06-22-15 03:12 AM
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  1. BB-JAM215's Avatar
    I had the sane thoughts as the original OP. Chen does say things that elude to fixing the app gap. Don't know what other fix there would be. That being said, I always assumed it would be forked android with the amazon store. At least it would mean the apps you could download would work fine.
    The "app gap" that Chen wants to fix is the one that will help him sell BlackBerry software and security services to the enterprise and business market. If it also benefits the consumer market and BlackBerry sells more hardware as a result, that's nice too.
    04-28-15 08:41 PM
  2. jmr1015's Avatar
    Samsung and BlackBerry working together. BlackBerry benefits from Samsung's years of experience developing Android handsets, skins, and bloat. As already revealed, Samsung KNOX security enhanced by BlackBerry benefits Samsung, and that could likely be the foundation of a BlackBerry Android device. (Their work on this partnership could have shown BlackBerry that Android is a viable platform for security with their know how) Hell, BlackBerry could get completely out of designing and manufacturing hardware, contracting Samsung to do the heavy lifting of design and production.

    BlackBerry can cut costs on design and production of hardware and their own OS, lay offs in hardware and BB10 divisions, and they could benefit from the cheaper component costs Samsung can leverage thanks to moving large amounts of inventory, and the cheaper labor afforded to Samsung for assembly, for the same reason.

    BlackBerry can continue to push Enterprise sales, since many are using Android already. So then Enterprise customers can get Android, with BlackBerry security, and features like Hub and BBM.
    04-28-15 08:49 PM
  3. amjass12's Avatar
    It's been discussed many times in the forums.

    Frankly, developing the hardware for the slider and then releasing it only for BB10, would a terrible waste. The Slider, if done nicely, might have a larger audience in the Android world than what most here imagine. Specifically because Android users are used to switching around brands and models, and seem open to trying 'new' things.

    Posted via CB10
    agree to a certain extent, but I wouldn't want to see BB10 be a hybrid of an android OS as well.

    For me it would be better if full android app support truly meant that all android apps work flawlessly with proper hub integration, plus google play services so that we never see another error message again. Flaunt this and I think android users might still jump ship to bb10.

    But bb10 as an Os is too good to change in any other way
    DJM626 likes this.
    04-29-15 03:22 AM
  4. MC_A_DOT's Avatar
    *cough cough* SECURITY *cough cough*

    seems legit

    Posted from q10, excuse me for not having any typos.
    *cough cough* that sales logic is still not working *cough cough*
    04-29-15 03:43 AM
  5. kbz1960's Avatar
    Samsung and BlackBerry working together. BlackBerry benefits from Samsung's years of experience developing Android handsets, skins, and bloat. As already revealed, Samsung KNOX security enhanced by BlackBerry benefits Samsung, and that could likely be the foundation of a BlackBerry Android device. (Their work on this partnership could have shown BlackBerry that Android is a viable platform for security with their know how) Hell, BlackBerry could get completely out of designing and manufacturing hardware, contracting Samsung to do the heavy lifting of design and production.

    BlackBerry can cut costs on design and production of hardware and their own OS, lay offs in hardware and BB10 divisions, and they could benefit from the cheaper component costs Samsung can leverage thanks to moving large amounts of inventory, and the cheaper labor afforded to Samsung for assembly, for the same reason.

    BlackBerry can continue to push Enterprise sales, since many are using Android already. So then Enterprise customers can get Android, with BlackBerry security, and features like Hub and BBM.
    So would there still be the buy Canada sentiment in Canada then like there is now for many here? That would mean more Canadian jobs lost.
    04-29-15 04:28 AM
  6. amjass12's Avatar
    OP, in Chen's interview on CNBC he said they are working on something "beyond amazon" for apps. If they want to make a Google phone then the BB10 android RT needs to go and thus amazon with it. So it wouldn't be "beyond amazon", it would be in place of amazon.
    absolutely right! although I would take his wording with a pinch of salt for he may have meant it that way literally... or been panicking and used words in the wrong context...
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    04-29-15 05:25 AM
  7. ubizmo's Avatar
    OP, in Chen's interview on CNBC he said they are working on something "beyond amazon" for apps.
    Notice how he deflected the interviewer's fishing for "something big." Chen just said, "Well...something." He didn't want to commit to something "big". I think a BlackBerry Android phone would be regarded by just about everyone as a "big" development, even if it's a development that some would hate.

    Whatever he was hinting at, I don't think it was a full Android phone. And I don't think Google Play Services for the Android runtime is even on the table.
    04-29-15 07:39 AM
  8. Pcmx's Avatar
    Originally Posted by crmabbitt
    Why you all forget about QNX Hypervisor? (=
    I think we will try it on slider ^^

    Posted via CB10
    That's what I'm hoping for.

