09-30-10 07:18 PM
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  1. cplush's Avatar
    I hope we start seeing some concrete info about this new OS soon. Is the blackpad still scheduled for Nov? Seems like we should have heard more about it by now. I wish RIM wasn't so secretive all the time.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I hope we hear something at devcon. If not I'm guessing a release date in 2011....that or it falls flat due to a lack of apps. The 9800 had no apps at launch and still has no themes....I hope the blackpad rollout isn't a repeat

    Posted from my BlackBerry using BerryBlab
    09-15-10 04:57 PM
  2. Aviator168's Avatar
    yes RIM can make a shiny new OS but if devs still find it hard to develop apps for or don't bother period, RIM would still be in trouble as it is today. Apps are now the driving force in the smartphone business today
    Apps have always been the driving force for computers back then and smartphones now. Remember how the IBM PC got off the ground. A killer app - Lotus 123.
    09-22-10 09:44 AM
  3. otacon#AC's Avatar
    RIM is in need of a new OS. I think the reason they bought QNX is because BB OS as we know it is about maxed out with what it can handle in terms of memory and graphics support. If they can start giving us much more application memory, and good a good base of applications and SDK's out there that can let programmers do the same things they can for Apple and Android I'll be a happy camper. My only concern is that they may be too late to the dance for developers to give them consideration.
    However, what is interesting is that the Journal's sources say BlackBerry has decided to pass on BlackBerry 6, its newest version of the BlackBerry 6 OS, in favor of a completely new OS build by QNX Software Systems. RIM purchased QNX earlier this year, and is said to be planning to transition all BlackBerrys to a QNX OS.

    BlackBerry Tablet Possibly Revealed Next Week

    ...there you go. Looks like BB OS will be RIP in the not too distant future.
    09-22-10 04:54 PM
  4. cplush's Avatar
    [QUOTE=otacon72;5606848]===== QUOTE lnichols ====

    RIM is in need of a new OS. I think the reason they bought QNX is because BB OS as we know it is about maxed out with what it can handle in terms of memory and graphics support. If they can start giving us much more application memory, and good a good base of applications and SDK's out there that can let programmers do the same things they can for Apple and Android I'll be a happy camper. My only concern is that they may be too late to the dance for developers to give them consideration.

    ===== /QUOTE ====

    However, what is interesting is that the Journal's sources say BlackBerry has decided to pass on BlackBerry 6, its newest version of the BlackBerry 6 OS, in favor of a completely new OS build by QNX Software Systems. RIM purchased QNX earlier this year, and is said to be planning to transition all BlackBerrys to a QNX OS.

    ===== /QUOTE ====


    BlackBerry Tablet Possibly Revealed Next Week (http://www.tomsguide.com/us/Research-in-Motion-BlackPad-SurfBook-BlackBerry-BlackBerry-OS,news-8082.html)

    ...there you go. Looks like BB OS will be RIP in the not too distant future.
    Yeah, there's way too much legacy code in it anyways. I played with an old 7290 the other day and was suprised at how the only thing that has changed is the graphics. Most of the menus are the same and that device was launched in 2005

    Posted from my BlackBerry using BerryBlab
    09-22-10 06:02 PM
  5. Pearl9100's Avatar
    The question is, are you blaming the right piece? What I tried to point out when I described the nature of QNX is that it really is an operating system in the minimalist sense. It is the low level kernel on which to build stuff. An OS itself doesn't really do very much relative to the end user app. Its basic job is to start applications and then get out of the way. Most developers don't work at the level of the OS: they write applications that run on the OS. I doubt that BMW's auto developers would want to touch the QNX OS code itself.

    If your Android game was laggy would you blame the Linux kernel on which it is built? Running on Linux, you have the game itself, the GUI, the class libraries, the Dalvik VM, and the various Android services that Google built on top of Linux. There is so much intervening stuff between the pretty picture on the screen and the low level OS that I think the user experience is unlikely to be affected by the lowly OS. Similarly blaming an end user experience for a GUI application running on QNX is like being stuck in a traffic jam and blaming your slow speed on the gasoline.
    again. iono. i can only speak from my experience using the dreaded idrive system. iono if its the os or the app that is launched. you would have to ask someone else.

