10-22-12 03:10 PM
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  1. fabio984's Avatar
    "Some people seem to expect BB10 as a sort of massiah. However :

    1) Waiting until mid 2013 doesn't make sense from a user's point of view"
    #The OS 7.1 and the BlackBerry 7 devices didnt launch so long time ago. They still better than other phones being launched now. The pressure is just because u see galaxy's and iphones launch, but the other phones (iphone 4s and galaxy s2, for example, are old now, and the OS7 devices still "new")#

    "2) It is is not specified how BB10 will be superior to other OS at that time"
    #OS superior? What do you mean? I'm used to BlackBerry (6th BlackBerry now on my pocket), so the OS will be superior for sure, for me #

    "3) Interest from apps developers is not guaranteed"
    #What depelopers? The usual apps are guaranteed. If are talking about fancy games and annoying apps, android will be your choice. I use my xbox360 when I want play#

    "4) It is not guaranteed that RIM will still exist at that time"
    #Is it not guaranteed that you or me will still exist that time, but if yes, ill be a BB10 uer#

    "5) It is not even guaranteed that BB10 will be bug-free"
    #BUGs are always there, if youre a developer and u guarantee "no bugs" I guess u have a job guaranteed#
    10-18-12 11:22 AM
  2. zorecati's Avatar
    This is your opinion, please stop speaking for the rest of us.

    You are correct, there are only about 17 Playbooks in the world today. 4 64gig, 3 32gig and 10 16gig and half those folks hate them. Shoot I own 3 of them so the owners of the other 14 and myself should get together and have a beer. We can use Blackberry Video Chat!.

    You seriously are just making stuff. Similar to the lady who wanted the deer crossing signs moved from the highways as she thought they made the deer cross at those locations. True story.

    I'm not praising RIM, I just hate trolls and trolling from individuals who seem to think that because their PB experience has been poo, everyone else has to be experiencing PB poo as well. It works for what I use it for. If it doesn't work for you, you bought the wrong device and don't forget you get what you pay for. I paid 240 dollars for my 64gig playbook and I believe I got 240 dollars worth of value from it. Now if you paid full price for your PB, you got ripped off and I don't think anyone here will argue that.
    10-18-12 12:03 PM
  3. rotorwrench's Avatar
    For rim to produce another android tablet into an already over saturated market place is, quite honestly, dumb. Your opinion of the other 2 os's listed are just that, opinion. I'm unfamiliar with any tablet that currently uses any of those os's Perhaps my own ignorance, but if they were worth mentioning, I'm sure I'd have heard about it.

    Your statement about immediate financial advantage, I'm not sure how you back that up. You're guessing at best or perhaps just wishful thinking.

    I think I can safely say, no one here wants android on their PB. There are already tons of really good and bad android tablets out there. We bought playbooks because we wanted an alternative to the other 2. If you seriously aren't happy with your pb, get something else.

    I can't stress enough that your comment about os's with bugs is ridiculous. THEY ALL HAVE BUGS. I'm starting to wonder of you are merely trolling at this point.
    I'd just move on. There's an MO you'll see when you read a poster's history. There's constructive criticism and then there's just criticism, constantly. Life's short, just ignore.
    10-18-12 12:06 PM
  4. zorecati's Avatar
    I'd just move on. There's an MO you'll see when you read a poster's history. There's constructive criticism and then there's just criticism, constantly. Life's short, just ignore.
    Yep, I've read the posters other nonsensical posts before but was eating lunch and possibly a bit board. I also need to pad my post count a bit.
    Last edited by zorecati; 10-18-12 at 12:27 PM.
    esk369, rotorwrench and Bobcat665 like this.
    10-18-12 12:15 PM
  5. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Some answers :