    Them replacing the Android Runtime with actual Android using the QNX Hypervisor. So it can run Android side by side while BB10 runs.

    So essentially we'll be using BB10. And any time you want to use an Android app, it'll use Android. Since it'll be a full version of Android, it should include Google Services.

    That way you have the apps of Android. And everything we love of BB10.

    Technically this is damn innovative. So I see this as sorta unlikely. Practically, it won't really make a difference to the user besides "hey I can run Android apps on here!"

    Posted via CB10
    idk what Hypervisor all entails but this is what I would imagine could be a big development and a way to switch between "work to play", enterprise users being consumers as well, esp. if BlackBerry has that ability. Personally, I see a lot of people show an interest or even a lust for BB10 devices but I cannot even fully recommend them to some people who are incredibly app dependent as this is a very important form of communication to them which differs from my own.

    The biggest complaint I hear from those I do hear with BB10 devices and their peers is, "this app I got from Amazon doesn't work," or "they couldn't get the FitBit or something app on their phone so they can't join in on the group.." The suggestion from me is to try installing Snap or Play but unless I can help them with it, many aren't all that inclined at the idea and will just live with the app gap. A full Android running parallel with services might be interesting although questionably usable to me at the least..

    BB10 runtime?

    GestureWhiz?

    I'd still prefer and use BB10! but wouldn't mind a "dual boot" insight into Android, especially if BlackBerry could continue to develop BB10 and get people more interested in it with some more transitioning aides.. and if I could clean or wipe that "Android partition" and leave the QNX one in tact
    04-29-15 08:11 AM
  9. roll2tide's Avatar
    I'm a long time BB user but a novice here on these boards so forgive me if I miss the obvious or anything, please.

    Would BB going to an Android OS not simply relegate BB to an app company? I mean BB doesn't exactly have cutting edge technology in their hardware as far as I know. What BB does have is a unique OS and great security. Cut out the OS and I see no viable way for BB to survive and no reason for anyone to even bother choosing BB.

    Google/Android dominate the consumer market along with Apple/iOS. The one area that neither Android nor iOS have a strong foothold is corporate security. Given BB's ability to split its OS for consumer/Enterprise use does it not make more sense that Google sees advantages to giving BB unprecedented access in return for corporate security penetration? BB and Google could certainly help each other here. Just a thought...

    But my point is that I can't see BB phones simply being a shell for Android. I see no long term sustainable benefit in that for BB.
    04-29-15 09:12 AM
  10. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    Google isn't allowing play store access in exchange for some perceived security panacea from BlackBerry. BlackBerry is losing money on hardware because they don't sell enough phones. BlackBerry doesn't sell enough phones because of the app gap. The only way to kill the app gap is play store access. The only way to get play store access is to meet googles requirements.

    The current situation is untenable. A Google play store certified phone is the only logical way to keep handsets alive.

    Posted via CB10
    04-29-15 09:28 AM
  11. keithhackneysmullet's Avatar
    I'm a long time BB user but a novice here on these boards so forgive me if I miss the obvious or anything, please.

    Would BB going to an Android OS not simply relegate BB to an app company? I mean BB doesn't exactly have cutting edge technology in their hardware as far as I know. What BB does have is a unique OS and great security. Cut out the OS and I see no viable way for BB to survive and no reason for anyone to even bother choosing BB.

    Google/Android dominate the consumer market along with Apple/iOS. The one area that neither Android nor iOS have a strong foothold is corporate security. Given BB's ability to split its OS for consumer/Enterprise use does it not make more sense that Google sees advantages to giving BB unprecedented access in return for corporate security penetration? BB and Google could certainly help each other here. Just a thought...

    But my point is that I can't see BB phones simply being a shell for Android. I see no long term sustainable benefit in that for BB.
    BlackBerry absolutely has cutting-edge hardware. Capacitive keyboards, paratek antennas, the best hardware keyboards around. BlackBerry phone design has always been great especially when you consider how durable they are. The vast majority of hardware manufacturers are using off the shelf parts anyway

    Posted via CB10
    roll2tide likes this.
    04-29-15 09:38 AM
  12. RichardHBB's Avatar
    Don't ask me for sources.
    No worries mate..

    Richard
    04-29-15 09:52 AM
  13. Axacta's Avatar
    That's what I'm hoping for.

    Them replacing the Android Runtime with actual Android using the QNX Hypervisor. So it can run Android side by side while BB10 runs.

    So essentially we'll be using BB10. And any time you want to use an Android app, it'll use Android. Since it'll be a full version of Android, it should include Google Services.

    That way you have the apps of Android. And everything we love of BB10.

