01-13-11 12:54 PM
86 1234
tools
  1. Knuw1's Avatar
    Best post I've ever read on these forums.
    Def one of the best posts on this forum...couldn't agree more!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-31-10 08:26 PM
  2. bvrat5199's Avatar
    For me it was the opposite. I saw the i4 comapred to the torch on both this sites reviews and in person and wanted the torch. It is the best of both worlds and does the most important thing best when looking at a cell phone - making and receiving calls - what concept.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-31-10 08:53 PM
  3. leilani_J's Avatar
    If you need to compare a phone to another phone... Then get the phone your comparing it to. Most Blackberry users who switch to the "latest and greatest" Blackberry out can live with whatever "issues" that new Blackberry has because they know RIM is likely to address them... It's the people that don't come from the "Blackberry world" that have to compare a device to the iPhone... Most Blackberry users don't compare their BB's with other devices, they mostly compare their BB's to other BB models...
    Well said. The End.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-31-10 09:21 PM
  4. leilani_J's Avatar
    This is a world where other platforms now exist and dominate the landscape. RIM needs to expand beyond what it is known for. I love my Torch for communicating via SMS, email, FB, AIM, etc but for everything else I prefer my iPhone. Most consumers don't need the high-end communications BB offers.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    There is nothing that says RIM needs to change what they're doing just to match the competition. Every other phone out there tries to copy the iPhone or fails on comparison. Though I am already a loyal BB user, I almost appreciate the fact that RIM doesn't choose to set out to copy the popular iPhone, but rather does what it needs to IMPROVE UPON what it is known for, and what BB users have come to love about their phones. You can never say one phone is better than another, anyway; choice of device will always be based on an individual's preference/needs. Not on whether a device carries more or less bells and whistles. You either need them or don't. That's the only difference that has true validity in any argument regarding all of these devices. And IMHO, *Android is just too ugly (and too rushed) of an interface for me to waste my money on. *(strictly my decision and my preference, thank you.)

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-31-10 09:46 PM
  5. Thanontos's Avatar
    It would be nice if I could have a torch that packed the media capabilities of my captivate, but many blackberry users do not need faster processors or higher res screens.

    Rim does two things great, battery life and communication. For those saying the torch has bad battery life, that is true when compared to other blackberry's, but stack it up to other smartphones and I could pull almost 40 hours of use out of my blackberry. I had better signal with my blackberry too and living in a weak att coverage area it was nice to never drop to no signal.

    It isn't much of a secret though that RIM isn't into media aspects. For some people (like myself) media is a big part of my life. I would spend more time web browsing and streaming videos than I did using bbm or email. So I switched. Bottom line is, if you are questioning the phone you got, then you've picked the wrong phone. Maybe users could have the best of both worlds where RIM would build phones to cater both like Nokia does. I agree that most smartphones look like slabs of glass and still sell. It is because of the target audience that focuses on internals instead of capabilities.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Last edited by Thanontos; 12-31-10 at 09:55 PM.
    12-31-10 09:53 PM
  6. twigg's Avatar
    There is nothing that says RIM needs to change what they're doing just to match the competition. Every other phone out there tries to copy the iPhone or fails on comparison. Though I am already a loyal BB user, I almost appreciate the fact that RIM doesn't choose to set out to copy the popular iPhone, but rather does what it needs to IMPROVE UPON what it is known for, and what BB users have come to love about their phones. You can never say one phone is better than another, anyway; choice of device will always be based on an individual's preference/needs. Not on whether a device carries more or less bells and whistles. You either need them or don't. That's the only difference that has true validity in any argument regarding all of these devices. And IMHO, *Android is just too ugly (and too rushed) of an interface for me to waste my money on. *(strictly my decision and my preference, thank you.)

