09-25-16 02:21 AM
31 12
tools
  1. mithrazor's Avatar
    Keep brightness at 0-10%.

    You're welcome.

    Also keep a minimal number of apps installed. And clear recent apps. I've found the apps in the recent apps page tend to have processes still running.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    Attached Thumbnails Figured out how people get 4+ hours of SOT-133775.jpg  
    loadafreak likes this.
    09-19-16 12:26 AM
  2. Drenegade's Avatar
    Groundbreaking information, OP. Much thanks. You're a savior to all.

    Posted via CB10
    Wezard, tigrute, awus and 5 others like this.
    09-19-16 12:27 AM
  3. mithrazor's Avatar
    Also I had brightness on 50% for about 20-30 of those SOT minutes

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    09-19-16 12:27 AM
  4. mithrazor's Avatar
    Groundbreaking information, OP. Much thanks. You're a savior to all.

    Posted via CB10
    Doing what I can. Hang up my name on your wall with a candle in front of it if you really want to thank me

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    09-19-16 12:28 AM
  5. Mirko935's Avatar
    Keep brightness at 0-10%.

    You're welcome.

    Also keep a minimal number of apps installed. And clear recent apps. I've found the apps in the recent apps page tend to have processes still running.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    Good apps have minimal background processes, you never have to clear recent apps. It can actually worsen your battery life.

    Take a look in this topic: http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...-doze-1084898/
    I can get it to 6 hours easily by making a profile with somewhat reduced brightness in Velis Auto Brightness. Not 0-10 % since it would be unusable outdoors, but overall a few percent lower than usual. I noticed that a maximum of 180-200 out of 256 is bright enough for it to be readable in direct sunlight.
    Those 6 h SOT are without any gaming and such stuff, only web-browsing, messaging, a bit camera usage, things like that. Games would, naturally, bring it down.
    09-19-16 02:40 AM
  6. mfk2901's Avatar
    I get easily 6+ hrs of sot with at least 50% brightness all day long. Now if I install a lot of apps that number goes down to ~5:30hrs sot. So I only keep the necessary apps installed and delete what I never or rarely use.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    Attached Thumbnails Figured out how people get 4+ hours of SOT-3598.jpg  
    09-19-16 03:16 AM
  7. Wezard's Avatar
    you never have to clear recent apps. It can actually worsen your battery life.
    Clearing recent apps is not the same as killing them, you should always clear the app when you are finished with it.
    09-19-16 07:11 AM
  8. Mirko935's Avatar
    Clearing recent apps is not the same as killing them, you should always clear the app when you are finished with it.
    What do you mean by that? "Finished with it" in what way?

    It's not the same as "Force stopping" it since it does auto-restart if it's cleared from recents (at least the services do), but it does get closed.
    09-19-16 08:20 AM
  9. BriniaSona's Avatar
    Nope, I dislike my brightness up high at all, except when I need to watch youtube or gifs. I don't like lying in bed and being Flash-Banged because my phone was at 60% brightness and my eyes were adjusted to the dark.

    I still get 2h SoT with the brightness at 0. Something in the background is keeping my phone awake and active.

    This morning I woke up to a dead phone. It's not the SoT or how much I use it. Something is in the background chewing battery.


    EDIT: Phone just turned on. It was Mdiaserver that kept it awake and active. I don't know what that is, but I don't like it.
    Last edited by BriniaSona; 09-19-16 at 09:11 AM.
    09-19-16 08:59 AM
  10. Wezard's Avatar
    What do you mean by that? "Finished with it" in what way?
    When you are done using it, as in when you finish browsing, close your web browser. Tap the square on the bottom right, then either tap the 'X' in the app box, or tap clear all.
    And no, it's not like killing it, it's still doing whatever it's supposed to be doing in the background, as Android is designed to do.
    09-19-16 10:09 AM
  11. Mirko935's Avatar
    When you are done using it, as in when you finish browsing, close your web browser. Tap the square on the bottom right, then either tap the 'X' in the app box, or tap clear all.
    And no, it's not like killing it, it's still doing whatever it's supposed to be doing in the background, as Android is designed to do.
    Android was in fact designed so that no manual app closing is ever necessary. It closes apps on its own when there's a need, and having apps in "Recent apps" can help you get around faster when you want to use an app again without having to search for it in the app drawer or somewhere.

    I like the option of opening the browser instantly, and closing it from "Recent apps" does indeed close it and when you tap it later it has to start from scratch instead of just coming to the foreground.

