12-12-08 03:40 PM
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  1. VoltaicShock's Avatar
    There is a petition in my signature.

    I would call and complain but I am on a Business plan with my company and I have to jump through hoops to get any help from them.
    07-29-08 02:10 PM
  2. anon(368121)'s Avatar
    The lazy consumer strikes again.
    Lazy? Hardly. Just aware enough of my own desire for financial growth that I'd do the same thing in Verizon's place.

    In the last couple of months: Why did Verizon give me an extra $50 discount on the Curve?
    I paid $55 for my Curve, for a total discount of $250 off the listed price. And I didn't even ask for it.

    Why did Lenovo give me a free (twice as powerful) laptop to replace my 3 year old laptop?
    3 year hardware warranty, and no parts inventory to replace what was broken would be my guess. IBMSERV offered to do the same thing for me if the final effort to fix a nagging issue wasn't resolved to my satisfaction. Fortunately, it was . . . but again, I didn't have to ask for it.

    Why did Circuit City give me a free $25 gift card?
    Why, for the love of God, would you shop at Circuit City?

    And I get those from Sears, Best Buy and Circuit City in the mail regularly. Never asked for 'em.

    Why did Flat Top Grill give me $30 in gift cards?
    Fly in your soup? Most likely an unfortunate dining experience regardless, and managers in corporate-owned restaurants are programmed with a "do anything to get 'em to come back" mentality whether the customer's right nor not.

    Why did Hilton give me 2,500 extra HHonors points? Why did Hyatt give me an extra 2,000 Gold Passport points?
    Because they give them out like penny candy at Hallowe'en. Have you checked the redemption charts? Those points would barely get you a magazine subscription.

    FWIW, (and admittedly, it's not a lot), I received 13,000 Marriott Rewards points for making a 15 minute run to Wal-Mart to buy some flashlights during a power outage. And I didn't ask for anything.

    Why does this stuff happen to me constantly?

    Because I ask--nicely.
    It's kind of sad that you have to ask.

    Believe it or not, the people on the other end of the phone are reasonable and willing to listen to proactive consumers. After all, we are helping them to improve.
    Sometimes, yes. Sometimes it's just b!tch!ng.

    It's not hurting Verizon to deny open access to the GPS and it will not hurt Verizon to allow open access to the GPS.
    Opening GPS will have an impact on Verizon's revenue stream. I'm quite sure that if they felt they could generate more revenue by attracting customers to an open GPS than charging existing customers to use the service, they would've done it in a heart beat. They're not stupid.

    It's a simple phone call and if you are too complacent to try to create a better consumer-provider relationship then move on--this thread isn't for you.
    I'm actually most interested in helping people use their time constructively. Makes more sense than tilting at windmills.
    07-29-08 03:36 PM
  3. MangoGT's Avatar
    I'm usually the one that is accused of having a "holier than thou" attitude, but man, do you walk around looking for pissing contests? Your post is entirely off topic. If you can't stay on topic, don't post here. Nevertheless, even trolls deserve to be corrected:

    I paid $55 for my Curve, for a total discount of $250 off the listed price. And I didn't even ask for it.
    I paid $70 after tax, and I only had a $50 New Every 2. From a starting price of $300, you do the math.

    3 year hardware warranty, and no parts inventory to replace what was broken would be my guess. IBMSERV offered to do the same thing for me if the final effort to fix a nagging issue wasn't resolved to my satisfaction. Fortunately, it was . . . but again, I didn't have to ask for it.
    No inventory for an 80gb hard drive? Solectron (or as you call it, IBMSERV?) wanted me to ship my machine in to have it looked at and fixed. I called Lenovo's Executive Offices and took care of it on my own.

    Why, for the love of God, would you shop at Circuit City?

    And I get those from Sears, Best Buy and Circuit City in the mail regularly. Never asked for 'em.
    If I'm getting the best deal on a product at Circuit City why wouldn't I shop there?

    I'm not talking about coupons or dollar-off offers. Retailers don't send gift cards in the mail unless you have a rewards card, branded credit card, etc. I don't have any of those affiliations with Circuit City. Still, I received $25.

