[dejanh]

An article from Venture Beat summarizes the situation pretty well.

BlackBerry needs a miracle to meet its annual handset sales goal | VentureBeat | Mobile | by Evan Blass

There is not much hope for the HW division based on the current outlook of things.

[Rello]

Honestly, they are probably right, but it's still a great sign that a month of sales raised the ASP from 240 to over 300. That could go a long way towards making them profitable.

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[meltbox360]

On one hand they need a miracle... but who said they'll close up shop now? They're making progress. At the very least the Priv improving things will keep the hw division churning stuff out a little longer. I agree that the Priv and Vienna won't be what saves them though. They need an all touch. Really need one.

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[yohannrjm]

I also doubt that they'll hit their 5M devices mark unless the Priv really sells like hot cakes once more carriers get their hands on it.

However, as has already been said, their margin on the Priv may be big enough to not need so many devices sold. I think that if the response is good enough, they'll stick around in the hardware business. The reviews of the phone are great and a lot of users have been praising the thing too (there are still some horror stories, of course). This could help build some momentum for BlackBerry Android devices.

We'll see, but my guess is that even if they don't hit the 5M mark, they'll still keep hardware going......as long as the response is positive enough to justify it. I think they're still looking for the right balance of form-factor and price. The Priv doesn't hit the price sweet-spot and the Vienna will not be what the 'masses' want. I don't blame them for not starting out in the all-touch Android world though - it's too hard to stick out there.

[TGIS]

I also doubt that they'll hit their 5M devices mark unless the Priv really sells like hot cakes once more carriers get their hands on it.

However, as has already been said, their margin on the Priv may be big enough to not need so many devices sold. I think that if the response is good enough, they'll stick around in the hardware business. The reviews of the phone are great and a lot of users have been praising the thing too (there are still some horror stories, of course). This could help build some momentum for BlackBerry Android devices.

We'll see, but my guess is that even if they don't hit the 5M mark, they'll still keep hardware going......as long as the response is positive enough to justify it. I think they're still looking for the right balance of form-factor and price. The Priv doesn't hit the price sweet-spot and the Vienna will not be what the 'masses' want. I don't blame them for not starting out in the all-touch Android world though - it's too hard to stick out there.

There's a good chance that will happen. Only a few carriers supported so far. There's only a few countries it's available in. Yet in only a month, BlackBerry managed to sell 100-250k privs, based on calculations in I support bbry and buy shares thread. That's amazing for a struggling company. And even though BlackBerry's hardware division still lost money this q, it made more revenue than the last one because of the higher ASP.

'it all started with the  Priv...then the Vienna?'

[RECOOL]

should'nt of ignored the million- 2 bb10 users you had.. Every number counts.

[anon(2325196)]

They're doing great. The PRIV will have an impact. Maybe even a chimpact or pimpact.

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[Happy_Tramp]

I didn't even click on it and have no idea what the article said nor do I care.

I find this is always the best way to form a rational opinion.

[missing_K-W]

I think we should wait for a solid 3 months of sales with full global availability. Just reading drivel otherwise.

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[buwee]

I think we should wait for a solid 3 months of sales with full global availability. Just reading drivel otherwise.

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That's what I'm going to wait for, reading all these analysts, tech reviewers, stock broker houses is all speculation, and plenty of biased opinions. People who have shorted the stock NEED to generate some bad news and doubt to try and bring the stock price down to save their shirt. For all I know, all of BB's hardware including the Priv could be a big flop and could mark the end of the hardware division but until then it is just guessing and innuendo.

Fanboi's of other platforms like to rush to this forum whenever they can dig up any little bit of bad news and I myself, good or bad refuse to click on any of the articles. I'll just wait patiently for the official numbers & not that it effects me a great deal as I only have about 2000 shares of BB stock which I bought when it was around $7.50 (Canadian) and if they pack it in with hardware I'll move on - it's just a phone and I rarely keep using the same phone for more than about 6 months anyway.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I think we should wait for a solid 3 months of sales with full global availability. Just reading drivel otherwise.

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To see those results, will have to wait till the first quarter of fiscal 2017.... in JUNE.

Because full global availability isn't going to come until sometime in February, the end of next quarter. Feb is still the date for Verizon, maybe T-Mobile... along with many other global markets. (pretty sure it's all part of a plan)

But by then the PRIV will be old news, and a whole new batch of devices from other OEMs will redefine what a Android Flagship phone is. The PRIV will already be coming down from it's launch sales highs. And by Feb I expect to see BB10 sales really falter as it becomes more clear that BB10 is part of BlackBerry's history. Probable see the BB10 line up consolidated - if any of them are even in production anymore. Thus sales number will continue to fall well below the projected 5 million mark.

