11-04-10 12:40 PM
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  1. Borborygm's Avatar
    Even with QNX onboard, chances are good that they won't be making changes to their backend NOC configs and we'll still be stuck with download limits and bs truncated emails.
    QNX means no BIS/BES needed, meaning the simple email apps that are on iOS and Android will also be available to QNX... The playbook has wifi, so for instance on BBs, apps that require BIS won't need to in the future. You will have a CHOICE. What a concept. Oh, and the rooting that will be going on will be insane.

    Also, iOS has many many many download/upload limits. They have been pointed out on Gizmodo many times, and still exist in the latest patches and betas.
    11-01-10 05:18 AM
  2. hub's Avatar
    I have been getting tired of my Storm 2 with its smallish screen, and very limited apps so when I heard that Verizon had dropped the Storm 3 I decided to go to a Droid X since a lot of people told me they loved it. Then I started looking at forums about the X and found out about the cockamamie way Android syncs (really doesn't) with Outlook. That was the end of that. Sooooo, I really need for RIM to come out with a new phone that is much better than either Storm models (I've had both). If it takes QNX to do that, fine. Just get it done.
    11-01-10 07:03 AM
  3. The_Engine's Avatar
    I have been getting tired of my Storm 2 with its smallish screen, and very limited apps so when I heard that Verizon had dropped the Storm 3 I decided to go to a Droid X since a lot of people told me they loved it. Then I started looking at forums about the X and found out about the cockamamie way Android syncs (really doesn't) with Outlook. That was the end of that. Sooooo, I really need for RIM to come out with a new phone that is much better than either Storm models (I've had both). If it takes QNX to do that, fine. Just get it done.
    What about Android's syncing with Android is "cockamamie"? Depending on your exchange settings Android, iOS, WP7 etc provide email syncing fairly similiar to RIM. Main difference is push vs pull from what I understand. Alfo you can get an app like touchdown from android that vastly improves your exchange syncing.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-01-10 07:11 AM
  4. The_Engine's Avatar
    QNX means no BIS/BES needed, meaning the simple email apps that are on iOS and Android will also be available to QNX... The playbook has wifi, so for instance on BBs, apps that require BIS won't need to in the future. You will have a CHOICE. What a concept. Oh, and the rooting that will be going on will be insane.

    Also, iOS has many many many download/upload limits. They have been pointed out on Gizmodo many times, and still exist in the latest patches and betas.
    On the bolded part...Where did you get the impression Playbook would NOT run BES/BIS? Just because apps should be easily portable doesn't mean that the playbook won't use their NOC. Is I missed something let me know.

    And Rooting? QNX has as many security certs as RIM, if not More. There won't be any rooting. Just because the app platform is becoming more Open source that doesn't mean the OS will. RIM would idiotic to sacrifice the their last redoubt, security, in a new OS. I think BB's should still be as un hackable on QNX as they are on BB6/5.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Last edited by The_Engine; 11-01-10 at 07:17 AM.
    11-01-10 07:14 AM
  5. hub's Avatar
    What about Android's syncing with Android is "cockamamie"? Depending on your exchange settings Android, iOS, WP7 etc provide email syncing fairly similiar to RIM. Main difference is push vs pull from what I understand. Alfo you can get an app like touchdown from android that vastly improves your exchange syncing.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I agree, Android does OK, I guess, with enterprise environments, but I don't have that. I am running Outlook 2003 stand-alone. When you have to first convert your contacts to a csv file and then import them into Google Contacts - therefore putting your contacts in the cloud - then sync your Droid from Google, that to me is cockamamie and way different from BB. They also try to make you run all your POP3 accounts through Gmail. Google says they don't try to control you like Apple does. That just is not true. Everything they make you do is based around Google Apps and Gmail. Who needs those extra hoops Google makes you jump through just so they can stick it to Microsoft?

    I thought I was making a sacrifice by giving up BBM, but this syncing problem was the deal breaker.