    Fly in your soup? Most likely an unfortunate dining experience regardless, and managers in corporate-owned restaurants are programmed with a "do anything to get 'em to come back" mentality whether the customer's right nor not.
    No flies. The General Manager did ask me to come in so he could personally thank me for my feed back and give me the gift certificates. Have I gone back? Not yet but I probably will.

    Because they give them out like penny candy at Hallowe'en. Have you checked the redemption charts? Those points would barely get you a magazine subscription.

    FWIW, (and admittedly, it's not a lot), I received 13,000 Marriott Rewards points for making a 15 minute run to Wal-Mart to buy some flashlights during a power outage. And I didn't ask for anything.
    Apparently you don't stay in hotels very often. I didn't have to run to Wal-Mart (why would you shop at Wal-Mart?) to get my points. And I was wrong, it was 5,000 Gold Passport points--which is a free room. The Hilton points were 25% of a free room. (In both cases, a lot more than a magazine subscription)

    I'm actually most interested in helping people use their time constructively. Makes more sense than tilting at windmills.
    I don't really see running to Wal-Mart to buy flashlights as an effective use of my time. If you don't want to participate in this, then don't. At this point, you're just trolling this thread.

    If you have something constructive to add, then go for it. Otherwise, **** off until you can get your facts straight.
    07-29-08 04:02 PM
  4. anon(368121)'s Avatar
    I'm usually the one that is accused of having a "holier than thou" attitude, but man, do you walk around looking for pissing contests? Your post is entirely off topic.
    So, I'm assuming that anyone that disagrees with you is "off-topic." Interesting world view.

    If you can't stay on topic, don't post here.
    Wearing your Moderator hat now, are you?

    Nevertheless, even trolls deserve to be corrected:

    I paid $70 after tax, and I only had a $50 New Every 2. From a starting price of $300, you do the math.
    I did. Looks like I got a better deal by keeping my mouth shut. Feel free to bask in your glory, though.

    No inventory for an 80gb hard drive? Solectron (or as you call it, IBMSERV?) wanted me to ship my machine in to have it looked at and fixed. I called Lenovo's Executive Offices and took care of it on my own.
    IBMSERV (IBM's Service organization) handles technical support and warranty repair for Lenovo. They subcontract the actual repair out to folks like Qualex, Solectron and others. And yes, it's entirely possible that an 80GB hard drive would be out of stock. IBM/Lenovo only switched to non-proprietary firmware on drives within the last 2 years or so. It's entirely possible that the 80GB drive would not have been replaceable.

    If I'm getting the best deal on a product at Circuit City why wouldn't I shop there?
    If you think you're getting the best deal at CC, you're obviously not looking very hard. But there's a better reason to avoid shopping there, and that's their amazingly short-sighted decision to fire all of their best, most knowledgeable salespeople to institute a new compensation plan a little over a year ago. A plan that fails even today to appropriately reward their best performers.

    I'm not talking about coupons or dollar-off offers. Retailers don't send gift cards in the mail unless you have a rewards card, branded credit card, etc. I don't have any of those affiliations with Circuit City. Still, I received $25.
    And that serves to contradict my statement how?

    No flies. The General Manager did ask me to come in so he could personally thank me for my feed back and give me the gift certificates. Have I gone back? Not yet but I probably will.
    As I suspected. Bad dining experience, manager wants your repeat business. Clever wording on your part though.

    Apparently you don't stay in hotels very often. I didn't have to run to Wal-Mart (why would you shop at Wal-Mart?) to get my points. And I was wrong, it was 5,000 Gold Passport points--which is a free room. The Hilton points were 25% of a free room. (In both cases, a lot more than a magazine subscription)
    I've been a Marriott Rewards Platinum with an average stay of 110 nights/year for the last 4 years. And I don't stay exclusively in Marriotts.

    And I ran to Wal-Mart because the front desk staff was overwhelmed and looked like they could use some help. It's called "being a good citizen."

    Oh, and your "free room?" One night at their lowest category hotel. Hey, you go girl!

    I don't really see running to Wal-Mart to buy flashlights as an effective use of my time.
    Ah, I see. Sitting in the dark is a better use of your time. Again, I must use the little sad face emoticon . . .

    If you don't want to participate in this, then don't.
    Oh, but I do. But it's beginning to feel like a gunfight with an unarmed man.