    And clearing all is definitely something that shouldn't be used ever under normal circumstances. I guess that function is there only for those situations when something is bothering you and slowing your device down and you have no clue what it is.
    09-19-16 10:24 AM
  12. evodevo69's Avatar
    Android was in fact designed so that no manual app closing is ever necessary. It closes apps on its own when there's a need, and having apps in "Recent apps" can help you get around faster when you want to use an app again without having to search for it in the app drawer or somewhere.

    I like the option of opening the browser instantly, and closing it from "Recent apps" does indeed close it and when you tap it later it has to start from scratch instead of just coming to the foreground.

    And clearing all is definitely something that shouldn't be used ever under normal circumstances. I guess that function is there only for those situations when something is bothering you and slowing your device down and you have no clue what it is.
    Are you sure about that?

    Why do lag tests always open all the apps possible and then see how the phone performs?



    #whatisclassic
    09-19-16 03:08 PM
  13. mithrazor's Avatar
    Android was in fact designed so that no manual app closing is ever necessary. It closes apps on its own when there's a need, and having apps in "Recent apps" can help you get around faster when you want to use an app again without having to search for it in the app drawer or somewhere.

    I like the option of opening the browser instantly, and closing it from "Recent apps" does indeed close it and when you tap it later it has to start from scratch instead of just coming to the foreground.

    And clearing all is definitely something that shouldn't be used ever under normal circumstances. I guess that function is there only for those situations when something is bothering you and slowing your device down and you have no clue what it is.
    A lot of this is so wrong. If you want to use the app later then you're not "finished" with it.

    Also I use OS Monitor to see what processes are active and using the CPU. And there are apps from the recent apps list that will continue being active for whatever reason. Notably Snapchat. So yes, clear out the recent apps so these processes aren't activated arbitrarily.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    09-19-16 04:41 PM
  14. Wezard's Avatar
    If you know you will be using the browser again in 15 or 20 minutes,and can't wait for the extra 1/10 of a second for it to open, then by all means leave it open.
    But if you've got several apps open, not being used, that little 808 is working for nothing, and using more battery than it should. Then when you ask it to actually do something for you, on top of your open but unused apps, it has to work it's little behind off, and starts getting hot.
    Close your unused apps!
    09-19-16 09:02 PM
  15. bluetroll's Avatar
    If you know you will be using the browser again in 15 or 20 minutes,and can't wait for the extra 1/10 of a second for it to open, then by all means leave it open.
    But if you've got several apps open, not being used, that little 808 is working for nothing, and using more battery than it should. Then when you ask it to actually do something for you, on top of your open but unused apps, it has to work it's little behind off, and starts getting hot.
    Close your unused apps!
    I didn't actually know that it affected battery life.

    I never close the recent apps. I guess I'll try closing them and see if there is improvement on battery drain.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    09-19-16 10:01 PM
  16. Mirko935's Avatar
    Are you sure about that?

    Why do lag tests always open all the apps possible and then see how the phone performs?

    #whatisclassic
    I'm not sure what lag tests do you mean?

    A lot of this is so wrong. If you want to use the app later then you're not "finished" with it.

    Also I use OS Monitor to see what processes are active and using the CPU. And there are apps from the recent apps list that will continue being active for whatever reason. Notably Snapchat. So yes, clear out the recent apps so these processes aren't activated arbitrarily.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    So, there's a situation when you know you'll never use the browser on your phone again? Interesting...

    Snapchat runs as a service. It has to run. You can force close it through Settings > Apps

    If you know you will be using the browser again in 15 or 20 minutes,and can't wait for the extra 1/10 of a second for it to open, then by all means leave it open.
    But if you've got several apps open, not being used, that little 808 is working for nothing, and using more battery than it should. Then when you ask it to actually do something for you, on top of your open but unused apps, it has to work it's little behind off, and starts getting hot.
    Close your unused apps!
    That little 808 is doing nothing when an app is in the background. Except in the rare case of poorly written apps, as discussed in several other threads. Normal apps just save a bit of their state when onPause is called (when you put it in the background) and it's called on again with onResume when going back to the foreground. All active processes are supposed to be halted when pausing an activity.

