[bigberries]

I know I'm not a crazy heavy poster here but... can we drop the the Storm .114. postings? Can we delete them all until the next one comes out?

There is way too much to read and, from what I've read, there's too much chatter for this to be considered a good or official release. I've downloaded many of the Betas including .114. This is the only one I decided to roll back to .109

Suffice to say this is my opinion and I don't feel like rehashing the findings. I don't want to start another 80 page thread. If you do choose to respond to this thread, I would recommend saying nothing but "Agree" or "Disagree"

[verizonadam]

Agree to disagree =)

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[LaRZo]

I'm sorry...but I must.

Do you realize what you're saying? Maybe you havent seen things long enough in this forum. But once the latest OS is leaked, or a hybrid is made, it is ALL that is talked about on the forum until speculations come out of a new OS. That's why it's called "Storm OS Beta Discussion". People discuss their experiences and issues with the beta's of the newest leaks. It's just how it works and how it's been working.

[bigberries]

I'm sorry...but I must.

Do you realize what you're saying? Maybe you havent seen things long enough in this forum. But once the latest OS is leaked, or a hybrid is made, it is ALL that is talked about on the forum until speculations come out of a new OS. That's why it's called "Storm OS Beta Discussion". People discuss their experiences and issues with the beta's of the newest leaks. It's just how it works and how it's been working.

I respectfully disagree. What I see is cross talk about multiple BETAs. As it should be. I'm now saying that it is counter-productive to continue talking about .114 as it is not moving us forward. There is nothing more to talk about with .114 regardless of when the next OS or BETA is released.

[mmiles84]

After receiving my third Storm since November, I was in Verizon yesterday, and I talked to the manager for customer service in the store and he said there will be an official update for sure in two weeks. And the reason being is that some they wanted the OS to be top notch before the BlackBerry World App Store comes out. Now with that being said he didnt know what the update was going to run but he made it very clear that the update will be amazing. If anybody has any questions shoot me and email and I will give you more information.

Miles

[jbjr43]

I know I'm not a crazy heavy poster here but... can we drop the the Storm .114. postings? Can we delete them all until the next one comes out?

There is way too much to read and, from what I've read, there's too much chatter for this to be considered a good or official release. I've downloaded many of the Betas including .114. This is the only one I decided to roll back to .109

Suffice to say this is my opinion and I don't feel like rehashing the findings. I don't want to start another 80 page thread. If you do choose to respond to this thread, I would recommend saying nothing but "Agree" or "Disagree"

bigberries, gonna have to disagree with you on this one.

[bigberries]

bigberries, gonna have to disagree with you on this one.

Yoru signature OS and platform are disagreeing with your disagreement.

[ptcbass]

Thanks for starting this thread. I have been looking for when Verizon will release their next Storm OS (I don't have any beta versions) and now I know. 2 weeks and I am so looking forward to it!

Oh and Disagree. So many people love talking about it and so many people are looking for info on it.

[drunken0monkey]

I know I'm not a crazy heavy poster here but... can we drop the the Storm .114. postings? Can we delete them all until the next one comes out?

There is way too much to read and, from what I've read, there's too much chatter for this to be considered a good or official release. I've downloaded many of the Betas including .114. This is the only one I decided to roll back to .109

Suffice to say this is my opinion and I don't feel like rehashing the findings. I don't want to start another 80 page thread. If you do choose to respond to this thread, I would recommend saying nothing but "Agree" or "Disagree"

I disagree, but if you've got such a big problem with it, perhaps if you let one of the administrators know they might agree with you and clean things up.

Just a thought.

[bigberries]

I disagree, but if you've got such a big problem with it, perhaps if you let one of the administrators know they might agree with you and clean things up.

Just a thought.

Right now, I'd just like to offer my voice and extend that offer to others. My feeling about BETA products, any BETA products, is that we are reviewing NEW and/or upgraded versions. IMHO, the 'official' release of the Storm OS can't be considered a legit release. The phone itself should have never been released with such a problematic OS. Therefore, the BETA releases are not, by most definitions, BETA. They are desperate attempts at getting our phone to function properly while Verizon struggles to get the right resources behind this phone.

[minigts]

So you started yet ANOTHER .114 thread?

[Roscopcoletrain]

I respectfully disagree. What I see is cross talk about multiple BETAs. As it should be. I'm now saying that it is counter-productive to continue talking about .114 as it is not moving us forward. There is nothing more to talk about with .114 regardless of when the next OS or BETA is released.

So what shut the forum down until a new release is out? If you dont like reading whats posted, dont read it. Simple as that. Lots of people that are just looking at these thread and they need support for issues they may encounter when updating.