    Technically this is damn innovative. So I see this as sorta unlikely. Practically, it won't really make a difference to the user besides "hey I can run Android apps on here!"
    Microsoft is all about incorporating other platform's programs into their own. It is inevitable that eventually Windows phones will be able to dual boot Android. Why not BB? In fact BB could add options for adding Android and Windows OSs. And running them in parallel. If and when these phones begin to appear look for Apple to open their walled garden, and then everything changes.
    04-29-15 10:02 AM
  14. BlackberryFan777's Avatar
    Wrong. Google doesn't allow Play Access unless you load the device with ALL of their apps and services. I believe there is 20-something of them now. They also require access to the usage data from these applications which means good bye security and privacy.

    I do not understand why everyone thinks BlackBerry is going to run Android. Do you think the executives are unaware of Sony (who is contemplating leaving the smartphone market), HTC (whose sales continue to slide), LG (same as HTC), and the coming of the razor-thin margin Chinese manufactures taking over the Android market? You really think that's where they want to go?
    Good points. Margins would have to be very slim, indeed, for BlackBerry to compete with OnePlus and others in offering Android devices.

    I think the problem here is that BlackBerry users are not seeing the direct benefit of using BB10. And, frankly, it is hard for me to grasp that benefit, too, since the other platforms are so similar, but offer the advantages of greater marketshare. Now that iOS is secure enough for 95% or more of what we call "enterprise" even security seems like a difficult mobile differentiator. Can BlackBerry take the advantages of using neutrino, BPS, cascades, and all the other aspects of the BB10 platform and actually make them into a real world benefit for users, the kind of benefit that cannot be easily obtained on other platforms, the kind of advantage that would keep users from choosing Android or iOS, the kind that they just can't live without?

    If there's a chance that BlackBerry can build BB10 into a major mobile platform -- much of the foundation is there, we just need to keep up and provide a differentiator or two -- than Chen should kill the BlackBerry Experience project and make sure his devices never become dime-a-dozen Android devices competing on specs when the leader has a huge economy of scale and manufacturing advantage.

    On the other hand, my Passport is not a great Android experience and if CB people want Android, they'll leave when the BlackBerry Experience comes to Android if Chen doesn't offer them Android.

    Just my thoughts. I agree with everything you said.

    Posted via CB10
    FairlightRacing and bp2k7 like this.
    04-29-15 11:05 AM
  15. Nicholas Mauro's Avatar
    No.

    Posted via CB10
    04-29-15 11:29 AM
  16. ubizmo's Avatar
    Would BB going to an Android OS not simply relegate BB to an app company? I mean BB doesn't exactly have cutting edge technology in their hardware as far as I know. What BB does have is a unique OS and great security. Cut out the OS and I see no viable way for BB to survive and no reason for anyone to even bother choosing BB.
    That great security is in part hardware-based. That is, it's physically baked into ROMs in the device, as I understand it. This prevents rooting exploits during bootup. That kind of hardware-based security is of interest to only a small niche of users, however.

    With cross-platform BBM and BES, BlackBerry is already well on its way to becoming an app company. But BES and BBM (especially BBM Protected) involve more than just apps: There's an infrastructure behind them that makes them work securely. That seems to be the main product that BlackBerry is transitioning to.

    How the BlackBerry Experience will fit into this is still unclear, but it looks like it will be a kind of BB10-like front end for other platforms. Just a guess.
    kirson and roll2tide like this.
    04-29-15 11:39 AM
  17. CharlieV's Avatar
    That great security is in part hardware-based. That is, it's physically baked into ROMs in the device, as I understand it. This prevents rooting exploits during bootup. That kind of hardware-based security is of interest to only a small niche of users, however.

    With cross-platform BBM and BES, BlackBerry is already well on its way to becoming an app company. But BES and BBM (especially BBM Protected) involve more than just apps: There's an infrastructure behind them that makes them work securely. That seems to be the main product that BlackBerry is transitioning to.

    How the BlackBerry Experience will fit into this is still unclear, but it looks like it will be a kind of BB10-like front end for other platforms. Just a guess.
    Well put.
    04-29-15 12:53 PM
  18. LazyEvul's Avatar
    The only caveat here is that, in order to reap the full benefits of Android through Google Play Services, BB10 would likely have to be stripped of the Android runtime or outright discontinued. Unless Google interprets their rules differently or cuts a deal with BlackBerry, BB10's runtime could be interpreted as an Android "fork", which members of the Open Handset Alliance are not allowed to manufacture.

    Without Google Play Services, there's very little reason for BlackBerry to go Android - you're still stuck with the app gap, but now you're on an OS that has a poor reputation for one of your company's core values (security) and you have little control over the code that goes into it, updates, etc. I guess you're saving some development costs (maybe?), but I don't see it helping sales.

