10-11-15 12:52 PM
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  1. KAM1138's Avatar
    What could chen do?

    Samsung spent $14 BILLION on marketing in 2013, more than the entire value of blackberry AND Samsung get to market devices with apps.

    Writing has been on the wall for a while and blackberry needs to evolve or die, and that is what is happening.
    No, BlackBerry is not "Evolving" It is DE-Evolving--towards a lesser OS.

    The "change is good" mindset without regard to what that change is, defies reason.

    The writing on the wall is that BlackBerry is and has been run by CEOs and a Board of Directors that are horrible failures, and NOTHING about that is changing at all. They HAD a very good piece of technology in their hands (BB10) and THEY Failed at making it successful. These Failures are blaming a piece of software for their continued failures.

    KAM
    nah.uhh likes this.
    10-09-15 09:29 AM
  2. Paul Ratanaboon's Avatar
    How is he saving it? By making it Android for high end Govt and entrepreneurs which is not as secure as bb10? Or by completely finishing the handset business and making BlackBerry a software co. ?
    If he wanted to save BlackBerry handset division he could have targeted normal average consumer by low price phone even if he have to go android!!!

    Posted via CB10
    He is saving it by stop the bleeding. You think Blackberry would survive this long without Chen? Probably you wouldn't even have a Q10.

    If you follow news very closely, you would have known that Chen said for quite sometimes that BBRY cannot compete on prices because they cannot get the cost down to levels that match Lenovo, Huawei, or other Chinese manufacturers. In business, you either go low-cost or value-added. So for blackberry, I guess the company's stong point goes well with the latter, and that's what Chen is doing.

    If I want cheap Android phone with crazy high-end specs, I cannot find a reason why I will not buy Chinese phone instead of Blackberry.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    10-09-15 09:44 AM
  3. tomh235's Avatar
    No, BlackBerry is not "Evolving" It is DE-Evolving--towards a lesser OS.

    The "change is good" mindset without regard to what that change is, defies reason.

    The writing on the wall is that BlackBerry is and has been run by CEOs and a Board of Directors that are horrible failures, and NOTHING about that is changing at all. They HAD a very good piece of technology in their hands (BB10) and THEY Failed at making it successful. These Failures are blaming a piece of software for their continued failures.

    KAM
    And bb10 was YEARS too late. The ship has sailed.

    QNX was the best choice from a technical point of view, but it was by no means ready to be made into a phone OS pushing the launch date back to a point at which blackberry was no longer relevant.

    A good piece of technology is irrelevant, I could name a dozen good pieces of technology without any customer buy in that have failed miserably. The winners are the ones in the right place at the right time and bb10 was the wrong time.

    Could blackberry have got bb10 out any faster? Maybe. Would it be the same OS? Probably not.

    Ironically, if blackberry had put out something less technically good, earlier, then the company might be doing better. Nothing Chen or any other CEO could have done would make bb10 a relevant phone platform for anyone but the people on this forum. Android is their ONLY chance to retain a hardware presence and I am glad that Chen is trying to keep hardware a part of blackberry.

    Change is good when it's the right change and blackberry has to change.

    Posted via CB10
    dejanh and DueNorthBB like this.
    10-09-15 09:45 AM
  4. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    He is saving it by stop the bleeding. You think Blackberry would survive this long without Chen? Probably you wouldn't even have a Q10.

    If you follow news very closely, you would have known that Chen said for quite sometimes that BBRY cannot compete on prices because they cannot get the cost down to levels that match Lenovo, Huawei, or other Chinese manufacturers. In business, you either go low-cost or value-added. So for blackberry, I guess the company's stong point goes well with the latter, and that's what Chen is doing.

    If I want cheap Android phone with crazy high-end specs, I cannot find a reason why I will not buy Chinese phone instead of Blackberry.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    Good luck doing that OnePlus lottery and brace for all the RMA problems. True story from my friend, he gave up and got an Xperia Z instead.
    10-09-15 09:48 AM
  5. skibnik's Avatar
    How is he saving it? By making it Android for high end Govt and entrepreneurs which is not as secure as bb10? Or by completely finishing the handset business and making BlackBerry a software co. ?
    If he wanted to save BlackBerry handset division he could have targeted normal average consumer by low price phone even if he have to go android!!!

