04-12-14 07:06 AM
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  1. redlightblinking's Avatar
    It's hard to argue with you. You don't accept valid points and your opinion is contrary to the majority.
    It's hard to argue with me because my opinion is contrary to the majority? Perhaps you should try arguing with people who don't agree with you (or whatever you believe to be "the majority") to get more practice.

    Yours are are valid points in your opinion. That's why it's called an argument. But, I'm curious how you know about this "majority". Did you take a poll?

    If you're the type of person who can retrieve the phone within 3 seconds every vibration, you might benefit.
    HUH? What does retrieving the phone within 3 seconds have to do with anything? Why would you have to "retrieve" anything if the backlight simply turns on and shows you. Only the people who DON'T have the backlight turn on have to do any retrieving..

    I Everyone else appreciates the led and lock screen notification.
    Who is this "everyone else" that you speak of? Again, is there some scientific poll results you'd like to share?

    I can see several of last few messages, not just one, and I can view each one with double tap.
    Yes, I can too because I have the same phone. Not sure what your point was. I never made any mention of only seeing one of the last few messages as opposed to several of them. Yes, I can view each with two taps (after I sometimes have to tap the star icon)....which comes after I wake the screen.

    Overall, it's for battery savings,
    How do you know this? Do you work for BlackBerry? Is this their published position on the matter? And, if so, how do they rectify this with their previous phones that allowed this, or with other alerts, like phone or skype, that light up the screen?

    but even if there was the option, I'd disable it.
    Ah, so you agree with me that options are good, and this would be just another option. See, we're not so different after all.


    The assumption is when screen on, your eyes are looking. It screen is off, your eyes are not, so displaying brief message is silly.

    Posted via CB10
    Who said anything about a "brief message"?
    tack likes this.
    03-10-14 03:03 PM
  2. BCITMike's Avatar
    It's hard to argue with me because my opinion is contrary to the majority? Perhaps you should try arguing with people who don't agree with you (or whatever you believe to be "the majority") to get more practice.
    Because you are not accepting that the default and desired behaviour benefits the majority. Majority desired behaviour should be default action in nearly all cases in nearly all products.

    Yours are are valid points in your opinion. That's why it's called an argument. But, I'm curious how you know about this "majority". Did you take a poll?
    No, this is based on assumed usage case and common sense. When screen is off, eyes are not looking at the screen and most likely put away.

    HUH? What does retrieving the phone within 3 seconds have to do with anything? Why would you have to "retrieve" anything if the backlight simply turns on and shows you. Only the people who DON'T have the backlight turn on have to do any retrieving..
    Where is the phone in the case where the screen is off? Could be holster, could be table, could be your hand. Bottom line, its not 10" in front of your eyes, and you need to "retrieve" it so that its within viewing angle/distance. For example, my phone is in my pocket when its not in use. Same for a lot of others (no scientific poll!). So if my phone vibrates or I get a message, I need to retrieve it from my pocket before I can view it. If the screen came on while in my pocket, its a complete waste of power used by the display. This is why the magnetic holster is so important to profiles and why screen activates upon removing from holster. If you think the battery use by that is negligible, you are wrong.

    Who is this "everyone else" that you speak of? Again, is there some scientific poll results you'd like to share?
    Common sense, and typical usage scenario that the phone isn't in front of your eyes like google glass.

    Yes, I can too because I have the same phone. Not sure what your point was. I never made any mention of only seeing one of the last few messages as opposed to several of them. Yes, I can view each with two taps (after I sometimes have to tap the star icon)....which comes after I wake the screen.
    My point is that the current method to view recent messages works nicely for myself and many others based on crackberry feedback over the last year. I prefer this over turning my display on and wasting battery when not going to be seen.

    How do you know this? Do you work for BlackBerry? Is this their published position on the matter? And, if so, how do they rectify this with their previous phones that allowed this, or with other alerts, like phone or skype, that light up the screen?
    As to why previous phones did this, I couldn't tell you. I can easily state that phones of yesteryear without bigger screens, faster processors and LTE enabled radios did not use near as much battery. So when making a phone that uses a lot more battery, CHANGES NEED TO OCCUR. You can't always have your cake and eat it, too. Physics just doesn't co-operate like that.

    Ah, so you agree with me that options are good, and this would be just another option. See, we're not so different after all.
    It's almost always good to have options. Problem is, they need to support it. They need to develop it, QA it, add enterprise/security control through API, etc. So its not always easy to make a setting configurable. Nor do they want people to enable that, ignore the battery usage impact, and then get slammed for having a feature that uses a lot of battery?

    Make the suggestion for a developer to make this app. I'm guessing they need to monitor incoming messages, and then force screen on and toast the message. Can probably be done.

    Who said anything about a "brief message"?
    You're talking about having a message come up on the screen for a few seconds when the screen is locked. if the message didn't go away on its own, then the screen is using EVEN MORE battery, or it just took screen focus away from the actual app I was working with. Both cases are not wanted by me.
    03-10-14 04:08 PM
  3. Sesameopen's Avatar
    Because you are not accepting that the default and desired behaviour benefits the majority. Majority desired behaviour should be default action in nearly all cases in nearly all products.



