09-07-15 07:07 PM
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  1. TheBirdDog's Avatar
    You think its bad now - wait until the forum starts to fill up with

    • "What are your favourite android apps?"
    • "How do I remove the blackberry experience suite from my Venice?"
    • "Shifted from BB10 to Android Venice and loving it!"


    and long-term members say "take that trash to Android central" and the response is "but it's a blackberry!"
    Looking forward to that!

    However, this thread really isn't about the OS. BB10 could remain as it is or it could disappear altogether. Either way...

    This is about BlackBerry (the company, not the OS) securing Android. If they can successfully secure it on their own device on a more fundamental level than Android has currently then why wouldn't Google want it to become a part of Android, in general?
    samgne likes this.
    09-01-15 09:32 PM
  2. The Big Picture's Avatar
    I really hope that when the slider is launched it actually does come with a "secured" android.

    If they can advertise the fact that's it's a "secured" android the way silent circle does with their blackphone, that would be even better.

    Posted via CB10
    Superfly_FR and ayngling like this.
    09-02-15 02:26 AM
  3. cgk's Avatar

    This is about BlackBerry (the company, not the OS) securing Android. If they can successfully secure it on their own device on a more fundamental level than Android has currently then why wouldn't Google want it to become a part of Android, in general?
    But how do you know that android isn't 'secure enough' for google's purposes? And again it just ignores everything we know about the culture of google - ideologically they believe android is superior in the same way that people here are convinced that bb10 is superior.
    Mecca EL likes this.
    09-02-15 03:14 AM
  4. early2bed's Avatar
    While I'm sure there is plenty of good software engineering talent left at BlackBerry, I seriously doubt they are head and shoulders above their counterparts at Google even if they weren't overwhelmingly out-numbered and out-resourced. I just don't think BlackBerry has cornered the market on security wizardry because it's in their DNA. They don't even have that much Android expertise to begin with.

    Most will accept that BlackBerry probably can implement some kind of BES-level secure communication experience by putting up barriers that are more enterprise-friendly than consumer-friendly. It's a niche that Google probably doesn't mind BlackBerry going after. However, if John Chen continues to imply that BlackBerry has a more secure version of Android then he risks getting cut off from the Google Play ecosystem. I wouldn't be surprised if there will be some severe restrictions on what BlackBerry can claim about securing Android going forward.

    Remember that both Apple and Google have been known to "Sherlock" platform features developed by other companies in their ecosystem. Dropbox is a prime example - a good idea that eventually gets incorporated into the OS. Eventually, any "secure Android" is just going to shortly be Android.
    09-02-15 04:47 AM
  5. The Big Picture's Avatar
    While I'm sure there is plenty of good software engineering talent left at BlackBerry, I seriously doubt they are head and shoulders above their counterparts at Google even if they weren't overwhelmingly out-numbered and out-resourced. I just don't think BlackBerry has cornered the market on security wizardry because it's in their DNA. They don't even have that much Android expertise to begin with.

    Most will accept that BlackBerry probably can implement some kind of BES-level secure communication experience by putting up barriers that are more enterprise-friendly than consumer-friendly. It's a niche that Google probably doesn't mind BlackBerry going after. However, if John Chen continues to imply that BlackBerry has a more secure version of Android then he risks getting cut off from the Google Play ecosystem. I wouldn't be surprised if there will be some severe restrictions on what BlackBerry can claim about securing Android going forward.

    Remember that both Apple and Google have been known to "Sherlock" platform features developed by other companies in their ecosystem. Dropbox is a prime example - a good idea that eventually gets incorporated into the OS. Eventually, any "secure Android" is just going to shortly be Android.
    If silent circle which is a small company can do it why not BlackBerry?

    Posted via CB10
    09-02-15 05:30 AM
  6. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    And if you need an example of how bad Google can be for security you should read up on Stage Fright. The researchers that found the vulnerability, by just looking at the code apparently, sent Google patches. Google applied the patches and released the update apparently without checking the patches very closely. The patches introduced a new bug and vulnerability. Being big and having all the money in the world won't make you secure when security isn't in your corporate culture.

    Z10STL100-3/10.3.2.2252 SR 10.3.2.2168
    09-02-15 08:53 AM
  7. TheBirdDog's Avatar
    While I'm sure there is plenty of good software engineering talent left at BlackBerry, I seriously doubt they are head and shoulders above their counterparts at Google even if they weren't overwhelmingly out-numbered and out-resourced. I just don't think BlackBerry has cornered the market on security wizardry because it's in their DNA. They don't even have that much Android expertise to begin with.

