very embarrassing...

    Posted via CB10
    I would feel the same, pulling out a Samsung S2 in public at the airport, soooo embarrassing

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 09:03 AM
  11. mkelley65's Avatar
    I have to agree that 30 limit is very silly. Numerous reasons and workarounds have been given in this thread and I can feel a lot of passion by every supportors here.. but personally its plan silly..

    Yea, we can pdf or screen shot.. but wasn't the whole idea of blackberry been very efficient and productive? Isn't that's the key advantage people look for when buying a blackberry. (its definitely true for me own a 9700, 9900 and now a z10).

    No reason you need to keep emails over 30 days? For some users, I agree.. but lets keep an open mind that a lot of other users do need that.. and it's not even one of those corner case scenarios..

    I like this forum.. been reading heaps about it.. lots of very helpful people assisting each other.. but lately, the tones seems to be very defensive.. its becoming like just another apple forums.. hope we can all accept the z10 is not the best phone in the world, I brought it because it does suit me the best..


    Posted via CB10
    My initial reply was not about personal preferences. In fact I avoided the previous discussions when it came to individuals. It was about the OP stating it was corporate decision. It perplexes me why a company looking to deploy 1500 devices as he stated does not have a viable CRM system that can be accessed by a smart phone. A company that size relying on email for document retention? I don't get it.
    web99 and Omnitech like this.
    03-30-13 10:13 AM
  12. armrob#AC's Avatar
    its funny how people are trying to justify what is obviouy a limitation.
    and this is the biggest deal breaker for me also.
    and 2 days ago i realized how important it was. i was on the phone with a company trying to return an item and i needed the email invoice dated 2 months ago. it was a pain going to the browser and searching for it.
    while on the iphone and windows phone you can have your email from anytime.
    and people who say you can search, well it the search is also limited to 30 days , so its worthless.

    those who think and hope what this will be fixes, dont get your hopes up. this has been an issue since the release of the playbook. and if u check the forums, people complained about it. they didnt. fix it ans released bb10 with the same limitation. it must be a technical difficulty or they dont care.

    either way, chances are it will remain the same and thats a shame.
    h20work likes this.
    03-30-13 10:16 AM
  13. Snoke's Avatar
    If you are in a position of influence, you need to go in there and test Lumia's keyboard. IT also won't want to make a decision that would get a barage of criticism from the business users.
    Lumia 920 keyboard is GREAT, not usre why you would think differently unless you have never used it and just assuming.
    03-30-13 10:32 AM
  14. bb4life21's Avatar
    Michael Clewley's tweet about this is somewhere in this thread that is already too long.

    Posted via CB10
    Well if you feel the thread is "too long" you can gladly move on. A lot of good information is being passed along in this thread.

    PS. BTW Alec Saunders also "tweeted" Skype would be available when Z10 would hit the US..........ummmmm
    h20work, JeepBB and Moonbase0ne like this.
    03-30-13 10:35 AM
  15. goldie335's Avatar

    As a legal, you must know that typing fast and accurately is key. Time is money. You can't get any better other than the Z10

    Posted via CB10
    Oh ya. First thing I think of as I'm walking into the office each day.

    Posted via CB10
    03-30-13 10:40 AM
  16. pandapurple's Avatar
    Lumia 920 keyboard is GREAT, not usre why you would think differently unless you have never used it and just assuming.
    You should read my post properly and not jump into conclusion. I had not said that one is better than the other. I had merely said to make sure IT test Lumia's keyboard (to ensure that it is what the business users want)
    03-30-13 10:56 AM
  17. pythons's Avatar
    To me, it sounds like someone making the decision just does not like BlackBerry and grabbed a minor point to justify his rejection.
    Those who don't work for mega law firms don't get to classify.....
    ...What's important to mega law firms.
    ...Cases often last MONTHS & months.
    JeepBB likes this.
    03-30-13 10:58 AM
  18. pythons's Avatar
    My initial reply was not about personal preferences. In fact I avoided the previous discussions when it came to individuals. It was about the OP stating it was corporate decision. It perplexes me why a company looking to deploy 1500 devices as he stated does not have a viable CRM system that can be accessed by a smart phone. A company that size relying on email for document retention? I don't get it.
    Our CRM is used by Sales Consultants and those who manage them...
    ...Our DMS is used by Admin, Managers and people in service & parts.
    ...Both require a VPN if outside our Domain.

    Aside from setting up profiles & permission sets in those two systems I don't use them....
    ...What I'm saying is NONE of my email goes through the CRM.
    ...I'm guessing that there are a lot of other I.T. people who's email doesn't either.

    ****, we are still manually backing up onto "tape" and it's served us just fine...
    ...Blackberry must fix this and stop using "sour grapes" theology when something looks difficult for them.
    ....I'm not saying this about you mkelley, I'm calling BBRY out on this.

    BBRY lost market share because they didn't realize certain things were THAT important to people.....
    ...Now, it looks as if they are actually starting to CULL those very things they initially got right.
    ...By using a sour grapes thought process ( i.e. 'people don't really need that anyway' ).

    mkelley65 likes this.
    03-30-13 11:17 AM
  19. dsan1's Avatar
    sorry for not reading page 3-5, it's just too much text, even for a saturday afternoon. Might I still ask one question?

    This 30 day limit you're talking about concerns only e-mail on the Z10 harddrive, doesn't it? You can still server search your MS Exchange mail, can't you?

    In this case I wouldn't be bothered by a 30 days cap at all.

