[Rjsumthin]

Thank you for getting on topic toasty, i'm not wanting to debate the value of wifi or how verizon is sooooo expensive. All I want to do is have a discussion as to why, wifi, is not included on the storm.

I also agree there might be limitations. While I wouldn't agree it's not smart business sense **Not listening to verizon means losing a potential almost 70 million customer base to sell your product to, which when someone has a phone is free advertisement for your company as well** I really don't see them saying leave wifi out.

I would lean more on the side of the OS maybe? IF it were CDMA related. I know sprint and alltel don't have it, so it could be plausible. Windows mobile phones have the implementation, so it couldn't be STRICTLY cdma related.

Also maybe, on the side of userbase. Windows Mobile users that rely on wifi are typically in a position where they need to download documents, word, excel, etc, on a more regular basis than lets say a BES user. I know this is putting a tag on people, but in my experiences this does ring true.

My dad for example, wants a blackberry over a WinMo phone, but due to WinMo having the lock at the point he bought his phone on Excel etc, he sided with a wifi phone due to what his work needed.

I also see alot of BES users needing instant email, instant instant instant, not necassarily needing to edit word and excel documents on the go as often as you see a WinMo user **That is ACTUALLY USING THE PHONE FOR WHAT IT'S FOR** Don't get me started on people with motorola Q's and palm treo's turning off data. Makes no flippin sense.

[ushneb]

If you bring your own phone in, you can purchase just a voice plan, right?

Not if it's a Blackberry.

[karledice]

I agree with most. Simply put the cost outweighs the benefits, plain and simple. You must remember that to a regular average user, they don't necessary look at wifi when making their purchasing decisions. They invested a better camera in this fone because that's what might persuade people, so it's worth it for them.

Including wifi will cost more (design wise), drives the price of the fone up and bulks up the device and makes the phone heavier...they already have enough radio in there and it's not even supported by their exclusive carrier...and in the end benefits a small percent of the targeted market...

They (RIM) have done real consumer studies on this both in US and Europe to come up with the requirements for this phone and that's what the results show. That's all I'm saying

[toastyz71]

I agree with most. Simply put the cost outweighs the benefits, plain and simple. You must remember that to a regular average user, they don't necessary look at wifi when making their purchasing decisions. They invested a better camera in this fone because that's what might persuade people, so it's worth it for them.

Including wifi will cost more (design wise), drives the price of the fone up and bulks up the device and makes the phone heavier...they already have enough radio in there and it's not even supported by their exclusive carrier...and in the end benefits a small percent of the targeted market...

They (RIM) have done real consumer studies on this both in US and Europe to come up with the requirements for this phone and that's what the results show. That's all I'm saying

downside to your argument is that it appears that the chipset/radio that is in the device natively supports wifi...

[mab4285]

9510 will be out a couple months after the 9500/9530 and it will have wifi.

Even if this were true, the current numbering nomenclature would say that the 9520 would have wifi and the 9510 would have GPS.

[Duvi]

It just seems odd that most if not all CDMA carriers don't have their own wifi networks (or even partnerships like Starbucks) like the GSM carriers (Rogers, T-mobile, AT&T, etc..) do.

It probably has something to do with the carriers as well as the manufacturers.

AIM Convo between RIM and Verizon

RIM: We really don't want to put wifi on this
Verizon: Whatever
RIM: Cool...
Verizon: Good

Rim has left the chat.
Verizon has disconnected.

A week later... The "Storm"



Duvi

[Goldengriff]

hahaha



alright everybody. this is getting out of hand. this thread was NOT about whining and complaining that the phone doesnt need wifi or it does or verizon is lame for not having wifi in the phone. but amazingly, that is what it has turned into. shame on you people for runing this thread.



i really think that part of the reason why there isnt wifi on the phone still may have to do with implementation of the wifi with CDMA. maybe it is only related to cost. i dont see verizon saying dont put wifi on the device. that's just not smart business sense to listen to one carrier that closely. now, perhaps verizon said ok the hardware can support wifi, but we dont want to implement it at this point. but if that were the case, why doesnt the 9500 have wifi either? points further towards the idea that this wasnt a carrier decision. who knows, and to a greater extent, who cares?

the phones dont have wifi, so if you dont like it, dont get the phone. simple as that.

I still say, that 10% or less even use wifi on a cell phone so RIM is thinking why spend money on wifi, lets build it for the masses and not the few. We keep wifi out and we can make it cheeper.