    what i do know is that there are lots of sensors, and the computer in the m3 is doing millions of computations per second (or something like that. dont quote me on it) when you are driving. it immediately helps adjusts the suspension and brakes to control yaw for you. its very refined and precise, but i dont think its the qnx os. its not apart of the idrive system either (i dont think so at least) and its probably a program (or app, w/e you wanna call it) that bmw created to do all these computations and has nothing to do with the os. iono. what do you think?
    09-23-10 02:08 AM
  6. 67Tucker's Avatar
    I find it sort of funny that on one hand, when comparisons between Android and Blackberry occur and apps are mentioned, RIM supporters are quick to say things like "My Blackberry has all of the apps it needs" or "Who cares if Android has 25 fart apps" etc. But now after reading through this thread and seeing someone mention that Kevin said that the new OS may have the ability to run Android apps, I now see things like "That would be awesome" and "Can you imagine having that many apps virtually overnight?". That is confusing to me because I can't understand why anyone would want 25 fart apps for their Blackpad!
    09-23-10 03:49 AM
  7. zensen's Avatar
    I find it sort of funny that on one hand, when comparisons between Android and Blackberry occur and apps are mentioned, RIM supporters are quick to say things like "My Blackberry has all of the apps it needs" or "Who cares if Android has 25 fart apps" etc. But now after reading through this thread and seeing someone mention that Kevin said that the new OS may have the ability to run Android apps, I now see things like "That would be awesome" and "Can you imagine having that many apps virtually overnight?". That is confusing to me because I can't understand why anyone would want 25 fart apps for their Blackpad!
    unless its the same person stating that, then yes that would be confusing but remember not everyone feels the same way and a lot of people would love a billion stupid apps on their phone with some blackberry users feeling like they are missing out. I personally don't give a crap about apps but I can totally understand developers wanting better tools to develop on the blackberry platform and if it makes it easier for app developers to move apps over, I have no problems with that (whether that is even possible). One things for sure, its not the apps that keeps me using a Blackberry smartphone.
    Last edited by zensen; 09-23-10 at 08:25 AM.
    09-23-10 08:23 AM
  8. mke67's Avatar
    Technically, neither QNX nor Linux are "Unix based". Neither of them have any roots in the original AT&T Unix nor the BSD variant. Both were developed independently from scratch. Architecturally QNX, unlike Unix and Linux, is a microkernel, real-time operating system.

    Analogically, QNX is a distant "cousin" to Linux in that they implement similar system calls (POSIX) as Unix, so you can port Unix apps to them easily. Both are bare-bones platforms on which you need to build everything else: drivers, GUI, telephony, API etc. Google built Android on top of Linux. RIM is presumably building ... something -- BBOS? ... on top of QNX. Bottom line is that the phone user experience is so far removed from the underlying low-level OS kernel that you can't assume anything about what your experience will be just because you got QNX under the covers. Your BlackBerry may be running QNX right now: how can you tell it isn't?

    In theory, RIM might have a few tricks with QNX because unlike Android/Linux it is a real-time OS, meaning stricter guarantees in terms of responsiveness in multitasking and scheduling. But I cannot even begin to speculate how RTOS characteristics would translate to a real competitive advantage. I'll just have to wait and see.


    The question is, are you blaming the right piece? What I tried to point out when I described the nature of QNX is that it really is an operating system in the minimalist sense. It is the low level kernel on which to build stuff. An OS itself doesn't really do very much relative to the end user app. Its basic job is to start applications and then get out of the way. Most developers don't work at the level of the OS: they write applications that run on the OS. I doubt that BMW's auto developers would want to touch the QNX OS code itself.

    If your Android game was laggy would you blame the Linux kernel on which it is built? Running on Linux, you have the game itself, the GUI, the class libraries, the Dalvik VM, and the various Android services that Google built on top of Linux. There is so much intervening stuff between the pretty picture on the screen and the low level OS that I think the user experience is unlikely to be affected by the lowly OS. Similarly blaming an end user experience for a GUI application running on QNX is like being stuck in a traffic jam and blaming your slow speed on the gasoline.

    Well said...........
    Last edited by mke67; 09-23-10 at 03:24 PM.
    09-23-10 03:20 PM
  9. qbnkelt's Avatar
    Looking at my day and the apps I need...what am I lacking???

    I want to find a restaurant - Poynt. I want to get directions - Google Maps. I want to know the weather in Seattle for next week's trip - WeatherBug. I want to do some banking - my bank apps. I want to keep track of my phone's performance - Meterberry. I want to find out exactly what message I'm getting - BerryBuzz. I want to read some news - magazines and newspapers. I want to be entertained by clowns - seek out said clowns on Crackberry Forum launch. I want to find out when my 9780 is coming out - CB.

