09-18-15 02:30 PM
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  1. ayngling's Avatar
    I'm not sure if that's true. In order to compete in the Android market, I'm guessing they'll have to deliver much more expensive hardware and that means lower margins, possibly razor thin ones. They won't have to move too many of them, but possibly more than BB10.

    Plus, they give up future revenue from BlackBerry World and all the benefits of owning your own platform, which is where the money really is. So, they'll need to sell more devices to make up for that.

    In the end, all that traffic you have going to your forums asking BB10 specific questions should start flowing to Android forums and sources like XDA. Some BlackBerry users will buy the Android Slider and stick around for another round of Android or two, but others will find that they like Android and can get better devices with better specs from companies like Sony, LG, HTC, Samsung, OnePlus, and Motorola. The Slider will be their gateway drug to Android from other vendors and away from BlackBerry in the long run -- after all, the apps will all run, why not just move from device to device when they are on the same platform.

    Meanwhile, Windows 10 is starting to look really tempting. I've never been tempted by a windows phone device, but I'm running Windows 10 on my MBP and it smokes OSX and just feels like second nature. The whole idea of tight integration with my laptop or tablet, universal apps, being able to install on Android devices, etc. Well, it's tempting. And, if the cameras are great and the retina scanning **** isn't to scary. Windows 10 could be closer to what Mike L would have dreamed up than what BlackBerry will offer under Chen.

    -- B.

    Posted via CB10
    I am not sure I agree that people here are staying with BB10 because they have not yet tried and liked Android. Maybe that is true for the people still on BBOS, but if they would have done so already if they were planning to buy BB10 devices when their hardware gives up.

    I agree that Android is a worse situation than if BlackBerry World was successful with a thriving app ecosystem for BB10. I hope BlackBerry finds the resources (money/manpower) to keep selling BB10 alongside Android, get rid of the Android runtime in BB10, and slowly work on getting more native apps for their ultra-secure COBO customers. (Wishful thinking, I know.) BB10 is an awesome platform.

    Ps: I know, Windows 10 is nice! I got a surface pro a few months ago to replace my MacBook Pro, highly recommended.
    09-17-15 05:08 AM
  2. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    In the end, all that traffic you have going to your forums asking BB10 specific questions should start flowing to Android forums and sources like XDA. Some BlackBerry users will buy the Android Slider and stick around for another round of Android or two, but others will find that they like Android and can get better devices with better specs from companies like Sony, LG, HTC, Samsung, OnePlus, and Motorola. The Slider will be their gateway drug to Android from other vendors and away from BlackBerry in the long run -- after all, the apps will all run, why not just move from device to device when they are on the same platform.
    Which is possibly where the BlackBerry software experience can come into play, and not just for Android. If they do a good job with the software suite (and price it reasonably) they could add to their revenue. Personally speaking, I love the touch capacitive PKB on the Passport (with actions and shortcuts), but I've played with their VKB and really like it as well. If BlackBerry eventually moved out of handsets I might still be interested in the BlackBerry Experience software package.
    ayngling likes this.
    09-17-15 08:08 AM
  3. vladi's Avatar
    Your opinion that "Slider will be a breath of fresh air". Nobody wants a slider these days. Maybe some PKB diehards but there are not too many of them anymore. VKB's (BlackBerry in particular) are great now and the slider was good back in the day.
    No one i buying slab flagships either cause they don't offer nothing in comparison to OnePlus. If Note can find customers with a frekin stylus then there is a market for PKB as well. It's not big but at least it's something.
    09-17-15 08:26 AM
  4. lift's Avatar
    Some BlackBerry users will buy the Android Slider and stick around for another round of Android or two, but others will find that they like Android and can get better devices with better specs from companies like Sony, LG, HTC, Samsung, OnePlus, and Motorola. The Slider will be their gateway drug to Android from other vendors and away from BlackBerry in the long run -- after all, the apps will all run, why not just move from device to device when they are on the same platform.
    You know, That's a really good point. I hope BlackBerry thought about that when they decided to go android.
    09-17-15 09:08 AM
  5. audio_Rx's Avatar
    You know, That's a really good point. I hope BlackBerry thought about that when they decided to go android.
    I'm pretty they did. That's why it has some BlackBerry features.

