05-07-13 03:15 AM
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  1. Empyrean's Avatar
    This just in post count is directly related to level of truth.

    Posted via CB10
    I've run the numbers using regression analysis, exponential smoothing, and Holt Winters... the adjusted R value is 0.9984. It's official, people's first posts are blatant lies and become more truthful over time.
    04-27-13 07:09 PM
  2. jesse_h's Avatar
    I've run the numbers using regression analysis, exponential smoothing, and Holt Winters... the adjusted R value is 0.9984. It's official, people's first posts are blatant lies and become more truthful over time.
    Seems legit!

    Wait a second, look at your post count!
    peter9477, Empyrean and CMcRob like this.
    04-27-13 07:14 PM
  3. ScwB's Avatar
    Thanks everyone. I'll live with it till Monday then head to Rogers...and I have screen shots to prove to them I'm not crazy!
    Blackberry 4 Life!!!

    Posted via CB10
    If you have screen shots then it's not burned in. That wouldn't show up. I'd still take it in if it persists.

    Posted via CB10
    ^^^ What Shifty said. A burn-in doesn't show up on screenshots, so you might just be crazy after all, veitchina. It's more likely a software issue then.
    04-27-13 07:27 PM
  4. tphp's Avatar
    It is impossible for an LCD to 'burn in'. The reason screen savers were developed was because the old CRT's would burn in as a result of the phosphor coating on the inside of the screen becoming worn by the electrode gun. An LCD display doesn't use this technology of course. LCD's can in very, very rare cases get what's called video retention, or video memory which results in a persistant image, although I've never come across it and the likelyhood of it happening with modern display technology is close to 0% probability. It's either a software bug or bs.
    th3h0ff, kbz1960, brout and 1 others like this.
    04-27-13 08:36 PM
  5. th3h0ff's Avatar
    It is impossible for an LCD to 'burn in'. The reason screen savers were developed was because the old CRT's would burn in as a result of the phosphor coating on the inside of the screen becoming worn by the electrode gun. LCD's can in very, very rare cases get what's called video retention, or video memory which results in a persistant image, although I've never come across it and the likelyhood of it happening with modern display technology is close to 0% probability. It's either a software bug or bs.
    ^^^ Fact ^^^

    This is one of the reasons I wil not buy an led screen phone whether it's amoled / old / or any other led phone. 3 different Samsung galaxy phones (galaxy nexus and 2 galaxy s3s) all with burn in after about a month. And it got progressively worse on each. Never have I ever had burn in on an LCD or SLCD...

    Via Zed using CB10
    04-27-13 08:43 PM
  6. scrannel's Avatar
    ^^^ Fact ^^^

    This is one of the reasons I wil not buy an led screen phone whether it's amoled / old / or any other led phone. 3 different Samsung galaxy phones (galaxy nexus and 2 galaxy s3s) all with burn in after about a month. And it got progressively worse on each. Never have I ever had burn in on an LCD or SLCD...

    Via Zed using CB10
    Interesting. Didn't know this.
    04-27-13 08:53 PM
  7. Omnitech's Avatar
    It is impossible for an LCD to 'burn in'. The reason screen savers were developed was because the old CRT's would burn in as a result of the phosphor coating on the inside of the screen becoming worn by the electrode gun. An LCD display doesn't use this technology of course. LCD's can in very, very rare cases get what's called video retention, or video memory which results in a persistant image, although I've never come across it and the likelyhood of it happening with modern display technology is close to 0% probability. It's either a software bug or bs.


    Hehehe, demonstrably untrue. How much money are you willing to wager that I cannot show you a bunch of LCD monitors with screen burn?

    Yes, it's much harder to burn an LCD screen. But it is FAR from impossible. Take a look at some LCD monitors that have been used in point-of-sale or industrial systems for a few years some time.


    This helps peak all the crystals and reset them. You can also gently massage the spot with your thumb during it...