    Posted via CB10
    Quote from Chen from Recode event: We have two new releases of BB10 coming out to support government and high-security space.
    This shows BB10 will still be around for government/enterprise use.

    Chen is doing what Blackberry needed to do from the very beginning, keep BB10 (or kept BBOS) for government/enterprise the so called Prosumer and joined the OHA to release Android devices for the average consumer who demands a large and varied app ecosystem. If this was done back when Google first proposed the OHA we would all be having a very different conversation. lol
    10-09-15 09:58 AM
  6. kbz1960's Avatar
    You are talking about BlackBerry 10, fair enough. And according to you Priv is the last kick. Fine...but why would he tell the world that Priv is not as secure as a competitor. You don't need SAMSUNG marketing dollars to NOT make such a foolish statement! He simply striked off a key selling point.
    Maybe because it's true?
    extisis and dejanh like this.
    10-09-15 10:11 AM
  7. anon(679606)'s Avatar
    Nobody wants overpriced BlackBerry hardware. Nobody wants bb10 OS. Passport android runtime is working well enough & nobody wanted it.

    Nobody wants android with bb10 hampering it calling it "secure".

    If customers want android, they will not over-pay for it hobbled by cobbled-together security bloat on overpriced hardware lacking up-to-date features.

    Android should have powered a cheap Leap. The Priv is too big, too ill-conceived, too expensive, too late.

    Enterprise customers don't give phones as Christmas gifts.
    KAM1138 and andy957 like this.
    10-09-15 10:13 AM
  8. extisis's Avatar
    He can't seem to handle public interviews and ends up saying some of the craziest things. Why is his PR team letting him make fool of himself?

    Posted via CB10
    you're assuming they have a PR team.....
    nah.uhh likes this.
    10-09-15 10:19 AM
  9. dejanh's Avatar
    You are talking about BlackBerry 10, fair enough. And according to you Priv is the last kick. Fine...but why would he tell the world that Priv is not as secure as a competitor. You don't need SAMSUNG marketing dollars to NOT make such a foolish statement! He simply striked off a key selling point.
    Tell me, what is the point in being disingenuous? He could have stood there and lied, said that BlackBerry was the most secure Android device in the market, and the moment BlackBerry Priv gets affected by the next Android vulnerability, the entire BlackBerry business will come crumbling down. Security is a game of trust. Trust is earned by being honest. BlackBerry's true goal is software revenue from MDM. You don't want to have hardware cause your MDM clients that trust you to start walking only because they ask the question "what else did they lie about?"

    Furthermore, albeit perhaps of lesser relevance, is the fact that saying Priv was the most secure Android on the market is equivalent of painting a bullseye on your back. Everyone in the Android world who cares about hacking would probably target the BlackBerry device, just for the bragging rights of being the person who "hacked" the most secure Android.
    10-09-15 10:39 AM
  10. KAM1138's Avatar
    And bb10 was YEARS too late. The ship has sailed.

    QNX was the best choice from a technical point of view, but it was by no means ready to be made into a phone OS pushing the launch date back to a point at which blackberry was no longer relevant.

    A good piece of technology is irrelevant, I could name a dozen good pieces of technology without any customer buy in that have failed miserably. The winners are the ones in the right place at the right time and bb10 was the wrong time.

    Could blackberry have got bb10 out any faster? Maybe. Would it be the same OS? Probably not.

    Ironically, if blackberry had put out something less technically good, earlier, then the company might be doing better. Nothing Chen or any other CEO could have done would make bb10 a relevant phone platform for anyone but the people on this forum. Android is their ONLY chance to retain a hardware presence and I am glad that Chen is trying to keep hardware a part of blackberry.