    Most will accept that BlackBerry probably can implement some kind of BES-level secure communication experience by putting up barriers that are more enterprise-friendly than consumer-friendly. It's a niche that Google probably doesn't mind BlackBerry going after. However, if John Chen continues to imply that BlackBerry has a more secure version of Android then he risks getting cut off from the Google Play ecosystem. I wouldn't be surprised if there will be some severe restrictions on what BlackBerry can claim about securing Android going forward.

    Remember that both Apple and Google have been known to "Sherlock" platform features developed by other companies in their ecosystem. Dropbox is a prime example - a good idea that eventually gets incorporated into the OS. Eventually, any "secure Android" is just going to shortly be Android.
    I'm not going to argue with that but I will ask 'how does that happen though?' Any "secure Android" just becoming the standard will mean that the standard, in some capacity will have to change. And, BlackBerry is hopefully cooking up something pretty useful there - yes, speculation but we are all hoping that this Android scenario is as good as it could be on all fronts (most just want the device to be as awesome as possible and I'm there as well!)

    Google is a giant compared to BlackBerry. I'm not suggesting that Google will pay BlackBerry anything to use the QNX kernel since what they are using now is open source and therefore completely free, as I understand it. Licensing BlackBerry as an integral part of Android would probably 'secure' John Chen's great-grandchildren an early retirement. It probably won't happen that way. That isn't to say that it couldn't open other doors though. I believe that Google would likely buy BlackBerry out before they would pay to use their software as they would see it as a better return on their investment rather than another added expense.
    09-02-15 10:45 AM
  8. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    You think its bad now - wait until the forum starts to fill up with

    • "What are your favourite android apps?"
    • "How do I remove the blackberry experience suite from my Venice?"
    • "Shifted from BB10 to Android Venice and loving it!"


    and long-term members say "take that trash to Android central" and the response is "but it's a blackberry!"
    Reminds me of my days on webOSNation.
    09-02-15 11:19 AM
  9. chenageddon's Avatar
    It's one thing to adopt a secure operating system and develop it with security in mind. BlackBerry did that and can rightly claim that they have security in their DNA. It also helps to not show up on the radar of most hackers due to market share.

    However, that does not automatically translate to securing anything else. It's easier to have security practices when you are mostly focused on messaging and enterprise capabilities. However, if you are expanding the APIs to facilitate access to every social network, home automation, car systems, cloud data, etc. and adding fingerprint access and whatever peripherals anybody can dream up, then it's harder to provide security.

    It doesn't automatically mean that BlackBerry can come in and secure another OS. QNX is inherently secure. How does that secure Android? You have a bank vault that is secure. Does that mean you are going to be able to secure my college campus? If so then Wells Fargo should be doing airport security because they have been doing bank vaults and armored cars for more than a century.
    Last edited by chenageddon; 09-02-15 at 12:12 PM.
    Mecca EL likes this.
    09-02-15 11:46 AM
  10. bhoqeem's Avatar
    It's one thing to adopt a secure operating system and develop it with security in mind. BlackBerry did that and can rightly claim that they have security in their DNA. It also helps to not show up on the radar of most hackers due to market share.

    However, that does not automatically translate to securing anything else. It's easier to have security practices when you are mostly focused on messaging and enterprise capabilities. However, if you are expanding the APIs to facilitate access to every social network, home automation, car systems, cloud data, etc. and adding fingerprint access and whatever peripherals anybody can dream up, then it's harder to provide security.

    It doesn't automatically mean that BlackBerry can come in and secure another OS. QNX is inherently secure. How does that secure Android? You have a bank vault that is secure. Does that mean you are going to be able to secure my college campus? If so then Wells Fargo should be doing airport security because they have been doing bank vaults and armored cars for more than a century.
    Nice analogy.

    Z10STL100-4/10.3.2.2639
    09-02-15 12:34 PM
  11. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    It's one thing to adopt a secure operating system and develop it with security in mind. BlackBerry did that and can rightly claim that they have security in their DNA. It also helps to not show up on the radar of most hackers due to market share.

    However, that does not automatically translate to securing anything else. It's easier to have security practices when you are mostly focused on messaging and enterprise capabilities. However, if you are expanding the APIs to facilitate access to every social network, home automation, car systems, cloud data, etc. and adding fingerprint access and whatever peripherals anybody can dream up, then it's harder to provide security.

    It doesn't automatically mean that BlackBerry can come in and secure another OS. QNX is inherently secure. How does that secure Android? You have a bank vault that is secure. Does that mean you are going to be able to secure my college campus? If so then Wells Fargo should be doing airport security because they have been doing bank vaults and armored cars for more than a century.
    In short: it's a good - sorry, mandatory - start.
    Hardware locking, isolation...
    From there one can start to build security.

    And please, don't raise the 'out of the radar' to explain the zero exploit on BlackBerry. Breaking a BES enabled BlackBerry is not only mythical but also probably synonym of huge future revenues for anyone capable of it.
    They just don't want because they (acknowledge/think they) can't.