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    RIM needs to change if it wants to rermain a competitive force in the smartphone race for the foreseesble future. I'm not saying that RIM needs to copy Apple, I'm saying that it needs to change to meet growing and shifting consumer demands. They can't simply play on their strengths, they need to grow their feature set to more then what they are know for. Their marketshare is slipping, that's a fact. And if you look at the reviews and sales compared to other flagship or mid-tier devices, its much lower.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-31-10 11:13 PM
  7. iN8ter's Avatar
    What an obnoxious post. You sound like a five year old saying "My Mommy is better than your Mommy". Grow up please!
    How so, your post doesn't make any sense.

    RIM's phones are worse than high end Android, WP7, and iOS devices.

    The Torch has worse specs than the Palm Pre+, and the OS is worse than WebOS 1.4.5. RIM's services are good (Push Email, BBM, etc.). Their devices are bad, and their OS is bad. Right now, they're literally years behind the competition as far as hardware and functionality is concerned. They are carried by the 2G Market and the Corporate sector - plain and simple.

    The fact that RIM sold quite a few of them, really doesn't matter. The fact and the matter is that they do not sell many phones at all to non-business users.

    Torch probably sold somewhat well in the US to business users because it's on AT&T, and AT&T gives ridiculous deals on them to businesses. My job has a contract with AT&T, and we get $100 off on RIM smartphones and in addition to the universal (which we get regardless of what we buy) 20% discount on our plans.

    Yes, someone just adding a line for work and sharing the minutes between both phones will probably get the Torch, especially when the company runs BES on their Exchange servers and you have to lie, cheat, and sneak around to get any non-RIM smartphone hooked into the Exchange server.

    At that kind of a discount, you can get a Refurb on the cheap and not have to worry about ETFs/contracts and such.

    But I don't know anyone with a BB, where that BB isn't a work phone. But 2 people.

    RIM knows their phones are pretty bad, and that they need to revamp their OS. That's why they're waiting for dual core processors to get that done.

    Also, a bit of reading comprehension never hurts...

    Buying a RIM smartphone right now is, IMO, a waste of money/a contract with dual cores on the horizon. It's better to just stick with what you have and wait for them to release a decent device (decent by market standards, not by RIM standards).

    70% of the cell market is feature phone users. People like what they like. If you like RIM phones, then good for you. No one (certainly not me) is trying to make you switch. But if you don't criticize a company for its failures and shortcomings the end result is bound to be more of the same. That's why 80% of hte phones they're shipping today are only moderate improvements (outside of the OS, which IMO hasn't really improved all that much either) over what they were shipping a decade ago). Back then it was hot stuff. Not so much, anymore...
    Last edited by N8ter; 01-01-11 at 12:59 AM.
    01-01-11 12:54 AM
  8. homer1475's Avatar
    It would be nice if I could have a torch that packed the media capabilities of my captivate, but many blackberry users do not need faster processors or higher res screens.

    Rim does two things great, battery life and communication. For those saying the torch has bad battery life, that is true when compared to other blackberry's, but stack it up to other smartphones and I could pull almost 40 hours of use out of my blackberry. I had better signal with my blackberry too and living in a weak att coverage area it was nice to never drop to no signal.

    It isn't much of a secret though that RIM isn't into media aspects. For some people (like myself) media is a big part of my life. I would spend more time web browsing and streaming videos than I did using bbm or email. So I switched. Bottom line is, if you are questioning the phone you got, then you've picked the wrong phone. Maybe users could have the best of both worlds where RIM would build phones to cater both like Nokia does. I agree that most smartphones look like slabs of glass and still sell. It is because of the target audience that focuses on internals instead of capabilities.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    This post nails it on the head. RIM could care less what others are doing, what they do they do very well. Just because every kiddie out there is a spec wh*re doesn't mean the torch can't compete against other phones with higher specs. Just because you have a super Amoled and/or "retina display", to me it means nothing. I'm not a media hound(yes i do have some videos and music on my torch), but when I do use my torch for that purpose it works just fine.

    I will agree that the touch on certain droids and iphone is way better, but the torch's touchscreen being RIM's first true touchscreen device, I think it works great.

    Sure there are bigger and better devices out there that can do 100 more things then the torch can do, but in the end it all comes down to what works for you(if what works for you is reading specs on a sheet that mean nothing when implemented improperly then so be it).

