[xattica]

It would be great to have a thread that discussed the technical aspects of the Storm without degrading into a bunch of bickering. I would love it if we could talk about the details of the hardware, like what the processor is capable of instead of why it doesn't have WiFi.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Nice idea Pyroja. Just open people that can handle both possibilities.

[cereal killer]

Hawse this is the first Blackberry you have ever owned if memory serves me right correct?

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[Hawse771]

Damn u a moron. I will end this figth now. Is nice to debate about anything with open people but you dont. You the one that needs to read better.
The sheet read supports in several parts:
-Support for MS-Assisted (GPS), the Strorm has GPS?
-Support for for MDDI, the Storm has MDDI?
-Support for stereo output, the Storm has stereo output?
-Support for external Bluetooth, the storm has it???
Get the point.

Also, I really dont care if you trust im an engineer or not. I just noticed that you just think you know everything. This is a forum. I enter here to learn not to fight.
I will not continue this stupid back and forward.
And for your information, just the QUALCOMM chipset cost $30. The Storm cost almost $190 not $28.

I get the point you don't. Who built the phone?

And I know the cost of the storm. That is what ck thinks it costs. But I can see how it coulf be taken the wrong way.

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[Hawse771]

Hawse this is the first Blackberry you have ever owned if memory serves me right correct?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Yep ad your point? Does that have anything to do with wifi or cost?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Read the sheet you posted a link too. You CANT be an engineer. IT SAIS "SUPPORT FOR". What does that mean...??? IT MEANS IT SUPPORTS IT NOT THAT ITS IN THE CHIP..Jesus christ...I feel like I need to sit down with hooked on phonics and you to spell this out.

VZW DID NOT DISABLE AND OR PREVENT THE STORM FROM HAVING WIFI. This would require RIM saying here's a device with Wifi and VZW saying nah we dont allow that. If that were the case TELUS/BELL would have wifi on their storm...WHAT dont you get about this simple concept?

The Storm does not have Wifi because Verizon did not want it. Plain and simple. Also, all Storms have triband HSPA, but of course Verizon mandated that they be locked down. Anyways, a Storm with Wifi is coming soon, no worries.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Yep ad your point? Does that have anything to do with wifi or cost?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

And That Has to do with the Hardware Being Inefficient?

[Hawse771]

Wifi is hardware. Cost of parts used certainly effects hardwar wouldn't you say? Ck would have you believe the storm cost 28 in materials which would mean it is made from junk. Which isn't even close to the cost of a smartphone.

And That Has to do with the Hardware Being Inefficient?

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[cereal killer]

Yep ad your point? Does that have anything to do with wifi or cost?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Has nothing to do with wifi or cost.

It just helped me understand you. Your new to Blackberry's and don't have a lot of experience with them. It all makes sense now.

Before you freak out. I'm not insulting you.

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[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Wifi is hardware. Cost of parts used certainly effects hardwar wouldn't you say? Ck would have you believe the storm cost 28 in materials which would mean it is made from junk. Which isn't even close to the cost of a smartphone.



Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Although I wish WiFi was included- there are ALOT of people who feel that it is unnecessary.

VZW Believes that it's network is so dandy that it didn't need wifi, and that including it would be superfluous and burdensome.

So According to VZW leaving out the WiFi on the Storm is Cost efficient, and hardware efficient.

Definitely not inefficient.

Althought, I think $28 is a bit low, leaving out WiFi certainly makes the device cheaper to make.

[xattica]

CX thanks for the confirmation. Then, the 850/1900mhz HSPA can be unlocked???

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[xxxxpradaxxxx]

*For reference rants/raves is less then 7% of Storms total posts so we could live without it question is could you lol jk

OH and For the Record, Hawse-

The Storm Rants and Raves Section Has 969 Threads, With 22,322 Posts.

Which May Very Well Be 7% of the Storm Posts-

But That Doesn't Include All The Posts That Were Rants, Before there was an actual Rants Sub Forum.

Not To Mention All of the n00bs Posting in Wrong Places.

And By The Way-

How Many Other BlackBerry Sections Have a "Rants" Sub Forum To Begin With?



And Yes, I could Live Without The Rants Section.

I Have Been Here WAAYYY before there was a Storm Section, Let Alone a Rants Sub Forum-

To Be Fair, I Don't Think I Could Live Without the Off Topic Discussion Thread Though.

