[ShortSxit]

1. Civic mentioned that the GPS is locked down. He's correct. However, you're talking about using google maps to get directions (not turn-by-turn). This can be done with Verizon. So your point is invalid.

2. From HoFo. Look familiar?

look back about 2 pages.
anyway, can someone tell me why verizon wouldnt include vz naz for free if you have a data plan?

3. You get what you pay for is nothing like "If it's more expensive, it must be better." Please take an economics class. You can't compare a filet mignon to cup o' noodles, and say that they should be the same price. If t-mobile works in your area, that's great. Feel free to switch. That doesn't change the fact that they lack 3g, have fewer customers, less coverage area, worse deals for resigning contracts, etc.

1. what civic said.
2. when did i ever suggest it should be completely free? i said vz nav or some other feature like txts should be bundled with the data plan. the whole issue is that we are being overcharged for the data plan by itself.

3. "you get what you pay for" is in the same line of thinking as "its more expensive so it must be better." do i really have to point out why that line of thinking is bad for consumers? and i live in a major city so lack of coverage is not an issue for any carrier in my area.

[ShortSxit]

by the way here is what I was talking about

Leaked Official RIM Announcement of the BlackBerry Storm | BerryReview.com �


go to the comments too for some discussion of it.

That's been known for about a week (from the Verizon internal slides), but nobody is holding their breath. It certainly sounds promising, though!

[sdotmiles]

1. Civic mentioned that the GPS is locked down. He's correct. However, you're talking about using google maps to get directions (not turn-by-turn). This can be done with Verizon. So your point is invalid.

2. From HoFo. Look familiar?


3. You get what you pay for is nothing like "If it's more expensive, it must be better." Please take an economics class. You can't compare a filet mignon to cup o' noodles, and say that they should be the same price. If t-mobile works in your area, that's great. Feel free to switch. That doesn't change the fact that they lack 3g, have fewer customers, less coverage area, worse deals for resigning contracts, etc.

1. point is still valid, you have just missed it. it doesnt really matter though if they are going to open up the gps.

2. what does the word "include" mean in that sentence? i said vz nav or some other feature like txts should be bundled with the data plan. again, the whole issue is that we are being overcharged for the data plan by itself.

3. sigh. you might live in rural idaho where you only have one service provider with coverage, but where i live the better comparison would be a porterhouse to a rib-eye, ie, they are both good. and yes t-mobile is rolling out 3g as we speak. word is they will get the BB Bold soon.

[JRSCCivic98]

1. Civic mentioned that the GPS is locked down. He's correct. However, you're talking about using google maps to get directions (not turn-by-turn). This can be done with Verizon. So your point is invalid.

I don't know what's funnier. The fact that you think GPS is only good for turn-by-turn directions or the fact that you keep harping on bent-truth Verizon tactics to get your points across.

Everyone in the world thinks Verizon is overpriced and they are. Having a superior network does not give them the right to charge more. What is there a "charge more if your service is better" handbook out there or something? Bottom line, if they want to be number 1 and for that matter the ONLY 1, then they should consider dropping their prices on the plans or bundling in some pay-for features. No one can get away with 450minute plans anymore, so those of us who use the phones a lot end up spending a lot of money each month to get the right amount of coverage. And this 9pm nights is bullisht and everyone knows it. It should be 6pm. I'm surprised it's only 9... I'm sure VZW execs wanted to make it 11pm if they could.

[hal1]

It's useless for turn-by-turn directions, but it can still be used to map out a path, contrary to the other poster.

Agreed. Gmaps is a great free app on my non-VZ Nav Verizon curve. It shows my approx. location, I just "say" Radio Shack, and it shows me on the map where I am and where the stores are they are. Bingo

The map is WAY good enough, also for approximating your location.

[ClickClack911]

I don't wanna get too involved in this discussion, but I had to comment about one thing: having a superior network DOES give a company (in this case Verizon) the right to charge more. Again, as it's been pointed out a few times already, it goes back to basic economics.

Superior = more demand = more charge

Inferior = less demand = less charge

Pretty simple concept.

[sdotmiles]

I don't wanna get too involved in this discussion, but I had to comment about one thing: having a superior network DOES give a company (in this case Verizon) the right to charge more. Again, as it's been pointed out a few times already, it goes back to basic economics.

Superior = more demand = more charge

Inferior = less demand = less charge

Pretty simple concept.

its all relative though. as i have said, every major carrier works extremely well in the area i live (a big city), so you cannot say that one is far and away more superior than another. you guys talk about economics as if the cell phone industry exists in a vacuum. in a place where all things are equal, it is easy to see that these supply/demand-superior/inferior scenarios do not work.

[sdotmiles]

Wow, really now? You ask me to show you where you said that Verizon should include Navigator for free and I show your exact quote and you respond with "What does the word include mean?" Your exact words were that they should include it for free.

why are you still talking about gps? ive already conceded that point since the gps will supposedly be open on the storm.

and you may want to take note of what the word "include" means. i know its a very basic word that gets glossed over but you should still know what its proper meaning is. try typing "define: include" into google.

Definitions of "include" on the Web:
* have as a part, be made up out of; "The list includes the names of many famous writers"
* consider as part of something; "I include you in the list of culprits"
* add as part of something else; put in as part of a set, group, or category; "We must include this chemical element in the group"


so "include for free" is the same as "bundle" or "added at no additional cost." its not actually free if the price is rolled in.