    Personally I loathe itunes so that's not even an option for me, battery life on every droid absolutely sucks when compared to any BB. Droid OS is clumsy, cumbersome, and very redundant at its best(have never owned one but have played with quite a few of them recently). Seems everyone at work wants a droid(wowed by the "amoled" screen), until they play with my torch and see how easy it is to use, email is effortless to setup and use, plus the combination of touch + trackpad + physical keyboard is a sure win, also when asked how is the battery life on the droid(as my co worker is plugging it in), the reply is always terrible. One of the major selling points for my coworkers is battery life, I have a little app that gives you in hours how much battery you have left until at 10% that shows right in your notification bar, and when that says 16 hours with only 65% battery life it sold them on the torch.
    01-01-11 07:05 AM
  9. Daniel Ratcliffe's Avatar
    This post nails it on the head. RIM could care less what others are doing, what they do they do very well. Just because every kiddie out there is a spec wh*re doesn't mean the torch can't compete against other phones with higher specs. Just because you have a super Amoled and/or "retina display", to me it means nothing. I'm not a media hound(yes i do have some videos and music on my torch), but when I do use my torch for that purpose it works just fine.

    I will agree that the touch on certain droids and iphone is way better, but the torch's touchscreen being RIM's first true touchscreen device, I think it works great.

    Sure there are bigger and better devices out there that can do 100 more things then the torch can do, but in the end it all comes down to what works for you(if what works for you is reading specs on a sheet that mean nothing when implemented improperly then so be it).

    Personally I loathe itunes so that's not even an option for me, battery life on every droid absolutely sucks when compared to any BB. Droid OS is clumsy, cumbersome, and very redundant at its best(have never owned one but have played with quite a few of them recently). Seems everyone at work wants a droid(wowed by the "amoled" screen), until they play with my torch and see how easy it is to use, email is effortless to setup and use, plus the combination of touch + trackpad + physical keyboard is a sure win, also when asked how is the battery life on the droid(as my co worker is plugging it in), the reply is always terrible. One of the major selling points for my coworkers is battery life, I have a little app that gives you in hours how much battery you have left until at 10% that shows right in your notification bar, and when that says 16 hours with only 65% battery life it sold them on the torch.
    And just to add, in the UK, BlackBerry seems to be outselling Androids, and potentially even iPhones. Why? Because a lot of the people in the UK like the communications and are captivated by how STABLE the OS is. True, it may be slightly clunky, and it might not match the competition in specs, but the UK loves RIM for its communications and solidity, and so they buy them. Specs mean nothing (heck, I'd take a phone with worse specs than the BlackBerry Curve I have now, if it could exceed the performance I get out of my current phone), and the UK market is not simply a replication of the US market.

    Let BlackBerry focus on doing what they do best, the UK market loves RIM for that, and a lot of people don't want to be Herr Jobbs sheep, and so, they look to RIM.
    01-01-11 10:26 AM
  10. Berrywannabe's Avatar
    Perception means a lot.