    Oh my, what is the world coming to with this anthropomorphizing of tech devices???

    First you "peak their crystals", and then you "gently massage the spot" until it all seems better?

    Some people don't get that kind of royal treatment.
    04-28-13 07:52 AM
  8. th3h0ff's Avatar


    Hehehe, demonstrably untrue. How much money are you willing to wager that I cannot show you a bunch of LCD monitors with screen burn?

    Yes, it's much harder to burn an LCD screen. But it is FAR from impossible. Take a look at some LCD monitors that have been used in point-of-sale or industrial systems for a few years some time.
    Okay so lets get the technology behind this straight... IPS (in plane switching) LCD displays, like the Z10, are NOT subject to BURN IN. By design IPS LCD technology uses Liquid Crystal layered in a plane parallel to the glass substrate which is then sandwich between 2 transparent polarizing filters. The display is activated when opposite currents run through the liquid crystal attached to the substrate displaying an image. That is to say that images on an IPS are driven by electrical currents and its effect on liquid crystal. IPS displays can have IMAGE RETENTION which occurs when the temperature of the display exceeds its operating capacity and the currents fail to cool adequately to allow the "image" to be removed adequately. Simply turning the display off to cool will remove this retention as the display cools. OLED technology on the other hand is a display based on electroluminescence of organic material sandwiched between 2 layers , an anode layer and a conductive layer . OLEDs while more vibrant and displaying true black have a much shorter lifespan than IPS LCD's. When an electric current is applied across the OLED, the current flows from the cathode to the anode through the organic layers in the middle. The anode removes electrons from the conductive layer, while the cathode gives electrons to the emissive layer. The phosphorescence of the organic material degrades at different levels based on the color it chemically emits. For instance OLED screens are notoriously bad with the color blue which decays very rapidly by comparison to other colors. OLED phonesare prone to BURN IN simply because of the static images and therefor use of the the organic material in certain areas i.e the phone icon, search and camera keys for us BB10 users. You will swee this complaint on the Q10 I imagine within months of its release.

    In summary OLED potential for "burn in" = permanent. IPS LCD potential for "retention" +not permanent.

    Sorry for the technical explanation.. end rant...
    Andrew4life, kbz1960, tphp and 7 others like this.
    04-28-13 11:40 AM
  9. tphp's Avatar
    Like the poster above IPS LCD cannot 'burn in'. Should have been more clear on my last post, yes maybe some older forms of LCD can 'burn in' (actually video memory/video retention whatever you like to call it), but like was said, this happens on years old screens that constantly display static components on screen. Whats the chance the OP has had a static image on his screen long enough for any type of image retention to occur? Not to mention IPS cannot 'burn in'. Again, it's a software error or he's talking rubbish.
    04-28-13 01:41 PM
  10. habicht's Avatar
    have come across an article where BlackBerry mentioned to move the positions of standard ui elements very very slightly on AMOLED displays to prevent burn in...


    the problem on AMOLED is described here:
    http://developer.blackberry.com/devz...bb10/oled.html

    burn in on the Z10 is possible, but therefore you have to use it for many many years... Never have seen it on consumer screens, it's more a result for industrial displays - showing the content 24/7 for a very long time.

    *taking Screenshots for showing display problems:

    front facing camera gets out of its housing - takes a picture and walks back...

    Posted via CB10
    04-28-13 02:04 PM
  11. philiopoilopoli's Avatar
    I've run the numbers using regression analysis, exponential smoothing, and Holt Winters... the adjusted R value is 0.9984. It's official, people's first posts are blatant lies and become more truthful over time.
    Says the guy with 63 posts. :P wait, how many posts do I have? I dont know what to believe anymore!
    04-28-13 03:26 PM
  12. Thud Hardsmack's Avatar
    Beneath my phone logo is my floor.
    I've run the numbers using regression analysis, exponential smoothing, and Holt Winters... the adjusted R value is 0.9984. It's official, people's first posts are blatant lies and become more truthful over time.
    Outstanding.
    04-28-13 06:16 PM
  13. John Pawling's Avatar
    Getting close to Monday. Interested if Rogers recognizes the OP's screen burn in issue. Hope the OP posts an update or this thread should be closed.