    Thanks in advance for clearing this up and - again - sorry for not reading the whole thing.
    micfaust likes this.
    03-30-13 11:19 AM
  20. LadyOfTheLAN's Avatar
    it has been four hours now and the ISP email still hasn't come threw, the yahoo server ones have
    Go to your account settings for this faulty account. It will advise if there is a problem with credentials. Also, can you log onto that mailbox via computer web browser?

    BesAdmin Z10 User
    03-30-13 11:27 AM
  21. Enyigma's Avatar
    I won't pretend to justify why BB limited e-mail storage on a BB10 smartphone to 30 days. I am pretty sure it would be by design and is not a "bug", "limitation", or any other pejorative term.

    I would not consider those who are organised to be "fools" if they don't see a need to keep a smartphone cluttered with mostly old and useless data that would inevitably downgrade device performance.

    What I do question is the size of the market for loading down a smartphone with mountains of old e-mails as a proxy to a document record management system. To me, a business so disorganised as to require a high tech solution to go through mounds of garbage to find a rare useful item cannot be very good at what it does. Then again, it is not up to the phone maker to decide what businesses are good and design phones around their needs and which ones are not and ignore those businesses' wants,. The ultimate goal is to sell phones to as many businesses as possible.

    From what I understand, this very _minor_ limitation by design will be changed. This is likely in response to the feedback process any good firm uses to fine tune an offering.

    I might recommend that BB also put up a pop-up warning window about keeping very large quantities of e-mails will impact device performance lest the people now whining about the 30 day limit on e-mails start complaining that BB10 devices start becoming laggy and slow while trying to manage thousands of old e-mails.
    mkelley65, web99 and Omnitech like this.
    03-30-13 11:37 AM
  22. bb4life21's Avatar
    I won't pretend to justify why BB limited e-mail storage on a BB10 smartphone to 30 days. I am pretty sure it would be by design and is not a "bug", "limitation", or any other pejorative term.

    I would not consider those who are organised to be "fools" if they don't see a need to keep a smartphone cluttered with mostly old and useless data that would inevitably downgrade device performance.

    What I do question is the size of the market for loading down a smartphone with mountains of old e-mails as a proxy to a document record management system. To me, a business so disorganised as to require a high tech solution to go through mounds of garbage to find a rare useful item cannot be very good at what it does. Then again, it is not up to the phone maker to decide what businesses are good and design phones around their needs and which ones are not and ignore those businesses' wants,. The ultimate goal is to sell phones to as many businesses as possible.

    From what I understand, this very _minor_ limitation by design will be changed. This is likely in response to the feedback process any good firm uses to fine tune an offering.

    I might recommend that BB also put up a pop-up warning window about keeping very large quantities of e-mails will impact device performance lest the people now whining about the 30 day limit on e-mails start complaining that BB10 devices start becoming laggy and slow while trying to manage thousands of old e-mails.
    Another Fanboy defense lawyer SMH....You know by starting off you post with "I won't pretend to justify why BB limited e-mail storage on a BB10 smartphone to 30 days." but then trying to justify it the rest of the post is pointless right??

    First off you try to justify BB10 LIMITATION by assuming people who want to store their emails longer than 30 days must have their device " cluttered with mostly old and useless data". Maybe you are not in a situation where all of your emails are useless junk but some of us actually get important and useful data emailed on a daily basis.

    I'm also glad "From what I understand, this very _minor_ limitation by design will be changed." But from what YOU understand mean actually NOTHING to the rest of us. From what I understood organizing my bookmarks of my playbook was gonna be a minor limitation that would be fixed. We all know how that turned out.

    You can recommend blackberry put out a pop-up window about device performance to help all of us "whining" about the situation. Just make sure they change it please. You know back to how it was on our previous devices.....when it was considered a asset...before bb10 got rid of it and now fanboys can't understand how it is useful at all.
    mset, JeepBB, h20work and 1 others like this.
    03-30-13 12:03 PM
  23. gordonthebull's Avatar
    Check your settings. I use active sync for my office email. We use outlook 10 and set to push email. I get my emails instantly!
    03-30-13 12:17 PM
  24. mkelley65's Avatar
    sorry for not reading page 3-5, it's just too much text, even for a saturday afternoon. Might I still ask one question?

    This 30 day limit you're talking about concerns only e-mail on the Z10 harddrive, doesn't it? You can still server search your MS Exchange mail, can't you?

    In this case I wouldn't be bothered by a 30 days cap at all.

    Thanks in advance for clearing this up and - again - sorry for not reading the whole thing.
    Depends on your version of Exchange. Many people refuse to upgrade and are still on legacy Exchange systems. Search will not work on versions prior to MS Exchange 2007. The current version is MS Exchange 2013. I also suspect many of those Exchange 2003 systems are running on 2003 era hardware. No way I'd trust something so vital to 10 year old equipment.
    web99 and dsan1 like this.
    03-30-13 12:19 PM
  25. dsan1's Avatar
    Depends on your version of Exchange. Many people refuse to upgrade and are still on legacy Exchange systems. Search will not work on versions prior to MS Exchange 2007. The current version is MS Exchange 2013. I also suspect many of those Exchange 2003 systems are running on 2003 era hardware. No way I'd trust something so vital to 10 year old equipment.
    Thank you for your answer mkelley65. I'm on a hosted MS Exchange 2010 so I should be good. Thanks again!
    03-30-13 12:21 PM
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