07-17-13 01:53 PM
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  1. bp3dots's Avatar
    Ahh, I was responding only to the comment re: Buyer Beware. I have to agree, the rant you responded to is childish and antagonistic. That said, I still think they too may have been impacted by the "false and misleading" statement issue I have alluded to.

    Thanks for being level headed and concise in your responses. I MUCH prefer the intelligent discussion over emotion and name calling
    The sad part is, this whole debacle would be a non issue if he'd just left it at "we're working on it, and will update if possible."
    playbook_swiper1 likes this.
    07-03-13 03:50 PM
  2. kraschute's Avatar
    This person is obviously not someone who got a device that worked for them now. That is what i meant. Your situation sounds different.
    - I can continue with the list, like no Caldav working because I'm only allowed to enter a email address as user login...
    - No real navgiation that works offline...GPS is pretty useless like this
    - and and and

    The only way living with these minors was patiently waiting for BB10 on the PB and do not beleave this bull**** he was telling. The only reason is he doesn't want to invest money anymore on the Playbook. They do not plan to release a future table so why adopting BB10 to that form factor...BB10 will be a phone only OS, live with this that there will be no real ecosystem around...
    blueberrymerry likes this.
    07-03-13 05:01 PM
  3. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Have I ever "promised" and not delivered?
    I call bullsh*&
    07-03-13 05:41 PM
  4. bambinoitaliano's Avatar
    Ahh, I was responding only to the comment re: Buyer Beware. I have to agree, the rant you responded to is childish and antagonistic. That said, I still think they too may have been impacted by the "false and misleading" statement issue I have alluded to.

    Thanks for being level headed and concise in your responses. I MUCH prefer the intelligent discussion over emotion and name calling
    That's what you tube is for
    07-03-13 06:22 PM
  5. daglesj's Avatar
    Flying several thousand miles for a shareholder meeting just isn't in the cards, so get real.
    Re. this and other excuses I am surprised. After all, if we take how strongly the feelings some seem to have about this 'outrage', it would seem its a life and death issue.

    Ahem...So....back to reality, with a dose of persepctive, it's not really all that important is it!

    Let's see you are a bit pissed off at the moment...but that will pass give it a day or two. If it hasn't, may I recommend some therapy, a vacation...getting laid?

    And yes I am a shareholder in 8 companies and I have been to a few share holder meetings.
    07-03-13 07:43 PM
  6. njblackberry's Avatar
    Eight whole companies?
    Wow. That's great.
    07-03-13 07:44 PM
  7. daglesj's Avatar
    Eight whole companies?
    Wow. That's great.
    Yes and all of them make money and products people want to buy/use.

    Great isnt it.

    So I wouldnt buy BB stock.
    07-03-13 07:48 PM
  8. njblackberry's Avatar
    Because they have no demonstrable marketing skills, have found no way to differentiate their new products from others (that command over 90% of the market) and have lost all credibility with the investor community. And, while doing all of that, they somehow found a way to **** of a significant number of their most die-hard customers - the < 1% of tablet buyers who bought the Playbook.

    That's why I wouldn't buy BlackBerry stock.

    But you sound like you have done your homework, so feel free and buy the stock. An awful lot of it has been traded in the last three trading days. When it lost 30% of its value.
    07-03-13 07:52 PM
  9. godsfantasy's Avatar
    I think someone needs to go up to Heins and personally slap him multiple times across his face with a PlayBook. Afterwards, demand the team that was responsible for putting BB10 on the PB, and then give them the same treatment.
    07-03-13 08:15 PM
  10. FF22's Avatar
    Because they have no demonstrable marketing skills, have found no way to differentiate their new products from others (that command over 90% of the market) and have lost all credibility with the investor community. And, while doing all of that, they somehow found a way to **** of a significant number of their most die-hard customers - the < 1% of tablet buyers who bought the Playbook.

    That's why I wouldn't buy BlackBerry stock.

    But you sound like you have done your homework, so feel free and buy the stock. An awful lot of it has been traded in the last three trading days. When it lost 30% of its value.
    Has this always been the case? Did they have marketing that worked at one time or did bb phones penetrate to 70 million by mere word of mouth and corporate adoption. I guess I don't recall bb ads but I probably never watch cell phone commercials.
    07-03-13 09:27 PM
  11. njblackberry's Avatar
    Has this always been the case? Did they have marketing that worked at one time or did bb phones penetrate to 70 million by mere word of mouth and corporate adoption. I guess I don't recall bb ads but I probably never watch cell phone commercials.
    They had the best marketing plan of all - first mover advantage. In 1999 when I got the 950 it was revoluationary. Mobile e-mail. Unbelievable. Then they made it a phone! OK, so the 5710 was a terrible BB. And people loved it. Business, governments, military. Everyone loved it. There was no competition. Palm was for consumers. iPaqs (HP) were a mess. So they grew and grew. Legitimately and they did a great job.