[cereal killer]

Wifi is hardware. Cost of parts used certainly effects hardwar wouldn't you say? Ck would have you believe the storm cost 28 in materials which would mean it is made from junk. Which isn't even close to the cost of a smartphone.



Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Yes that's correct $28.00 just in materials. Most expensive component is the chip which supposedly goes for $30.00. Which when bought in bulk drops the price substantially.

What's left besides the camara component that raises cost? That runs what $2-$3?

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[Crucial_Xtreme]

CX thanks for the confirmation. Then, the 850/1900mhz HSPA can be unlocked???

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Unlocked isn't the accurate description. Anyways, the triband radio is there. But I can't speak on it any further. Sorry.


Edit: Materials for the Storm are more than $30.

[xxxxpradaxxxx]

Yes that's correct $28.00 just in materials. Most expensive component is the chip which supposedly goes for $30.00. Which when bought in bulk drops the price substantially.

What's left besides the camara component that raises cost? That runs what $2-$3?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Yea Good Point-

Buying in Bulk Would Definitely Decrease the Actual Cost of the Goods.

[Hawse771]

Yes that's correct $28.00 just in materials. Most expensive component is the chip which supposedly goes for $30.00. Which when bought in bulk drops the price substantially.

What's left besides the camara component that raises cost? That runs what $2-$3?

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Camera is atleast 10-12..it costs $12 on the G1 and theirs is a 3.0MP vs our 3.2..come on now. I could be wrong on the wifi..CX knows much more about it then me but. Undoubtedly 110% you are completely wrong on the cost of the storm being $28 and you can quit saying just in materials because thats what I'm talking about to..not talking labor to put it together as that costs $16.xx according to the breakdown which could have a slight margin of error. Even if we exclude battery/memory card incase they are included in the BOM it would still be over $100 and well over your guess of 28. Even if RIMM bought a million of the chipset that costs 35 (or is it 30 dont feel like checking again). There is no way they are going to get it for half price..what kind of profit margins do you think qualcomm works on?

[Hawse771]

Yea Good Point-

Buying in Bulk Would Definitely Decrease the Actual Cost of the Goods.

Yes it would..by maybe 5-10%..but its all speculation of how much RIM bought at once. I highly doubt they bought a million of anything..if they did WHY did they sell out so quickly and have a shortage?

the companies that make these components aren't mom and pop shops..they deal in large quantities to begin with. They aren't on huge profit margins either. Walmart buys a product by the millions that my company does..they aren't getting it for half the cost of ours..they can just sell it for a lot less because they dont mind only making 10% profit because of the volume they deal in. Whereas a smaller shop has to make 40-70% profit to sustain business (talking gross profit)

[xattica]

Thanks again CX!!!

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[cereal killer]

Hawse if its not $28 its pretty darn close.... $35.00USD tops is a pretty good guesstimate

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[Crucial_Xtreme]

Hawse if its not $28 its pretty darn close.... $35.00USD tops is a pretty good guesstimate

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No, the processor alone is $35.

BlackBerry Storm Costs More To Make Than iPhone -- BlackBerry Storm -- InformationWeek


iSuppli: BlackBerry Storm costs $4 more than its purchase price to build - BlackBerry , Mobile

[cereal killer]

WHY did they sell out so quickly and have a shortage?

)

Because they had to downgrade all the devices back to .65 because of a "security issue."

You really drink the VZW kool-aid don't you : )



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[Hawse771]

The Storm does not have Wifi because Verizon did not want it. Plain and simple. Also, all Storms have triband HSPA, but of course Verizon mandated that they be locked down. Anyways, a Storm with Wifi is coming soon, no worries.

I'm not up to par on the HSPA specifications but are you referring to them simply locking down the HSDPA that requires an unlock code from VZW to use the phone in euro? And either way while a b!tch move I can't fault them for locking something down that would make a lot of people buy the phone and cancel service (because between teh 199 price and the ETF it would still be cheaper then buying the phone outright I believe especially if you qualify for the $99 price in the beg) and take it to another carrier?

Apple has attempted to do something similar in their latest firmware update that updated the baseband that at the current moment (or last time I checked) prevents the phone being unlocked on other networks now. As with everything this will get worked around and right now all you have to do is a somewhat hybrid os to keep the old baseband but still..same concept I think.