    Posted via CB10
    09-02-15 03:39 PM
  12. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Still think simple is all Chen can afford right now....
    But maybe he'll surprise us ALL!
    Samsung just announced at IFA they'll invest massively in the IoT in the coming months.
    Chen stated that the partnership was "far beyond Knox alone".
    So, something surprising ?
    Let me put on my rosy glasses for a while at least it gives us something to talk about !
    09-03-15 07:42 AM
  13. chenageddon's Avatar
    Only on CrackBerry can an announcement that doesn't mention BlackBerry at all, be potentially all about BlackBerry.
    AnimalPak200 likes this.
    09-03-15 01:17 PM
  14. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Get used to it
    We do like tea leaves and 8 ball.
    The more we do, the biggest the chance to be right.
    lol


    Posted via CB10
    muciumbe likes this.
    09-03-15 06:24 PM
  15. dusanvn's Avatar
    Replacing the kernel is technically impossible because of the complexity (so, the cost) of the change.

    BlackBerry knows how (and is able) to secure Android is as believable as Google can do so for QNX.

    Running Android atop of QNX is another approach. This would, however, bring zero benefits to Google because for example, QNX + Android is as secure and efficient as Android alone, at most.

    Should BlackBerry and Google take place in an Android joined action, there is only one possibility: a potentially profitable marketing trick. Period.
    chenageddon likes this.
    09-05-15 05:28 AM
  16. chenageddon's Avatar
    OK, well we are still left with our hero technology looking for a purpose. Can anyone think of a way to shoe-horn QNX into Good Technology? John Chen should make them use QNX for something
    09-05-15 08:29 AM
  17. The Big Picture's Avatar
    Replacing the kernel is technically impossible because of the complexity (so, the cost) of the change.

    BlackBerry knows how (and is able) to secure Android is as believable as Google can do so for QNX.

    Running Android atop of QNX is another approach. This would, however, bring zero benefits to Google because for example, QNX + Android is as secure and efficient as Android alone, at most.

    Should BlackBerry and Google take place in an Android joined action, there is only one possibility: a potentially profitable marketing trick. Period.
    http://gizmodo.com/blackphone-2-is-p...tph-1688857610

    So how is Blackphone secure?

    Posted via CB10
    09-05-15 03:08 PM
  18. muciumbe's Avatar
    Blackphone comunications are secured only Blackphone to Blackphone

    Posted via CB10
    09-05-15 03:27 PM
  19. BlackberryFan777's Avatar
    Does anybody happen to know when and how QNX branched from the rest of the UNIX family tree?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...simple.svg.png

    Posted via CB10
    I'm not sure it did. My recollection is that QNX made an RTOS that kind of morphed into Nuetrino. In order to increase their product usefulness to most people, QNX made the OS POSIX complaint, which means it has met a certain compatibility with UNIX. But, if I remember correctly, that was not originally the case.

    If you are trying to reconcile something John Chen said with the truth, you might be on an impossible mission. He could be right, but the guy is a fuddly-duddly and he gets a pass because he hasn't learned to speak English very well after living in the United States for decades. He's super confident while using terrible grammar, saying things that most assuredly discourage BB10 app development and device sales, and being a bit of a know-nothing when it comes to the company he is pretty much destroying in favor of an opportunity to focus everything on EMM/MDM software.

    Just my two cents.

    Posted via CB10
    09-05-15 03:48 PM
  20. BlackberryFan777's Avatar
    I'm not going to argue with that but I will ask 'how does that happen though?' Any "secure Android" just becoming the standard will mean that the standard, in some capacity will have to change. And, BlackBerry is hopefully cooking up something pretty useful there - yes, speculation but we are all hoping that this Android scenario is as good as it could be on all fronts (most just want the device to be as awesome as possible and I'm there as well!)

    Google is a giant compared to BlackBerry. I'm not suggesting that Google will pay BlackBerry anything to use the QNX kernel since what they are using now is open source and therefore completely free, as I understand it. Licensing BlackBerry as an integral part of Android would probably 'secure' John Chen's great-grandchildren an early retirement. It probably won't happen that way. That isn't to say that it couldn't open other doors though. I believe that Google would likely buy BlackBerry out before they would pay to use their software as they would see it as a better return on their investment rather than another added expense.
    Actually, Android as an OS isn't all that profitable. The platform, which includes Play app sales is where Google gets most of its return on investment. That's one of the reasons why we'd like BlackBerry to have its own platform. The money is in the platform.

    Google has ongoing issues about its use of Java. Oracle may eventually want to be compensated for every handset sold, every tablet, every app, etc. This issue arises from time to time and then seems almost resolved and then comes back. So, integrating QNX in Android core would be looked at very carefully by Google's legal department and would probably need approval from the highest levels of approval. Using Java was a decision that may destroy Android.