    OK, to the app fanatics....I must be completely missing out on life's great joys....

    What apps am I missing out on?????
    Last edited by Qbnkelt; 09-24-10 at 06:57 AM.
    09-24-10 06:53 AM
  10. drjay868's Avatar
    Looking at my day and the apps I need...what am I lacking???

    I want to find a restaurant - Poynt. I want to get directions - Google Maps. I want to know the weather in Seattle for next week's trip - WeatherBug. I want to do some banking - my bank apps. I want to keep track of my phone's performance - Meterberry. I want to find out exactly what message I'm getting - BerryBuzz. I want to read some news - magazines and newspapers. I want to be entertained by clowns - seek out said clowns on Crackberry Forum launch. I want to find out when my 9780 is coming out - CB.

    OK, to the app fanatics....I must be completely missing out on life's great joys....

    What apps am I missing out on?????
    Ummmm... HELLO!?!?!? 25 Fart apps!
    09-24-10 09:33 AM
  11. drjay868's Avatar
    BTW, thank you cwong15. That was by far the best explanation of QNX I've read yet. Now I get what's going on here.
    09-24-10 09:34 AM
  12. Fubaz's Avatar
    Ummmm... HELLO!?!?!? 25 Fart apps!

    QFT.... 10 chars
    09-24-10 09:34 AM
  13. drjay868's Avatar
    QFT.... 10 chars
    What does QFT mean?
    09-24-10 11:36 AM
  14. qbnkelt's Avatar
    quoted for truth.....
    09-24-10 11:59 AM
  15. SaintThomasAquinas's Avatar
    Two quick points I would like to make...

    1. Why would Blackberry Release a new tablet device (or any other device for that matter) without an app store or the ability to run apps from an existing app store? It is a absolute certainty that one of those app stores won't be Apple so that leaves Android. I could be wrong but the existing Blackberry Apps are Java correct? Well Java is a cross Platform language and thus could run on any OS that supports Java including Perhaps QNX.

    2. If QNX is a Linux based OS as is Android then assuming the Balckberry device is equipped with a CPU of the same architecture as those devices which run Android than no emulator is necessary.

    So to summarize the suspicion that the new RIM Tablet will be able to run Android apps is the only plausible way I can see this rumor of a tablet release to be true.
    09-26-10 06:29 PM
  16. taylortbb's Avatar
    Two quick points I would like to make...

    1. Why would Blackberry Release a new tablet device (or any other device for that matter) without an app store or the ability to run apps from an existing app store? It is a absolute certainty that one of those app stores won't be Apple so that leaves Android. I could be wrong but the existing Blackberry Apps are Java correct? Well Java is a cross Platform language and thus could run on any OS that supports Java including Perhaps QNX.

    2. If QNX is a Linux based OS as is Android then assuming the Balckberry device is equipped with a CPU of the same architecture as those devices which run Android than no emulator is necessary.
    1. It is correct that all BlackBerry apps are Java. There's no reason that they couldn't have the JVM running on top of the QNX OS for complete backwards compatibility.

    2. QNX is not a "Linux based OS". Linux is an OS, QNX is an OS, the only "Linux based OS" is Linux. Android (a package of customized Linux + apps) is also a completely Java-based platform. However, Google has made some modifications to Java (and that's why they're currently involved in a legal battle with Oracle). Due to Android being open source though there's no reason RIM couldn't ship a standards-compliant JVM and an Android-compatible JVM.
    09-26-10 11:08 PM
  17. qnxqnx's Avatar
    I am an old UNIX kernel hack (dates back to IBM PC-IX on IBM PC) - my first experience of QNX was back in 1988. A few facts:

    - QNX has evolved over 30 years,
    - QNX stands for QNX is Not Unix.
    - QNX was selected by CISCO when it was developing the CRS-1 (circa. 2004)
    - QNX is a real time operating system with guaranteed context switching time, and the first in multicoreís SMP way back in the late 90ís.

    Playbook is just the start, the pivotal point for investors to understand is QNX gives RIM a lead, and an edge for the upcoming mobile revolution. PC & notebooks are truly toast.