    - BB10 is an enhanced PBOS with a new UI (in very very short)
    - BB10 is not only an OS, it's a platform, meaning we can expect enhanced interoperability with BB phones (but also with other devices - say - DLNA for instance)
    - No dev interest ?
    . Current PB apps should run on BB10 (if this appends 100% then, I'll be surprised, but a vast part will "as-is")
    . Future BB10 (phone) apps will run on PB
    - Mid 2013 ? Who said ?
    - RIM dead ? Well ... no.
    - Android ? again ? Ok, here's T. Heins "why", I share.
    “We took the conscious decision not to go Android. If you look at other suppliers’ ability to differentiate, there’s very little wiggle room. We looked at it seriously – but if you understand what the promise of BlackBerry is to its user base it’s all about getting stuff done. Games, media, we have to be good at it but we have to support those guys who are ahead of the game. Very little time to consume and enjoy content – if you stay true to that purpose you have to build on that basis. And if we want to serve that segment we can’t do it on a me-too approach.”
    10-18-12 01:18 PM
  6. TheScionicMan's Avatar
    I'd just move on. There's an MO you'll see when you read a poster's history. There's constructive criticism and then there's just criticism, constantly. Life's short, just ignore.
    I disagree completely. Life is the longest thing you'll ever do.
    esk369 likes this.
    10-18-12 01:47 PM
  7. texazzpete's Avatar
    As far as i'm concerned, BB10 IS the 'messiah'....anything to make me finally get rid of this 9900.

    After the infrequent lock ups and the horrible horrible battery life (which I've already talked about several times in this forum), today was probably the final straw for me with OS7. Updated BBM, BBM icon vanished from my BB. Appworld kept throwing up the 'AppWorld will now close' error. Took a while before I was able to resolve this.

    BB10 will be more stable, faster, more fluid than OS7. It should also come with loads more apps...and much more capable hardware. Since I have to use a BB, BB10 to me IS the great hope...
    10-18-12 03:49 PM
  8. esk369's Avatar
    @zorecati.
    "Similar to the lady who wanted the deer crossing signs moved from the highways as she thought they made the deer cross at those locations. True story"
    Hey thanks for making a otherwise useless thread not a total waste of time and I really needed something like that today I would love to know the story behind that one
    10-18-12 03:51 PM
  9. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Some people seem to expect BB10 as a sort of massiah. However :

    1) Waiting until mid 2013 doesn't make sense from a user's point of view
    For a user whose contract is up now and is looking for an upgrade? If someone came to me today and ask for the best phone, I'd tell them BB10 was coming but that if they didn't want to wait there are many great phones available now.

    2) It is is not specified how BB10 will be superior to other OS at that time
    There has been a great deal of material made available both by RIM and others that show an attractive, fluid interface that is demonstrably easier to navigate through. As well as a cool, tricky camera.

    3) Interest from apps developers is not guaranteed
    There are thousands of developers who are committed to this platform. RIM has done the smartest thing they can with the money they have: they've spent it on building their developer base. Remember that even the Playbook has reasonably respectable dev support now.

    4) It is not guaranteed that RIM will still exist at that time
    Now you're just being silly. RIM still has cash in the bank and stands a reasonable shot at returning to profitability once they've got new product launched. They have 80 million subscribers, and make money off each and every one of them every month in subscription fees. No, we have no guarantee that BB10 will "save" the company, but that doesn't automatically mean they're dead, either.

    5) It is not even guaranteed that BB10 will be bug-free
    There's no such thing as "bug-free", sorry. Even Apple can't escape them (see: iOS 6 maps fiasco). What I can say is that what I've seen so far looks very clean. It stands a very good chance of a "clean" (i.e. no showstopper bugs) launch.

    I would be far more interested in paying for a port of Android Jelly Bean. With proper funding it would probably come earlier than BB10, be more reliable and bring more apps. With Android flexibility it would even be possible to apply some of RIM's great interface ideas, like the upward swipe.
    RIM couldn't possibly implement its proprietary security infrastructure in Android before January. And moving to Android would make them just another "me-too" phone with dozens of competitors. In two years it will be clear how superior BB10 is to Android, mark my words.

    I think BB10 is not a hope, it's the main impediment threatening RIM's survival. Even for the phones most informed buyers are not buying now, they are waiting for the next generation. A shift to Android and the sales would boost sales immediately.