    Having said that, if hypothetically BlackBerry did put a skinned Android, with Google Play Services, on the Slider, I would love to give that a go. Contrary to what many believe on these forums, Android really isn't that bad an OS - with a good skin and some great hardware, it's easily enjoyable. We'd have to see whether or not it'd fit my needs as well as BB10 does, but I'm open to the idea.
    04-29-15 06:32 PM
  19. Joao Oliveira's Avatar
    Wrong. Google doesn't allow Play Access unless you load the device with ALL of their apps and services. I believe there is 20-something of them now. They also require access to the usage data from these applications which means good bye security and privacy.

    I do not understand why everyone thinks BlackBerry is going to run Android. Do you think the executives are unaware of Sony (who is contemplating leaving the smartphone market), HTC (whose sales continue to slide), LG (same as HTC), and the coming of the razor-thin margin Chinese manufactures taking over the Android market? You really think that's where they want to go?
    Finally someone with common sense... People in this world think that Android is "FREE"... Well, it's not, android sells advertesing, so to have "full android" in your blackberry, your blackberry should also be another spyware device connected to google ads database, you pay with your [lack] of privacy and giving away your choices and way of life. Wich is the oposite of what Blackberry is all about, wich is Security and Privacy, Google is the oposite...
    Trauma Surgeon likes this.
    04-29-15 06:32 PM
  20. FCSC's Avatar
    Google doesn't allow access to the play store unless the device runs real android. I think BlackBerry wants the app gap to go away and this is the only way to do it. Android moves from emulation to the os and bb10 moves from the os to the skin. BlackBerry Hub, calendar, defender, and keyboard become apps just like bbm.

    Posted via CB10
    how would the keyboard be an app if its a physical keyboard?
    04-29-15 06:33 PM
  21. LazyEvul's Avatar
    Finally someone with common sense... People in this world think that Android is "FREE"... Well, it's not, android sells advertesing, so to have "full android" in your blackberry, your blackberry should also be another spyware device connected to google ads database. Wich is the oposite of what Blackberry is all about, wich is Security and Privacy, Google is the oposite...
    Preloading Google apps does not mean forcing anyone to use them, however. You can still, at the very least, hide them and use one of several alternatives offered on the Google Play Store, or any other Android marketplace. BlackBerry would likely preload their own alternatives as well, from their upcoming BlackBerry Experience Suite.
    04-29-15 06:37 PM
  22. Zeratul57's Avatar
    FOOLS
    04-29-15 08:34 PM
  23. johnny_bravo72's Avatar
    BlackBerry, just make Instagram create a native app for BB10 and all these insinuations about BBRY going Android will stop. )))))))))))))))))))))))))) #imho #lol #yougottabekiddingme #weaintneednoandroid #toomuchweirdhashtags #whocares

    P.S.: Seriously, BB running Android. I haven't heard the seven trumpets of Apocalypse yet...
    You're a consumer. BlackBerry won't listen to you.
    04-29-15 08:52 PM
  24. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    I am starting to believe from the cryptic statements from John Chen and blaze that the Zlider is going to be a full android Google play access phone. It will run the hub and BlackBerry services as a cross platform app. It's going to have samesung bloat ware like chat on and milk music pre-installed. We already know it's going to have a samesung screen and probably exynos processor. Don't ask me for sources. It's just a feeling I have and I want to prepare everyone so we all don't commit hara-kiri when BlackBerry joins the dark side.

    Posted via CB10
    If the Slider runs skinned Android, they'd be preparing it for all BB10 handsets.
    04-29-15 09:51 PM
  25. TooSquare's Avatar
    Security doesn't sell. Apps sell. I don't like it anymore than you do but it's going to happen. BlackBerry will get run out of the enterprise market without Google services. BlackBerry doesn't care about the 0.1% of us that are still buying BlackBerry's. BlackBerry wants the millions of customers who had bolds and curves and moved on to android and ios.

    If BlackBerry could put a enterprise twist on android it could be a game changer

    Posted via CB10
    I agree with this post 100%. BB10 as much as we love it, we have to face the fact that, it will never be able to get the mass that will turn the tide due to the apps. Personally I am not much of an App user, but most are.

    If BB continue to depend on a shrinking number of hardcore users and the Enterprise (which is also shrinking even more rapidly) it will not save them.

    If BB is able to come out with a secured Android device with it's own skin/ flow, they might have a fair chance in getting back many of the ex-users and better yet, attract new users. In my personal opinion, though Android is a tough space to compete, but if BB maintain the QWERTY KB, security features, and well built phones, it might be able to stand out from the rest of the pack who are just making slabs.
    kirson likes this.
    04-29-15 10:54 PM
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