    Posted via CB10
    09-17-15 10:46 AM
  6. 6stringriffs's Avatar
    You know, That's a really good point. I hope BlackBerry thought about that when they decided to go android.
    They did. That's why they are becoming more & more just a software company and will sell their BB Suites to ALL OS platforms.

    That's why a potential Slider buyer should also consider getting a Moto X Pure and just purchase the BB Suites separately. (A lot will depend on price of course). Cause with Moto X you can go to any carrier: CDMA or GSM, and get quicker updates just like the Nexus devices.
    09-17-15 04:16 PM
  7. LuvULongTime's Avatar
    I agree.

    And BlackBerry, with its Passport, has proved that they know better than Samsung, Sony, Microsoft, Nokia etc why innovation in hardware is critical and what should be done within their modest technology (relatively to Apple's one). Just that they still do not know how to achieve it, which is proved by the Slider (as we know about it from leaked photos).
    I don't think they have proven anything. The Passport, as much as we may all like it, has proven to be a commercial failure. If it sold in quantities as large as the iPhone I would agree with you. Just because it is square doesn't mean it was good innovation, or something people really need/want.
    dusanvn likes this.
    09-17-15 04:49 PM
  8. dusanvn's Avatar
    I don't think they have proven anything. The Passport, as much as we may all like it, has proven to be a commercial failure. If it sold in quantities as large as the iPhone I would agree with you. Just because it is square doesn't mean it was good innovation, or something people really need/want.
    I agree that the Passport was a commercial failure because it didn't sell much. Nevertheless, we can see that many its users find it useful as a pocket computer, i.e. a [complete or partial] replacement for their laptops and tablets. No other phones pose this property.

    Of course, there are still serious shortcomings in its physical design (I mean, screen form factor and keyboard layout) which prove the lack of understanding users' needs on this new kind of device and which has probably prevented the major of potential buyers from actual buying it, but this is another story.

    So, although it is much like a work in progress, it has opened a window to an entirely new market. I see in it real innovation, not useless gimmicks (as are in the Slider). It has big potential and great future once the shortcomings are addressed.
    09-18-15 12:01 AM
  9. LuvULongTime's Avatar
    I agree that the Passport was a commercial failure because it didn't sell much. Nevertheless, we can see that many its users find it useful as a pocket computer, i.e. a [complete or partial] replacement for their laptops and tablets. No other phones pose this property.

    Of course, there are still serious shortcomings in its physical design (I mean, screen form factor and keyboard layout) which prove the lack of understanding users' needs on this new kind of device and which has probably prevented the major of potential buyers from actual buying it, but this is another story.

    So, although it is much like a work in progress, it has opened a window to an entirely new market. I see in it real innovation, not useless gimmicks (as are in the Slider). It has big potential and great future once the shortcomings are addressed.
    Sure, the PP can be used as a kinda laptop. But even in this regard Windows Phone has them beat:

    Your Windows 10 phone can turn into a full PC | The Verge

    At the end of the day I credit Blackberry for trying something different. The PP wasn't a smash hit, but they tried.

    If they want to do something different they need to look at how Apple came up with the iPhone. Apple looked at all the smart phones in 2007 with all of their buttons, and completely simplified the process of operating that kind of phone. Blackberry needs to continue on that train of thought. What are things people hate about the iPhone? How can they make it better? They tried with peek and flow, but the 'in and out' Apple paradigm that Heins always talked about was not really something Apple users hated. So I think that is still the question... how do they improve on things iPhone users hate and then market it in a way that appeals to the masses?
    09-18-15 11:22 AM
  10. lnichols's Avatar
    Sure, the PP can be used as a kinda laptop. But even in this regard Windows Phone has them beat:

    Your Windows 10 phone can turn into a full PC | The Verge

    At the end of the day I credit Blackberry for trying something different. The PP wasn't a smash hit, but they tried.