    An alternative is to join Tizen. BB10 is great for a few Crackberry users, but for the rest of the world it simply does not exist.
    There are probably more users awaiting BB10 than you seem to think. And Tizen? Really? It's a promising idea, but BB10 already incorporates its best ideas (the web browser is completely built of HTML5 components and it kicks A$$).
    10-18-12 04:06 PM
  10. shingi_70's Avatar
    Do people really expect BB10 to be the messiah like the op says.

    From what i gather while there is excitment about the platform most people here seem to be pretty realstic about BB10 and the playbook. And there isnt anything wrong saying that its the best platform and if they like it.

    I'm going to be going into the microsoft ecosystem with a htc 8x and HP envy x2. I don't expect the ecosystem to be #1 at the start but its the one i like and fits me. Same with blackberry.

    Doesn't have to be the next coming or #1 as long as its what suits you.

    Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2
    esk369 likes this.
    10-18-12 04:07 PM
  11. dthoupis's Avatar
    Someone once said and people in the crackberry world know who that is..... and I quote "Blackberry is for people who want to get done" (excuse my profanity but I thing is appropriate for the statement.

    One thing which I look a lot forward is ActiveSync on the BB10 platform which will open a whole new integration world regarding emailing as for the time being we were a bit constrained on non BES. I have tried Windows phone and Android (got the famous HTC Hero when was out). Not bad phones but dont get me the things I want done and things which were important to me was email, keeping contacts in place and phone calls with no issue. Blackberry even over BIS is doing a far more advanced messaging support than any other platform period and no one can argue about it. Girlfriend has an iPhone. I really cannot use it dont know why!!! In any case.. My 2 cents. Dont want to wait for BB10... then don't. I see how my PB evolves with each update. Remember when the iPhone did not even have a copy paste function? Still people waited and waited until version 4 to get done. Dont thing we cant wait a bit longer for a system which from the looks of it really really really rocks. At least the videos and flow of the platform seem like this. I am very very interested seeing the qwerty version of the BB10 platform. In any case I am buying it..
    Saluti
    Demetris
    blusls likes this.
    10-18-12 04:30 PM
  12. Mikey_T's Avatar
    Call it PB OS3, BB10, whatever. What I'm still waiting for is Netflix, Skype, DLNA connectivity, direct Outlook sync via DM for contacts & calendar and an improved/faster messaging app. Aside from that I'm reasonably satisfied with what I have now.
    10-18-12 04:35 PM
  13. southlander's Avatar
    I know, I know RIM will not do something obvious that would immediately save the company. I just feel compelled to say it would save them.

    In the segment of alternative OS, the current version is still less good than Symbian or Bada, which are yet scheduled to die now. You should have seen this month update of Symbian to version FP2, it feels so much more reliable, professional and clean than OS 2.1

    In 2013 BB10 will have to compete with Tizen and maybe others in the segment of alternative OS. The main OS, Android and Ios, will become better and you can rest assure that if there is anything interesting in the beta versions of BB10, they will quickly implement it, better and quicker than RIM. And then Windows 8 will increase its shares probably.

    And then with RIM's history of releases, there is a probability that BB10 will come with important bugs or unjustifiable shortcomings.



    Zero long term control, immediate financial advantage, reliable system and needed apps. Possibility to customize interface, access to system code to add security code. And... survival. Maybe survival is a prerequisite before demanding total long-term control.



    As far as I know developers like XDA are not interested in the playbook. They consider it dead and to difficult to crack. It would take an incentive by RIM, motivated by a wish for survival.
    I'll defer to your knowledge of Bada/Tizen, etc since I have never used those. I just assume that RIM had *a lot* of very smart people inside the company that took a serious look at Android before deciding against it. In fact the app player kind of looks like it came out of that as a sort of poor plan B of sorts (??).

    All I know is Android is turning into a Samsung market. And all the other players are more and more moving to vertically integrate everything they can -- own the hardware, the OS, the services. Heck Amazon is looking to make CPUs (crazy) and now Microsoft is building a tablet. Don't believe what Google said about Motorola operating independently. Not if things get worse for Google (note their missed earnings today).

