12-03-12 05:04 PM
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  1. airjoe#CB's Avatar
    Comment about apps, as I think some people seem to really minimize them. Yes, some are bad or bloated versions of what you can do online.

    Where some apps really shine are things like Time or Sports Illustrated - where, yes, you download using wifi (eg at home), and then when traveling you can have several magazine at your disposal. Not only that, but the embedded videos that they have put in there really shine when you compare to a paper version.

    So, I think there are apps which really make the iPad shine (offline) that many people who haven't experienced underestimate... just my opinion.
    02-08-12 08:05 AM
  2. leftypepper716's Avatar
    Just something I thought I would share, and maybe discuss...

    I bought my PB when the Nov. sale happened and I also bought one fr my brother and gf (both bday and xmas gifts combined for both). My uncle and cousin both bought iPads at the same time. We traded them during the holiday get together and as of last week BOTH my uncle and cousin have purchased PBs as well as two of my other uncles that used my PB that day.

    The PB ay not have sold well in the start, but it is picking up A LOT of steam BECAUSE of he sale and getting units in peoples hands. I show my PB to EVERYONE and if everyone else does the same im sure we can get some TRUE publicity for this product.

    I will recommend this to ANYONE (especially the 64GB for $300)

    - Browser rocks (compared to other mobile devices)
    - Quality is top notch (IMO)
    - Price is very affordable for the great specs you get
    - QNX is GREAT
    - LOTS MORE!


    What do you think (I know this mayhas been done before, but I think that it would be cool to share 'conversion' stories)
    I tried out the Playbook last year when it 1st came out at Best Buy, and I really liked it, so when they dropped the price to $199.00, I was VERY tempted to get one, but after a few trips to Best Buy comapring the ipad2 & Playbook, I chose the ipad2 (even though it was $200 more.) And not being an Appleboy, I really LOVE my ipad2. I think I've got the best of all worlds, a wonderful Sprint Bold 9930 (best smartphone I've ever owned) an ipod touch 4th gen (which I have an HDMI adapter that I plug in my TV and watch Netflix thru my ipod touch) and the ipad2 (which I can watch Brighthouse cable TV on and the apps!!! wow)
    02-08-12 08:47 AM
  3. Economist101's Avatar
    And since with the playbook we bridge through our Berries, this is a clear advantage above expensive dataplans for the IPAD.
    And yet I keep reading that the smartphone market is young (mostly regarding RIM comeback hopes), and that most people still use feature phones. For those people, it's not "free Bridge through BB or expensive data plan," but rather "iPad data plan or expensive smartphone device + voice + data." As you can imagine, the math there is significantly different, and no longer favors Bridge. Add to this that despite 75+ million BB users, we only have 850K documented shipments in the PBs first 7.5 months, so even if every single PB owner also owns a BlackBerry (and we assume they sold all 850K units plus another 150K since) you're still talking 1 in 75. (By comparison, the iPad ratio i read many months back was around 1 in 3, though I have no information on the number at present.)
    02-08-12 09:05 AM
  4. shn'g's Avatar
    I would like to point out that data usage depends only on the users habits, and not on the type of OS running. I don't see any logical reason to think that one OS uses more data than another, if both are generally accessing the same internet content. Sure the PlayBook will give a richer web experience with Flash and whatnot, but wouldn't that theoretically make it use more data than an iPad would? There is no real correlation that has been established between type of OS and an increase or decrease in amount of data consumed relative to another OS.
    Yeah like others have mentioned you are def wrong on this! the OS actually has a lot to do with it! I had a blackberry and used the same apps and same amount of time on both, but with blackberry I would use 250MB to 400 monthly. iPhone easily hits close to 1GB every time. It compresses almost every app better than iPhone does... I don't really care as 1GB is right where I need it to be for my plan and I enjoy using the iPhone. But ones who do care its a def bonus
    Last edited by shn; 02-08-12 at 09:13 AM.
    02-08-12 09:09 AM
  5. OttawaGabe's Avatar
    Yeah like others have mentioned you are def wrong on this! the OS actually has a lot to do with it! I had a blackberry and used the same apps and same amount of time on both, but with blackberry I would use 250MB to 400 monthly. iPhone easily hits close to 1GB every time. It compresses almost every app better than iPhone does... I don't really care as 1GB is right where I need it to be for my plan and I enjoy using the iPhone. But ones who do care its a def bonus
    I've only cracked the 1GB mark on my iphone + ipad a couple of times - and that's a combo of youtube and netflix when I'm not in wifi range.