    Change is good when it's the right change and blackberry has to change.
    Posted via CB10
    "A good piece of technology is irrelevant..." My temptation is to strongly resist this statement, because it goes against everything I personally believe, and against objective truth. However, Practically speaking I can't deny this is what rules the day.
    Whereas you seem to think it is more about timing, I think it is more about all of the other things that must be done to insure that quality wins out, and that is where Blackberry has failed so miserably.

    I think you are totally off base by saying that BB10 COULD NOT be relevant to anyone except us here. I think this is the core flaw in the pro-android argument. We are here, because poor decisions led us here.

    Going with Android Solves NONE of the problems that brought BlackBerry to where it is today. It's merely the technology that is "irrelevant" without everything else to back it up.

    You are right--BlackBerry DOES have to change, and what we are seeing is that it hasn't. It's just choosing to mishandle a different OS. BlackBerry ISN'T changing which is what I find so exasperating about all the unwarranted optimism people are hoping for with this "change."

    KAM

    Side Note: The Abundance of Ads (I suspect) are making CrackBerry almost unusable at this point. I can't even type a post without it hanging up every few seconds.
    10-09-15 10:44 AM
  11. sonicpix's Avatar
    My last few posts have echoed this.

    Posted via CB10
    10-09-15 10:47 AM
  12. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    Side Note: The Abundance of Ads (I suspect) are making CrackBerry almost unusable at this point. I can't even type a post without it hanging up every few seconds.
    The autoplay video WITH SOUND was my last straw. I put them on my Adblock Plus blacklist.
    dejanh likes this.
    10-09-15 10:49 AM
  13. KAM1138's Avatar
    The autoplay video WITH SOUND was my last straw. I put them on my Adblock Plus blacklist.
    Ok, so it isn't just me. I tolerate ads, because people need money to support websites, but this is getting obnoxious.

    KAM
    dejanh likes this.
    10-09-15 10:56 AM
  14. MGDania's Avatar
    Chen is a great CEO, I trust him to get the most for the shareholders.

    Chen is the absolute worst spokesman for a brand. He constantly uses "I" when a real team leader always uses "We". He also continually gives more reason for customers to hesitate than to support the brand. I almost think he wants the handsets to fail so he can sell most of BlackBerry by spinning off Government sensitive services and selling the rest to Samsung once and for all.

    Lock him up in the corner office and hire a professional spokesperson to do PR.

    Posted via CB10
    10-09-15 11:13 AM
  15. DJM626's Avatar
    I like Chen and see why he's doing what he's doing. If it were not for him Blackberries ship would have sunk and not existed today.

    Posted via CB10
    10-09-15 11:15 AM
  16. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    No, BlackBerry is not "Evolving" It is DE-Evolving--towards a lesser OS.
    Time for John Chen to go campaign-5166465451_ded900eaf8_z.jpg
    Market says otherwise.
    MO3iusONE likes this.
    10-09-15 11:42 AM
  17. Q10Bold's Avatar
    Lol...Chens interviews are sad
    andy957 likes this.
    10-09-15 11:48 AM
  18. KAM1138's Avatar
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Market says otherwise.
    HAH--Great response.

    However, market popularity is not the question I'm referring to. It IS my opinion that Android is a steaming pile of...well, you know compared to BB10, and that's why I don't see this as anything except a failure--necessary or not. webOS was far superior to the even worse trash that Android (and iOS) was in 2009, and it died too.

    I really hope that People are able to discern the difference between quality of product and popularity, but as you indicate--apparently they don't.

    Now, if people are of the opinion that iOS and Android are superior, then that's an opinion they are welcome to, but I'm not sure why they would be interested in blackberry in the first place.

    I think this is all a strong indicator that Marketing, PR and Branding are all powerful, if not deciding influences of success and failure. BUT people get angry at that notion for some reason, no matter how often it is demonstrated.

    KAM
    Jake2826 and extisis like this.
    10-09-15 12:06 PM
  19. KemKev's Avatar
    How is this level of screw up Possibly out of anyone's league?