    At this point, you're just trolling this thread.
    Umm, I don't think an alternative viewpoint counts as trolling.

    If you have something constructive to add, then go for it. Otherwise, **** off until you can get your facts straight.
    I think my facts are pretty much straight. I do think you may need to work on yours.
    07-29-08 05:05 PM
  5. John Yester's Avatar
    Uhhh you guys want to shove it and be quite and get back on topic.!!!! Man..... back and forth about nothing is really frustrating to me...... we went from GPS to store blah blah blah.......


    Get a grip and move on to the topic at hand.....
    07-29-08 05:16 PM
  6. timberdc's Avatar
    Uhhh you guys want to shove it and be quite and get back on topic.!!!! Man..... back and forth about nothing is really frustrating to me...... we went from GPS to store blah blah blah.......


    Get a grip and move on to the topic at hand.....
    "I'm actually most interested in helping people use their time constructively. Makes more sense than tilting at windmills."
    You see the irony here, don't you?
    07-29-08 05:21 PM
  7. tabraha's Avatar
    But there's a better reason to avoid shopping there, and that's their amazingly short-sighted decision to fire all of their best, most knowledgeable salespeople to institute a new compensation plan a little over a year ago. A plan that fails even today to appropriately reward their best performers.
    Circuit City got rid of their most knowledgeable salespeople? I must have missed the era where they ever had any!

    Anyhow, back on topic: I'd rather not take VZW to the BBB as much as I'd like to see the options of $10/month to unlock the GPS completely or preferably a large "lifetime" fee to unlock the GPS altogether. $10 for just VZ Nav is not feasible when the Freedom BT Keychain gives you a break even cost in 7 months and is not locked into one app. With the Freedom Keychain not being locked it is currently way more future proof for BB Apps down the road too. Now having the option to unlock the internal GPS would easily be worth more than the price of any of the external units to many as being integrated is just one less piece of equipment to keep up with.
    07-29-08 05:25 PM
  8. shooptek's Avatar
    I'd just port my number out of Verizon and go to AT&T.. I will deal with a few dropped calls here and there if it means usable, free GPS..

    besides.. GSM 3g is,

    1. Faster due to HDSPA..
    2. allows for data AND voice at the same time.

    I cant tell you how ANNOYING it is on my Sprint WinMo phone, when I send a sms message, my Microsoft Office Communicator disconnects..
    Suggesting to jump ship to another carrier simply for GPS is absolutely outrageous. I have GPS built into my car! To me, being able to place and hold calls anywhere I want is far more important than being able to have a free GPS program on my phone. Have you ever compared a call on VZW to a call on ATT? The quality is far superior on VZW's CDMA network. And when was the last time that you were downloading something that the minor boost of speed that HSDPA actually made more than a few seconds of a difference over EVDO? Probably never.

    If you want a handheld GPS, buy a handheld GPS! If you dont like it, then pay the $10 a month and use VZW's program. VZNav isnt half bad if you really need to have GPS on your phone, and still be able to make and receive CLEAR calls.



    On the other hand, I do agree that it is ridiculous for VZW to lock the GPS on RIM devices. VZW has every right to do this, as they are providing you with service to a device that they are selling you. They are a business and are trying to make as much money for their shareholders as possible, which is understandable.

    I am VERY dissapointed with RIM for allowing VZW to mangle their device like this. RIM should protect their loyal customers and their devices! They put GPS in there to be used, not locked up by the carrier. RIM needs to take a stand and tell VZW that they cant do this anymore, and that is the only way that I think any change is going to come about.
    07-29-08 05:27 PM
  9. knoxunlabeled's Avatar
    I had service with Cingular/ At&t for ten years before I switched to Verizon. I started when they were Bell South Mobility then stayed when they became Cingular and stayed about 2 months after the merge with At&t. I never had a problem with reception or customer service until after the merge. One day out of the blue, my phone (my wife's too) quit working at my house. I literally had a 2 foot square in my backyard that I could make and receive calls from. I called customer "service" over and over about the problem and they would do absolutely nothing. I finally spent about 6 hours on the phone with them one day (inside the 2 foot square) moving SLOWLY up the ladder with my problem. Starting with the person who answered my call (rude as she could be) and then moving to her supervisor, then that person's supervisor, then that person's supervisor, then that person's supervisor and finally that person's supervisor/manager. This person finally told me that they would not do anything for me and that I should just use my phone when I was away from home. Needles to say, I was floored and extremely mad. I tried to explain that this was going to make me switch carriers and that I had had service with them for 10 years and he told me it didn't matter. He also laughed and told me their would be a $400 penalty if I switched out of my contract.