    The problem with being the first mover is staying in front. And I guess everyone knows what happened in 2007 when the iPhone came out. And then Androids. Cheap phones that got e-mails and had "applications". And then companies allowed employees to choose their own. BYOD. All of this came together in a mobile worst case scenarios that BlackBerry ended up in. A Perfect Storm.

    So now it is an uphill battle and so far, the marketing has been subpar and they are trying to climb back to third place.
    FF22 likes this.
    07-03-13 09:34 PM
  12. blueberrymerry's Avatar
    First movers are the first to fall, unfortunately, unless they have such a huge lead in a relatively stagnant market that they retain that monopoly for years. Like MSFT.

    Nokia were once at the top of the smartphone market. They were the first to come up with a proper smartphone that ran Symbian when everyone else had simple phones that ran proprietary OSes without support for third party apps. Nokia sat on its arse for so long, making incremental tweaks and spending most of its energy with infighting, that it was caught unawares when Apple and Google re-defined the smartphone market.

    Maybe SOM can chime in?

    I think BBRY were doomed even before they started working on BB10. The company is stupid enough to think carriers and major corporations are its major customers; it didn't give a damn about the end users who actually used the devices. It's suicidal to keep thinking like this when the competition goes for consumers' wallets directly.

    If it had actually listened to customers, stupid BB10 launch bugs like a 30-day email limit and poor IMAP support would have been fixed before release. It's like the BB10 team plugged its ears with cotton, ignored all the criticism of the PlayBook's software, then proceeded to keep those same bugs in BB10. That shows extremely poor management where company divisions don't communicate.
    07-03-13 11:10 PM
  13. GV2012's Avatar
    I dont know who else watched the latest Podcast with Kevin Chris and the rest of the crew but when the topic of the PB and BBs discontinued give a ****, those guys didnt seem to care much about it either. They just seemed to do a verbal shoulder shrug and move on to bigger things. If I interpreted this wrong I apologize and will go back a view again but thats how I see it. Kevin hasnt chimed in here - I dont think he gives a **** about the PB. Im not making judgement either way - thats just how I saw it.
    FTR, I am a playbook owner - bought at fire sale. I would have liked the 10OS but as was mentioned the "promise" was done much after most of our purchases. I doesnt bother me that much that its there from a personal users pt of view however from a business/company pt of view I have never seen anything like what has gone on with this company over the last, 3+ years. I do own BB stock (though sold most of it a while ago)I have been an investor for a long time and the only time Ive seen such disfunctional management is when they turned out to be corporate criminals (I dont think this is the case here - just saying). The only saving grace for me with this company was when Prem came on board and he has said it will take years for this to turn around.
    blueberrymerry likes this.
    07-03-13 11:45 PM
  14. blueberrymerry's Avatar
    BBRY doesn't have years to turn things around, not when the competition is executing faster and with more innovation. Thor came onboard as CEO on 2012 and he promised a lot of changes to the company... most of which haven't materialized.

    And yes, I agree with you, Kevin and CB really don't give a sh!t about PB. It's old news, it looks bad for their benefactor (BBRY), so they would prefer to leave that elephant alone.
    godsfantasy and kraschute like this.
    07-03-13 11:50 PM
  15. Michel Souris's Avatar
    "&^(&^(&^(%^$ off !!!"
    07-04-13 10:10 AM
  16. nappp's Avatar
    "&^(&^(&^(%^$ off !!!"
    lmao!

    Sent from an ATM
    No trees were harmed during the making of this message
    07-04-13 10:50 AM
  17. kraschute's Avatar
    These Blackberry apologists are plain silly. You see, there was never a cake to begin with, or it was never promised, or it's not really your birthday according to the lunar calendar, or you don't deserve a cake, or or or... anything but the REALITY, which is that Thorsten betrayed the trust of the Blackberry community, and then hushed it up for who knows how many months just to unload their excess inventory.

    Guys, for all we know the Playbook was dead six months ago, there was no serious effort to bring BB10 to it, and Heins just didn't want to ruin the "BB10 platform of the future momentum". BARF

    BAAAAAARF
    I can't be more d'accord than with you and I'm also astonished by the stupidity brough forward here by some of the fellow forum members: The head of this defending and ignoring is Kevin - who like others respects no BB10 as understandable decison and now everyone should move on... this is thought too short and ignores that the complaining customers have every right to complain! BBRY is not our girlfriend and we do not have to make peace with BBRY again after being let down in such a way!

    Yes, there are reasons for all sides and a company which is failing(like BBRY) might not have the money for bringing an update to an unsuccessful older product. We do not say this is an invalid argumuent, but then we should openly speak about the real reasons why the BB10 update was canceled and not defend once more that nonsense of 2GB being a rational reason!

