[sad_old_man]

It came as a shock to all of us, we'll some of us, we'll actually probably just me, that the bridge functions that I used to enjoy are no longer available when you upgrade your handset to bb10. I will not dwell on my theory of an upgrade usually indicates enhancement of what you already have so that's enough of that.

Now here we go.

Having thought long and hard about this problem (well 10mins in the bath last night actually) but never the less I did invoke the thought process at some point. I started thinking of how bridges are wondrous things that enable humans to do things that they couldn't do without them, like crossing a river without getting your feet wet. I was then drawn to the famous bridges in history like the San Francisco bridge, London bridge, the bridge across the stream in my garden, Brooklyn bridge, Sydney Harbour Bridge etc etc. When comparing them to the BB bridge one thing was strikingly obvious and that is that the BB bridge is the only one that doesn't work anymore.

Now I do understand that lots of great bridges that did exist at one time now don't work anymore. Normally this is due to age, financial cost of upkeep etc etc. However the BB bridge functionality or should I say lack of it was man made was it not? Having come to this conclusion the rest of the puzzle was simple to solve.

The only famous bridge that I know of in history (remember I'm british) that was created by humans to the point that it worked perfectly and then for no sensible reason the same human beings who created it destroyed it was 'The Bridge on the River Kwai'. With me so far?

My thoughts therefore are that the god Thor (bb version of course not the comic book one) is actually Japanese or has watched the film and is trying to make a name for himself in the historic annuls of Bridge history by creating his own version of the disaster in modern times.

How about that then for a thought whilst just having a bath. I have lots more thoughts when I'm on the toilet but that's for another thread.

[thatplaybookguy]

I don't like this.

[Gooseberry Falls]

Watch out! S_O_M is only familiar with Sock Theory. Don't give any credence to his other "theories".

[FF22]

S_O_M

I like it. Terrific. I am sorry, well, A_S_O_M (another sad .....) that I cannot give this more likes or even a LOVE!

But maybe Thor is doing a Bunny Hop, two foward, one back, repeat.

The loss of Bridge features is sadder than, well, a S_O_M. I am not sure what they were thinking. But, again, I'm not sure that they were actually thinking.

You know, there will be those who step forward and say, once again, they don't miss the features. FINE. Really, not everyone has to like or miss the same things. But give us the option. Those who liked those features can use them, the others can ignore them. The Kwai, oh, Rim Bridge had that option. There were check-off boxes and you can disable/disengage those Bridge functions you did not want. I did not have Tasks showing on my pb. I don't like Tasks - ask Madame X!!!!

Salud. L'Chaim. Bottom's up (no, not that bottom)

[BuzzStarField]

I
The only famous bridge that I know of in history (remember I'm british) that was created by humans to the point that it worked perfectly and then for no sensible reason the same human beings who created it destroyed it was 'The Bridge on the River Kwai'. With me so far?.

...but your analogy breaks down because Thor did not destroy his bridge - he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it. I do miss PIM integration between my PB and smartphone and I am a bit peeved that the workarounds are unwieldy. But I can still use the other Bridge functions:
1. I can use the remote control features on my smartphone to control my PB
2. When WiFi is not available to my PB, I can access the internet via my smartphone.
3. I can open File Manager on my PB and access the file system on my device (and SDCard if present)
4. I can take advantage of PB's larger screenby opening web pages and documents on my smartphone and using the "Open on PlayBook" functions

[FF22]

...but your analogy breaks down because Thor did not destroy his bridge - he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it. I do miss PIM integration between my PB and smartphone and I am a bit peeved that the workarounds are unwieldy. But I can still use the other Bridge functions:
1. I can use the remote control features on my smartphone to control my PB
2. When WiFi is not available to my PB, I can access the internet via my smartphone.
3. I can open File Manager on my PB and access the file system on my device (and SDCard if present)
4. I can take advantage of PB's larger screenby opening web pages and documents on my smartphone and using the "Open on PlayBook" functions

Ah, so "open on pb" still exists on the z10 or bb10 devices?

[sad_old_man]

...but your analogy breaks down because Thor did not destroy his bridge - he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it. I do miss PIM integration between my PB and smartphone and I am a bit peeved that the workarounds are unwieldy. But I can still use the other Bridge functions:
1. I can use the remote control features on my smartphone to control my PB
2. When WiFi is not available to my PB, I can access the internet via my smartphone.
3. I can open File Manager on my PB and access the file system on my device (and SDCard if present)
4. I can take advantage of PB's larger screenby opening web pages and documents on my smartphone and using the "Open on PlayBook" functions

"he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it."