    I was in a Verizon store about 15 minutes later switching both my numbers and buying new phones. That was about 4 years ago and I have never been happier. I have not dropped a single call since I have had them and not been able to find a dead spot anywhere. Verizon also has the best customer service of any company I have ever dealt with. They are always nice and willing to bend over backwards to help me. They have also removed overages and given me extra minutes in the past. When I purchased my Curve, they helped me set it up and GAVE me the VZ navigator for free, because I asked. They know how to treat customers and unless something drastically changes, they have my business for life.

    BTW Cingular/At&t tried to stick me with a $450 charge for canceling my contract, but my friendly Verizon rep showed me the part in the contract that states it is null and void if I move to an area and can no longer get service, which happens to cover what happened to me. After C/As eighth call they accepted what I was saying and voided my penalty.
    Talk about a success story! This is the exact reason I myself stay with VZW! If that means I have to pay $10 each month for VZNAV, so be it! Although I don't use/need navigation I'm sure if I did I would gladly pay the fee for VZWNAV.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-29-08 05:27 PM
  10. MangoGT's Avatar
    I'm not talking about Better Business Bureau or anything like that. I"m just saying call the executive offices and tell them that you are interested in a particular feature--an unlocked GPS. The more people that call the more effective we can be.

    So anyway, back to the topic at hand: Send me a PM if you want the number for the direct line.
    07-29-08 07:41 PM
  11. anon(368121)'s Avatar
    Sorry for the diversion, folks. MangoGT and I obviously have a difference of opinion on the subject of Verizon's control of their aGPS service, and there won't be any changing of minds on either of our parts.

    We're apparently continuing our little convo via PM, as it appears he's left an unkindly titled message there for me. To my shame, I admit that I've been somewhat rude in my response . . .

    I'm bowing out of this thread. Good luck with Verizon, y'all!
    07-29-08 08:04 PM
  12. sniffs's Avatar
    Suggesting to jump ship to another carrier simply for GPS is absolutely outrageous. I have GPS built into my car! To me, being able to place and hold calls anywhere I want is far more important than being able to have a free GPS program on my phone. Have you ever compared a call on VZW to a call on ATT? The quality is far superior on VZW's CDMA network. And when was the last time that you were downloading something that the minor boost of speed that HSDPA actually made more than a few seconds of a difference over EVDO? Probably never.

    If you want a handheld GPS, buy a handheld GPS! If you dont like it, then pay the $10 a month and use VZW's program. VZNav isnt half bad if you really need to have GPS on your phone, and still be able to make and receive CLEAR calls.



    On the other hand, I do agree that it is ridiculous for VZW to lock the GPS on RIM devices. VZW has every right to do this, as they are providing you with service to a device that they are selling you. They are a business and are trying to make as much money for their shareholders as possible, which is understandable.

    I am VERY dissapointed with RIM for allowing VZW to mangle their device like this. RIM should protect their loyal customers and their devices! They put GPS in there to be used, not locked up by the carrier. RIM needs to take a stand and tell VZW that they cant do this anymore, and that is the only way that I think any change is going to come about.

    I dont know about you.. but if I'm on a call and I need to check directions or look up something on the internet.. I like being able to do that. On Verizon, that is simply not possible.

    As for downloading.. My company has ALOT of people who tether out in the field and need to be on conference calls at the same time.. This also is simply not possible with Verizon. So rather than getting them a Blackberry with data and an aircard, we use AT&T which allows for both data/voice at the same time. (currently none of the BB's allow this, so we're talking OTHER types of phones here, such as the Moto Q9h, Tilt, etc)

    I feel Verizon has the fascist method to their network.. like it or leave it.

    Verizon's CDMA may be a little superior in call quality, and their CS is pretty superior I admit that, as I'm the carrier admin/bes admin for my company and have to deal with both carriers daily, but cell phone's are not all about calls now-a-days, some people use their device for streaming radio, or podcasts..