    ANY PR Firm...or Common person off the street should know better than this.
    I say you hurry up and send in your application. You seem to know how to turn BBRY around better than those million-dollar executives!
    10-09-15 03:03 PM
  20. tomh235's Avatar
    "A good piece of technology is irrelevant..." My temptation is to strongly resist this statement, because it goes against everything I personally believe, and against objective truth. However, Practically speaking I can't deny this is what rules the day.
    Whereas you seem to think it is more about timing, I think it is more about all of the other things that must be done to insure that quality wins out, and that is where Blackberry has failed so miserably.

    I think you are totally off base by saying that BB10 COULD NOT be relevant to anyone except us here. I think this is the core flaw in the pro-android argument. We are here, because poor decisions led us here.

    Going with Android Solves NONE of the problems that brought BlackBerry to where it is today. It's merely the technology that is "irrelevant" without everything else to back it up.

    You are right--BlackBerry DOES have to change, and what we are seeing is that it hasn't. It's just choosing to mishandle a different OS. BlackBerry ISN'T changing which is what I find so exasperating about all the unwarranted optimism people are hoping for with this "change."

    KAM

    Side Note: The Abundance of Ads (I suspect) are making CrackBerry almost unusable at this point. I can't even type a post without it hanging up every few seconds.
    It's a sad situation, I wanted bb10 to be a huge success but unfortunately it hasn't. I love my passport, and I loved my z10 and q10 before it.

    If bb10 was out in 2010 then I feel it would have been a success and the mobile landscape would have been very different. How they could have done this, I don't know but it would have been a different product to what we have today. (maybe if BlackBerry bought palm instead of HP? That would have been interesting!)

    At the moment, Android is a way out of the mess BlackBerry are stuck in and it's actually a decent OS. Stock android is 100x better than the Samsung crap they ship and blackberry seems to have added some quality features to android. We can't go back in time and this is the best option for BlackBerry right now.

    Posted via CB10
    10-09-15 03:42 PM
  21. KAM1138's Avatar
    I say you hurry up and send in your application. You seem to know how to turn BBRY around better than those million-dollar executives!
    This is a pretty silly response, born out of an inability or unwillingness to deal with the plain and simple fact that BlackBerry is and has been doing a very poor job at PR.

    Two fallacies you're forwarding;
    1) You're responding as if I claimed I had a plan to turn BBRY around, when in fact, I'm pointing out what they ARE doing, and have been failing at. So, your response really doesn't make a lot of sense.
    2) You're essentially appealing to Authority. "Well, they get paid millions of dollars, so they must know what they are doing."
    That's simply not an argument that holds water. In fact, these "million dollar executives" are failing to succeed after YEARS of mismanagement.

    I actually make money in my field, and my work allows others to make many, times more than what I get paid If I didn't I assure you that I wouldn't get paid Unfortunately, people such as yourself are apparently more than willing to accept, defend and makes excuses for continued failures. This apparently endless tolerance for failure enables continued failure.

    So, after your "witty" comments have been disposed of, we're still left with reality--a CEO who makes really stupid remarks, and a company that continues to make a joke of itself. So, you might find that comforting or acceptable, but I don't.

    KAM
    app_Developer likes this.
    10-09-15 03:45 PM
  22. KAM1138's Avatar
    It's a sad situation, I wanted bb10 to be a huge success but unfortunately it hasn't. I love my passport, and I loved my z10 and q10 before it.

    If bb10 was out in 2010 then I feel it would have been a success and the mobile landscape would have been very different. How they could have done this, I don't know but it would have been a different product to what we have today. (maybe if BlackBerry bought palm instead of HP? That would have been interesting!)

    At the moment, Android is a way out of the mess BlackBerry are stuck in and it's actually a decent OS. Stock android is 100x better than the Samsung crap they ship and blackberry seems to have added some quality features to android. We can't go back in time and this is the best option for BlackBerry right now.

    Posted via CB10
    First...BlackBerry buying webOS and adapting it would have been something I would have liked to see. I think BlackBerry did adopt some similar features to webOS, and could have gone farther. Alas, that didn't happen.