    Posted via CB10 on my Zed10
    04-28-13 06:22 PM
  14. Omnitech's Avatar
    Like the poster above IPS LCD cannot 'burn in'. Should have been more clear on my last post, yes maybe some older forms of LCD can 'burn in' (actually video memory/video retention whatever you like to call it), but like was said, this happens on years old screens that constantly display static components on screen.

    You do realize that the VAST majority of flat panel displays that have been sold in the last 10-20 years are NOT IPS, right?


    Whats the chance the OP has had a static image on his screen long enough for any type of image retention to occur?

    I agree. I made no claim about the original poster's issue being "screen burn-in", personally I think that's horse puckey. I just got a good chuckle over people's claim that it's "impossible to burn-in an LCD monitor". I've got a few here to disprove that claim, is all. (And yes, it takes lots of operational hours displaying the same high-contrast material to make that happen on an LCD panel. Which is why I mentioned "point-of-sale or industrial systems". I used to be one of those people who thought "screen burn is nonexistent on LCD" until I saw a few first-hand.)
    peter9477 likes this.
    04-28-13 07:13 PM
  15. John Pawling's Avatar
    ^^^ What Shifty said. A burn-in doesn't show up on screenshots, so you might just be crazy after all, veitchina. It's more likely a software issue then.
    What I would like to see is a picture taken, from another camera, of the face of his Z10 with peak active so we all can see the burn in. I think BlackBerry would like to see that too.

    Posted via CB10 on my Zed10
    04-28-13 07:20 PM
  16. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Until the OP posts pics its all bull****.

    Posted via CB10
    John Pawling likes this.
    04-28-13 07:22 PM
  17. xsacha's Avatar
    Just something to keep in mind: I have some 3 year old phones with an AMOLED screen (Nokia N8, etc.) and it has no screen burn-in ever.
    They just move an image (the time) around the screen when it's locked and it not only shows you the time when you need it, it avoids burn-in.

    Not sure if this will work on Q10 since it doesn't show a screensaver, but at least it isn't showing anything when locked.
    04-28-13 07:28 PM
  18. Villain's Avatar
    and the other 2 providers telus and bell? yeah no replacements after 30 days.... after 30 days it is sent out for repair and loaner devices are $200+ deposits with bell and telus.

    ALSO with Rogers you have 1 of 2 choices.

    1- refurbished replacement sent directly to you if the device is older than 30 days DOA period

    2- send your device away for repair and get a loaner device for a $50 deposit.
    04-28-13 07:31 PM
  19. bpmg4u's Avatar
    Seems legit!

    Wait a second, look at your post count!
    Hey wait! ... seems everyone (sarcastically??) agrees with the original statement.

    BUT - and it's a big one: "doesn't this mean that EVERYONE here started out as absolute, total liars ... and 'some' of you still are to some degree?" (because no-one's defined at what post-count the "lies" vs."truth" line is crossed ...)

    Just sayin', is all ...
    04-28-13 07:32 PM
  20. Omnitech's Avatar
    Just something to keep in mind: I have some 3 year old phones with an AMOLED screen (Nokia N8, etc.) and it has no screen burn-in ever.
    They just move an image (the time) around the screen when it's locked and it not only shows you the time when you need it, it avoids burn-in.

    Not sure if this will work on Q10 since it doesn't show a screensaver, but at least it isn't showing anything when locked.