    Btw, VP of Engineering for Android disagrees with you. If my words don't mean anything to you, at least read what he has to say. I guess he knows a thing or two about what he's talking about:
    Closing Apps to Save Your Battery Only Makes Things Worse | WIRED

    Hiroshi Lockheimer (on Twitter)
    "same [as iOS]; system is optimized for managing what's running, messing with that just causes more thrash"
    "in general better to let the system do its job; it was designed to manage running apps so you don't have to"
    "could very slightly worsen [the battery life] unless you and algorithm are ONE (you kill something, system wants it back etc)"

    Again, Android is designed with memory and process management in mind so you never need to do anything related to active apps, activities, whatever.
    vpblaze likes this.
    09-20-16 02:47 AM
  17. Wezard's Avatar
    Maybe I, (we) need to be clear on our terminology, I have been guilty of saying close, when what I really mean is clear.
    When you clear an app on your recents screen, you are not really closing it, you are telling Android that you are no longer using it. So Android then knows it can shut the shut the app down if it needs to. If it's an often and recently used app, Android will shut it down last, and only if it needs to. Android knows what it's doing, but it doesn't know what you are doing.

    To my knowledge, the only way to close an app is by going into the settings - thats not a good idea,(for most apps).
    What I should have ended my post with is
    Clear your unused apps! - That way Android will know you aren't using them.
    09-20-16 06:08 AM
  18. Mirko935's Avatar
    Maybe I, (we) need to be clear on our terminology, I have been guilty of saying close, when what I really mean is clear.
    When you clear an app on your recents screen, you are not really closing it, you are telling Android that you are no longer using it. So Android then knows it can shut the shut the app down if it needs to. If it's an often and recently used app, Android will shut it down last, and only if it needs to. Android knows what it's doing, but it doesn't know what you are doing.

    To my knowledge, the only way to close an app is by going into the settings - thats not a good idea,(for most apps).
    What I should have ended my post with is
    Clear your unused apps! - That way Android will know you aren't using them.
    NHF, but you're wrong. Swiping apps from Recent Apps really does close them, unless they're services. Try opening e.g. Chrome, press Home, go to App Drawer and open it again. Then try swiping it from Recents and then open it. It will restart which means it was closed by swiping from Recents. Or even Hub, which does run as a service, but when you swipe it it closes (I guess) everything except for the service part because of push email etc.

    There is really no point in closing apps manually, you're just wasting your time. Some by swiping them and thinking about that and some more when you have to relaunch an app that could just as well have stayed opened waiting for you to bring it to the foreground again.
    09-20-16 06:53 AM
  19. Wezard's Avatar
    Not a lot of time, but I did some research, and I'm now willing to concede you might be right. Seems to be plenty of knowledgeable people on both sides of the isle. Lockheimer may be an expert, but when he uses the word kill in a two line tweet, I can't take it seriously, he's obviously talking off the cuff and not being clear.

    When I switched to Android last year, I also did research, and was finding about 85% of those that should know saying clear your apps, now it seems more like 50 /50.

    I did try opening several apps, not clearing them, then 're-opening' them, can't tell the difference. If more than 4 are open, it becomes hard to tell which is which and switch back and forth, (part of that is age and old eyes, good eyes might be able to do 8 or 10).
    BTW, Chrome is disabled, too slow, and I try to avoid anything Google, (yeah, I know, my phone basically IS Google). I use Opera.
    09-20-16 08:18 AM
  20. Mirko935's Avatar
    I switched to Android 5 years ago, and even then there was the very same debate. I don't believe it'll ever end.

    Simply put, leaving apps in RAM consumes no power. Every bit of a RAM has to be refreshed periodically regardless of its content and processes requiring CPU power should be stopped in the onPause method.
    What does consume more power is launching an app from scratch instead of just resuming its activity. That's why you might actually have a bit worse battery life if you are constantly closing apps.

    I currently have 56 apps in Recents and you complain about 4? Most of the time I don't even launch apps from homescreen or app drawer, I know when I last used it so I pretty much use Recents for that. If it remained in RAM it opens instantly, if not I wait a few seconds till it launches. Either way it's a bit faster than closing them and then searching for them later.

    Btw, my phone has been up for 14 days and 1 hour, I obviously don't clear apps, and it runs great, no slowdowns, freezes or anything.
    FF22 likes this.
    09-20-16 10:07 AM
  21. Wezard's Avatar
    OK, we're speaking different languages again. Clearing an app from the recents screen doesn't close the app, it gets it off the screen and allows Android to move it higher on 'apps that can be closed if need be' list.
    Which is what I've been trying to say all along, except I keep falling into the trap of saying "close".
    My understanding is that if an app is in the recent list, Android will avoid closing it, or using that memory, till it has no choice. Even to to the point of possibly degrading performance, because Android thinks you will be using it again any minute. When forced to, Android will start closing apps in the recents list, according to some algorithm that takes into account, - the fact that it is in the list, - how long since it was last used, - how often it gets used.

