[KR2013]

I kind of agree that perhaps no device would have been able to change BB10's faith. Now, assuming BlackBerry goes Android (say, Android with BB10 skin), the real question will then be which type of BB phone will have better chance of success - Passport, Classic, a regular full touch, a Slider, or ...? And, by success, I don't mean a couple million BlackBerry die-hards buying the phone. I am talking a more general mass appeal.

[cbvinh]

I kind of agree that perhaps no device would have been able to change BB10's faith. Now, assuming BlackBerry goes Android (say, Android with BB10 skin), the real question will then be which type of BB phone will have better chance of success - Passport, Classic, a regular full touch, a Slider, or ...? And, by success, I don't mean a couple million BlackBerry die-hards buying the phone. I am talking a more general mass appeal.

If it'll be Android, regular full touch because that will be compatible with the most apps, which is the point of going Android in the first place. The Slider would have the next appeal, for those wanting keyboards. Passport and Classic wouldn't have much appeal, again due to app compatibility. Full touch, head to head, against the competition would be a fail unless BlackBerry does offer something special, which right now, security isn't it, because general consumers could care less about it. (It's an accepted way-of-life that privacy and security are gone.) So, without that "something special", a Slider is the best differentiator.

[KR2013]

...1 touch low end, 1 pkb low end, 1 pkb and 1 vkb high end, and one crazy experiment device.

I sent my last post before seeing yours. Perhaps that's the answer to my question: one of each!

[KR2013]

If it'll be Android, regular full touch because that will be compatible with the most apps, which is the point of going Android in the first place. The Slider would have the next appeal, for those wanting keyboards. Passport and Classic wouldn't have much appeal, again due to app compatibility. Full touch, head to head, against the competition would be a fail unless BlackBerry does offer something special, which right now, security isn't it, because general consumers could care less about it. (It's an accepted way-of-life that privacy and security are gone.) So, without that "something special", a Slider is the best differentiator.

Makes sense, but I only have one issue with the Slider - it may still remind people of the old BlackBerry.

[John Vieira]

If it'll be Android, regular full touch because that will be compatible with the most apps, which is the point of going Android in the first place. The Slider would have the next appeal, for those wanting keyboards. Passport and Classic wouldn't have much appeal, again due to app compatibility. Full touch, head to head, against the competition would be a fail unless BlackBerry does offer something special, which right now, security isn't it, because general consumers could care less about it. (It's an accepted way-of-life that privacy and security are gone.) So, without that "something special", a Slider is the best differentiator.

Yes. BUT.

We know Blackberry can't compete with other OEMs in price vs. Hardware.

Chinese oems can pump out sub 100 dollars android phones that are actually decent.

Blackberry couldn't even put out the leap for 200 bucks.

I think even if it runs android, they should stick to what I said earlier, maybe drop the low end devices? They can't make low end android, just doesn't work.

I think one vkb and one pkb, along with one crazy device once in a while.

I do think the Passport with android would be great. I wouldn't buy one, but I'd certainly be interested.

However, I don't want skinned android. If I'm going android, I'm going to root it and install cyanogenmod anyway.

A blackberry android device will lag, have a Crappy launcher, and we probably won't even be able to flash it with something else. Literally making blackberry devices worse, and removing any advantage that android has.

FML

[cbvinh]

Makes sense, but I only have one issue with the Slider - it may still remind people of the old BlackBerry.

At this point, they could produce a full slab and disappear in the crowd or make a Slider that is at least different...

[cbvinh]

Yes. BUT.

We know Blackberry can't compete with other OEMs in price vs. Hardware.

Chinese oems can pump out sub 100 dollars android phones that are actually decent.

Blackberry couldn't even put out the leap for 200 bucks.

I think even if it runs android, they should stick to what I said earlier, maybe drop the low end devices? They can't make low end android, just doesn't work.

I think one vkb and one pkb, along with one crazy device once in a while.

I do think the Passport with android would be great. I wouldn't buy one, but I'd certainly be interested.