    In December, I purchased a 9700. My satisfaction with the device is influenced by these facts:
    it's by first smart phone;
    I switched from two less-than-mediocre phones;
    and just prior, all the 'cool kids' I met were using a Blackberry.
    01-01-11 01:17 PM
  11. twigg's Avatar
    So RIM should jusyt keep on building on their strengths while turning a blind eye to the app and media functions in high demand by consumers? And to those who defend the Torch's specs as adaquate for its OS its not. Just look at the performance of the browser compared to other high end or even mind tier phones. And its not about whether "you" like your BB (this is Crackberry so its obvious you do to some degree) its whether the global markets do. RIM"s market share is slipping, that's a fact.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-01-11 03:51 PM
  12. stardotstar's Avatar
    RIMS biggest problem for me is ATT service, 3G in Houston! Cant wait for the 700 hz!
    01-01-11 04:00 PM
  13. Masahiro's Avatar
    So RIM should jusyt keep on building on their strengths while turning a blind eye to the app and media functions in high demand by consumers?
    I don't know. You tell us. You're the one with all the ideas. Not a single other person in this thread has really suggested what RIM should or shouldn't be doing except certain spec-obsessed forum executives that seem to think the only important aspect of a smart phone is how fast the processor is or how pretty the screen is.
    01-01-11 06:27 PM
  14. Thanontos's Avatar
    So RIM should jusyt keep on building on their strengths while turning a blind eye to the app and media functions in high demand by consumers? And to those who defend the Torch's specs as adaquate for its OS its not. Just look at the performance of the browser compared to other high end or even mind tier phones. And its not about whether "you" like your BB (this is Crackberry so its obvious you do to some degree) its whether the global markets do. RIM"s market share is slipping, that's a fact.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Maybe you can complain to the other smartphone companies about why they have horrible battery life and communications options that are not user friendly and don't push notifications to your phone. Or you could make the switch as I did, yea it sucks.losing some of the great things but you either adjust or you will never be happy with anything. I am almost sure there is no.perfect device out there anyway, but still you need to choose the one that is closest to feeling customized to you. If you are unhappy with your phone because you feel the company is slipping and everyone is jumping ship, you'd might be surprised to see how many people will hopon the chance to buy you phone out of contract.

    What is also funny, as the op suggests that the torch is a highly returned phone, I decided to ask my local att store about captivate returns and the rep told me he sees more reterns on the captivate than the torch. I will admit that a stock captivate is horrible though and to get it to run smooth you have to root the device and load up.a custom os without the att bloatware. Most users probably are not into or aware of modding the phone. Same with the torch I suppose, I read all the time on the forum about people.returning to.the torch after seeing how much better it ran on a new os. So maybe a lot of returns were due to users who felt the software was the issue, but without hard proof about why every customer returned their phone it is just speculation that the hardware is the main cause.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-01-11 08:23 PM
  15. Capitan Totti's Avatar
    1) You have the pope has an avatar? HA! Seriously?
    2) What do you mean by "apple or the iphone?" Are they now two different things? Buddy, the iPhone is Apple. Pass the kush...
    3) You talk like someone who has no clue what they are talking about. Granted, I don't find this astonishing as you are a jesusfreak with a Ratzinger avatar on a blackberry forum, but FYI, the Iphone4 was named the top tech failure of 2010, there is also a thread about it here on cb, because of its reception (and not perception) issues known to EVERYONE. Apple even gave out free covers to fix this.
    4) BBs are known to be, with Nokia, some of the best in the reception battery life category.
    01-01-11 08:39 PM
  16. sleepngbear's Avatar
    So RIM should jusyt keep on building on their strengths while turning a blind eye to the app and media functions in high demand by consumers?
    Geez, you sound an awful lot like that n8ter troll.

    Who says RIM is turning a blind eye to the demands of consumers?? What would you call the acquisition of QNX and TAT? Before you answer that with some kind of lame-azz reference to it all being an admission of failure, remember that Google bought Android first.

    And to those who defend the Torch's specs as adaquate for its OS its not. Just look at the performance of the browser compared to other high end or even mind tier phones. And its not about whether "you" like your BB (this is Crackberry so its obvious you do to some degree) its whether the global markets do. RIM"s market share is slipping, that's a fact.
    Ok, let's compare browsers. Would you consider the iPhonee high-end? My wife has one, and in the same house on the same Wi-Fi, my browser smokes hers pretty regularly. And let's not even talk about the consistently better reception I get on my crappy Torch than she does on her almighty iPhone. Regardless, she still loves her phone for the things it does, and I love mine for the same reasons, and neither of us thinks any less of ther other's phone for any reason. In fact, we're pretty tickled that we could both find such different devices on the same carrier that suit both our needs as well as these do.

    Ok, so RIM's market share is slipping. Duely noted, but don't think for a second they're sitting on their hands watching it happen. Not to mention the FACT that they're still selling more phones than ever.