[CynicalDreams81#CB]

I have the Voyager with Verizon which, if some do not know, is a touch screen phone. I've had no problems with the VZNavigator or any other programs such as Mobile Email (which of course I won't need on the storm). It's mainly the phone that gives problems because the voyager takes several presses of the screen sometimes to select a button (due to bad firmware, one update and Verizon won't be doing another because they're releasing the storm). As responsive as the Storm's screen is going to supposedly be I doubt there will be any problems.

[jon341427]

while i get the joke about his name having civic in it and him going to a mercedes dealer its still another dumb example. if you can get the exact same c-class at carmax for 10k less than the mb dealership, most smart people are going to go to carmax or at least ask the mb dealership why they are charging more for the same car. apples to apples.

so what i gather from what your saying is that because in bigger cities carriers have the same reception (about), that when you compare verizon to tmobile for example, you are paying more for the same service..... verizon obviously being more expensive. if this is what your saying, then think of it this way. a bmw vs a civic. the bmw and civic both will drive you around (which would be equivalent to different providers being able to make phone calls), but with the bmw your ride will be smoother (cdma sounds better then gsm), with your bmw you will pay more for maintence (verizon costs more), and with your bmw you will have more options availible (verizon has more options) lastly with bmw you pay for the name, i believe that verizon is sort of a status symbol nowadays.

[sdotmiles]

so what i gather from what your saying is that because in bigger cities carriers have the same reception (about), that when you compare verizon to tmobile for example, you are paying more for the same service..... verizon obviously being more expensive. if this is what your saying, then think of it this way. a bmw vs a civic. the bmw and civic both will drive you around (which would be equivalent to different providers being able to make phone calls), but with the bmw your ride will be smoother (cdma sounds better then gsm), with your bmw you will pay more for maintence (verizon costs more), and with your bmw you will have more options availible (verizon has more options) lastly with bmw you pay for the name, i believe that verizon is sort of a status symbol nowadays.

thats a very rational breakdown but it just does not apply. forget cars and steaks and things and just think about the phones. storm on vzw vs storm activated on t-mobile/att/alltel/etc, and tell me why paying more per month for the same service (data+email) and less features (less voice min's, no txts included, etc) would be a good idea. especially when in my area i will not notice any difference in call quality or coverage.

[Chrisy]

thats a very rational breakdown but it just does not apply. forget cars and steaks and things and just think about the phones. storm on vzw vs storm activated on t-mobile/att/alltel/etc, and tell me why paying more per month for the same service (data+email) and less features (less voice min's, no txts included, etc) would be a good idea. especially when in my area i will not notice any difference in call quality or coverage.

it wouldn't make sense for you to pay more if the carrier you have now meets your needs.

i gladly pay more for VZW because i travel across the US frequently and their coverage is superior to all the other carriers. i had AT&T for 8 years and was generally happy with them until i travelled out west in arizona and up to vermont. i also noticed increased dropped calls when at&t was merged with cingular.

i wouldn't even touch t-mobile because of their lack of rural and overall coverage.

alltel seems fine as they roam off of VZW towers however they have roaming charges and i'm not down with that!

sprint has almost no usable service in the area that i live so that counts them out.

so, i pay more for the carrier that suits my needs. my need is nationwide coverage, no roaming and fast speeds on the phone's internet.

having had both gsm and cdma i notice that with one gsm bar the call quality is grainy and fades in and out and tends to drop. with cdma the call sounds the same with 1 or 5 bars. i don't know what it is in the technology that allows this but that is why i favor cdma.

[JRSCCivic98]

hey civic go into a mercedes dealer and tell then their cars are over priced and they should sell them cheaper.

Let me know how that one goes.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

They are overpriced here in the states. Have you seen what they cost in Germany? Yeah, it's all relative.

And as for your steakhouse example, perhaps if Mortons charged you for seating, water, salt/pepper, silverware use, and the waiters shoes (due to traffic wear because he's walking back and forth to your table) then your viewpoint might change.

[sdotmiles]

Let me help you out a little....I said it was rhetorical question. I believe it's origin is greek.

Wikepedia's definition says: A rhetorical question is a figure of speech in the form of a question posed for its persuasive effect without the expectation of a reply.

That help you a little bit?

I can't help but laugh at you.......

skyys, shortsix, chrisy we are arguing and really wasting our time.

Tell you what sdotmiles. So this thread can move forward and for the good of everyone reading. Why don't we bury you face down in the sand, stick a flag in your a*s, and declare you the winner.

Congratulations.

is english a second language for you? not trying to be a ****, but if it is it would explain your lack of comprehensive sentence structure. you obviously cannot see anything other than your own perspective. at least Chrisy520 has made rational arguments and understands that things are all relative to different situations. thats a position i can respect. you're the one who has his head in the sand if you don't understand that.

[Reed McLay]

Castor Troy has been issued a 10 day infraction for insulting behaviour.

Keep this on topic, please.

[Castor Troy]

they keep me up all night, stripped me naked, threw me in a 5 x 9 cell and feed me once a day. Stay on topic PLEASE so that I may be freed......

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[msrtech]

It will have VZ nav in the pics you can see VZ navigator

[david.dent]

I don't have more knowledge about mobile phones but i have a website name which is provide online mobile help.

------------------------
Gps Navigation Systems - Tomtom.com

" Gratitude in your attitude will affect the latitude of your life."

[Chrisy]

so the Storm will have VZ Navigator 4.2.5. Does anyone know what the features of this new VZN are? or if those of us not moving to the storm will be able to get the update on our nav?