    RIM is just ahead of the curve in this respect. And they are trying to complete the circle.

    If RIM does fail you could see someone buy up the NOC and open it up (BBM on Android.. that kind of thing). Just a thought.

    But I am optimistic at this point about RIM.
    10-18-12 04:54 PM
  14. Bakamushi's Avatar
    I am not praising Symbian or Bada. I'm saying they are obsolete and yet they still feel better better done than OS 2.1. At least you don't hear from all the weird stuff that happens on OS 2.1. And their apps store is cleaner too.

    As for Tizen, I have no idea how it's going to turn out, but I know that with RIM's poor work and many delays, it should be easy to make a better OS by mid 2013. So that RIM will have to compete with Tizen and Windows 8 in the marginal OS segment of the market. In fact I think any large company starting now would be able to do better than RIM by mid-2013.

    As for BB10, you can believe in it or from the very poor work done so far and the strange amount of delays, you can suspect that RIM is not really working anymore, but only showing signs of existence - or non disappearance - before being bought or finding jobs elsewhere. I'm starting to wondering if there is something inside the box.
    10-18-12 05:46 PM
  15. amjass12's Avatar
    i dont want a device that is superior to other os's .. i dont want the messiah of smartphones per s... i need what works for me and thats definitely blackberry... and the playbook has re-inforced my decision to stay with bb. because the stable, fast and smooth qnx platform coupled with the bb os is awesome.. bb10 previews look amazing (and btw to me it looks like it can do things the other os's cant and has awesome features implemented) but each to their own of course.

    and thats y im staying... i dont care for facts and figures... the app world right now is redundant... but i havent moved away from blackberry... besides, theres a huge developer initiative for bb10. im sure there will be great apps available for bb10...

    the only thing i care about RIM still being round nxt yr lool... i hope they still are!!

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk
    Toodeurep likes this.
    10-18-12 07:42 PM
  16. esk369's Avatar
    @amjass12
    I'm hearing what your saying.
    Especially with the developer part if for no other reason the 10k commitment will bring people in
    The end of this story has yet to be written I personally hope its a happy one and for me it doesn't have to be a messiah its just has to do what I need to do heck I'm still using a curve 8530.
    Toodeurep and amjass12 like this.
    10-18-12 07:52 PM
  17. peter9477's Avatar
    Troll thread is trolling...
    10-18-12 08:01 PM
  18. zorecati's Avatar
    So use your old smart phone. I'm not sure what you tell you but I would think that 99% of the folks here think you're just trolling. Judging by some of your previous threads I had a chance to read, I'm kind of thinking you just want to be argumentative for the sake of being argumentative, kind of like a politician. You know my ti84 is pretty smooth too which seems like a legit comparison to the PB. Hope whatever you decide to do works out for you.
    Last edited by zorecati; 10-18-12 at 08:36 PM.
    esk369 and rotorwrench like this.
    10-18-12 08:22 PM
  19. Bobcat665's Avatar
    TROLLING!!!

    Why hope for BB10 ?-trolling_trolling_troll_internet_likes_to_fight_fail_jerk_pu_demotivational_poster_1239308887-s6.jpg
    Last edited by Bobcat665; 10-19-12 at 05:40 PM.
    10-18-12 08:25 PM
  20. zorecati's Avatar
    @zorecati.
    "Similar to the lady who wanted the deer crossing signs moved from the highways as she thought they made the deer cross at those locations. True story"
    Hey thanks for making a otherwise useless thread not a total waste of time and I really needed something like that today I would love to know the story behind that one

    There you go.
    http://www.break.com/index/move-a-deer-crossing-save-an--2379698
    Fret Madden likes this.
    10-18-12 08:26 PM
  21. TheScionicMan's Avatar
    The real question is Why NOT hope for BB10? If all of these other phones are the holy grail of smartphones, go use one. If it is that good, why would you look back to BB and even care? There must be something that they're not fulfilling if you're this concerned with BB10

    Just because you think of all of these things about BB and Android, etc. doesn't make it true.
    Toodeurep and rotorwrench like this.
    10-19-12 12:41 AM
  22. jonno_atamaniuk's Avatar
    Umm... do you currently use an Android device? I'm going to go with no....