    What are you doing to go over 1gb?

    "Same apps" also don't mean much if your videos are in HD on iOS but only SD on BB.
    02-08-12 09:53 AM
  6. Trevante's Avatar
    Just a little rectification to some comments above.

    It's not the phone that uses less or more data. But actually has to do everything with the combination of the OS and the NOC infrastructure. It's this combination which keeps BB users data usage low.

    First of all our internet is provided through RIM's infrastructure. So the data can be compressed. And luckily our Blackberries can decompress them. (OS + infrastructure)

    Second is the implementation of push which also gives us an advantage. Our apps (apps that make use of the push infrastructure) don't have to constantly go and check for updates, messages, notifications, etc. ... So we don't generate unnecessary data.

    And since with the playbook we bridge through our Berries, this is a clear advantage above expensive dataplans for the IPAD.

    I believe that this smartphone and tablet experience is the way to go. As a service provider I would push my customers towards Blackberries because they are not as heavy on the network as other smartphones. So capacity issues would be less common and heavy investments aren't always necessary. It actually saves them and the customer money. WIN- WIN anyone?
    But offcourse the IPAD dataplans also make them earn a lot of money so the question is which direction do they want to go?
    This is somewhat reasonable, but once again, you first have to consider the habits of the user, in addition to the capabilities of the device. With the majority of Blackberries having smaller screens (and depending on how old the model is, it may not even have wifi), users aren't as likely to consume online media as much as they are on a device with a larger screen such as the iPhone/iPad. Not to mention that iOS, Android, and even WP7 devices (to some extent) are designed for and marketed as media consumption devices. Blackberry devices, not so much. Someone who wants to watch Netflix or any other streaming video isn't going to buy a Blackberry, and someone owning a Blackberry with a smaller screen isn't as likely to watch videos on YouTube or else where because the device is not conducive to doing so.

    In addition to user habits/device capability factor, there's also the consideration of how well the OS/NOC actually compresses the data. Are there any real numbers as to how much less data a Blackberry may or may not use? We're hearing all the theories of data compression and whatnot, but where are the numbers at? If you go to Slickdeals.net: The best coupons, deals and bargains to save you money! (~10 KB) on your Blackberry, Android, iOS, WP7, or WebOS device, how much more or less data can one really expect to consume according to the platform being used? Is it actually a significant amount? It's not just as simple as data compression, it's about the results of that compression too.

    Yeah like others have mentioned you are def wrong on this! the OS actually has a lot to do with it! I had a blackberry and used the same apps and same amount of time on both, but with blackberry I would use 250MB to 400 monthly. iPhone easily hits close to 1GB every time. It compresses almost every app better than iPhone does... I don't really care as 1GB is right where I need it to be for my plan and I enjoy using the iPhone. But ones who do care its a def bonus
    Every time someone says "Platform X" uses more data than "Platform Y", there is never any actually a scientific method to the point being made. You using yourself (which already causes a sample size error) as an example of more or less data usage doesn't make any sense. As I mentioned previously, the data usage is determined mostly by the user's habits, not by the type of device they have.

    We don't know what apps you were running
    We don't know how you used those apps
    We don't know how often you used those apps
    We don't know if you didn't use wifi sometimes and 3G data other times and for long you did, if you did
    We don't know if you didn't use more data on your iPhone because it's a more data/media focused device
    We don't believe you, you need more people!