    Anyways, I'm not here to argue.. I absolutely love AT&T's data network, but you can't beat Verizon's call quality. It's a trade off.
    Last edited by sniffs; 07-29-08 at 11:31 PM.
    07-29-08 11:28 PM
  13. OPTiK's Avatar
    There's way to many posts here saying "oh version rules, who cares if they lock gps", "dont be cheap and pay the $10", etc.

    First, the OP simply stated if you wanted the number to place a POLITE request with the execs to PM him. If you don't want to then great for you but please stop posting non sense to de-rail the post. The last thing we need is super fanboys running through here trying to stick up for a company that has blatently hindered a feature that should be free. If you dont agree with the cause GTFO
    07-30-08 12:36 PM
  14. MangoGT's Avatar
    There's way to many posts here saying "oh version rules, who cares if they lock gps", "dont be cheap and pay the $10", etc.

    First, the OP simply stated if you wanted the number to place a POLITE request with the execs to PM him. If you don't want to then great for you but please stop posting non sense to de-rail the post. The last thing we need is super fanboys running through here trying to stick up for a company that has blatently hindered a feature that should be free. If you dont agree with the cause GTFO
    Thanks.
    07-30-08 12:51 PM
  15. Japy's Avatar
    I love verizon service and coverage. I've been paying for vz navigator for 2 years on my last phone and this one, I love it for turn by turn and local searching. Yet I still want the internal gps unlocked, its not because I don't wanna spend money, f that, ill keep navigator anyway, but I use google maps for work constantly, for the fact that its considerably faster loading, allows me to add favorite stars, pull up satelite images, and mark on the maps where all my employees are on the map. The problem is that because the internal gps is locked, google maps uses radio towers to try and guess my location. Fun part is- its within 5000 meters, this is horribly inaccurate and its a real pain in the *** trying to pinpoint my location on it in a large city I'm unfamiliar with.

    They should unlock the gps simply so that people such as myself can use whatever fing map software they want for whatever features they offer. As I said I'd still use navigator and I use it frequently to warrant 10$ a month.
    07-30-08 01:57 PM
  16. mynameismatrix's Avatar
    [QUOTE=Dodge Deboulet;549026]If you think you're getting the best deal at CC, you're obviously not looking very hard. But there's a better reason to avoid shopping there, and that's their amazingly short-sighted decision to fire all of their best, most knowledgeable salespeople to institute a new compensation plan a little over a year ago. A plan that fails even today to appropriately reward their best performers.

    Uhhh...actually I think they did that more than a year ago, but then again it sounds like you were once an employee so you might know. BTW, this thread is very funny!
    Last edited by mynameismatrix; 07-30-08 at 02:16 PM.
    07-30-08 02:02 PM
  17. MangoGT's Avatar
    Has anyone received any sort of satisfactory response from the people at VZW?
    07-31-08 01:09 PM
  18. EsmereldaPea's Avatar
    I can't believe that so many people are saying the VZWNav is so great. It worked once or twice, but I've been unsuccessful in getting it to work consistently, I just cancelled it. In addition, it is such a hog and kludgey - its interface looks circa 1990 as well. Just my two cents . . .
    10-09-08 12:15 PM
  19. gtstang462002's Avatar
    I used VZnav on my last 2 phones and it worked great. On the BB though it always seemed to run about 30 seconds behind so I would always have to look for my turn before the VZnav would tell me about it. To me that is useless for a navigation system. The other issue that I would have is on long trip over 400 miles the nav would add an extra 100miles to my trip by taking me the scenic route regardless of my trip settings. And they wonder why I won't pay $10 a month.
    10-12-08 07:42 PM
  20. Rollingbones's Avatar
    I'm not talking about Better Business Bureau or anything like that. I"m just saying call the executive offices and tell them that you are interested in a particular feature--an unlocked GPS. The more people that call the more effective we can be.