    Just give me a better BB - and fast!
    Last edited by hubsm; 11-01-10 at 07:53 AM.
    11-01-10 07:46 AM
  6. Mike_is_Mike's Avatar
    RIM announced the Playbook 6-8 months before it will be released. It would be nice if they would let us know what's going on with the Storm phone.

    I am in the same boat as many others, my 2 year Storm contract is up this year - and there is no new Storm to upgrade to.

    I don't even know if there WILL be a new Storm to upgrade to, or if there is, what to expect. Rumors on this forum really don't mean much, and CB's "rumor site" is a JOKE.

    Sprint's EVO 4G is looking pretty damn good at this point, even though I'm with Verizon right now.
    11-01-10 08:27 AM
  7. The_Engine's Avatar
    I agree, Android does OK, I guess, with enterprise environments, but I don't have that. I am running Outlook 2003 stand-alone. When you have to first convert your contacts to a csv file and then import them into Google Contacts - therefore putting your contacts in the cloud - then sync your Droid from Google, that to me is cockamamie and way different from BB. They also try to make you run all your POP3 accounts through Gmail. Google says they don't try to control you like Apple does. That just is not true. Everything they make you do is based around Google Apps and Gmail. Who needs those extra hoops Google makes you jump through just so they can stick it to Microsoft?

    I thought I was making a sacrifice by giving up BBM, but this syncing problem was the deal breaker.

    Just give me a better BB - and fast!
    Yeah I was definitely thinking of EAS and not stand alone.
    11-01-10 09:42 AM
  8. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    I agree, Android does OK, I guess, with enterprise environments, but I don't have that. I am running Outlook 2003 stand-alone. When you have to first convert your contacts to a csv file and then import them into Google Contacts - therefore putting your contacts in the cloud - then sync your Droid from Google, that to me is cockamamie and way different from BB.
    You coulda just used the google sync addon for Outlook. As well there are a plethora of apps that will sync with your desktop if you choose not to use google. No need to convert contacts or anything... plugin-sync-go (without google), or wireless (doesn't get much easier).

    They also try to make you run all your POP3 accounts through Gmail.
    Since when? Completely untrue. Why anybody would use POP3 on a mobile device is beyond any reasonable logic anyway, but there is absolutely no limitation forcing the use of gmail.

    Google says they don't try to control you like Apple does. That just is not true. Everything they make you do is based around Google Apps and Gmail. Who needs those extra hoops Google makes you jump through just so they can stick it to Microsoft?
    I know many an Android User who doesn't use any google products (beyond Google Maps anyway) and aren't limited to their apps.
    Last edited by rmjones101; 11-01-10 at 07:51 PM.
    11-01-10 07:46 PM
  9. Borborygm's Avatar
    On the bolded part...Where did you get the impression Playbook would NOT run BES/BIS? Just because apps should be easily portable doesn't mean that the playbook won't use their NOC. Is I missed something let me know.
    I didn't say it wouldn't at all ever, I said it wouldn't be NEEDED in most cases[like now with many apps, ie/facebook]. WiFi only versions wouldn't be usable if this was not the case[or on the other side of the fence, make wifi almost useless].

    And Rooting? QNX has as many security certs as RIM, if not More.
    Don't worry, it doesn't have the same drawbacks as say android[on linux] would. It's modular, so anything done would be added in after the fact. It's already been done on consumer devices to run a larger [feature filled] version of QNX, all the way back to the iOpener. Any security issues would be the fault of the modder themselves because of added modules.
    11-03-10 06:47 PM
  10. The_Engine's Avatar
    I didn't say it wouldn't at all ever, I said it wouldn't be NEEDED in most cases[like now with many apps, ie/facebook]. WiFi only versions wouldn't be usable if this was not the case[or on the other side of the fence, make wifi almost useless].



    Don't worry, it doesn't have the same drawbacks as say android[on linux] would. It's modular, so anything done would be added in after the fact. It's already been done on consumer devices to run a larger [feature filled] version of QNX, all the way back to the iOpener. Any security issues would be the fault of the modder themselves because of added modules.
    On wifi and BIS/BES.... You are missing the fact that if the playbook doesn't go through the RIM NOC and therefore BIS/BES then it doesn't get the advantage of RIM's push architecture. That is one of RIM's few remaining strong points in that it allows much battery life. Even over WIFI a BB is connecting to the RIM NOC.