But then by Feb we will probable be talking about the Vienna (or some other new cheaper Android device), It's kinda been hinted that the next BlackBerry will be a more mainstream device with a much lower price point... so many will look to it to become the multi million unit device. But again it will take several quarters to globally release it....

But no, this time next year.... BlackBerry won't have sold 5 million phones. But maybe he doesn't really have to.......

[Ecm]

Closed for review.

[Ecm]

[WARN]Discuss or debate the topic, not each other. Don't get personal.[/WARN]

The off-topic comments (and where they were quoted) have been deleted.

[crucial bbq]

It is still too early to call it and Chen has one more quarter to go (towards that 5M mark). However, here are some things to think about:

1. The global rollout will result in more sales, but how much more? Unless one is on a CDMA network like Verizon, many still have/had the option to purchase through one of the Shop BlackBerry's, Car Phone Warehouse, Amazon, Wal-Mart, and a few other e-commerce sites. It's possible that outside of Verizon the bulk of the sales may have come to past. Or not. Some may be waiting until they can actually see one in person before buying; some may be waiting for M (don't know why this is such a big deal to some, but it seems to be. I mean, who cares if you are on Lollipop for a month or two?); some may be waiting for the price to drop; if you are in the U.S., perhaps you plan to use your tax return; and so on. However, these only apply to those who already know of the Priv. To the overwhelming majority of the world's population the Priv is still an unknown option.

To hit that 5M mark is going to rely on continued and aggressive advertising and sales reps who have reason to push the device.

2. It's going to be slow for awhile. BlackBerry needs to rebuild the brand and image before they can start profiting from hardware again. Anyone who thinks that will happen by the end of fiscal 2016 (it ends in what, Feb. 2016?) is nuts. The main focus for calendar 2016 needs to be changing public perception and nothing else. Chen also needs to step down as the voice of BlackBerry, seriously. That guy does more harm then good when ever speaking in public. Where is Wilson? I mean, Mark Wilson is their Chief Evangelicalist and as such it is his job to promote the brand.

3. Chen is not going to exit hardware anytime during 2016, or likely not even during 2017. For one, he has been saying this since early in 2014 and it has yet to happen despite declining sales quarter after quarter. Under Chen's watch, total number of BlackBerry users dropped by over 50%. If he was going to kill hardware he would have done it by now.

4. Everyone, including BlackBerry, seems to be talking about the Priv and Android on BlackBerry as if the Priv is going to be their one and only Powered by Android device. I mean, when ever asked about Android, features, etc. the answers always relate back to the Priv. It is possible to discuss what they hope to accomplish with Android without mention of the Priv, you know. Even if this is the case they need to stop it. The Vienna needs to be released sooner rather than later and we need rumors of a "Priv 2" to start flying by early 2016. This goes back to changing their image and brand. Because no one at BlackBerry, or even CrackBerry for that matter, talks about anything relating to the future, as it stands the Priv is seen as the hail mary pass at best and soon to be seen as a one-trick pony at worst. I am going to ask once again; is being tight-lipped and/or modest a Canadian thing? BlackBerry needs to change that; they need to get people talking about future devices as that will indicate confidence by BlackBerry; it will show that they are dedicated to hardware; and it will help boost consumer confidence--who are way more important right now than shareholders.

[crucial bbq]

Probable see the BB10 line up consolidated - if any of them are even in production anymore.

As an aside, a few members over in the Classic forum claim to have recently purchased Classics with a build date of 10/25/2015. I may have that day wrong, but take it for you will.

[xxjavaxx2001]

They are releasing the phone here in the middle east which is a BlackBerry stronghold. Sales would definitely pick up here.

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[blackberrybrad]

As an aside, a few members over in the Classic forum claim to have recently purchased Classics with a build date of 10/25/2015. I may have that day wrong, but take it for you will.

I can confirm that my Blue Classic was built on that date. It is the code on the side of the box.

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[sentimentGX4]

I'm fairly confident that number accounted for midrange and possible lower end Android devices as well. Not just the 700 USD PRIV. So, despite the huge deficit, it's a little less big than implied.

[mithrazor]

Wait for more carriers to offer it. Shop BlackBerry was out of stock for majority of November.