    No, this is based on assumed usage case and common sense. When screen is off, eyes are not looking at the screen and most likely put away.



    Where is the phone in the case where the screen is off? Could be holster, could be table, could be your hand. Bottom line, its not 10" in front of your eyes, and you need to "retrieve" it so that its within viewing angle/distance. For example, my phone is in my pocket when its not in use. Same for a lot of others (no scientific poll!). So if my phone vibrates or I get a message, I need to retrieve it from my pocket before I can view it. If the screen came on while in my pocket, its a complete waste of power used by the display. This is why the magnetic holster is so important to profiles and why screen activates upon removing from holster. If you think the battery use by that is negligible, you are wrong.



    Common sense, and typical usage scenario that the phone isn't in front of your eyes like google glass.


    My point is that the current method to view recent messages works nicely for myself and many others based on crackberry feedback over the last year. I prefer this over turning my display on and wasting battery when not going to be seen.


    As to why previous phones did this, I couldn't tell you. I can easily state that phones of yesteryear without bigger screens, faster processors and LTE enabled radios did not use near as much battery. So when making a phone that uses a lot more battery, CHANGES NEED TO OCCUR. You can't always have your cake and eat it, too. Physics just doesn't co-operate like that.



    It's almost always good to have options. Problem is, they need to support it. They need to develop it, QA it, add enterprise/security control through API, etc. So its not always easy to make a setting configurable. Nor do they want people to enable that, ignore the battery usage impact, and then get slammed for having a feature that uses a lot of battery?

    Make the suggestion for a developer to make this app. I'm guessing they need to monitor incoming messages, and then force screen on and toast the message. Can probably be done.



    You're talking about having a message come up on the screen for a few seconds when the screen is locked. if the message didn't go away on its own, then the screen is using EVEN MORE battery, or it just took screen focus away from the actual app I was working with. Both cases are not wanted by me.
    Omg tl;dr

    Sent from my HTC One dual sim using CB Forums mobile app
    03-10-14 04:11 PM
  4. redlightblinking's Avatar
    Because you are not accepting that the default and desired behaviour benefits the majority. Majority desired behaviour should be default action in nearly all cases in nearly all products.
    .
    No one has ever discussed the "default and desired behaviour" other then the OP whose desired behavior is the OPPOSITE of yours.

    And, who is the "majority" you keep referencing? Or is it because YOU like it, then everyone else does to?




    No, this is based on assumed usage case and common sense. When screen is off, eyes are not looking at the screen and most likely put away.
    You lost me at "assummed". News Flash: if you are just assuming something, you can't make any claim to it as being a fact.

    "most likely"? Wow, some powerful argument you got there. What are you basing this on? And why do you think it's put away? Multiple people in this thread have already discussed others with phones on tables that were not "put away". If your phone is on the table, or desk, or car cradle, or even just in your hand....and an alert happens.....YOU HAVE A REASON TO LOOK AT IT. Make sense yet? And....how do you apply your logic to PHONE CALLS?

    Where is the phone in the case where the screen is off? Could be holster, could be table, could be your hand. Bottom line, its not 10" in front of your eyes, and you need to "retrieve" it so that its within viewing angle/distance. .
    But it IS in front of your eyes in ALL OF THOSE SITUATIONS (except the holster). You simply LOOK AT IT. My phone is on the desk now, I don't need to do ANYTYHING except look at it to read what it say (if only the back light were on). Just like those people at the table in the various examples mentioned in this thread. Did you read the thread? You know....the "majority" you keep mentioning?

    For example, my phone is in my pocket when its not in use. Same for a lot of others (no scientific poll!). So if my phone vibrates or I get a message, I need to retrieve it from my pocket before I can view it. If the screen came on while in my pocket, its a complete waste of power used by the display. This is why the magnetic holster is so important to profiles and why screen activates upon removing from holster. If you think the battery use by that is negligible, you are wrong.
    Great, you just argued against you own position by invoking the holster. That would nullify any concern of the .001% of battery life lost due to the backlight coming. But, if you retrieved it from your pocket....because you want to see what it says....you still need to turn the backlight on. What is the point you are making? EITHER WAY....you were required to do something the phone should just be doing anyway because that's the next obvious step. You know.....like for PHONE CALLS.

    And, beyond the obvious situation of when your phone is out of sight....how about when your phone IS IN SIGHT? THEN WHAT?

    AND, what are you basing this significant battery loss claim on? Any facts, or just....oh....wait......I know......you're "assuming" again.

    Common sense, and typical usage scenario that the phone isn't in front of your eyes like google glass.e.
    ROFL. There you go again. No facts. No polls. You only cite "common sense" as your source. Why do you keep referencing a phone that is hovering in front of your face? You can't divert your eyes towards your phone in a fraction of a second? Based on your logic.....cars should blank out the speedometer display unless you are "looking at it". Hilarious.

    My point is that the current method to view recent messages works nicely for myself and many others based on crackberry feedback over the last year. I prefer this over turning my display on and wasting battery when not going to be seen.
    Great. Thanks. I think you really need to get over this battery loss myth.