    They had plans and maybe it was stupid to communicate in this way to make everyone believe it will come. But I can only see only one reason for that and that's getting rid of the stocks piled up and maybe they also hoped a BB10 update would restart PB sells again...who knows but it seems they got rid of old PBs now and new sells do not justify anymore energy put on this topic - so they clearly did not deliver what they promised over the last month and for many 100000 people this was a reason to buy their products and even advetise BB10 for them. That's really shabby and unquestionable!

    They of course hoped that BB10 phones will bring them back on track much faster but instead it seems the ship is really burning now, so Thorsten needs to cut all losses to not ruin his balance completely (before he gets kicked out). With more BB10 phones sold they might have been more generous and could have afforded this "present" to their loyal supporters, but Thorsten probably has already cut this project 2 month ago... He's an incompetent manager and bad communicator (Just look at his Siemens past), so who the **** cares about loyal customers when you want to save your *** as CEO. He's not interested in the commuity. What he needs is positive numers or his days are counted! Do not expect anything from him. We could expect more from Kevin but he's also more a BBRY employee than a community leader!

    The 2GB is a really lame excuse because they could have always stripped it down a bit. If it's just 100000 customers, then who cares if these have a slim version of BB10 or not the optimum performance! Make the update optional or take some things out and say they are not possible while you could still code now apps also for the Playbook with the same tools as for the phones.
    The 2GB excuse is there for the media and the dumb believers - Generally speaking I also do not see here a lot of professional users or developers but a lot of BBRY fans that hope their BB10 phones aren't outdated in 6 month the same... So better step over the fallen bodies and keep on marching...the trumpet in the front still plays a music they think and they believe, they MUST believe the battle isn't over yet - otherwise they will be ****ed by Thorsten same as us in a few months (But please do not complain then!)

    They also won't ever bring a tablet anymore! They try to survive with the phones and if that strategy is not successful over the next 6 month, then it's definetely GAME OVER. You won't see the same BBRY after christmas and I bet investors will cut any future efforts earlier than later!

    We all see these reason, still we have the valid point, that a company like BBRY can't afford to waste another "army of loyal troops" just to survive a litle bit longer! The next battle will kill them because there is no one left to fight for them anymore beside some foolishly blind defenders who live in a pink world and are afraid to be kicked out of paradise in a few month together with their new phones. I promise. we will then stand by and watch with some popcorn how the remaining foolish fanboys will head into their last hopeless battle :-)

    There will be a lot of very cheap Z/Q10s that you can buy in 6 month I will promise you! You can pick them up from the defeated fanboys on the battlefield once this is all over :-)

    Now I became even a little bit literary - but i find it explains it quite well...
    Last edited by kraschute; 07-04-13 at 11:21 AM.
    07-04-13 11:10 AM
  18. lnichols's Avatar
    BlackBerry's biggest problem right now is the name BlackBerry. It simply isn't iconic anymore, and has too much negative baggage and a history of poor execution. They need to release the A series under some new branding, with the name BlackBerry nowhere found on the device or the marketing. Since they did such little marketing with the Z10 or Q10 showing what it can do,they could pull it off. Think of it how Toyota created the brands Lexus and Scion and no one, other than car people, really associates them with Toyota. They should have done this with the Z10 and Q10.

    The BlackBerry name got them to 80 Million, but it is now hurting them more than helping them, especially since the new devices share absolutely nothing with the old ones.

    Posted via CB10
    07-04-13 11:12 AM
  19. lexluthorxx's Avatar
    Kraschute writes: ............................................this is thought too short and ignores that the complaining customers have every right to complain! BBRY is not our girlfriend

    (forgive me, my friend....i didn't read it all)


    but...as for blackberry not being your girlfriend....then why do i feel i've been f**ked?
    victorshikhman likes this.
    07-04-13 11:45 AM
  20. kraschute's Avatar
    The BlackBerry name got them to 80 Million, but it is now hurting them more than helping them, especially since the new devices share absolutely nothing with the old ones.

    Posted via CB10
    Maybe Lamiu? So it follows the Lumia brand , but sounds more like Lame :-)
    07-04-13 11:46 AM
  21. chaosdivine's Avatar
    I actually think BlackBerry will bring BB10 back to tablets but just not for another year - if they survive until then (they want the PlayBook to die a good death first and let the dust settle from the blowback). They will be forced to do this (I mean, the marketplace is still VERY tablet orientated) and how Thorsten thinks that a phone will supplant all tablets is beyond me - he must have been doing some Peyote with his mates when he brainstormed that idea...

    By then the hardware issue of the current generation PlayBook not being able to support BB10 is moot. Technology will have advanced a LOT by then and everyone will be looking for 2GB of RAM on a tablet (or better). Then they'll be like, oh, well we had a change of heart and our customers say that they want BB 10 on a tablet - we love and listen to our customers...blah, blah, blah - *cough, cough B.S!

    Anyhow, not everyone likes reading on a tiny screen - me especially. I bought the PlayBook because it has a small enough form factor to be useful, comfortable and portable. I do have a 10 inch screen device too and it is a much different user experience. It's awesome for on screen usage (web browsing and games especially) but it's NOT as portable, light or convenient to tote around with you.

    You wait, BB 10 or 11 will be on a BB tablet someday...just not our PlayBooks. But the question will be, is it too late for anyone left to care by then?
    Dave XII likes this.
    07-04-13 12:33 PM
  22. playbook_swiper1's Avatar
    I call bullsh*&
    And that is your perogative. However, if you read the entire quote, I always quantify when I take on a task the risk of failure. I will "attempt", but I will not gaurantee a successful resolution. It's rather easy when you know your own limitations and are not to egotistical to assume you can do everything all the time.
    07-04-13 01:25 PM
  23. Dave XII's Avatar
    IF Thorsten thinks that a phone will supplant all tablets is beyond me - he must have been doing some Peyote with his mates when he brainstormed that idea...
    Lovely said, this guy is living on some other planet. Ridiculous. But assume there will be a management change soon, anyway.
    Just imagine how stupid his thinking is, because even IF there will be no tablets in 5yrs or so from now; Apple and competition will sale hundreds of million devices till then. To say, one company can not afford 'not to' have a tablet in its portfolio these days.
    chaosdivine likes this.
    07-04-13 01:50 PM
  24. victorshikhman's Avatar
    I know many people (including me) are still hoping that when Heins said BB would continue supporting the current Playbook OS, it means we'll at least get some lower-level updates - Cascades, Browser, Android Runtime, etc.

    As far as I know, only one BB fan site predicted that the BB10 upgrade would be cancelled - BBOS. Here is their post from a few weeks back explaining why, referencing anonymous contacts within Blackberry:

    BlackBerryOS.com - BlackBerry 10 Is Not Coming To PlayBook And Here's Why

    It's a very detailed article and the predictions made were completely proven right. I emailed the author to see if I could find out more:

    Hello,

    I'm a recently devastated Playbook owner. I just now found your article from a couple of weeks back where you predicted that the Playbook would not get the OS10 update. However, you did mention that some kind of update is in store, likely Bridge support. Have any of your contacts mentioned/winked that features like Cascades and the Jelly Bean run time would make it into that update? Having access to most BB10 apps (Skype!!!!, BBM, Whatsapp, etc.)would resolve 99% of my angst about being lied to and manipulated.

    Or is Blackberry just flipping the consumer off and planning to push only Bridge-BB10 functionality to keep all those business that deployed Playbook from delaying BB10 upgrades?

    If you can, please find out and write a post about it. Either way, it would put a lot of people's minds to rest.

    Thank you,
    -Victor
    I just received his response:

    Hi Victor,

    Right now, the team and I are in the dark about what updates will be coming to the PlayBook. It was difficult enough extracting information that the update wouldn't be coming!

    I'd love to see the stuff you've mentioned as that would really make a huge difference. I doubt that will be the case though, as it most likely would have been mentioned when it was officially stated.

    Right now, I'd just take the BB10 browsing engine

    If we hear any more, we will of course publish it but right now we're in a "wait and see" situation.

    John
    The reason I am posting this is to dispel certain people's illusions and delusions that Blackberry will push out any update to Playbook, or do something, ANYTHING without intense and consistent pressure from us, its once loyal customers, demanding that the company and Thorsten Heins keep their promises.

    Everyone who doesn't want this update or is sneering at those of us who do can go take a hike. I'm not at all interested in your lame defenses of this indefensible, unacceptable and as I've laid out in multiple posts now, ultimately counterproductive decision to throw some 2.5 million Blackberry customers under the bus. I can't fathom your contempt for fellow Blackberry fans, telling us to shut up and take this betrayal with a smile on our face.

    Blackberry COULD push out updates to give us Playbook owners Cascades, Jelly Bean, Bridge and three or four other key features at exceptionally little cost to the company. The code is already there, waiting for a decision. And if we push hard enough, NOW, they WILL.
    FF22, nappp, chaosdivine and 1 others like this.
    07-04-13 02:10 PM
  25. Dave XII's Avatar
    Guys, please stop dreaming. PB is dead. It's over. Why don't you understand this?? Only as a proof, I called PB helpdesk because of an issue with email client . Linked to my question about updates I was told "no further updates or patches will be provided for the PB". But that's no news. Simply, what Heins said last week already. No BB 10 no PB OS 3. You have to take it.
    kb5zht likes this.
    07-04-13 04:53 PM
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