[MoeDaddy]

I'd imagine VZW doesn't partner with wi-fi cus they have such a big evdo network

[Duvi]

I still say, that 10% or less even use wifi on a cell phone so RIM is thinking why spend money on wifi, lets build it for the masses and not the few. We keep wifi out and we can make it cheeper.

This could definitely be the logic as far as pricing goes. Notice the 8320 costs a crap load more than the 8310 and even the 8330 that was just released is now cheaper. CDMA phones are naturally more expensive (without wifi), imagine with. $400 for a krzr w/ wifi, lol on a 2 year contract.

[karledice]

downside to your argument is that it appears that the chipset/radio that is in the device natively supports wifi...

hm really? I really doubt that...wifi is a seperate set of radios why would it be included in the CDMA or UMTS chip of the device? I'm not an engineer guy but pretty sure it's seperate...they already have a wifi and non wifi (with GPS) version of the pearl and the curve

[Rjsumthin]

Im not sure if it's natively installed with the chipset. Again I think we are looking at this odd here.

Samsung i730, wifi, usable, you can even not sign up for a data plan, block all data access and only be allowed to use wifi.

The thought that verizon would disable Wifi on a chipset that is already available is absurd. GPS? sure, you can make money off that. Blackberry disable wifi? Why in the world would that make any logical sense, they already require a data plan period, they wouldn't just disable it for no reason.

AND Vodaphone as well? Now we are stretching it.

I would concur it's probably cost related, not network, doesn't make sense for them to include it when an obviously underwhelming part of the consumers care/need wifi. Again this isn't a debate to wether you think it should be there or not, it's a matter of why it's not there.

So factor in an already preestablished 3g network, start counting on alltel's network **im sure thatll get approved and I am sure that is being considered** and what verizon can do to expand their 3g coverage there. Wifi becomes a moot point. Where the Iphone needs to have it due to a lower % of 3g in at&t's network, it makes sense. Also makes sense that other blackberries have had the wifi on GSM, due to 3g network being non existant in the states, but not on CDMA, 3g covering over 80% of their coverage.

So compare the extra cost, troubleshooting that would have to be done, technical issues, replacements, etc. Not worth it in the long run.

[Rjsumthin]

[COLOR="DarkRed"]

RIM: We really don't want to put wifi on this
Verizon: Whatever
RIM: Cool...
Verizon: Good

Rim has left the chat.
Verizon has disconnected.COLOR]

That.... is funny

[cuban_dudeca]

It's not like they allow you to purchase the phone without the data package anyway.

Exactly....I just think if your using 3.5g when your out and about then whats the point. If I am at home im going to surf the internet with my laptop so wifi. I mean if wifi was included then cool but its not a deal breaker. I will be using the storm for everything. I think the majority of people will do the same and not care.

I sure as **** do not want a GSM EDGE storm with no 3g but wifi. There is no point to that.

[nethiker]

Interesting thread. Seems to me that while I'm sure the reason for no wifi involves many of the theories proposed here, it really boils down to cost. I was surprised when Rim's stock dropped when analysts knew the storm was about to be announced. The reason I read most was that they over invested in their upcoming phones. If there is even a modest increase in cost to add wifi, that would increase the initial investment by a huge amount.

The other cost angle is in relation to competition. I'm sure the suits have run the numbers that show a decreased sale price of $25-$50 (off the top of my head) will sell more phones than the addition of wifi.

I personally will miss wifi, more because it's a feature I will not have than from any realistic need. I think threads like this, even the rants, are productive because it becomes part of the information available to the carriers and manufacturers when they are faced with the decision of money vrs. size vrs. feature. My vote is for more is more when it comes to my gadgets. versatility is a prime consideration, especially on a multi-function personal electronic device that promises to organize your life, provide voice and data communications, entertainment, keep you from getting lost, etc.... Any device lacking available features or capabilities falls short. They all fall short. I was excited when the iphone came out because that was the closest yet to the do all (reasonably well) personal device. Now RIM and others are striving to compete and we all benefit. I would be surprised if the next version of Storm was lacking wifi. My bet is that the Storm and RIM will be so successful that the increased value of adding wifi will out-weigh the other considerations.

[Mr Bigs]

I still say, that 10% or less even use wifi on a cell phone so RIM is thinking why spend money on wifi, lets build it for the masses and not the few. We keep wifi out and we can make it cheeper.

I would say wait until the phone comes out and see what one of the major complaints. People that truly need their phone for the purpose of what it was designed for use most of its features. This is in opposition to people who buy phones just because it's the hottest thing out and not have a clue what it is capable of.