BlackBerry has always been a slow but steady type of seller.

Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android

[Blacklatino]

Always a good sign when sales are still happening inspite of minimal marketing. I'm still waiting for the Marshmallow OS updates before I consider getting a couple of Sliders.

[Troy Tiscareno]

As an aside, a few members over in the Classic forum claim to have recently purchased Classics with a build date of 10/25/2015. I may have that day wrong, but take it for you will.

As has been explained many, many times, the dates on the boxes are merely the packaging date.

When BB orders phones from a contract manufacturer, those phones are bulk-packed and shipped to BB warehouses. When BB gets actual orders for phones from a distributor, they will (if necessary) flash the phones to the latest OS version and package the phone in the latest appropriate packing materials for that order (in some cases, boxes branded with the carrier's name, etc.). They then ship out the order. 6 months later, the same distributer may put in another order for the same phones, and the process is repeated - but if there has been changes to the artwork on the boxes, or the inserts, or a significant OS update, the phones will be flashed and packaged with the latest materials.

Until they are packaged, though, the phones sit in the warehouse, not in a retail box but in bulk packaging, waiting for orders. This kind of thing is VERY common in the manufacturing world for products with a long shelf life.

The Classic's production run ended long ago, and while this doesn't prevent BB from ordering another run, it's very unlikely that they will - or will need to. They'll be more concerned about selling off their existing stocks than about running out of them. Bottom line: the date on the box is not the date the hardware came off the production line, but rather the date the phone was packaged in retail packaging for delivery to a distributor.

[crucial bbq]

As has been explained many, many times, the dates on the boxes are merely the packaging date.

When BB orders phones from a contract manufacturer, those phones are bulk-packed and shipped to BB warehouses. When BB gets actual orders for phones from a distributor, they will (if necessary) flash the phones to the latest OS version and package the phone in the latest appropriate packing materials for that order (in some cases, boxes branded with the carrier's name, etc.). They then ship out the order. 6 months later, the same distributer may put in another order for the same phones, and the process is repeated - but if there has been changes to the artwork on the boxes, or the inserts, or a significant OS update, the phones will be flashed and packaged with the latest materials.

Until they are packaged, though, the phones sit in the warehouse, not in a retail box but in bulk packaging, waiting for orders. This kind of thing is VERY common in the manufacturing world for products with a long shelf life.

The Classic's production run ended long ago, and while this doesn't prevent BB from ordering another run, it's very unlikely that they will - or will need to. They'll be more concerned about selling off their existing stocks than about running out of them. Bottom line: the date on the box is not the date the hardware came off the production line, but rather the date the phone was packaged in retail packaging for delivery to a distributor.

Well, that's a bummer. I can assure you this is the first I have read of it. At the very least one can find the manufacturing date through the IMEI number.

[KemKev]

I'm fairly confident that number accounted for midrange and possible lower end Android devices as well. Not just the 700 USD PRIV. So, despite the huge deficit, it's a little less big than implied.

Ah, I should borrow that

[zipro]

If Chen was serious about quitting the hardware business if they don't meet the 5 million target, I believe the Priv is Blackberry's last handset. I doubt it's selling better than the Passport.

I wouldn't expect too much from the international rollout, either. They're not selling in Europe, as far as I can tell and they're too expensive for India and China.

[BlackberryFan777]

An article from Venture Beat summarizes the situation pretty well.

BlackBerry needs a miracle to meet its annual handset sales goal | VentureBeat | Mobile | by Evan Blass

There is not much hope for the HW division based on the current outlook of things.

Well, devices amount to 40% of revenue and, maybe, about 70% if you count service fees for BBOS devices. Given this is the first quarter in which revenue hasn't declined, it's hard to imagine Chen shuttering hardware. Is he a bad CEO? Certainly. He might be the worst working in tech at this level today. But, going forward as a software company right now would mean his turnaround just involved shrinking BlackBerry to the point of relative insignificance.

Let me be clear: Almost every handset manufacturer you've heard of makes devices at a loss these days. BlackBerry has far more reason to do so than the others.

The main problem for BlackBerry fans going forward is that Chen has demolished the company's ability to differentiate itself as a platform. There's simply too little of what made us love BlackBerry in Chen phones and too much of what us love BlackBerry in iOS. The Priv isn't really a BlackBerry and there's only three reasons to buy one (1) brand loyalty to the business rather than the platform, (2) physical keyboard, and (3) your Nexus 6p is backordered and you want something to use until arrives.

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