    Yes, RIM could have moved quicker into the consumer market and possibly be in a better position market share-wise. They could also be in a whole lot worse shape were they not as good at their core competency as they are. The fact is that its OS IS adequate for what most of its users need and do. If it's not adequate enough for you, then by all means get ytourself something that is.
    01-01-11 08:43 PM
  17. Capitan Totti's Avatar
    Last night, NYE, Las Vegas Strip. 20.000 people on it, not to mention all around the country's mass texting and calls. All my friends had iPhones 3GS and one iPhone4. NONE, had reception, and NONE could send any SMS until 130, 2 AM. My 9700 on T-Mobile. No problems what so ever. Full signal. Day before that, my friend didn't receive EVER 2 texts I sent him. Weird thing that happen was, to all the phones, we all lost battery like crazy fast. I don't know if it has to do with NYE's amount of cell usage but it was very weird. Today, I read a friend of mine on Facebook posting "Sorry but had no reception at Cosmopolitan last night." Turns out that she has an iPhone3GS and she got loads of texts also after 2AM. Coincidence? I think not. My old Nokia 6610 had a far better reception than my buddy's iPhone3GS! No joke.
    01-01-11 08:52 PM
  18. 2jnc5's Avatar
    i like pie !
    01-01-11 09:27 PM
  19. KodyShadow's Avatar
    I'm a long time Blackberry user and supporter and I've never used any other brand of device. I have recently had the opportunity to use a Torch while someone was on holidays. Compared to my 9700 I didn't like it (keyboard not as good for me, OS6 I just plain didn't like it, and the phone itself was too big for me). Last week my hubby (also bb user) was given an Iphone 3GS as the company gives them to all staff in N.America as opposed to a Blackberry (something to do with email and company servers). Anyway, I'm really enjoying using this iphone and the touch screen is so easy to type on, despite my saying for years I would never go touch. It's fun, the apps are cool, and I'm seriously considering switching this year if nothing better comes from RIM. Never thought I'd say it, but I am
    01-01-11 09:39 PM
  20. twigg's Avatar
    I don't know. You tell us. You're the one with all the ideas. Not a single other person in this thread has really suggested what RIM should or shouldn't be doing except certain spec-obsessed forum executives that seem to think the only important aspect of a smart phone is how fast the processor is or how pretty the screen is.
    homer1475 was suggesting that and that was who my post was directed at "RIM could care less what others are doing, what they do they do very well."

    And I do own a Torch and I love it for communicating purposes (my iPhone 4 for everything else) so I don't hate RIM. But what I do hate is a bunch of fanboys that are just as bad as those on Macrumors who won't admit any fault with their beloved phones n

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-02-11 02:38 AM
  21. twigg's Avatar
    Last night, NYE, Las Vegas Strip. 20.000 people on it, not to mention all around the country's mass texting and calls. All my friends had iPhones 3GS and one iPhone4. NONE, had reception, and NONE could send any SMS until 130, 2 AM. My 9700 on T-Mobile. No problems what so ever. Full signal. Day before that, my friend didn't receive EVER 2 texts I sent him. Weird thing that happen was, to all the phones, we all lost battery like crazy fast. I don't know if it has to do with NYE's amount of cell usage but it was very weird. Today, I read a friend of mine on Facebook posting "Sorry but had no reception at Cosmopolitan last night." Turns out that she has an iPhone3GS and she got loads of texts also after 2AM. Coincidence? I think not. My old Nokia 6610 had a far better reception than my buddy's iPhone3GS! No joke.
    You're comparing AT&T's network to T-Mobiles buddy.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-02-11 02:39 AM
  22. twigg's Avatar
    Maybe you can complain to the other smartphone companies about why they have horrible battery life and communications options that are not user friendly and don't push notifications to your phone. Or you could make the switch as I did, yea it sucks.losing some of the great things but you either adjust or you will never be happy with anything. I am almost sure there is no.perfect device out there anyway, but still you need to choose the one that is closest to feeling customized to you. If you are unhappy with your phone because you feel the company is slipping and everyone is jumping ship, you'd might be surprised to see how many people will hopon the chance to buy you phone out of contract.