    The true bottom line is, either way, the damn thing is faster than me.
    mithrazor likes this.
    09-20-16 05:25 PM
  22. Mirko935's Avatar
    OK, we're speaking different languages again. Clearing an app from the recents screen doesn't close the app, it gets it off the screen and allows Android to move it higher on 'apps that can be closed if need be' list.
    Which is what I've been trying to say all along, except I keep falling into the trap of saying "close".
    My understanding is that if an app is in the recent list, Android will avoid closing it, or using that memory, till it has no choice. Even to to the point of possibly degrading performance, because Android thinks you will be using it again any minute. When forced to, Android will start closing apps in the recents list, according to some algorithm that takes into account, - the fact that it is in the list, - how long since it was last used, - how often it gets used.

    The true bottom line is, either way, the damn thing is faster than me.
    I don't mean to sound arrogant, but we're speaking different languages because you got it a bit wrong.

    I'm not sure what are your sources, but swiping an app or tapping on X in Recents closes it immediately. The exact functionality of that screen changed throughout the years, so I'm not sure if doing that sends a "kill" command (I think not) or it closes it more peacefully in Marshmallow, but it does get closed. Logcat would probably show exactly what happens.

    But I did try with several apps. Normal apps just close, for instance your Opera (I despise Chrome as well ), Calculator (try that, if you swipe it when you return to it there is no result), Instagram etc., while in the case of processes that are also services it closes them, but the service remains, e.g. WhatsApp, Hub, I also tried AirMore (the service, i.e. the connection to the PC remains active, but upon launching the program it shows the Loading screen as it apparently has to relaunch its UI etc.)

    No, Android won't avoid closing your programs because they're in the Recents, I'm not sure where did you get that info. It closes them according to their priorities, status, RAM and CPU consumption etc. I'd have to revise my knowledge a bit about that. Google "Android OOM levels", "parameters" or something like that and you should find some info.
    09-21-16 03:02 AM
  23. vpblaze's Avatar
    I didn't actually know that it affected battery life.

    I never close the recent apps. I guess I'll try closing them and see if there is improvement on battery drain.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    I don't see how closing the recent apps can really effect battery life.
    I close only once a day, before bed for the night.
    I still get 5-6 hours SOT.
    I think it comes down to not having power hungry apps, keeping the brightness at a reasonable level, etc.
    09-21-16 07:43 AM
  24. aespix's Avatar
    I always get over 4 hours SOT. The priv has a huge battery.

    Should be giving atleast 5.

    So they messed up there.

    But yeah. Android is a battery killer. The cpus etc are very efficient these days but if you have a killer OS operating there's not much you can do.

    Posted from my BlackBerry Priv powered by Blackdroid
    09-21-16 08:36 AM
  25. Mirko935's Avatar
    I don't see how closing the recent apps can really effect battery life.
    I close only once a day, before bed for the night.
    I still get 5-6 hours SOT.
    I think it comes down to not having power hungry apps, keeping the brightness at a reasonable level, etc.
    It can affect it a little bit.

    First case when closing can have a positive effect is if there are apps that consume power while in the background I doubt there are many such bad apps nowadays.

    Second case, which is more likely, is that closing can affect the battery life negatively if the phone has to relaunch an app that could have remained in RAM. As i said earlier, RAM always consumes the same amount of power, but when you launch an app from scratch it has to read the NAND and the CPU has to process the data in order to open it. Both of those activities consume power. If aside from that the app also has to fetch some data from the internet there would be a larger difference.
    Especially bad case would be having a task killer that kills everything, including services, because those would relaunch immediately and the whole process just wastes battery.

    Yes, power hungry apps and brightness have the largest inflence on battery life. Since I made a brighter brightness profile in Velis I get around 5 hours, while with a more conservative one I had around 6 h SOT with 10-15 % battery left.

    I always get over 4 hours SOT. The priv has a huge battery.

    Should be giving atleast 5.

    So they messed up there.

    But yeah. Android is a battery killer. The cpus etc are very efficient these days but if you have a killer OS operating there's not much you can do.

    Posted from my BlackBerry Priv powered by Blackdroid
    I think it's not so much about Android as it is about power-hungry high-end Snapdragons. Take a look in this review under Power Consumption: BlackBerry Priv Smartphone Review - NotebookCheck.net Reviews
    vpblaze likes this.
    09-21-16 09:05 AM
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