    You are right--we can't go back in time, and I've not really claimed that at THIS point, given that they've neglected development of BB10, that the damage can be undone.

    However, what I've generally argued against is that things HAD to be this way--that it was inevitable to come to this point. Here's why: You've stated that you love your passport, and Z10 and Q10. Are you a fool for thinking that? No--of course not. There are reasons why you like BB10, and choose to use it. So, BB10 CAN (or at least COULD) appeal to people.

    There is no technical reason that BlackBerry could not have a very broad and satisfying array of apps. All it takes is someone to actually do it, and for that--you need customers. So, the Crux of everything is to GET those customers--like yourself (and me). They might have needed better support, etc, but the point is--it COULD Be done.

    Next point: You and I aren't a mutants or aliens right? There's nothing that makes us inherently able to appreciate BlackBerry more than person X. So, it is possible that BB10 devices COULD appeal to other people--perhaps MANY people. So, why hasn't it? Well, obviously personal preference comes into play. Some people will like a thing over another--that's natural.

    A lot of "could" adding up there right? That's worth...well nothing, EXCEPT as a reminder that there is reason that instead of "could", we have "didn't."

    People don't want to accept this (at least some people), but people respond to advertising, and can be convinced to buy a certain product, but you are certain to NOT gain customers if they aren't aware you exist. That's where Blackberry is. BlackBerry did not reach its potential audience, BECAUSE of PR/Marketing/Advertising failures and/or Brand Image damage.

    I really think there is more than .3% of people that might like what BlackBerry has to offer, like you and I do, and that would become a larger percentage as the ecosystem grew--which happens when you DO have a larger market base--it's an upwards spiral, but they failed to do what was needed to hit that critical mass where they could grow.

    Sidebar: I bought a cheap Windows Phone last night from a Big Box store, and happened to pull out my passport. This salesperson who sells phones for a living literally said "what's that...oh a BlackBerry...I didn't know they were still around."
    So, anyone out there who DOESN'T think that this is a problem for a company trying to sell phones...better get up to speed.

    So, you may be right--NOW they're stuck with Android, but this is BECAUSE of earlier failures NOT related to what BB10 is and can do.
    You are very right--we can't go back in time and correct what they HAVE done, but it is VITALLY important to learn from past mistakes instead of misidentifying them. That's exactly what I think is going on with a lot of people, and they are going to repeat those same mistakes.

    KAM
    10-09-15 04:09 PM
  23. 6stringriffs's Avatar
    You are very right--we can't go back in time and correct what they HAVE done, but it is VITALLY important to learn from past mistakes instead of misidentifying them. That's exactly what I think is going on with a lot of people, and they are going to repeat those same mistakes.

    KAM
    Well I for one, am not going to make the same mistake all over again and purchase another OS Platform with a dying ecosystem, dying OS... as in not getting updates, and dying apps as in apps never getting updates resulting in not working or giving me inaccurate data/information.

    You can try and type all the intellectual gymnastics you keep doing (and it doesn't even make any sense) to justify BB10, and I am just observing all my hands-on experiences with the device, and my observations with the outside world (web or real world). And I conclude this: BB10 is becoming useless week after week, month after month. I am not an early adopter, so I can only hope that my Z30 serves me until March 2016 when all competing devices (including the OS, apps, features, ec.) have settled down and I can pick which one is the right one for me.

    BB10 is dead. The only thing missing is the funeral. No amount of denials, ignores, or fancy intellectual gymnastics can change what I see.
    10-09-15 05:07 PM
  24. anon(679606)'s Avatar
    I got webOS & it died, I got bb10 & it will die soon...Woe is me !! I am the phone OS's hex !!!
    kbz1960 likes this.
    10-09-15 05:11 PM
  25. kbz1960's Avatar
    I got webOS & it died, I got bb10 & it will die soon...Woe is me !! I am the phone OS's hex !!!
    Stop it! LOL
    10-09-15 05:13 PM
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