    As to why previous phones did this, I couldn't tell you. .
    Wha....what? You mean it wasn't "common sense"....or....."the default and desired behavior that benefited the majority"???? Or, is that only if it's the way YOU prefer it?

    I can easily state that phones of yesteryear without bigger screens, faster processors and LTE enabled radios did not use near as much battery. So when making a phone that uses a lot more battery, CHANGES NEED TO OCCUR. You can't always have your cake and eat it, too. .
    Of course you can........you just buy ANOTHER PHONE. Uh, I don't know....what was that phone the people in this thread were talking about on the table? I-something? Pretty sure that's bigger screen than a q10, faster processor, LTE enabled.

    You see, ANY phone can be a power hog REGARDLESS of how many times your backlight comes on. It's up to you to tweak those settings, which is why all phones....including BB10....let you chose how to adjust between convenience and energy savings. The backlight turning on would be just another one of those adjustments.

    It's almost always good to have options. Problem is, they need to support it. They need to develop it, QA it, add enterprise/security control through API, etc. So its not always easy to make a setting configurable. Nor do they want people to enable that, ignore the battery usage impact, and then get slammed for having a feature that uses a lot of battery?
    So....after over a year of being on the market and a year before that to develop, they still haven't perfected the process of letting the user turn on the backlight for an alert.....like ALL THEIR OTHER PHONES DID? Like other manufactures can do? Hmmmmm......interesting theory.

    You really think that the occasional backlight pop (especially on a Amoled) is in any way comparable to the impact of 4G, or GPS, or streaming video, etc? ? THOSE are the power hogs that cause people to complain, and they can be adjusted. And, again, you're theory holds no water anyway because the backlight comes on for every call. If you get a lot of calls a day there's no difference.

    Make the suggestion for a developer to make this app. I'm guessing they need to monitor incoming messages, and then force screen on and toast the message. Can probably be done.
    .
    Been done a long time ago by many users. Devs can do nothing until BB lets them have access to turn on the backlight. But you know this because you're so well connected to the people and their "common sense" and what not.


    You're talking about having a message come up on the screen for a few seconds when the screen is locked. .
    No, I'm not talking about that. Why do you think I'm talking about that?


    if the message didn't go away on its own, then the screen is using EVEN MORE battery,.
    Of course it goes away EVENTUALLY. But certainly longer than "a few seconds". Perhaps go to the default backlight timeout or something in between.


    it just took screen focus away from the actual app I was working with. Both cases are not wanted by me.

    Uh...what? The phone was NOT LIT. It was "in your pocket"......remember? Sooooooo.....how were you working on it?
    SmileDahling and tack like this.
    03-10-14 05:03 PM
  5. WhitsterN's Avatar
    Just to add a little something to this I might have been able to get behind the whole battery saving idea if, when I do go to turn the screen on the actual message is there straight away. But it's not. You have to turn on the screen and then touch the specific icon you want to read notifications for. And I've noticed, on the Q10 at least, it seems to require a very specific touch and then there's a sort of fading or some sort of animation which means the message doesn't load exactly instantly. That just seems like poor design to me. Putting in steps which don't need to be there. iPhone and Android have both shown how it can be done quickly and cleanly.

    Of course this is all nitpicky. But again, if this is a phone designed for businessmen and people who need to get things done why isn't there an option to make one of the key features of a modern smartphone as efficient as possible to use.
    03-10-14 05:22 PM
  6. redlightblinking's Avatar
    But again, if this is a phone designed for businessmen and people who need to get things done why isn't there an option to make one of the key features of a modern smartphone as efficient as possible to use.
    Yep. You've just summarized the sentiment of many of those BB users that are simply holding on to their OS7 device (or returning after trying BB10). You shouldn't have to trade off losing power windows on the new model just to get a built in Bluetooth radio in your new car. But that's the proposition that BlackBerry is proposing to it's users when asking them to switch from OS7 to BB10. You get the cool new stuff....but we left out the power windows. Hope you like rolling them up by hand.
    03-10-14 05:51 PM
  7. anon8656116's Avatar
    You can toggle on an app by app (or email, call text etc) basis. So the option is, quite rightfully I should say, available to you.
    That's actually not entirely accurate. There are only two options to prevent the iPhone screen from lighting up. Either you disable the lock-screen notification per app, in which case you will not see anything on the lock screen either, or you turn on Do Not Disturb mode. In the latter case, you will receive a lock-screen notification, but without a vibration or sound. It is not possible to control the screen separately without turning anything else off (notification or vibration/sound).
    03-10-14 08:03 PM
  8. BCITMike's Avatar
    redlightblinking,

    You need to chill out. Have a discussion and keep your blood pressure down. You are getting wayyy too worked up over this, and you are not open to discussing ideas. You discussed why you think the message should light the screen on all messages, and I made the case that its not done for battery savings. Ask BlackBerry, if you really want to know. Make a feature request with BlackBerry, I don't write the software.

    Re: Phone calls. Phone calls are different than messages in that they are implied urgent. For me, phone calls are to be answered in real time (and there is over 20 seconds to answer the phone with 4+ rings). They take priority over everything I'm doing. SMS, emails and notifications are not a real time priority for me. If I get a vibration or a message, I might finish a conversation, or excuse myself from the table, or check it when "I have a few minutes". Again, I don't need to take a poll to know this is the case for the majority ("What percentage of the time do you answer your phone when it rings? What percentage of time do you check your phone when it vibrates?"). Simply stating, 'phone calls are higher priority than emails and texts'.

    "ROFL. There you go again. No facts. No polls. You only cite "common sense" as your source. Why do you keep referencing a phone that is hovering in front of your face? You can't divert your eyes towards your phone in a fraction of a second? Based on your logic.....cars should blank out the speedometer display unless you are "looking at it". Hilarious."

    Common sense can often be used as a source. That's why its common. Above is nonsense and will only hurt your reasoning. Not only are you supposed to look at your speedometer within every 10 seconds, you don't know where in that 10 seconds you'll look, so of course the screen is on all the time. There is plenty of battery for the speedometer, which is often analog anyways. But the speedometer is also always on just under where your eyes should be anyways. You don't put a speedometer in your pocket, or in the cup holder, or even the seat next to you. Very poor comparison.

    "So....after over a year of being on the market and a year before that to develop, they still haven't perfected the process of letting the user turn on the backlight for an alert.....like ALL THEIR OTHER PHONES DID? Like other manufactures can do? Hmmmmm......interesting theory."

    The hub is a new feature that wasn't really present in previous phones or platforms like it is today (nor was it feature complete on day 1). It's supposed to be the central place for messages and for knowing what is read and what isn't. This feature to display messages in locked state could be on the roadmap, it might not be. I'm not in favour and won't be (I have a Z10 and can use all the battery I have). If a message flashes on the phone when screen is locked, should it be marked as read or unread? Will you be annoyed when you have to mark all those read when they are marked unread, or marked read when you were looking away? Should the notification LED still notify that there is a message? Will Apple and Android continue with this feature as they move towards better central messaging systems? As others have stated, the LED is central to the notification system and provides alternate functionality than reading every message in real time. Would Apple still do this if they had a notification led?

    You've made your case to me that there is a demand for this, but its limited to non-password, non-holster users who would like to see messages in real time. I get about 4 phone calls a day. I get over well over 100 messages a day (I'm sure these 'power users' get even more). If my phone lit up 5 seconds every time a message came in, I would NO DOUBT see an observable difference in battery life at the end of the day. Perhaps this could be 'green lit' for messages marked as priority...

    As to making it an option, it raises additional questions about how messages are marked as read/unread, privacy for sensitive messages appearing on the screen, battery use, preventing accidentally pushes/swipes once activated, etc. It's not a slam dunk decision to go forth and make it happen by BB developers on their own. It takes understanding to go through different use cases and figure out the best scenario for the majority of the people. Adding an option to leave the screen on when plugged into power might be satisfactory as its clear what the users intentions and expectations are.

    Ask someone at BlackBerry what their take on this and whether they'd ever option it. I've made my two cents, and that's all I have to say about that.
    03-10-14 08:41 PM
  9. SummersLastNight's Avatar
    Is turning the screen on "dumb" when you get a phone call? Because people can see who's calling you.

    Strange that nearly every phone, even feature phones and lots of BlackBerry's , have turned on the screen for years even though it's "dumb".

    If people are concerned about their phone being read at a table.....WHY are they putting it on a table????? Is it because they WANT to see the phone alert them to something? Or is it just to prove they deserve to sit at the table?

    When you say "turning on your screen is hardly a hassle at all", you mean that simply looking at your phone....not touching it....just looking at it to see the message....is NO different that reaching for it....then swiping or button pushing....then another swipe...then a tap.......then another tap.........then wait for the phone to do a little graphics dance....then....you might see the message if your were last in the hub list......OR you could be up to 2 MORE swipes away. Now your 20 seconds in still trying to see if the darn message. Yea, that's hardly a hassle. After all, most people that carry BlackBerry's really have nothing better to do anyway.

    How does BeBuzz or Hub++ make any difference? They don't effect this at all...they simply give you variations on vibe/ring, etc, but you still must go through the same sequence above just to actually see the message.
    Well when you use BeBuzz or Hub++ you assign a colour LED to different accounts. Without the screen turning on I know if I have received a text, email, bbm, twitter, facebook etc and automatically have the choice if it is important enough to view or respond to.

    From there if you have enabled previews on the lock screen it will show all of what you have in the hub that is new and you can simply tap once to preview and then determine if you should unlock the phone to respond.

    After you tapped to preview if you choose to respond, you just tap again -- unlock and are at the reply screen. It's really no more hassle than an iPhone.

    As for people leaving their phones out, it just happens. I can't explain why people do what they do. But if it is out and not in the pocket I would prefer that things stay as they are, for my eyes only.

    Posted via CB10
    03-11-14 01:09 AM
  10. kimoi's Avatar
    This doesn't' address the OP's concern, this only lets you know who the message is from if it's one of your setup contacts. (and you can remember all of the various flashing light sequences or sounds) You still have to do everything being described in order to see the message or at least part of it.
    I never once said it was the solution to the problem. I was only trying to help by telling how I deal with it. In my case 9 out of 10 times, it depends on who sent the message, based on that I decide if I want to read it immediately or it can wait. (just one of the many options of Hub++)

    Posted with my Z10 via CB10
    03-11-14 05:32 AM
  11. kimoi's Avatar
    Just to add a little something to this I might have been able to get behind the whole battery saving idea if, when I do go to turn the screen on the actual message is there straight away. But it's not. You have to turn on the screen and then touch the specific icon you want to read notifications for.
    When being on the lock screen, you can also tap the message you like to view, then when you unlock it, it goes immediately to that specific message.


    Posted with my Z10 via CB10
    03-11-14 05:34 AM
  12. BigAl_BB9900's Avatar
    1) Screen does not turn on when I get a text message, email or WhatsApp message. I get the vibration, sound LED flash and notification on the lock screen. But the screen never turns on. I thought I had been through all the settings menus by now but I still can't seem to fix this.

    2) Email notifications do not disappear when I've read the email on my computer. This is the most annoying when at work. I'll get an email through, notification will go on my phone. I'll read it on the desktop but the LED will keep flashing on the phone and icon will remain on the lock screen until I unlock the device. On the iPhone notifications disappeared almost immediately once the email has been read so I assume there's a way to do this on the Q10 too?


    6) Hub screen is slow to switch between areas. I've experienced hangs of over a second which doesn't sound like a lot but is very noticeable when using it. Considering this is one of the main areas of the phone it's very annoying that it should lag. I only have 1 work account, 1 personal account and WhatsApp signed up so I assume it should be quite fluid.

    I know it sounds like a bit of a moan but I really am mostly happy with the phone. Any help or suggestions on any of the above would be great!
    Hi, Welcome to the world of the Q10! I'm not sure if I have the answers you want, but here are my two pennorth to three of your questions

    1. My preference is that the Screen does NOT turn on - this is a security/privacy feature. Or, do you want the screen to turn on to the lockscreen so you can type your PIN straight in?

    2. For me, email notifications DO disappear for my personal IMAP and client Exchange accounts, but they do NOT for my POP3 accounts. For my IMAP account, the notifications disappear within about a minute - for my 2 Exchange accounts (2 different clients), 1 of them seems to update within a minute, the other one always takes nearer 5 minutes (I assume these are Exchange refresh settings that I have no control over)

    6. The hub is always a bit laggy for me immediately after I have done an OS Update (eg yesterday) - but within a day it has always returned to normal (eg instantaneous and buttery-smooth.... have just tested it again now, less than 24 hours after my last OS update) - I have hundreds of emails (if not > thousand) in each account
    03-11-14 06:11 AM
  13. FCSC's Avatar


    Now, you'd think with all the extra time on their hands from not actually writing any basic code for something as simple as turning on the backlight, that they'd have tons of time developing marketing strategies. But..............................I digress.

    Help me Obi Wan Chen, you're my only hope.
    Coders doing the marketing? Thank God you aren't in waterloo

    Posted via CB10
    03-11-14 06:54 AM
  14. redlightblinking's Avatar
    redlightblinking,

    You need to chill out. Have a discussion and keep your blood pressure down. You are getting wayyy too worked up over this, and you are not open to discussing ideas. t.
    Here we go. As soon as all of your points get challenged, go to the default mode of accusing the other of being "too excited" or having "high blood pressure". Seen your style a million times. When you're out of rebuttals, just try to belittle the other person talking. Well played.


    redlightblinking,

    and you are not open to discussing ideas.
    You haven't put forth any "ideas"...only your opinions and assertions about facts that turned out to be more of your opinions.

    redlightblinking,

    You discussed why you think the message should light the screen on all messages, and I made the case that its not done for battery savings. Ask BlackBerry, if you really want to know. Make a feature request with BlackBerry, I don't write the software..
    Yea, I get that, but you went on to say that it shouldn't be done for various other reasons including privacy, that it's done for the "default and desired behavior the benefits the majority".....or some odd description that your eyes aren't looking at it . etc. etc. etc. Remember that? The feature request lies in their cavernous queue, but that's like yelling into an empty cave.

    redlightblinking,

    Re: Phone calls. Phone calls are different than messages in that they are implied urgent. For me, phone calls are to be answered in real time (and there is over 20 seconds to answer the phone with 4+ rings). They take priority over everything I'm doing. SMS, emails and notifications are not a real time priority for me.
    Ahhh......so you're not speaking on behalf of the majority or the default.....just on behalf of you. Got it. Yes, phone calls need to be answered, but for some people who get lots of other messages all day.....so do those as well. The point is that if they don't mind turning on the back light for those phone calls (and some people get a lot of them) then what's the big deal to allow it for other messages as well. Not sure why you can't see this point that I've made several times now.


    redlightblinking,

    Again, I don't need to take a poll to know this is the case for the majority ("What percentage of the time do you answer your phone when it rings? What percentage of time do you check your phone when it vibrates?"). Simply stating, 'phone calls are higher priority than emails and texts'..
    Of course need to take a poll or cite scientific research, otherwise you are just arrogantly ASSUMING. How many times does one have to point this out to you? The only difference in your analogy is that people hearing a phone ringing know they have less time to answer before voice mail, but it doesn't mean people don't still look at their phone after another type of message comes in, as well as the fact that some people ignore ringing phones as well. And, for some people ALL alerts have the same priority. Some one is trying to send me a message and I want to know what the message is. Why do I have to do a dance for some messages and not others?

    redlightblinking,
    Common sense can often be used as a source. That's why its common. .
    Ha, that's funny. ANYTHING can be cited as a "source". You could say a man in the clouds told you. Doesn't mean it has any credibility. NEXT. And, in case you didn't know this, "common sense" is simply a figure of speech, not a quantifiable set of known facts.

    redlightblinking,

    Above is nonsense and will only hurt your reasoning. Not only are you supposed to look at your speedometer within every 10 seconds, you don't know where in that 10 seconds you'll look, so of course the screen is on all the time. There is plenty of battery for the speedometer, which is often analog anyways. But the speedometer is also always on just under where your eyes should be anyways. You don't put a speedometer in your pocket, or in the cup holder, or even the seat next to you. Very poor comparison..


    Soooooo...let's take your analogy further. You are "supposed" to look at the speedometer at intervals thus the reason it doesn't turn off when you look away. But, aren't you "supposed' to look at your phone when it is telling you a message came in? Isn't that the whole reason you set it to alert you (vibe or ring)? Otherwise....why have it makes sounds and vibrate?????

    And, there is also plenty of battery to light up your screen for intervals that you could choose, especially on amoled screens. You keep referring to this battery scenario with no actual data of how much battery it consumes relative to the other battery sucking operations.

    redlightblinking,

    You don't put a speedometer in your pocket, or in the cup holder, or even the seat next to you. Very poor comparison..
    Not at all. You put a phone next to you, just a glance away. You know.....like a speedometer. Luckily I don't have to make several taps and swipes every time I want to see if I have low tire pressure....it just tells me that too. Too bad my phone doesn't (unless I have an older BlackBerry or Iphone, etc. etc. etc)

    redlightblinking,

    The hub is a new feature that wasn't really present in previous phones or platforms like it is today (nor was it feature complete on day 1). It's supposed to be the central place for messages and for knowing what is read and what isn't. .
    First, this has nothing to do with simply lighting up your phone when you get a message. Second, the hub is basically the Universal inbox they've always had but with a new name and new sliding menus as well as integrating some other apps that send messages.

    redlightblinking,
    If a message flashes on the phone when screen is locked, should it be marked as read or unread?
    UNREAD. Like like all other phones. Why would you even ask this? It's unread until you actually ackownledge it.

    redlightblinking,
    Will you be annoyed when you have to mark all those read when they are marked unread, or marked read when you were looking away? .
    Moot point. They wouldn't be marked read untill you read them..like all other phones, including blackberries.

    Should the notification LED still notify that there is a message? .
    Of course....why wouldn't it? Eventually the screen would go dark again but the light keeps blinking. And the light being red tells you something is new, regardless of your screen state at that moment.

    redlightblinking,
    As others have stated, the LED is central to the notification system and provides alternate functionality than reading every message in real time.
    This makes no sense. How does the LED provide "alternate functionality than reading every message in real time"? It simply reminds you that you have missed something. You still have to eventually look at the messages. And, it's not the "central" notification. Depending on how you use your phone, the sounds are. Or the vibration is. The LED is sometimes just a last resort.
    But it would be nice if when we got one of those notifications they'd just turn on the darn screen so I can divert my eyes for moment then go back to being productive in my day that is limited by this finite thing known as time.

    redlightblinking,
    Would Apple still do this if they had a notification led?
    Still do what.......light the screen? I don't see why not. After having this ability for years I can't see why they'd take it away. What company in their right mind would do this to their customers........oh, wait........ Waterloo strikes again.

    redlightblinking,
    You've made your case to me that there is a demand for this, but its limited to non-password, non-holster users who would like to see messages in real time.
    Obviously it has to be non-password...that goes for all phones that have this feature. But non-holstered has nothing to do with it. I have a holster. Use it every day. But if I'm working at a desk the phone sits next to me so I can save time instead of constantly reaching for the phone. It would be nice if the phone helped me save more time by not having to constantly reach for it to do the screen dance. And, yes, some people who make their living via communications want to see messages in real time. Apparently others don't value their time as much.

    redlightblinking,
    I get about 4 phone calls a day. I get over well over 100 messages a day (I'm sure these 'power users' get even more). If my phone lit up 5 seconds every time a message came in, I would NO DOUBT see an observable difference in battery life at the end of the day. Perhaps this could be 'green lit' for messages marked as priority...
    I believe that's why it wold be an OPTION. But how much of an "observable" difference would this be? Would you lose, say....20 minutes off your phones battery life in a day? You should research the amount of voltage required to light the screen before making any assertions about its impact.

    But think of how much more productivity you'd have.....how much time you wouldn't lose....if you weren't reaching for your phone, swiping and double tapping......over 100 times a day! Imagine if you just looked at your phone and let Hub++ or BeBuzz do the rest.

    redlightblinking,
    As to making it an option, it raises additional questions about how messages are marked as read/unread, privacy for sensitive messages appearing on the screen, battery use, preventing accidentally pushes/swipes once activated, etc.
    Why is their any "marked unread" issues? It's not marked read until you go the hub and read it.....OR...until you push the little "marked read" button on Hub++ or BeBuzz. Seems pretty simple. Just lighting the screen doesn't constitute a message be considered "read" any more than lighting the screen constitutes your voice mail being listened to. When you take it from holster....screen lights....but messages aren't marked as read there either.

    Privacy is user controllable. Don't want your phone being read....don't put it on the table unlocked for everyone to see what happens (like a phone call).

    Battery use would obviously be some...but the question is how much. Until you have the feature you have no idea.

    Accidental pushes/swipes? Your phone lights when you get a call. Same risk. It's about how you manage your phone.

    redlightblinking,
    It's not a slam dunk decision to go forth and make it happen by BB developers on their own. It takes understanding to go through different use cases and figure out the best scenario for the majority of the people. Adding an option to leave the screen on when plugged into power might be satisfactory as its clear what the users intentions and expectations are.
    Actually it is a slam dunk. Devs have stated right here that they can't turn on the screen.....BB won't let them yet. They'd do it but BB simply won't give them the key to the door.

    Strange that you talk about this "thorough" understanding as if its something that's never happened on any BlackBerry before....or any other phone for that matter.

    The plug in option would at least a half measure. But a nice little option toggle would be nicer. And maybe a couple option toggles.
    Last edited by redlightblinking; 03-11-14 at 11:17 AM.
    tack likes this.
    03-11-14 10:29 AM
  15. redlightblinking's Avatar
    Well when you use BeBuzz or Hub++ you assign a colour LED to different accounts. Without the screen turning on I know if I have received a text, email, bbm, twitter, facebook etc and automatically have the choice if it is important enough to view or respond to.
    Yes, but this has nothing to do with anything being discussed. You still have to reach for the phone and do the dance to read the message.....even if you know who it might be from. No one has been discussing who it's from, and not all people decide if they should view or respond simply by who it's from". They have to read the message first to make that determination. And, beyond that, this only works for KNOWN senders. You might get a request for business that needs attention right away...andHub or BeBuzz would have no way to communicate this to you since it's new sender.

    From there if you have enabled previews on the lock screen it will show all of what you have in the hub that is new and you can simply tap once to preview and then determine if you should unlock the phone to respond.
    Moot point. You still had to reach for the phone and do some action to wake the screen.

    After you tapped to preview if you choose to respond, you just tap again -- unlock and are at the reply screen. It's really no more hassle than an iPhone.
    You mean besides having the knowledge of whether you need to actually reach for the phone at all? You forgot that part. With Iphone that you mentioned you just look at it. Right on the screen I can read "yes...approved....proceed" in the message body. I never even reached for the phone. Major difference.

    As for people leaving their phones out, it just happens. I can't explain why people do what they do. But if it is out and not in the pocket I would prefer that things stay as they are, for my eyes only.

    Posted via CB10
    Luckily Iphone and older BB's with apps give you that option, at least in some way. But no phone gives you this option for phone calls anyway. If you need to say "hey, look at me, I have an Iphone" (or whatever phone you have) then you are accepting the fact that it might ring or alert at at some point after you set it on the table.
    Last edited by redlightblinking; 03-11-14 at 11:11 AM.
    03-11-14 10:53 AM
  16. redlightblinking's Avatar
    Coders doing the marketing? Thank God you aren't in waterloo

    Posted via CB10
    Stretch much? Managers assign directives and hire people and/or resources to fulfill them. It's called managing resources based on a finite limit on funding them.
    03-11-14 10:57 AM
  17. SmileDahling's Avatar
    I agree with all your points, redlightblinking.

    I don't see why so many people are assuming their views are the only ones and such that should be the default mode. I want the choice.

    Posted via my amazing Q10
    tack likes this.
    03-11-14 11:13 AM
  18. Karan Mohal's Avatar
    Regarding why it makes sense to have the screen turn on for a phone call and not a message (to me) is that with a phone call, you have 20 seconds (approx) to answer it, in order to have that live conversation with someone. In my circles, you usually only call someone if you require an immediate response. So it makes sense that a call would light up your entire display, and show who is calling. A text message on the other hand, is not necessarily something that requires immediate response, so it makes sense to notify the recipient that a message has arrived, but not as important to have that message read the moment it is delivered. So in this respect, an LED is a nice way to notify that you have a message waiting.

    As far as security is concerned I dont think that knowledge of who is calling could be as damaging as a text where you not only have the name, but the content (actual message) showing up the on screen as well.

    In contrast, if the only notification you get is the phone's screen coming on for a few seconds as a text comes in, you risk not knowing about the message at all (until you unlock your phone) if you don’t happen to have the phone's screen in sight. Obviously this comes down to personal use; personally, I dont leave my phone facing me at all times, so having the screen show an incoming text briefly, wouldn’t do anything but drain the battery.

    All that being said; sounds like the screen turning on briefly feature could be implemented very easily, so if people want it, bring it (just leave us the ability to disable it).
    BCITMike likes this.
    03-12-14 10:57 AM
  19. Karan Mohal's Avatar
    Also, how is it a 'dance' to check your messages on bb10? The lock screen shows a preview of your unread messages; from a sleeping/locked q10 you press one button to invoke the lock screen previews, and.. thats it. If thats a dance, its a pretty simple one.
    03-12-14 11:04 AM
  20. WhitsterN's Avatar
    Few more observations:

    The screen brightness range is nowhere near that of the 4s. That is, the screen does not get as dim or as bright on the Q10. This is quite annoying when using at night and you want a dim screen or using in sunlight and you want a bright screen.

    Nobex seems to buffer a podcast that you've already downloaded. This is confusing. I've already downloaded the podcast. I shouldn't have to wait 5 to 10 seconds for it to "buffer" when I click play.

    Is Nobex considered the best podcast player? Any recommendations? I just want an app focused on podcasting with good interface and easy to quickly skip back and forth through podcats in increments. Nobex seems OK but not exactly perfect.
    03-12-14 01:41 PM
  21. southlander's Avatar
    Of course this is all nitpicky. But again, if this is a phone designed for businessmen and people who need to get things done why isn't there an option to make one of the key features of a modern smartphone as efficient as possible to use.
    Seems like a good option to me. Why not add it to this list?

    What are your top FIVE things you'd like to see improved on BlackBerry 10? | CrackBerry.com
    03-12-14 01:48 PM
  22. anon8656116's Avatar
    I don't see why so many people are assuming their views are the only ones and such that should be the default mode. I want the choice.
    Because there is no choice. The feature does not exist on BlackBerry 10 and there is no one besides BlackBerry who can do something about it. As many pointed out here, BlackBerry 10 handles notifications differently than, say, an iPhone, which may explain why BlackBerry had no reason to implement it thus far and why it is in no hurry to do so.

    It is not helpful to be disgruntled about it and say that BlackBerry's developers are stupid for not offering a choice. Every mobile OS is different and every developer makes different choices. Just as BlackBerry 10 does not light up the screen when a notification comes in, the iPhone has no equivalent of an LED notification. Moreover, BlackBerry has limited resources and cannot implement everything. Even if they could, it is not always in their best interests to implement it, as the system may become bloated or unnecessarily complex. It's not always as simple. In the end, you have to adapt to your software, because the software will not adapt to all of your needs.
    03-12-14 02:04 PM
  23. bjw210's Avatar
    If you show the notifications on your lock screen, you can slide up from the bottom of the screen just a little bit and the screen will light up. If you lift your finger it'll stay lit up, if you drag it back down it'll turn the screen back off.
    03-12-14 02:28 PM
  24. SmileDahling's Avatar
    Because there is no choice. The feature does not exist on BlackBerry 10 and there is no one besides BlackBerry who can do something about it. As many pointed out here, BlackBerry 10 handles notifications differently than, say, an iPhone, which may explain why BlackBerry had no reason to implement it thus far and why it is in no hurry to do so.

    It is not helpful to be disgruntled about it and say that BlackBerry's developers are stupid for not offering a choice. Every mobile OS is different and every developer makes different choices. Just as BlackBerry 10 does not light up the screen when a notification comes in, the iPhone has no equivalent of an LED notification. Moreover, BlackBerry has limited resources and cannot implement everything. Even if they could, it is not always in their best interests to implement it, as the system may become bloated or unnecessarily complex. It's not always as simple. In the end, you have to adapt to your software, because the software will not adapt to all of your needs.
    Meh, I'll be mildly disgruntled if I want. That's my choice. :-)

    Posted via my amazing Q10
    03-12-14 03:10 PM
  25. redlightblinking's Avatar
    Also, how is it a 'dance' to check your messages on bb10? The lock screen shows a preview of your unread messages; from a sleeping/locked q10 you press one button to invoke the lock screen previews, and.. thats it. If thats a dance, its a pretty simple one.
    Step one, reach for phone and either swipe slightly or touch number key to light screen. Step two, hope the you get the previews and not just the icon, if not step two is to touch the icon to get the previews....which are not the actual messages, just who it's from and subject. Step three touch the preview, then touch it again. Wait for animation......and here's your message. I prefer to just look at the phone. Especially after having not one but two devices that allowed me to do this.

    Just make this an option. People who like to be in the "look at my phone but not my messages" club can feel confident to put their phone on the table for all to see, but have the freedom to shroud the screen from those pesky friends to avoid those embarrassing messages getting seen while checking.
    Last edited by redlightblinking; 03-12-14 at 06:29 PM.
    SmileDahling likes this.
    03-12-14 06:11 PM
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