    If they want to do something different they need to look at how Apple came up with the iPhone. Apple looked at all the smart phones in 2007 with all of their buttons, and completely simplified the process of operating that kind of phone. Blackberry needs to continue on that train of thought. What are things people hate about the iPhone? How can they make it better? They tried with peek and flow, but the 'in and out' Apple paradigm that Heins always talked about was not really something Apple users hated. So I think that is still the question... how do they improve on things iPhone users hate and then market it in a way that appeals to the masses?
    I've heard this from Windows before, and the implementation has never lived up to the hype. Remember how Windows Phone 8.1 and Windows 8.1 would run the same apps and the app barrier was gone? Never happened and they are putting in an Android interpreter. Also apps designed for desktop don't translate well to a 5 to 6" screen and never have.

    As for BB10 not fixing issues with the iPhone experience that was not liked, it did, but BlackBerry did not advertise the platform effectively at all, and they didn't have a good OS build and UI straightened out until the for sale sign went up and 10.2 was released. Chen came on and clearly threw in the towel. They needed to push BB10 then hard and work developers hard with 10.2.1, but chose to redefine the market to try to justify low sales and apparently lay plans to transition from a then 9 month old OS. In the meantime, Apple has obtained some BlackBerry talent and has been improving their OS and making it more Enterprise grade.

    Posted via Z30
    09-18-15 11:49 AM
  11. FirstBerry101's Avatar
    I will be buying one the day it launches. I am hoping they surprise the world and announce on the 29th that it is available now. That is how it worked with Passport made my Rogers friends mad though! Haha

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    ayngling likes this.
    09-18-15 11:59 AM
  12. LuvULongTime's Avatar
    I've heard this from Windows before, and the implementation has never lived up to the hype. Remember how Windows Phone 8.1 and Windows 8.1 would run the same apps and the app barrier was gone? Never happened and they are putting in an Android interpreter. Also apps designed for desktop don't translate well to a 5 to 6" screen and never have.

    As for BB10 not fixing issues with the iPhone experience that was not liked, it did, but BlackBerry did not advertise the platform effectively at all, and they didn't have a good OS build and UI straightened out until the for sale sign went up and 10.2 was released. Chen came on and clearly threw in the towel. They needed to push BB10 then hard and work developers hard with 10.2.1, but chose to redefine the market to try to justify low sales and apparently lay plans to transition from a then 9 month old OS. In the meantime, Apple has obtained some BlackBerry talent and has been improving their OS and making it more Enterprise grade.

    Posted via Z30
    I don't know about that. I never heard one mainstream layman iPhone user complain about the home button and the 'in and out' paradigm. There were things they did improve over the iPhone like battery life and multi tasking, but they were incremental improvements that were nowhere near enough to contend with the huge app deficit they faced.

    In terms of continuum, I'll reserve final judgment until I can play with it myself. But if I can connect a Win phone to an external monitor over HDMI and it scales the resolution and effectively runs like a surface pro 3, then I see no issue. This would be awesome. For employees that do basic work like email, spreadhseets, etc, this could replace a laptop and thus cut down on costs.
    09-18-15 12:00 PM
  13. dusanvn's Avatar
    Sure, the PP can be used as a kinda laptop. But even in this regard Windows Phone has them beat:

    Your Windows 10 phone can turn into a full PC | The Verge
    I agree that a Windows phone, or even an Apple phone or an Android phone, can turn into a full PC (a pocket computer, to be clear lol). However, just because it has a good OS and a rich ecosystem of apps does not make it a pocket computer. It still needs to have a properly designed hardware, i.e. a properly designed screen form factor and keyboard layout. If it must be connected with an external monitor or external keyboard in order to work as a computer, it is _not_ a pocket computer.

    The Passport has shown an idea how a pocket computer (roughly) looks like. It's up to BlackBerry whether to finish its idea in the form of a profitable product thereby to enter the PC market first, or to wait and see Microsoft, Apple and Samsung doing so.



    Posted via CB10
    LuvULongTime likes this.
    09-18-15 02:30 PM
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