    I was just thinking about that today - that Blackberry needs to implement something like that for Bedside Mode with the Q10, or else they might end up causing display issues with the (first for Blackberry) AMOLED display.
    04-28-13 07:35 PM
  21. tw_'s Avatar
    I don't know about the panel of the Z10 but IPS panels made by LG are known to suffer from ghosting issues for a long time. This was an still is a well known issue because Apple uses IPS panels made by LG. According to Apple "this is normal behavior for an IPS display":

    "Avoiding image persistence on Apple displays"
    => Avoiding image persistence on Apple displays

    But some people do not agree:
    Apple hit with class action lawsuit over defective retina displays | Ars Technica

    Some years ago I owned a LG TV with IPS panel myself which suffered from this issue. The ghosting could be removed in the beginning but it got way worse after some months.

    But I'm not saying the Z10 suffers from this issue though. I don't have seen it on the Z10.
    04-28-13 07:44 PM
  22. ddlax22's Avatar
    That should be: "you're lying."
    Welcome to reddit

    Posted via CB10 - FINALLY
    04-28-13 07:46 PM
  23. RADEoN1337's Avatar
    i've personally seen image persistence/burn in on phone LCD's and IPS panels. Omnitech is absolutely correct, and th3h0ff and tphp are absolutely wrong.

    IPS panel burn in on a mac

    xbox causing image persistence on new IPS panel

    so it's not likely for any LCD panel to experience this issue, but to say it's a fallacy is well, a fallacy. I saw an NEC MultiSync in the garbage due to it, and it's an IPS panel.

    and OP, ignore the people that are telling you to take a screenshot, it's a waste of time... it's a damaged panel, it's nothing to do with your software.

    run the youtube link, or, this flash based one which i'd actually suggest doing first. full screen the site, check white and black, you'll see your markings, then press "fix my screen" and let it run for a while. I'd gamble that your issue is resolved after the panel is put through it's paces.
    peter9477 and tw_ like this.
    04-28-13 08:13 PM
  24. Sloppy's Avatar
    It is impossible for an LCD to 'burn in'. The reason screen savers were developed was because the old CRT's would burn in as a result of the phosphor coating on the inside of the screen becoming worn by the electrode gun. An LCD display doesn't use this technology of course. LCD's can in very, very rare cases get what's called video retention, or video memory which results in a persistant image, although I've never come across it and the likelyhood of it happening with modern display technology is close to 0% probability. It's either a software bug or bs.
    you are absoluteldy WRONG about that.

    i work in a manufacturing plant where many LCD monitors display the same automatic test systems 24/7/365 and many many of them, after admittedly many months of use displaying the same image, burn in, or whatever term you wish to call it. And very noticeably. And we've not found anything that can reduce or fix it, and trust me, we have tried. After about two-three years these displays are permanently damaged and display the ghost of the automatic test software display forever.

    so don't believe this crapola about LCD displays never burning. The surely do, although these are undoubtedly severe applications.

    now with respect to the Z10, i find it a little hard to believe that a display that can't be more than, what?, three months old maybe? could be burned even if you left it on the same image since it first fired up. That's a bit of a stretch perhaps.
    Last edited by Sloppy; 04-28-13 at 09:40 PM.
    peter9477 and Omnitech like this.
    04-28-13 09:13 PM
  25. mset's Avatar
    Your are incorrect... The warranty on the refurb unit 90 days or remainder of original 1 year warranty.
    That's good to know. There was another thread started by a customer of one of the other carriers, in which the guy was told that his nice new Z10 would be replaced by a refurbished one 2 months into his ownership of it. Even if the balance of his one-year warranty turns out to be intact, it kind of sucks to get a refurb in your hands 65 days into ownership.

    None of this changes the fact that Blackberry washes its hands of its customers and leaves warranty repair/replacement in the hands of the 'point of sale entity' which in Canada means one of basically 3 firms that we know will happily screw their customers as long as it's optimal for them. In the case of one of the 3 majors, they don't even send the phones to BBRY to get repaired - the phones are sent to a '3rd party company contracted to perform repair work'. Straight from BBRY's KW head office support staff.
    04-28-13 09:24 PM
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