    There are probably a few other factors I'm forgetting, but the point remains that there is no particular reason to think going to a website on one platform is going to use significantly (major keyword) more data than another platform, if any at all.
    02-08-12 09:27 PM
  7. FSeverino's Avatar
    ^^^ with BB being used 'heavily' to check email you would think that they use a lot of data and what not... but all the articles i have read show iOS using the most data. im not sure if the articles were done scientifically or not, im just stating what i have read.
    02-09-12 12:58 AM
  8. Trevante's Avatar
    ^^^ with BB being used 'heavily' to check email you would think that they use a lot of data and what not... but all the articles i have read show iOS using the most data. im not sure if the articles were done scientifically or not, im just stating what i have read.
    But that's exactly my point, no one has actually done a scientific test to see if there's any tangible difference in data consumption. It's just a bunch of he-said-she-said lol. At the end of the day, it really just depends on how someone uses their phone, and not much else.

    And how does a BB "heavily" check data? Just because it's a Blackberry, does it check email any more or less than another OS would? Yes it's marketed as a device designed primarily for email, but does that mean that it uses more data when checking email? No, not at all. With push technology available on every platform (namely Exchange Activesync), most devices will sync about as much other devices on other platforms. I don't see any reason to assume a Blackberry would use more or less data when checking email vs another platform.
    02-09-12 02:27 AM
  9. jhanks64's Avatar
    That's completely carrier dependent, and given the fact we're likely not even in the same country, the comparison is even more meaningless.

    We have a separate corporate plan for the BB's at work, and emails don't count against data, they're treated separately - you still pay for it, just not the same way.

    I know some carriers charge extra for tethering, it's free on my carrier, and I only pay $5- more per month than the minimum data plan for 6gigs/mth.
    Often we have these discussions & some of the posters have not filled out any profile info. i wish Crackberry would gently push registered users to fill out device & carrier at least so we can just look under the username & see that info.
    02-09-12 03:00 AM
  10. jonno_atamaniuk's Avatar
    Love to hear about uses like this... great solutions.

    I think what most BB-PB owners forget when they think of bridging as a tool is that other platforms allow for multi-device hotspot. Now, for a guy like me, with a household of devices on the go, this is BIG.

    For singular use, bridge is fantastic. Great idea.
    multi-device hotspot is coming for BB OS 7.1. you could argue this is only for current devices and moot, but think on this... not all android devices got the bump up to 2.2 froyo to allow for mobile hotspot. the iPhone 3G got the iOS update to 4.1, but lacked mobile hotspot. I believe the 3Gs did too.

    with Bridge being compatible back to 5.0, it meant that someone with a 2-3 year old Blackberry Storm or even a Bold 9000 (the old king of the keyboards) that received the nod for an update to OS 5.0 could use bridge and all its features, making the Playbook a great browsing companion even if one had an older Blackberry.

    that all said, here is why Playbook was the better option for me personally. First and foremost, it truly is the full web in your hands. I think the only thing missing for compatibility in the web browser is support for Java Applets (not just Java support). But it honestly can do about 90% of the browsing my macbook does with no issue, whether i am on wifi or on the Bridge. Secondly, the size of these tablets is superb for not only for portability (mine goes everywhere with me, the same can be said for both my parents and their playbooks), but also for discretion. If i pull my playbook out on the subway with a certain style of case, it looks like a book. No iPad can be so easily disguised for use in public in places where let's be honest, theft happens. Third, it is designed for productivity right out of the box, especially with Word to Go, Sheets to Go, and Slideshow to Go pre-installed on the device. There is no need to spend an extra chunk of money on iWorks suite, though I will concede that yes Keynotes can create new slideshows right on the spot as opposed to just editing. Fourth is the ease of sync across the devices. If I do something in the calendar on the Playbook, it updates on my Torch and vice versa. This helps me because I don't have to adjust things on numerous devices. Then for me personally is the camera. Yeah I know I will be shooting most stuff with my phone and going back to the tablet afterwards, but sometimes I have my tablet right there, or it serves a purpose the phone doesn't (like self photography). While iPad has cameras and greater support for video editing right on the device (RIM ought to get developers on a great video editing app... maybe talk to Adobe about bringing a lighter edition of Premier over perhaps), the Playbook cameras are not only of printable quality, but the colour balancing is decent as well. Not to mention, full HD 1080p video versus 720P. And of course the multitasking capabilities...