[bigberries]

So what shut the forum down until a new release is out? If you dont like reading whats posted, dont read it. Simple as that. Lots of people that are just looking at these thread and they need support for issues they may encounter when updating.

Agreed. But, after 80 pages of needed support for a BETA, I think the only support that should be presented is how to downgrade back to the last working BETA - .109

[pstanger]

Disagree.

A forum getting too cluttered means it needs to be organized better, not indiscriminately deleted. The reason that the first page of this forum is populated with a lot of .114 forum threads is because many people have spent their time conversing in them; to delete these threads would undermine the contributions of those members.

The main advantage of the crackberry.com Storm forum is the large knowledge base to tap. With a such a large volume of users you must expect there to be a proportional amount of questions and comments.

[pstanger]

Right now, I'd just like to offer my voice and extend that offer to others. My feeling about BETA products, any BETA products, is that we are reviewing NEW and/or upgraded versions. IMHO, the 'official' release of the Storm OS can't be considered a legit release. The phone itself should have never been released with such a problematic OS. Therefore, the BETA releases are not, by most definitions, BETA. They are desperate attempts at getting our phone to function properly while Verizon struggles to get the right resources behind this phone.

beta: a nearly complete prototype of a product (as software);

preliminary or testing stage of a software or hardware product;

I'm not exactly sure what definitions you are referring to, but by these, and my, definitions, these releases classify as beta. Attempts at getting something to work properly? Yes, that is why programmers create, test, and update. Desperate? I am going to go with no, unless you happen to work at RIM and can tell me otherwise.

What resources of Verizon are you speaking of? Verizon by their own count posted impressive launch numbers for the Storm and RIM has had more new membership to their network than ever before.

[mistamista2000]

After receiving my third Storm since November, I was in Verizon yesterday, and I talked to the manager for customer service in the store and he said there will be an official update for sure in two weeks. And the reason being is that some they wanted the OS to be top notch before the BlackBerry World App Store comes out. Now with that being said he didnt know what the update was going to run but he made it very clear that the update will be amazing. If anybody has any questions shoot me and email and I will give you more information.

Miles

Until it comes out don't believe the hype. Every few days there is another thread with talk of Verizon employees who say that an official update will be out in XX weeks. Been like this since just after .75 was released.

[bigberries]

So what shut the forum down until a new release is out? If you dont like reading whats posted, dont read it. Simple as that. Lots of people that are just looking at these thread and they need support for issues they may encounter when updating.

Disagree.

A forum getting too cluttered means it needs to be organized better, not indiscriminately deleted. The reason that the first page of this forum is populated with a lot of .114 forum threads is because many people have spent their time conversing in them; to delete these threads would undermine the contributions of those members.

The main advantage of the crackberry.com Storm forum is the large knowledge base to tap. With a such a large volume of users you must expect there to be a proportional amount of questions and comments.

Agreed. Re-organizing the forum with an effort to retain forward moving focus for high volume (lots of people with lots of issues) events

fwiw, My frustration is with the phone, not the forum. This forum is clearly the best place for discussing the BB phones, beta releases and solutions. Blackberry has always had a terrific, even fanatical following. A well desrved reputation. I feel the Storm is compromising BBs reputation. I'm further angered by the commentary from the RIM CEO that BETA is the new Norm for smartphone products. I'm more than glad to test new features and ideas. But, can they first concentrate on making sure the phone functions at its basic level before bringing us consumers in to the loop???

Heck, with the huge following this board has, you'all could better organize your process of evaluating BETA releases - leaked or not. Then, present the findings in class action form to RIM, Verizon, etc.. for legit formal response.

[pi_admin]

Originally, I agreed with you. But to only one point -- I don't think there needs to be 100 different of the same threads for each release. "Specific problem, .114" = good thread.

But then, you said...

Right now, I'd just like to offer my voice and extend that offer to others. My feeling about BETA products, any BETA products, is that we are reviewing NEW and/or upgraded versions. IMHO, the 'official' release of the Storm OS can't be considered a legit release. The phone itself should have never been released with such a problematic OS. Therefore, the BETA releases are not, by most definitions, BETA. They are desperate attempts at getting our phone to function properly while Verizon struggles to get the right resources behind this phone.

beta test
n. The stage in the testing of new software before its commercial release, conducted by testers other than its developers.

You might be right that the Storm was released prematurely. But ... these are leaked updates that are between the current version and the next official release -- that, to me, means beta. At your own risk, hope you don't brick it, quirky maybe-better maybe-worse, beta.