However, I don't want skinned android. If I'm going android, I'm going to root it and install cyanogenmod anyway.

A blackberry android device will lag, have a Crappy launcher, and we probably won't even be able to flash it with something else. Literally making blackberry devices worse, and removing any advantage that android has.

FML

If security demands that the bootloader be locked, then that will be a point of contention for reviewers, a minus for a device in an already crowded space. I agree that a Passport or Classic would make an interesting Android device, but it would defeat the purpose of getting more apps due to the screen aspect. Again, the Slider makes sense, for both apps compatibility and getting the keyboard as a differentiator.

[John Vieira]

If security demands that the bootloader be locked, then that will be a point of contention for reviewers, a minus for a device in an already crowded space. I agree that a Passport or Classic would make an interesting Android device, but it would defeat the purpose of getting more apps due to the screen aspect. Again, the Slider makes sense, for both apps compatibility and getting the keyboard as a differentiator.

Yes.

I am somewhat interested in the slider, but I think it's a step backwards.

They should double down on the passport's 3 row keyboard, not go back to 4 row.

I think the curved edges are gimmicky, and I'm not interested.

Also, it seems to be very thin and light. Great. It will have poor battery.

FML

[lnichols]

Just as equally, there's fallacy in believing that the Z10 sold well and a new high-end full touch will solve BlackBerry's problems. You said it yourself, the high-end users have defected. Passport or full touch... same poor sales. The introduction of full touch to BlackBerry's line up brought demand for newer full touch. It's the same with the Passport. And will be the same with the Slider.

I'm not saying it will fix their problems, I'm saying it will improve sales by addressing a huge hole in the product portfolio. Z10 and Z30 users who love the OS and are using it as it was deigned to be from the ground up, full touch, have absolutely nothing to buy as an upgrade over two years later, and that is simply negligence on BlackBerry's part. So over half your existing BB10 customers are in purgatory and what are they going to do? Most Android and iOS people are not going to go for a Classic or Passport either, and the Leap is not a conversion device. People are always surprised that I have a BlackBerry and have never seen a Z30 or know that BlackBerry made a 5" full touch device.

Posted via Z30

[BlackberryFan777]

I'm not saying it will fix their problems, I'm saying it will improve sales by addressing a huge hole in the product portfolio. Z10 and Z30 users who love the OS and are using it as it was deigned to be from the ground up, full touch, have absolutely nothing to buy as an upgrade over two years later, and that is simply negligence on BlackBerry's part. So over half your existing BB10 customers are in purgatory and what are they going to do? Most Android and iOS people are not going to go for a Classic or Passport either, and the Leap is not a conversion device. People are always surprised that I have a BlackBerry and have never seen a Z30 or know that BlackBerry made a 5" full touch device.

Posted via Z30

My upgrade path has been Z10 --> Z30 --> Passport. But, I understand what you are saying. My guess is that the slider turns out to be a great full touch device with a keyboard as an added bonus for those shaky car rides and subway trips when typing on glass is not really feasible and certainly not ideal.

Posted via CB10

[Bonsaibo]

My upgrade path has been Z10 --> Z30 --> Passport. But, I understand what you are saying. My guess is that the slider turns out to be a great full touch device with a keyboard as an added bonus for those shaky car rides and subway trips when typing on glass is not really feasible and certainly not ideal.

Posted via CB10

Don't forget walking and typing! Can't do that on a vkb.

[CFFrost]

Every single iPhone is a publicity stunt. Hell, every single flagship is a publicity stunt, it's a way to get your name out there. Companies don't make money on the flagships, they make them on the lower end devices. Again, except Apple.

And of course the Passport wasn't going to sell millions, all the BB10 devices combined haven't sold millions.

He was expecting to sell about 100k. They knew how niche and gimmicky it was. It actually sold more than their expectations.

I don't know your hatred for the Passport. It's actually a great device. I have to admit, when I first saw the square screen, I was thinking that they were insane, but it kinda grew on me. I absolutely adore it.

It's the most original and innovative thing in mobile in about 6 or 7 years.