    Of course the playbook is the first BB device that is but centered on messaging so its entirely possible someone may only want surf the web and view media on it. So in that case why have it run through BIS? But in that case why have a playbook? Get a Nook color or Galaxy Tab.

    On rooting...I am not worried about it. I am saying it won't happen on a QNX powered BB. RIM doesn't want you accessing the core OS as that is a security issue. That is the othe last sacred cow of RIM's. They picked QNX because of its security certs. So you won't be seeing rooting and custom rom's on Berries in the QNX world just like you don't see it now. Not unless RIM goofs something up.

    You seem to forgetting what makes a BB a BB. Security and True Push.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-04-10 08:44 AM
  11. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    On wifi and BIS/BES.... You are missing the fact that if the playbook doesn't go through the RIM NOC and therefore BIS/BES then it doesn't get the advantage of RIM's push architecture. That is one of RIM's few remaining strong points in that it allows much battery life. Even over WIFI a BB is connecting to the RIM NOC.

    Of course the playbook is the first BB device that is but centered on messaging so its entirely possible someone may only want surf the web and view media on it. So in that case why have it run through BIS? But in that case why have a playbook? Get a Nook color or Galaxy Tab.

    On rooting...I am not worried about it. I am saying it won't happen on a QNX powered BB. RIM doesn't want you accessing the core OS as that is a security issue. That is the othe last sacred cow of RIM's. They picked QNX because of its security certs. So you won't be seeing rooting and custom rom's on Berries in the QNX world just like you don't see it now. Not unless RIM goofs something up.

    You seem to forgetting what makes a BB a BB. Security and True Push.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Actually, the thing that saves a lot of battery life with WIFI on a BB is the fact that it doesn't keep the connection on all the time. In fact, if you were to watch a wireless AP or router that a BB is WIFI connected to, you'd see that the BB only grabs an IP and stays connected when there's an active data connection. If there isn't one, the BB drops the connection. It's really weird... these are the first devices I've seen behave like this, but it's not like I paid much attention to it in the past. A question came up in another thread and while I was testing a few things, I noticed this pattern.
    11-04-10 09:55 AM
  12. The_Engine's Avatar
    Actually, the thing that saves a lot of battery life with WIFI on a BB is the fact that it doesn't keep the connection on all the time. In fact, if you were to watch a wireless AP or router that a BB is WIFI connected to, you'd see that the BB only grabs an IP and stays connected when there's an active data connection. If there isn't one, the BB drops the connection. It's really weird... these are the first devices I've seen behave like this, but it's not like I paid much attention to it in the past. A question came up in another thread and while I was testing a few things, I noticed this pattern.
    If it drops the Wifi connection does it revert to Cellular? If you have Cellular off, do you then disconnect in full? That does sound weird. How is it still there for Push purposes?

    AS I understand it Wifi in general is much more efficient on Battery than Cell.
    11-04-10 11:36 AM
  13. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    If it drops the Wifi connection does it revert to Cellular? If you have Cellular off, do you then disconnect in full? That does sound weird. How is it still there for Push purposes?

    AS I understand it Wifi in general is much more efficient on Battery than Cell.
    That's the weird thing. It doesn't drop it... the router shows as the device is no longer in connection to it, but the BB shows an active connection. It's almost as if the connection is in sleep mode or something. It's there, but not in active use. For instance, a laptop connected via WIFI to this router shows a constant connection while the WIFI card in the laptop is powered on. The BB only links up with it when it's actively communicating with it. Maybe it's just something buggy I'm seeing, but I don't think so. I think this is how BBs have worked for so long with even the network connections to the carriers. We know that natively even the cellular data connection is more efficient on a BB as apposed to other smartphone platforms. This "sleep mode" or low power mode for the connection heartbeat is certainly something that would allow for this.
    11-04-10 12:40 PM
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