[bigberries]

beta: a nearly complete prototype of a product (as software);

preliminary or testing stage of a software or hardware product;

I'm not exactly sure what definitions you are referring to, but by these, and my, definitions, these releases classify as beta. Attempts at getting something to work properly? Yes, that is why programmers create, test, and update. Desperate? I am going to go with no, unless you happen to work at RIM and can tell me otherwise.

What resources of Verizon are you speaking of? Verizon by their own count posted impressive launch numbers for the Storm and RIM has had more new membership to their network than ever before.

Wrong. BETA, literally, is the second letter in the Greek alphabet. And in development, it's the second phase. Alpha testing is the first stage that should have been performed by RIM, Verizon or who ever had a vested interest or partnership. In my opinion the oirginal release of the Storm and it's current 'official' release did not effectivle complete alpha testing. So anything beyond this is a futile effort at backpeddling.

The resources I speak of are engineers dedicated to getting this phone functioning properly.

Note:
I'm not trying to paint this phone as horrible. It's a very good phone with lots of fixable problems. In the infamous words of SNL, all I'm asking is that they FIX IT!

[blingdogg]

After receiving my third Storm since November, I was in Verizon yesterday, and I talked to the manager for customer service in the store and he said there will be an official update for sure in two weeks. And the reason being is that some they wanted the OS to be top notch before the BlackBerry World App Store comes out. Now with that being said he didnt know what the update was going to run but he made it very clear that the update will be amazing. If anybody has any questions shoot me and email and I will give you more information.

Miles

bullsh!t that manager has no idea what he is talking about... u wanna know when the official release will drop? when RIM/Verizon drops it thats when until they do no one knows... every day some one says oh i talk to this person and they said this pleasseee!! we will all know when its available

[shatiek]

Don't worry about .114. Soon when the GC is released that's all you will see. GC this and GC that. So start copy and pasting all of your .114 material . You can use it for the GC beef.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[pstanger]

Wrong. BETA, literally, is the second letter in the Greek alphabet. And in development, it's the second phase. Alpha testing is the first stage that should have been performed by RIM, Verizon or who ever had a vested interest or partnership. In my opinion the oirginal release of the Storm and it's current 'official' release did not effectivle complete alpha testing. So anything beyond this is a futile effort at backpeddling.

The resources I speak of are engineers dedicated to getting this phone functioning properly.

Note:
I'm not trying to paint this phone as horrible. It's a very good phone with lots of fixable problems. In the infamous words of SNL, all I'm asking is that they FIX IT!

I agree with you regarding the origins of the word beta and its subsequent adaptation for use in software development. Alpha testing for Blackberry OS begins at RIM, where every single build is tested by their own employees. Certain builds, (.75, .83, .85, ..., .114), pass alpha testing and make it to beta testing, which is conducted by carriers. This is where OS leaks occur. When we, at crackberry.com, receive a leak, it is an OS undergoing beta testing, making it a beta.

[bigberries]

I agree with you regarding the origins of the word beta and its subsequent adaptation for use in software development. Alpha testing for Blackberry OS begins at RIM, where every single build is tested by their own employees. Certain builds, (.75, .83, .85, ..., .114), pass alpha testing and make it to beta testing, which is conducted by carriers. This is where OS leaks occur. When we, at crackberry.com, receive a leak, it is an OS undergoing beta testing, making it a beta.

This make sense. The question open then is... How did v.075 get through to production and why? Hoe do the readers of this forum feel about the following statement:

RIM CEO: Buggy smartphone software is the "new reality"

[epphllps]

Agree, but only about multiple copies of a thread with the same topic. New threads with a significant point or even minor point, I should say, are completely acceptable. The mods here clean stuff up when needed or a request is made and its legit.

[pstanger]

This make sense. The question open then is... How did v.075 get through to production and why? Hoe do the readers of this forum feel about the following statement:

RIM CEO: Buggy smartphone software is the "new reality"

I never used .75 for more than a couple hours, but I was under the impression that it is generally an acceptable, usable OS, and users are somewhat content with it. Whether it is or not, .75 is a definite improvement over .65, and was well needed in that respect.

As for the quote, it is the opinion of one man who happens to be the head of the company that makes my phone. I do not usually take my tech advice from a man wearing a suit.

The way I see it is that as phones become increasingly more complex and packing more features programmers are going to need more time to create a stable working OS. While the engineers want their time to fiddle, the business people are looking at the money going in to R&D and are trying to get the device out the door to make a profit. A balance needs to exist, and that balance is software which works, but has some bugs. As the bugs are identified by consumers, engineers are afforded the extra time to fix them and release updates.