I would also like to know how sure you are of VZW being at fault for wifi...90% 100%..? I know you're in "the know" and wont question you too much if you are sure (without violating your NDA). But it just doesnt make sense because VZW isnt the only carrier of the storm..its not like the curve where it has wifi on other carriers but just not on VZW. VZW has also allowed every other new smartphone to have wifi this year pretty much...saga/htc/omnia even the old vx6800 or whatever the number was. Wouldn't Bell/Telus/Voda have wifi...and vzw wasn't even the first to get the storm voda was correct? It just doesn't make sense is all..RIM could have put wifi on it, sold it to bell/telus/voda and VZW could have simply disabled it..instead they told RIM no, so RIM sacrifced possible sales on 3 other carriers over it?

[clonehappy]

Unlocked isn't the accurate description. Anyways, the triband radio is there. But I can't speak on it any further. Sorry.

OT:

Have any of you elite OS hackers found a way to use the radio code from a 9500 on a 9530?

[ArmsDlr]

Yes that's correct $28.00 just in materials. Most expensive component is the chip which supposedly goes for $30.00. Which when bought in bulk drops the price substantially.

What's left besides the camara component that raises cost? That runs what $2-$3?

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I have no problem believing that the phone materials only cost RIM $28.00 and like Cereal said its because all that parts are bought in bulk. They probably only pay $1 for the $30 chip because they order in the thousands. If they bought 1 of each component, the phone would probably cost tens of thousands of dollars (having a company custom run 1 of anything automatically costs thousands for tooling [pcboards, the little metal bracket that holds the screen.....] and since you only want one piece there will be an automatic lot charge , etc..etc.). Material isn't the huge driver of cost, its the design and development of that extra stuff into the little phone housing. RIM has employees, bills, and development costs to pay for and thats were the phone cost comes from. Do you think when you buy a car you are paying for $28,000 of material?

Anyway, my point is, if their material costs were high I would assume they were idiots, not that my phone is of better quality.

Cereal, this post isn't directed toward you. I just used your quote to feed my rant.

Ok, realistically the materials probably cost $175 assuming the retail for the phone is $550 ( I dont remember the exact retail amount)

[Crucial_Xtreme]

I'm not up to par on the HSPA specifications but are you referring to them simply locking down the HSDPA that requires an unlock code from VZW to use the phone in euro? And either way while a b!tch move I can't fault them for locking something down that would make a lot of people buy the phone and cancel service (because between teh 199 price and the ETF it would still be cheaper then buying the phone outright I believe especially if you qualify for the $99 price in the beg) and take it to another carrier?

Apple has attempted to do something similar in their latest firmware update that updated the baseband that at the current moment (or last time I checked) prevents the phone being unlocked on other networks now. As with everything this will get worked around and right now all you have to do is a somewhat hybrid os to keep the old baseband but still..same concept I think.

I would also like to know how sure you are of VZW being at fault for wifi...90% 100%..? I know you're in "the know" and wont question you too much if you are sure (without violating your NDA). But it just doesnt make sense because VZW isnt the only carrier of the storm..its not like the curve where it has wifi on other carriers but just not on VZW. VZW has also allowed every other new smartphone to have wifi this year pretty much...saga/htc/omnia even the old vx6800 or whatever the number was. Wouldn't Bell/Telus/Voda have wifi...and vzw wasn't even the first to get the storm voda was correct? It just doesn't make sense is all..RIM could have put wifi on it, sold it to bell/telus/voda and VZW could have simply disabled it..instead they told RIM no, so RIM sacrifced possible sales on 3 other carriers over it?

The situation is much more complicated than you know, and I'm allowed to explain. Now back to the HSPA, months before the launch of the Storm I told everyone that you would be able to use the Storm on AT&T's 3G. And that was true until VZW decided they didn't want that to be able to happen, so they locked down the NA HSPA bands. Regardless, they're there. But you just can't use them.
In regards to Wifi, again very complicated, but it has to do with the agreement between the manufacturer and the main carrier of the device. Seeing as how the device was created more or less for one specific carrier, they had a lot of input over things.

Edit: again, the Storm definitely costs more than $35 to build. Parts only.

[Hawse771]

Because they had to downgrade all the devices back to .65 because of a "security issue."

You really drink the VZW kool-aid don't you : )


*edit: ahh ok $35 for processor. So $40
in total hardware. That's figuring in the obvious bulk price for those proccesors.*
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So...off topic but im leading back into topic. How much do you think the iphone costs..strictly materials?