    What is also funny, as the op suggests that the torch is a highly returned phone, I decided to ask my local att store about captivate returns and the rep told me he sees more reterns on the captivate than the torch. I will admit that a stock captivate is horrible though and to get it to run smooth you have to root the device and load up.a custom os without the att bloatware. Most users probably are not into or aware of modding the phone. Same with the torch I suppose, I read all the time on the forum about people.returning to.the torch after seeing how much better it ran on a new os. So maybe a lot of returns were due to users who felt the software was the issue, but without hard proof about why every customer returned their phone it is just speculation that the hardware is the main cause.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

    I think that you guys are forgetting that newer tehonology allows for a mor feature rich phone. As many of you have admitted the competition has more features. And my iPhone 4's battery life is fine of not on par with my Torch's. Btw my iPhone 4 is a fine and extremely user friendly communicating device (and it has push), the Torch is just better in that area. And i suggest you read my posts again, I do have a Torch.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-02-11 02:44 AM
  23. twigg's Avatar
    Geez, you sound an awful lot like that n8ter troll.

    Who says RIM is turning a blind eye to the demands of consumers?? What would you call the acquisition of QNX and TAT? Before you answer that with some kind of lame-azz reference to it all being an admission of failure, remember that Google bought Android first.



    Ok, let's compare browsers. Would you consider the iPhonee high-end? My wife has one, and in the same house on the same Wi-Fi, my browser smokes hers pretty regularly. And let's not even talk about the consistently better reception I get on my crappy Torch than she does on her almighty iPhone. Regardless, she still loves her phone for the things it does, and I love mine for the same reasons, and neither of us thinks any less of ther other's phone for any reason. In fact, we're pretty tickled that we could both find such different devices on the same carrier that suit both our needs as well as these do.

    Ok, so RIM's market share is slipping. Duely noted, but don't think for a second they're sitting on their hands watching it happen. Not to mention the FACT that they're still selling more phones than ever.

    Yes, RIM could have moved quicker into the consumer market and possibly be in a better position market share-wise. They could also be in a whole lot worse shape were they not as good at their core competency as they are. The fact is that its OS IS adequate for what most of its users need and do. If it's not adequate enough for you, then by all means get ytourself something that is.
    I'm not a troll, I'm just a realist and not a fanboy. I can also admit faults with the phones that I own (dual using Torch and iPhone 4).

    What determines a high end device in my opinion are the devices number and quality of features and the hardware it uses. Obviously a high end device is expected to have a bit good tech.

    You're using a personal experience to compare devices. If you look at comparison videos between the two browsers, the Torch doesn't fair so well.

    And yes, RIM has moved to slowly into the consumer market (the most important sector for smartphones) and it's now realizing this and try to catch up. If you look at their recent devices, they don't have the strong media functions and such that consumers demand and RIM needs to fix this or it will be in trouble. That is the point I am trying to get across. And the Torch is great for my communication needs, but not for much else.

    Many of my co-workers have Androids and have questioned my choice to choose to dual use a BB Torch when I already have an iPhone 4. I have defended the Torch as the best communication device out there, but also recognize that right now, that is all it is. It's not a very well rounded device and that's where my iPhone 4 steps in.
    01-02-11 03:10 AM
  24. Capitan Totti's Avatar
    You're comparing AT&T's network to T-Mobiles buddy.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    ? Ok, buddy, i texted back and fourth with my buddies. Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint all worked fine, but ALL iPhones failed. Is it network related? Is it device related? You tell me, all I know is what happen.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    01-02-11 03:55 AM
  25. 67Tucker's Avatar
    ? Ok, buddy, i texted back and fourth with my buddies. Verizon, T-Mobile, and Sprint all worked fine, but ALL iPhones failed. Is it network related? Is it device related? You tell me, all I know is what happen.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    You just proved his point.
    howarmat likes this.
    01-02-11 06:02 AM
86 1234
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD