[TomasTT]

I think we can cry, swear or whatever - "they" don't listen to users. Maybe they do on beta pages, but those are not open to everybody. As far as I know, there is updated witbni list of potential features for next sw cut and the forum is not monitored by staff... So it's wasting time to cry here.
Official FB pages are maybe better, sometimes you get staff response there. But how to submit requests for features really, what somebody will deal with and not delete it as trolling?

I already returned to Bold 9900 for work as I was loosing lot of time during the day doing stupid operations to perform tasks, what I have to do hunderet times every single day and what OS10 (including 10.2) made much less effective. I was waiting month to get 10.2 official release and when I got it, I decided to give up.
BlackBerry OS10 is not effective work OS, but underdeveloped concept, what may take long time to finish on the level, where was OS7. Fine details like hiding certain day in mail view (great if you work with several mails from different days, so you can hide days what you don't need now), listing of more mail messages on one screen (even on device with smaller and worse display then Q10), selection and deleting messages using hardware keyboard and so on. Selection of phone number written with spaces from web site and copy it was question of seconds with my old device. Now it's hard work even when new selection ring in 10.2 is far better then in 10.1. But nothing beats holding shift and using trackpad. Selection ring is often hidden by your finger, so you don't even know, what you do. Try to select something from end of URL (like remove youtube feature string from the URL to past it somewhere) with BlackBerry Q10 and Bold 9900. You will see.
Those are daily tasks, what you do. Copy phone numbers from contacts or received calls and past it in sms. Delete existence of certain phone number from your phone calls list etc. Basic things. For OS10 - probably not required as customer group is visibly different.
Calling phone numbers using long pressing keyboard was simply basic thing and it was possible to do it with one hand and almost under any conditions - even when laying under vehicle and trying to reach connection of some socket and was needed advice by colleague on the phone. Since 10+ years old business nokias was this feature standard, including old Windows Mobile smartphones and Symbian smartphones and all BlackBerry devices what I owned. Q10 is not able to do such simple and basic task - probably as it's not designed for work. If so, then it's wasting time at all. My resolution of the situation was to return to old Bold. But it's not good for BlackBerry as who else is good user group then owners who use it for work?


Posted via CB10

[SoxFan]

Seriously, I don't even know what to say, but WHAT THE F????????? Seriously, is this really such a terrible thing to include? Like will it break the phone if this works?? Why do they insist on removing one of the most convenient features a physical keyboard phone can have?? Who the hell makes the decisions at BlackBerry?? I really can't think of a single logical reason why this cannot be implemented. Sorry to sound so hostile, but seriously, is BB10 not capable of doing something so simple or what the hell is it??? Someone please explain to me...

It's not just this one function...the Q10 takes longer and more steps across the board. It's as if this is a new business for Blackberry...unfortunately, it's their swan song.

[nnik]

Somehow I don't see this as a problem at all? Am I crazy?

Posted Via CB10 - Q10SQN100-1/10.2.0.1791

no, and neither are most people.....only the ones too mentally challenged or other wise occupied to open and use a keypad or keyboard

Posted via CB10

[SoxFan]

So why does he say : I'm leaving my Q10 because of it (fine) but I go to a phone that doesn't have it either (not fine)

Because the iPhone is superior in most other respects...

[Bonnie Bonzai]

I do understand and commiserate with you slagman - the 9900 was awesome and had some amazing features that BB10 does not have. Why you say? Well my thought is they brought in an entirely different tech team to create BB10 and those people obviously did not talk to the other Legacy Techs. WHY I really don't know - it seems like common sense to us regular folk but that's what we got. Still I would not go back to my 9900 now - love my Q10 too much.

Posted via CB10

[SoxFan]

In some ways, yes, because it had time to gain all these features. None of them were there from the start, and all these features are coming to BB10 much more quickly than they came to BBOS.

Posted via CB10

That's so funny...are you really implying that BB10 didn't have the benefit of 15+/- years of cumulative experience? Really? They had an amazing road map. Not sure why some people are so prone to make excuses for such an epic failure?

[SoxFan]

You're still missing a few points. BBOS is not in the same league as the BB 10 on Universal Search

For those of us who have used BB's for the past 7 or 8 years, most of us are very happy with BB10.

In most respects, BB10 is a step backwards, and where it is a step forwards, it's in an area which would naturally be expected to improve after a couple of years and substantial R&D, like browsing speed, or it's in an area few of us care about, like social media integration, and therefore otherwise makes things take longer. The Blackberry Q10 is a lose lose.

Your other statement that most long time BBY users are very happy with BB10 is comical. Just look at the threads upon threads of complaints here on Crackberry. The fact is that most core BB7 users don't like BB10. Most have not bothered to convert to BB10. There were no lines around the block when the device was released. The product is DOA in the stores. Many more BB7 users have switched to other devices than have bought this device. Many more bought this device and returned it. Legions of companies large and small have had it with Blackberry and defected.

I was at a meeting at a PE firm today. Everyone used to have a Blackberry. Now they ALL have iPhones. I couldn't even get a spare charger as my battery was dying after 6 hours (another BB10 problem). ]

The proof is in the pudding.

[SoxFan]

Press the phone icon first.

Posted via CB10

That says it all: twice as many steps and more than twice the time. Go figure.

[waterfrontmgmt]

How many steps did it take to post to Facebook on BBOS? How many to tweet? Email? Text? Your math is a bit fuzzy. The Q10 is faster than BBOS on about 95% of everything....IF you take the time to learn how to use it. And it does take some time, I admit that. But when you design a new OS, no you DON'T have the benefit of 15 years experience... you are starting over from scratch.

That says it all: twice as many steps and more than twice the time. Go figure.

You are absolutely correct. All those battery pulls and spinning clocks did wonders for iPhones and Androids.

Many more BB7 users have switched to other devices than have bought this device.

Oh yeah, hasn't it been announced that speed dial is coming? Hopefully it won't 10 years like BBOS 7 did.

[woofhaven]

In most respects, BB10 is a step backwards, and where it is a step forwards, it's in an area which would naturally be expected to improve after a couple of years and substantial R&D, like browsing speed, or it's in an area few of us care about, like social media integration...

Aaand cue Soxfan, once again purporting to speak for everyone...

For the record, the areas in which BB10 has improved include a lot--as in a TON--of work behind the scenes that allow it to leapfrog the Lenix-based OS's in reliability, security, power, multithreading capability, and so forth. This change is emphatically not in the category of what "would naturally be expected to improve," since no one else has tackled such a difficult undertaking.

That?s not to excuse BlackBerry for failing to implement UI components that they should have known their fans would expect to see. It?s a company with serious issues surrounding its ability to execute on a strategy. I still prefer BlackBerry over companies with great execution but strategies that I don't like. But there are times when owning a BlackBerry feels like having an alcoholic spouse. Good sex, but you always wonder what life could have been like...

Posted via CB10

[Anonymous2039]

That's so funny...are you really implying that BB10 didn't have the benefit of 15+/- years of cumulative experience? Really? They had an amazing road map. Not sure why some people are so prone to make excuses for such an epic failure?

That's exactly what I'm implying. BB10 was built from scratch. It's just like if a whole city is destroyed by a fire (like was Chicago). At first when it is being rebuilt it WILL NOT have all the same things the old city had, but eventually most stuff will make it back. However, things like hitching posts will not make it back because they're obsolete, and some things like the huge fancy mansions or the skyscrapers will just take a lot longer because they're not necessity and take a long time to build, but they'll still come.

In my analogy, the hitching posts are the trackpad. Despite what people may think, right now they are becoming obsolete and have no place on a phone. There will always be those people who prefer horse and carriage, but cars are the future. Similarly, all the details like you like to complain about just take a little longer to build, but they'll still be built--they just have a smaller priority. You build the sewer system before you paint the lines on the road.

Posted via CB10

[Anonymous2039]

And just so you know SoxFan, there is a plus or minus symbol on the BlackBerry keyboard: �

EDIT: It appears CB10 won't display it.

Posted via CB10

[SoxFan]

And just so you know SoxFan, there is a plus or minus symbol on the BlackBerry keyboard: �

EDIT: It appears CB10 won't display it.

Posted via CB10

I understand there's a + and - sign on the keyboard to attempt to help compensate for the device's clunky navigation, but what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

[anon(4077577)]

I'm sick and tired of people blaming the price of tea in china. It's been discussed, and settled, let's move on.

from an australian Z10...

[slagman5]

I love my Q10, and I personally can survive without speed dialing.

But I agree that BlackBerry was foolish to leave it until now. It seems that their attention was split between attracting legacy BB-users and new non-BB users. I think they took their legacy users for granted a bit and they shouldn't have.

I know of one influential businessman who waited for the Q10 to launch, and when he finally got his hands on one, he was so disappointed that he dumped it and got an iPhone. Lack of speed dial was a critical missing feature for him.

Obviously, an iPhone isn't going to be keyboard friendly either, but it has the advantage of the ios ecosystem. We sacrifice a lot in terms of app availability to stay with BB. All those little convenience and workflow features do a lot to make up for the loss of app selection.

Take away those little features, and a legacy user looks at the phone and thinks "if I'm going to have to learn a whole new operating system anyways, I might as well learn an iphone".

I've heard it said elsewhere on this forum that the 9900 was a keyboard phone with a touch screen added on, and the Q10 is a touch screen phone with a keyboard added on.

There's this misconception that keyboards are just for entering text. Keyboards are sooooo much more than text entry. There's navigation, text editing, application shortcuts, task switching, app launching, speed dialing...

What I miss most is being able to launch apps from the home screen:

L = calendar
U = calculator
A = contacts
N = bbm
M = messages (hub)
K = lock
W = weather
Z = adv OS (quick access to flashlight)
W (long press) = voice mail
Q (long press) = quiet


I always thought it was stupid that these could not be customized on BBOS. I really hope they can be customized on BB10 when they finally come out. But, judging by the way the keyboard has been treated so far in BB10, I have to say I'm not holding on to a whole lot of hope.

What would be REALLY excellent, is if you could configure long press shortcuts to work from anywhere in the system. E.g. while editing an email message you could long press U and it would bring up the calculator.

I realize that some people use long presses to enter shifted or accented characters, so this feature would have to be configurable.

But as I say, it seems very unlikely that the current regime has enough respect for the keyboard to allow such a powerful feature.

We're probably just going to get speed dialing from the home screen and nothing else.

Posted via CB10

IF we get that much... And yes, excellent points you make, things I've been saying, we need as many advantages we can get due to the sacrifices we're forced to make to have a Q10... Take those away and it's hard to defend it...

[Anonymous2039]

I understand there's a + and - sign on the keyboard to attempt to help compensate for the device's clunky navigation, but what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

I commented on that because you used "+/-" when you could have just used the "plus or minus" symbol, which is a plus sign ontop of a minus sign. Unfortunately, CB10 has some issues displaying special characters, so it wouldn't work anyway.

And the + and - signs have nothing to do with your opinion that the Q10 has "clunky navigation", but rather to do with the fact that it's a commonly typed symbol. It was an aside, and has nothing to do with "the price of tea in China".

Posted via CB10

[slagman5]

It is not implemented because, I think, pressing any key at Homescreen initiates universal search and Type n Go function. Long pressing = capital letter. Implementing speed dial the old way will mess up immediate search and type n go.

Posted via CB10

And how exactly do you think it was in BB OS7?? It was exactly like that... Type n go never needs a capital letter as the first letter... typing "email [name]" will work the same as "Email [name]" and any search terms are not required to be capitalized either. The only time you need to capitalize during the thing is the posting tweets or posting facebook messages, but again, none of that needs to be the first. For example, to post a facebook status, you simply type "fb Hi I am eating lunch, yum." You don't need a capital "f" for that to work. Same with universal search in OS7, it ONLY GOES TO SPEED DIAL IF YOU LONG PRESS FROM THE BEGINNING, meaning as the first thing. If you've already started typing normally, it'll treat it like type n go or universal search, if you start with a long press, it's speed dial. It's that simple... Again, you're making up excuses for them, and that's not needed...

[slagman5]

It's the same on BB10.

Posted via CB10

Nope, wrong, long press 1 and you type a capital "W" in the universal search...

[slagman5]

Press the phone icon first.

Posted via CB10

Well, that's not at all what he was talking about now is it?

[slagman5]

I think we can cry, swear or whatever - "they" don't listen to users. Maybe they do on beta pages, but those are not open to everybody. As far as I know, there is updated witbni list of potential features for next sw cut and the forum is not monitored by staff... So it's wasting time to cry here.
Official FB pages are maybe better, sometimes you get staff response there. But how to submit requests for features really, what somebody will deal with and not delete it as trolling?

I already returned to Bold 9900 for work as I was loosing lot of time during the day doing stupid operations to perform tasks, what I have to do hunderet times every single day and what OS10 (including 10.2) made much less effective. I was waiting month to get 10.2 official release and when I got it, I decided to give up.
BlackBerry OS10 is not effective work OS, but underdeveloped concept, what may take long time to finish on the level, where was OS7. Fine details like hiding certain day in mail view (great if you work with several mails from different days, so you can hide days what you don't need now), listing of more mail messages on one screen (even on device with smaller and worse display then Q10), selection and deleting messages using hardware keyboard and so on. Selection of phone number written with spaces from web site and copy it was question of seconds with my old device. Now it's hard work even when new selection ring in 10.2 is far better then in 10.1. But nothing beats holding shift and using trackpad. Selection ring is often hidden by your finger, so you don't even know, what you do. Try to select something from end of URL (like remove youtube feature string from the URL to past it somewhere) with BlackBerry Q10 and Bold 9900. You will see.
Those are daily tasks, what you do. Copy phone numbers from contacts or received calls and past it in sms. Delete existence of certain phone number from your phone calls list etc. Basic things. For OS10 - probably not required as customer group is visibly different.
Calling phone numbers using long pressing keyboard was simply basic thing and it was possible to do it with one hand and almost under any conditions - even when laying under vehicle and trying to reach connection of some socket and was needed advice by colleague on the phone. Since 10+ years old business nokias was this feature standard, including old Windows Mobile smartphones and Symbian smartphones and all BlackBerry devices what I owned. Q10 is not able to do such simple and basic task - probably as it's not designed for work. If so, then it's wasting time at all. My resolution of the situation was to return to old Bold. But it's not good for BlackBerry as who else is good user group then owners who use it for work?


Posted via CB10

I'm a member of the beta zone, and yes, this was the first issue I raised there...

[slagman5]

no, and neither are most people.....only the ones too mentally challenged or other wise occupied to open and use a keypad or keyboard

Posted via CB10

LMAO, so we're mentally challenged because we're not fanboys that will make up excuses for every mistake BB makes? Try having a hectic lifestyle where you often come upon times where you can barely reach your phone when you need to make a call much less have to look at it and go through 5 steps to make a phone call. And for you to say that paying more for a "new" phone that has features WORSE than the legacy devices before it is not a big deal is ridiculous. You and the people like you are the reason why BB doesn't take action, they are likely reading your comments to every complaint and every issue about how stupid they are and how everything is perfect and so they choose to do nothing to better themselves, and guess what, now the company is tanking.

Fanboyism is a disease...

[slagman5]

I do understand and commiserate with you slagman - the 9900 was awesome and had some amazing features that BB10 does not have. Why you say? Well my thought is they brought in an entirely different tech team to create BB10 and those people obviously did not talk to the other Legacy Techs. WHY I really don't know - it seems like common sense to us regular folk but that's what we got. Still I would not go back to my 9900 now - love my Q10 too much.

Posted via CB10

I agree with you, the Q10 is definitely better in that no more spinning wheel everytime you want to do something... And I also agree on your reasoning. There's absolutely no way that if I had a 9900, and I was on the team to build BB10, that I would not incorporate all of the great features the older BB devices had, and even improving on them. But to leave them out, seems like they had no clue what made the old devices so great despite their outdated hardware...

[slagman5]

That says it all: twice as many steps and more than twice the time. Go figure.

It's more than twice because where once you can do it all without even looking at the phone, now you have to in order to make sure the touchscreen responded to your touch. I've tried touching the phone or camera icon before and it won't go the first time...

[PritK]

I'm also frustrated; I thought this would have been resolved by now. What is the best way to send comments/complaints to BB?

[slagman5]

How many steps did it take to post to Facebook on BBOS? How many to tweet? Email? Text? Your math is a bit fuzzy. The Q10 is faster than BBOS on about 95% of everything....IF you take the time to learn how to use it. And it does take some time, I admit that. But when you design a new OS, no you DON'T have the benefit of 15 years experience... you are starting over from scratch.



You are absolutely correct. All those battery pulls and spinning clocks did wonders for iPhones and Androids.



Oh yeah, hasn't it been announced that speed dial is coming? Hopefully it won't 10 years like BBOS 7 did.

With facebook and "tweets" (whatever the f those are...)(joking, I do, but I think twitter is freakin' ********), but with email and texts, it was still faster on my old devices. I had my convenience key set to "compose" so all I had to do was hit that, type the contact's name, and start typing the message. No extra step to choose a number, or channel (text, email, or mms), it picked the most recent one used for that contact, which 99.9% of the time was the method I wanted to use then. So I almost never had to change that... I shot out texts and emails on my 9900 in record time. In the amount of time it took my friends to unlock the screen, I could have been in the middle of a phone call or have already sent out two texts/emails by then... Now we're probably about on par... which is terrible since I have half the screen space as them and 1/100th the apps they have... Where are my advantages for making these sacrifices??