Don't be a hater.

Work Wide and Prosper

Yes they do make money off flagships, Apple included. Have you seen any of the videos which disassemble phones and count how much it costs to make one of each phone? Apple earns off an iPhone 6 almost 4x over manufacturing costs, Samsung makes nearly 3x over manufacturing cost. Yes the videos do not take into consideration factory overheads and R&D, but to answer your post, they do indeed make a profit off flagships. About the PP I don't know since a teardown & cost video doesn't exist for it.

Posted via CB10

[Carmels]

Don't forget walking and typing! Can't do that on a vkb.

Who says? Can't guarantee you won't get some sort of jiberish but walking and typing on my Z30 has been done on many occasions.

Look! It's Zedzilla30!

[Bonsaibo]

Who says? Can't guarantee you won't get some sort of jiberish but walking and typing on my Z30 has been done on many occasions.

Look! It's Zedzilla30!

Yeah, so have I, I guess, but when I'm walking and typing on � pkb, my accuracy goes way up.

[quadruple k]

I hate blackberry with AOSP. android without apps isnt good

Posted via CB10

[Jeroen Vos]

Allright I read quite a few posts on the last pages of this thread and then thought: "What was the subject of this thread? Will BlackBerry survive?" then I figured I wouldn't have clicked that...

Posted via CB10

[CarGuy1368]

My best case scenario is that BlackBerry will get the Google Play store working on their devices. The Amazon Appstore isn't enough.

More Android optimization and app selection will make me love the slider. I don't think I can let go of BB10. If the device is running Android at launch, I don't think I'll be getting one.

Posted via the super amazing BlackBerry Q10

[johnny_bravo72]

I hate blackberry with AOSP. android without apps isnt good

Posted via CB10

BlackBerry without apps is even worse.

Posted from an ME173X

[Toodeurep]

BlackBerry without apps is even worse.

Posted from an ME173X

Any OS without Apps or Programs is less than desirable. I much prefer BB10 and BlackBerry World over anything AOS has to offer.

[CmdrStraker]

This isn't a bakery, it's simply not feasible to keep current lines running in the factories,... and very much less investing serious R&D into future models. How many people can you pay with 800,000 devices (and falling), none of them selling at the full price they intended?

So the 'escape from hardware' button is much closer to Chen's desk than it used to be.

Don't forget the Foxconn factor. With Foxconn as the contract manufacturer of BlackBerry hardware, the number of devices needed to be sold to be financially viable has to be much lower as compared to when RIM manufactured their own hardware.

This change must have moved Chen's 'escape from hardware' button farther from his desk, but I don't doubt that The Button is still located in his office. ;-)

[tinochiko]

Don't forget the Foxconn factor. With Foxconn as the contract manufacturer of BlackBerry hardware, the number of devices needed to be sold to be financially viable has to be much lower as compared to when RIM manufactured their own hardware.

This change must have moved Chen's 'escape from hardware' button farther from his desk, but I don't doubt that The Button is still located in his office. ;-)

Also recently announced partnerships with similar manufacturers!

Check Out TechCraze

[chenageddon]

How many manufacturing partners do you need to launch one or two phones per year?

[anon(870071)]

As long as BlackBerry makes a BB10 version I'm OK

Sent from my Passport

*patiently waiting*!!!

 Passport SQW100-1 / leak 10.3.2.2252 Rogers Wireless Posted via CB

[Trauma Surgeon]

I kind of agree that perhaps no device would have been able to change BB10's faith. Now, assuming BlackBerry goes Android (say, Android with BB10 skin), the real question will then be which type of BB phone will have better chance of success - Passport, Classic, a regular full touch, a Slider, or ...? And, by success, I don't mean a couple million BlackBerry die-hards buying the phone. I am talking a more general mass appeal.

Zero interest in BlackBerry hardware running Android. Off back to Apple.

Posted via CB10

[pttptppt]

Zero interest in BlackBerry hardware running Android. Off back to Apple.

Posted via CB10

Same

Posted via CB10