    Just as an FYI, QNX was open source, albeit not always free as in beer, before BlackBerry bought it and closed the source. Mike L wanted to build it into something truly visionary and awesome. BlackBerry is no longer a company that does visionary and awesome as Chen is now the CEO and he's pretty much as opposed to what made BlackBerry great and also what made BlackBerry hiccup as a person can be.

    Just my thoughts...

    Posted via CB10
    09-05-15 03:59 PM
  21. anon(3993749)'s Avatar
    I'm not sure it did. My recollection is that QNX made an RTOS that kind of morphed into Nuetrino. In order to increase their product usefulness to most people, QNX made the OS POSIX complaint, which means it has met a certain compatibility with UNIX. But, if I remember correctly, that was not originally the case.

    If you are trying to reconcile something John Chen said with the truth, you might be on an impossible mission. He could be right, but the guy is a fuddly-duddly and he gets a pass because he hasn't learned to speak English very well after living in the United States for decades. He's super confident while using terrible grammar, saying things that most assuredly discourage BB10 app development and device sales, and being a bit of a know-nothing when it comes to the company he is pretty much destroying in favor of an opportunity to focus everything on EMM/MDM software.

    Just my two cents.

    Posted via CB10
    I thought I was the only one bothered by this, everyone else here loves the guy. The CEO of an international company headquartered in Canada should master the English language a lot better. It's like listening to a comma separated list of marketing fluff. No subject, no verb, just random keywords. He also needs to learn more about the products he is trying to sell before speaking on live TV. QNX and Android have absolutely nothing in common.

    Posted via CB10
    09-05-15 04:08 PM
  22. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Latest German rumors are interesting, to say the least.
    In short, they pretend GPS could be hosted by BlackBerry instead of Google servers.
    Ah ! This one, I never heard before... and there's so much to discuss about it !
    May tend in favor of stock Android then ...

    Source (thanks to @4realmfreeze) , Google translated.
    https://translate.googleusercontent....WQBMWbYdA6QQmQ


    Posted via CB10
    09-06-15 12:33 PM
  23. dusanvn's Avatar
    Blackphone 2 Is Probably the World's Most Secure Smartphone

    So how is Blackphone secure?

    Posted via CB10
    There're methods (and levels) of security.

    1. Lockdown the system, i.e. turn off features you aren't sure they're secure. [BlackBerry, Android run-time system in BB10].

    2. Implement a security mechanism, e.g. encryption, to secure certain feature. [Silent Cirles, Blackphone].

    3. Debug, i.e. hire security auditors to find holes and hire security experts (better the original authors) to fix the source code [Linux, Android].

    4. Construct it to be secure and hope it is [QNX], better obscure it [BB10].

    5. Construct it to be secure and prove it secure, better don't show proof to anyone [INTEGRITY].

    6. Construct it to be secure, prove it secure, and publish your security proof including the source code for independent verification [L4].

    So, to some extents, Android can be secured, and this has been _done_.
    09-06-15 02:14 PM
  24. evodevo69's Avatar
    I thought I was the only one bothered by this, everyone else here loves the guy. The CEO of an international company headquartered in Canada should master the English language a lot better. It's like listening to a comma separated list of marketing fluff. No subject, no verb, just random keywords. He also needs to learn more about the products he is trying to sell before speaking on live TV. QNX and Android have absolutely nothing in common.

    Posted via CB10
    http://crackberry.com/john-chen-answ...round-strategy

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but this transcription of his interview with Fox sounds like someone who has a stronger command of the language than the majority of native Canadians (ie. That never got a post secondary education).

    Unless you equate accent with one's mastery of a language.

    I hear words, grammar, sentence structure, and expressions - not accents. There are a lot of native Canadians with no accents that speak very poor english...

    Posted via CB10
    09-07-15 04:57 PM
  25. anon(3993749)'s Avatar
    http://crackberry.com/john-chen-answ...round-strategy

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but this transcription of his interview with Fox sounds like someone who has a stronger command of the language than the majority of native Canadians (ie. That never got a post secondary education).

    Unless you equate accent with one's mastery of a language.

    I hear words, grammar, sentence structure, and expressions - not accents. There are a lot of native Canadians with no accents that speak very poor english...

    Posted via CB10
    No, I'm not talking about his accent. Accents are totally acceptable in today's world.

    And that is not a transcript, there is no actual recording from what I can see. My guess is that Fox emailed BlackBerry the questions and Chen consulted with his marketing and PR people to craft some very well worded answers. Nobody talks like that, no matter how good they are with words. Watch a few actual videos and you will see what I'm talking about.

    Posted via CB10
    09-07-15 07:07 PM
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