    So anyway, back to the topic at hand: Send me a PM if you want the number for the direct line.
    My wife and I had Verizon back when it was Airtouch Cellular. My first phone was an analog phone. I was up at Mammouth Mtn resort in Calif for a Mountain Bike Festival. Four of us had cell phones. Three tried to call out and had no connection whereas I had 3 bars and a good clear call. Yes I'm a happy Verizon customer... ergo I have no problem being an even happier Verizon customer. With the economy being in the crapper and everyone trying to stick their hand deeper into your pocket and giving up less for it, I'll take a shot at it. I have GPS for the car, truck and the Burgman 650 Scooter, but what the hey, I'm already jazzed about the curve (I ahve an 8gb card with 65 CD's loaded and 3.7 gb left...sweet!!) and one more feature could only help when needed so I'm sending you a PM, send me the name/number and I'll call as soon as I can. I'll post back after the call. Thanks!!!!
    11-12-08 11:45 PM
  21. cdf3's Avatar
    I pay for VZnav, and like it. It would seem practical to unlock the GPS if I'm paying $9.99/mo. I would like to have the ability to search for stores near my GPS location with apps such as SuperPages Mobile and Beyond411 Search. VZnav has a similar search feature, but it's not always accurate and seems outdated. Paying $9.99/mo only unlocks the GPS to VZnav, and nothing else.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-13-08 04:22 AM
  22. VDoubleUVR6's Avatar
    I've been using a Bluetooth GPS receiver for a few weeks now and its been working great. $30 from a friend who had it sitting around, comes with a car charger and all AND it works with VZnav...so in about 2 1/2 months it'll pay itself off.
    11-13-08 08:20 AM
  23. ajdaniel's Avatar
    Apparently not many, based on the responses so far.

    I'm simply pointing out that your "because the customer wants it" line of reasoning is ludicrous. Retail and Service companies make money because customers want something those companies have and will pay for it. It's obviously not hurting Verizon's business to deny open access to the GPS hardware, so there's no incentive to change. Unless youthreaten to leave Verizon, you've got no leverage.

    And unless you're prepared to follow through on that threat, you're simply whining.
    Actually I left verizon and went to ATT because they locked their gps. So your argument doesn't hold true. No one is calling verizon and complaining because it's easier to ditch verizon and sign up with any other carrier as the rest of the carriers all provide this natural functionality of the phone.
    Last edited by ajdaniel; 11-13-08 at 08:44 AM.
    11-13-08 08:38 AM
  24. tx_dbs_tx's Avatar
    I also bailed out on Verizon this month and "locked GPS" was one the reasons. The other reason was plan pricing with Sprint and their new "simply everything" plans blows all other carrier's pricing out of the water! I had Verizon for several years and it really pissed me off that the GPS is locked and will only work with VZNAV and you have to pay extra for it. In my opinion the GPS is a built in feature of the BB Curve 8330 and is munufactured with it then Verizon decides they want to disable it and make their customer pay to use it at all. That's bs and I completely agree with the thread creator here that customers shouldn't have to pay extra to enable a feature that comes on the phone from the factory. It's like disabling bluetooth features unless you pay extra for it... or disabling the mp3 player unless you pay extra for it...or disabling the memory card slot unless you pay extra for that feature...or disabling the use of any other ringtones other than factory installed ringtones unless you pay extra for those. (they do that already but it's not too dificult to overcome that obstacle). That's my point.... I will not disagree that Verizon has the best network but since I've switched to Sprint I have had the same if not better call quality, data/web speeds (better actually), and the ability to use ANY third party Navigation/gPS software that I choose for FREEEEE! Sprint's Navigator is WAAAAY better than VZ Navigator with many more configurable options and a much more user friendly search and navigation features! I would gladly pay for Sprint Navigator....but guess what I don't have to because it's included free with the new "simply everything" plans!!! Sorry Verizon in the day and time it's all about saving money anywhere you can and I now pay half of what I was paying with Verizon and I still get unlimited everything including minutes... Enough said I'm happier now that I have a fully functional GPS!!! I think it's bs to disable a phone's built in function to turn around and charge a fee to use it and only with the carriers software on top of that. Pure BS
    11-15-08 05:53 PM
  25. MangoGT's Avatar
    Haha. Apparently too many people called the Executive Customer Service number so they switched it to Security Services. I just called and scammed the security guy into giving me a direct line to the office of Charlie Falco, the VP of Customer Service Operations for Verizon Wireless.

    PM me if you want it.
    11-16-08 03:39 PM
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