    I will concede, the iOS environment has much more in the way of apps and a bit better graphical processing speed, but I do believe that as developers get onboard with the Playbook, both re-packaging android apps and developing their own QNX apps, we will see the Playbook and the new series of OS 10 devices take off as people start to look at what their needs are in a device and how iOS and Android aren't the only ones to satisfy their needs.
    02-09-12 03:33 AM
  11. Delil's Avatar
    This is somewhat reasonable, but once again, you first have to consider the habits of the user, in addition to the capabilities of the device. With the majority of Blackberries having smaller screens (and depending on how old the model is, it may not even have wifi), users aren't as likely to consume online media as much as they are on a device with a larger screen such as the iPhone/iPad. Not to mention that iOS, Android, and even WP7 devices (to some extent) are designed for and marketed as media consumption devices. Blackberry devices, not so much. Someone who wants to watch Netflix or any other streaming video isn't going to buy a Blackberry, and someone owning a Blackberry with a smaller screen isn't as likely to watch videos on YouTube or else where because the device is not conducive to doing so.

    In addition to user habits/device capability factor, there's also the consideration of how well the OS/NOC actually compresses the data. Are there any real numbers as to how much less data a Blackberry may or may not use? We're hearing all the theories of data compression and whatnot, but where are the numbers at? If you go to Slickdeals.net: The best coupons, deals and bargains to save you money! (~10 KB) on your Blackberry, Android, iOS, WP7, or WebOS device, how much more or less data can one really expect to consume according to the platform being used? Is it actually a significant amount? It's not just as simple as data compression, it's about the results of that compression too.



    Every time someone says "Platform X" uses more data than "Platform Y", there is never any actually a scientific method to the point being made. You using yourself (which already causes a sample size error) as an example of more or less data usage doesn't make any sense. As I mentioned previously, the data usage is determined mostly by the user's habits, not by the type of device they have.

    We don't know what apps you were running
    We don't know how you used those apps
    We don't know how often you used those apps
    We don't know if you didn't use wifi sometimes and 3G data other times and for long you did, if you did
    We don't know if you didn't use more data on your iPhone because it's a more data/media focused device
    We don't believe you, you need more people!

    There are probably a few other factors I'm forgetting, but the point remains that there is no particular reason to think going to a website on one platform is going to use significantly (major keyword) more data than another platform, if any at all.
    Offcourse the habits of a user are important. But I think you have all the different type of media- and data-consumers on all the big platforms. I don't know if you can segment people just by a particular platform. Eg: if you're keen on media and you can choose between iP4s, SGII or BB 9860 they all get the job done & they are all marketed and promoted as mediadevices. So there's a choice on different platforms for people with the same demands / same type of consumer.

    The BB's with the smaller screens and especially the older ones are definitely not streaming and video oriented but with my 9900 I can still do all that if I want too. Maybe it doesn't give me the same experience but it's good enough. I picked it more for productivity and the awesome keyboard (To be honest because it just looks Pro and sexy :-)).

    Concerning the NOC infrastructure I don't know how much the compression ratio is. And like you said we don't have any actual figures but I know it has a different ratio depending on the data. The only thing we can use here is user experience.
    I mentioned in another topic before that me and my cousin were on holiday in the US. He had a 3gs and I owned a Storm 9500 (no wifi). We are on the same carrier in Belgium. So we have the same roaming rates. I was constantly on BBM, FB, Twitter, Google Maps. He actually paid attention to his usage and tried to use wifi as much as possible. At the end of the month he paid more than I did for roaming cause he used more data.