    Anyone can design and build the hardward (HTC, Dell, HP, Japan & Korea Inc, etc.) think without Android, where would these cloners be !? using windows mobile 7? and see your battery dies after 1.5 hours of usage? QNX, technically, trumps every other OS. Apple & IOS will have its response come January. But so will RIM. Think ARM Quad Core Cortex A15 at 2.5 GHz with low power ! I assure you Windows Mobile 7 will not run on it before QNX and IOS.
    09-27-10 08:12 PM
  18. FineWolf's Avatar
    so what kevin had to say in his podcast was very interesting.
    he thinks this whole new os with the qnx will be able to nrun android apps wow!
    if that were true blacberry would get all those apps over night and the flash is in the qnx os to this would be night and day for rim!
    No, this will not happen.

    What will happen is that since both OS are POSIX compliant, someone will write an abstraction library which will enable the develop to target both platforms. But apps will have to be rebuilt.
    09-27-10 08:16 PM
  19. FineWolf's Avatar
    1. Why would Blackberry Release a new tablet device (or any other device for that matter) without an app store or the ability to run apps from an existing app store? It is a absolute certainty that one of those app stores won't be Apple so that leaves Android. I could be wrong but the existing Blackberry Apps are Java correct? Well Java is a cross Platform language and thus could run on any OS that supports Java including Perhaps QNX.

    2. If QNX is a Linux based OS as is Android then assuming the Balckberry device is equipped with a CPU of the same architecture as those devices which run Android than no emulator is necessary.
    Both points are invalidated by the fact that while, yes, the JVM is cross-platform and yes, Android and QNX are POSIX compliant, Android has its own set of components, APIs and libraries for its functions which are not cross platform.
    09-27-10 08:19 PM
  20. billyblonco's Avatar
    So this is an all new OS by QNX and has nothing from OS6? so the whole Torch mobile deal was a waste of $$$
    09-27-10 08:26 PM
  21. iBlack11's Avatar
    Looks like OS6



    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
    09-27-10 08:29 PM
  22. fecurtis's Avatar
    again. iono. i can only speak from my experience using the dreaded idrive system. iono if its the os or the app that is launched. you would have to ask someone else.

    what i do know is that there are lots of sensors, and the computer in the m3 is doing millions of computations per second (or something like that. dont quote me on it) when you are driving. it immediately helps adjusts the suspension and brakes to control yaw for you. its very refined and precise, but i dont think its the qnx os. its not apart of the idrive system either (i dont think so at least) and its probably a program (or app, w/e you wanna call it) that bmw created to do all these computations and has nothing to do with the os. iono. what do you think?
    Yeah none of that is by fault of the OS. Also, to be technical, what you're talking about is actually dubbed mDrive.

    Most of that is handled through the car's ECU and an interface was merely developed to allow the driver to tell the ECU in what way to alter the car's settings, not very hard these days now that everything is drive by wire and electronically controlled, tons of cars have similar settings.
    09-27-10 08:43 PM
  23. fecurtis's Avatar
    Ummmm... HELLO!?!?!? 25 Fart apps!
    I agree, most of the apps I have on my Droid X I had on my Blackberry (took a while to get Poynt...that was Blackberry specific for a while).

    However, I will say the UI and overall speed of these apps are leaps and bounds better than when they were on my Blackberry.

    Besides...Blackberry has its fair share of fart apps too.

    Side note, if you ever read Apple's new user agreement for submitting apps for iTunes, they specifically request no fart apps, kinda funny. Basically Apple was saying that any app that would not provide at least some sort of long term entertainment would not be approved....even they claimed they have enough useless fart apps available.
    09-27-10 08:47 PM
  24. SaintThomasAquinas's Avatar
    Both points are invalidated by the fact that while, yes, the JVM is cross-platform and yes, Android and QNX are POSIX compliant, Android has its own set of components, APIs and libraries for its functions which are not cross platform.
    Thank you for answering. I had considered adding that libraries would be different and so without compatible libraries you would be forced to port apps.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    09-27-10 09:01 PM
  25. VIDGMER's Avatar
    For those who donít know QNX, itís a micro-kernel based operating system with a sophisticated graphical user interface, a modern POSIX-based tool-chain, and a fully distributable architecture. In laymanís terms, that means itís more stable than LINUX, runs in less memory than any of LINUX, OS X, or Windows Ė even the embedded versions, pretty to look at for users, and easy to develop software for using skills that are relatively common in the industry.
    QNX runs the high-speed TGV trains in France, the space arm on the shuttle, manufacturing plants around the world, automotive systems from dozens of manufacturers, and soon, Iím betting, your phone.
    Source..
    09-27-10 10:18 PM
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