    Speaking as an Android user who also has a Playbook and a Blackberry, one thing I have learned about Android is that it is 1 RIDDLED with bugs in comparison to QNX. I'll give you an example. I use skype on my device. After a recent skype update, whenever I went to do a video call, it would bring up my lock screen. Running OS 4.0 on my device, I was using the face unlock. The end result was that Skype would crash, ending the call immediately and causing great frustration. It wasn't until I disabled the face unlock (a feature highlighted by Google and many different OEMs as a great new feature) that Skype returned to operating normally. I won't go into how the longer screen of my device means many apps don't scale properly, stretch, or cut off in strange places. In other words, it doesn't work very well. People wonder why apps for BBOS would sometimes only be available for certain devices, this is exactly why! As well, not all apps are compatible with all Android devices. This is just how it is. Even some of the biggest name apps aren't universally compatible (though they come mighty close). Android is also not nearly as secure. In fact, that would be why XDA developers aren't interested in the Playbook and BlackBerry. It's incredibly secure, and designed (generally) to stay that way. People who are privacy minded or work in an environment where they need a secure device tend to go with either Blackberry OS or iOS for this specific reason. It's not as simple as adding security code. Android is open source, always has been and always will be. In order to make an OS secure, it takes more than just a few lines of secure code, or else Google would have already pushed for that so their devices would be able to take a stronger presence within the workplace.

    For me, my reasons for waiting are as follows:

    1. BlackBerry OS on the Playbook I find runs far better (more smooth within apps and significantly better with memory management giving the true multitasking capability) than OS 4.0 Android in my own personal testing. Take note, this isn't BBOS 10.x, this is PB OS 2.1.

    2. Flash support looks like it will continue further on as it seems to be baked right into the OS, where as Android is dropping support as of 4.1 to the best of what I have been able to read and observe. Yes, i'm aware HTML5 is becoming the new standard, but so far the QNX browser scores among the best for HTML5 scores.

    3. QNX is more stable than Android. Always has been, almost a guarantee it always will be. I have experienced few crashes of applications in comparison to my Android device.

    4. Blackberry devices (again from my own personal experience) tend to have better cellular reception than comparable devices from Android OEMs and Apple. If I'm on the edge of the network and in an emergency, I'd like my call to go through thanks .

    5. Navigation of BB10 is (in my personal opinion) looking significantly easier than navigation of Android. I actually like that from anywhere I can get to my messages. ANY app (including games) I will be able to stop what I'm doing (while the app continues to run live, not just hang) and check my notifications, reply, then get back to whatever I was doing before.

    you are right in your OP that certain things aren't guaranteed. But some of the things sort of tie in to one another. Why wait until Q1 (not mid, mid = Q2 or Q3) to launch? Well they want to work out as many of the bugs as possible to give one of the best experiences possible. They don't necessarily want to flub something like maps or the typing experience, or leave major vulnerabilities just sitting there (like the major problem malware used to be and sometimes still can be within even the Android Market). App support is not a guarantee. That said, Android didn't start off with a boatload of apps, nor did the iPhone. Developer support wasn't a guarantee for them, but a new platform OFTEN (not always, but often) attracts developer support because it's a new place for them to push their products when another platform's shop becomes incredibly full and hard to find your own app in. That and the incredibly large amount of support RIM is offering to developers shows that they are working to wards gaining more support from devs. And while I kinda agree from a client / customer standpoint that a 2013 launch, missing the coveted Christmas shopping season, doesn't make sense... I believe them when they say that carriers (you know, the people who actually sell the devices) are more supportive of a 2013 launch than a Christmas 2012 launch. Staff have to be trained about what sets one device out from the rest. If they were aiming for a Christmas season launch, they'd have to start training people some time in November... and no one would be able to attend/make time for training for that because front line sales people are already becoming swamped with clients/customers for numerous different things (remember, some places sell more than just cell phones). They would not get the training we need to give RIM the fighting chance they need in order to pull off a great device launch. Carriers want RIM to succeed, I believe that whole-heartedly and I do see it personally. If you don't believe any of what I say on that, well... go to your local carrier store, ask to be served by the most recent hire, if they've only been there for a few days, well... that's the kind of experience you'd get if RIM aimed for a December launch. They don't want that, I don't believe carriers would want that (just imagine the feedback from clients who get sub-par service), and I don't think anyone here wants that to happen either.