    The only correct way to test would be to install a data monitoring app on phones from the different platforms and do some tests. Visit the same sites download files, play a game online, use apps etc...
    Maybe something for crackberry.com to do in collaboration with the other members of mobile nations.
    Last edited by Delil; 02-09-12 at 06:25 AM. Reason: typo's
    02-09-12 06:17 AM
  12. jamesbondOO7's Avatar
    I have both but prefer the PB: quicker and smarter in terms of UI.
    I use the iPad at home when I want a larger screen or to use the kindle reader. I also use it to watch TV during breakfast as my TV provider offers only an iPad or an Android app for that.
    I think it is great to be able to have both, but my heart goes with BlackBerry, not with Apple as I don't like the zealotism and the hype that go with it.
    02-09-12 07:02 AM
  13. Skrilla#CB's Avatar
    This is an excellent thread as both devices are great

    I'm in the market for a tablet and have been thinking about getting one for awhile now....since I have an iphone and also have a 2nd gen ipod touch i'm pretty satisfied as far as apple goes so i don't really see the need for an ipad especially at the price point it is at right now

    i've seen the playbook in best buy a couple times and never really played with it but it would be a wonderful compliment to my iphone imo and with the 16 gb priced at $199 thats a steal!
    02-09-12 01:42 PM
  14. FSeverino's Avatar
    But that's exactly my point, no one has actually done a scientific test to see if there's any tangible difference in data consumption. It's just a bunch of he-said-she-said lol. At the end of the day, it really just depends on how someone uses their phone, and not much else.

    And how does a BB "heavily" check data? Just because it's a Blackberry, does it check email any more or less than another OS would? Yes it's marketed as a device designed primarily for email, but does that mean that it uses more data when checking email? No, not at all. With push technology available on every platform (namely Exchange Activesync), most devices will sync about as much other devices on other platforms. I don't see any reason to assume a Blackberry would use more or less data when checking email vs another platform.
    by 'scientific' i mean double blind and every measurement measured PERFECTLY. Im sure that the people doing the tests in these articles did similar activities on each device, but doing something similar is not exactly scientific.

    For example i remember reading an article where a guy played the same youtube video on loop using both a BB and a iPhone. The iphone used almost double the data after an hour. Im not sure how 'scientific' that was, but i would consider that a fair test bc the exact same thing was done on each phone for the same time.

    Again, i OWN an iPhone. so im not bashing the iphone... in fact i believe that it is a better phone then the BBs that came out at the time of its release (thats why i bought it). Im just stating what i have read and discovered over time.
    02-09-12 02:19 PM
  15. reyger's Avatar
    great topic! enjoy both!
    02-09-12 02:33 PM
  16. jackyjack's Avatar
    The Kindle Fire better watch its back. For that extra $100, I think most people who handle both side by side will see that the PlayBook is the better buy (after OS 2.0 is released, or even now..). After we get the Android App Player running some of the "big name apps" people have been begging for, other than brand or size preference, I don't see how the iPad2 would have anything to make a PlayBook owner envious..
    Sorry but nothing beets iPad!!!!! The free apps on the iPad are worth 10 on the kindle fire so iPad best but kindle fire is really good am sister has got one xxx love ya all
    12-01-12 08:15 PM
  17. bdegrande's Avatar
    One thing that has changed a lot since this thread started is pricing. You can now buy an iPad mini AND a PlayBook for less than an iPad by itself when this thread started, so why not both? They complement each other well. The iPad has a huge edge in apps, the PlayBook has USB, HDMi, Flash in the browser, etc.
    12-01-12 08:28 PM
  18. FSeverino's Avatar
    and playbooks have also got a lot more support in the months since i started this thread. if anything, the release of the ipad mini shows just how awesome the pb is... because the mini is NOT better than the PB, even with the pb being 'dated'
    12-03-12 05:04 PM
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