    As far as RIM existing, well... they seem to feel they have enough cash on hand to push themselves through another few quarters, and I don't doubt 'em to be honest. So I'm more than happy to wait... both as a user of BlackBerries, and an Android user looking forward to ditching that OS to work with something significantly more stable.
    Last edited by jonno_atamaniuk; 10-19-12 at 02:17 AM.
    10-19-12 02:05 AM
  23. Bakamushi's Avatar
    Quoted by Superfly_FR, T. Heins wrote :

    We took the conscious decision not to go Android. If you look at other suppliers’ ability to differentiate, there’s very little wiggle room. We looked at it seriously – but if you understand what the promise of BlackBerry is to its user base it’s all about getting stuff done. Games, media, we have to be good at it but we have to support those guys who are ahead of the game. Very little time to consume and enjoy content – if you stay true to that purpose you have to build on that basis. And if we want to serve that segment we can’t do it on a me-too approach.
    And this is how users are feeling (those who are not fanboys and/or have a social/professional life) :

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/16/te...nted=all&_r=1&

    For my part I started to have doubts when I had to reboot the pb in front of a friend to show him something. It hurts more when you are with someone. It took so long that I had to suggest we do something else in the meanwhile. My doubts were confirmed when I bought my Samsung 7.7, which boots in 15 seconds or so.

    Then I came here and was told I risked losing guarantee if I rebooted, and also other peculiarities you hear exclusively here, like :

    - On PB there are legal limitations to downloading podcasts to Europe, which happen not to exist on Windows, Mac, Android, Linux and all other OS
    - You are a troll if you want a vertical mail app to type with your thumbs on 7" tablet
    - No need for apps on a small screen, the browser is better

    Sometimes I wondered if RIM didn't have special meetings in order to stop fanboys from ridiculing them.
    10-19-12 04:04 AM
  24. Toodeurep's Avatar
    Troll thread is trolling...
    Having never met a troll, I would like to be prepared. Do I offer dried food or do they prefer the "fresh" variety from an easy open can?

    I really like your work peter9477, thanks for all you do.
    10-19-12 06:12 AM
  25. zorecati's Avatar
    Quoted by Superfly_FR, T. Heins wrote :



    And this is how users are feeling (those who are not fanboys and/or have a social/professional life) :

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/16/te...nted=all&_r=1&

    For my part I started to have doubts when I had to reboot the pb in front of a friend to show him something. It hurts more when you are with someone. It took so long that I had to suggest we do something else in the meanwhile. My doubts were confirmed when I bought my Samsung 7.7, which boots in 15 seconds or so.

    Then I came here and was told I risked losing guarantee if I rebooted, and also other peculiarities you hear exclusively here, like :

    - On PB there are legal limitations to downloading podcasts to Europe, which happen not to exist on Windows, Mac, Android, Linux and all other OS
    - You are a troll if you want a vertical mail app to type with your thumbs on 7" tablet
    - No need for apps on a small screen, the browser is better

    Sometimes I wondered if RIM didn't have special meetings in order to stop fanboys from ridiculing them.
    The reboot issue has been gone over many times. It's the price you pay for a secure device. I think I've rebooted mine 8 to 10 times not including os updates.

    I've read the article. I'd figure that if you are that shallow that you actually care about what other folks think of you by the phone/tablet you use, perhaps there lies the problem. If you want to write emails and text and get work done, you use a blackberry. If you want to play angrybirds and watch a cat talk, get an iPhone or android.

    Please sell your pb and stop posting here. You are terrible at it.

    - Fanny McFanboy
    10-19-12 08:20 AM
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