Exactly the same as the bridge over the Kwai. The British just changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it, from trains carrying supplies, troops civilians to the native jungle monkey, spiders and other such entities.

"I can take advantage of PB's larger screenby opening web pages and documents on my smartphone and using the "Open on PlayBook" functions".

Strangely enough I could do the same thing straight from my pb screen before "he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it.".

Here's a small thought but significant in my world while I'm trying to get my head around what this supposed world class CEO will screw up next!

"MR CEO THORSTEN WOULD YOU PLEASE STOP TRYING TO DO THINGS YOUR NOT CAPABLE OR EQUIPPED TO DO AND RETURN TO WHATEVER IT IS YOUR GOOD AT".

Or at least please credit the members of this forum with the respect they deserve and LISTEN TO WHAT (they) YOUR CUSTOMER BASE IS SAYING ABOUT THE PRODUCT THEY LOVE!

ps sorry for shouting but I had to get it off my chest. I feel better now. Oh and please don't pm me telling me that your going to fix everything in the next update or I will stamp my feet and scream until I'm sick!

[BuzzStarField]

Ah, so "open on pb" still exists on the z10 or bb10 devices?

Yes, for example you can open a pdf file on the Z10 and when you click on the share icon, you are offered thee option to open it on your playbook. When you are browsing a web page in the z10 browser and open the "share" menu, you can display it in the PB browser. Same thing applies to the pictures app on the z10.

[BuzzStarField]

"he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it."

Exactly the same as the bridge over the Kwai. The British just changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it, from trains carrying supplies, troops civilians to the native jungle monkey, spiders and other such entities.

"I can take advantage of PB's larger screenby opening web pages and documents on my smartphone and using the "Open on PlayBook" functions".

Strangely enough I could do the same thing straight from my pb screen before "he merely changed the nature of the traffic that crosses over it.".

Here's a small thought but significant in my world while I'm trying to get my head around what this supposed world class CEO will screw up next!

"MR CEO THORSTEN WOULD YOU PLEASE STOP TRYING TO DO THINGS YOUR NOT CAPABLE OR EQUIPPED TO DO AND RETURN TO WHATEVER IT IS YOUR GOOD AT".

Or at least please credit the members of this forum with the respect they deserve and LISTEN TO WHAT (they) YOUR CUSTOMER BASE IS SAYING ABOUT THE PRODUCT THEY LOVE!

ps sorry for shouting but I had to get it off my chest. I feel better now. Oh and please don't pm me telling me that your going to fix everything in the next update or I will stamp my feet and scream until I'm sick!

I can see that you are passionate about this issue. I agree that BBRY should replace the lost functionality and I think that they should improve it. My workaround involed setting up my email accounts on the PlayBook so that now I have the accounts set up on three separate devices - PB, Z10 and desktop (Outlook express). There is a slight delay in getting new posts synchronized on the three devices but I am pleasantly suprised that when I respond to an email on, say, my destop computer, the sent email finds its way onto both of my other devices. I used to have to send it to myself in order to have a record on my smartphone (and PB via Bridge).

My workaround for a family calendar is to start using Google's calender. I set up an account on PB, Z10 and I have always had desktop access. This arrangement is working much better than using only the local calandar on my smartphone because my new calendar can be shared more easily with the other members of my family.

Fact is, I wouldn't return to the previous Bridge way of doing things unless it could perform as well as my workarounds.

[FF22]

I can see that you are passionate about this issue. I agree that BBRY should replace the lost functionality and I think that they should improve it. My workaround involed setting up my email accounts on the PlayBook so that now I have the accounts set up on three separate devices - PB, Z10 and desktop (Outlook express). There is a slight delay in getting new posts synchronized on the three devices but I am pleasantly suprised that when I respond to an email on, say, my destop computer, the sent email finds its way onto both of my other devices. I used to have to send it to myself in order to have a record on my smartphone (and PB via Bridge).

My workaround for a family calendar is to start using Google's calender. I set up an account on PB, Z10 and I have always had desktop access. This arrangement is working much better than using only the local calandar on my smartphone because my new calendar can be shared more easily with the other members of my family.

Fact is, I wouldn't return to the previous Bridge way of doing things unless it could perform as well as my workarounds.

But you would not begrudge the rest of us an OPTION to do it the old way. At the moment, Rim/bbry has blown it away totally. No option - crippled bridge. Poor execution. Speaking of execution - someone could take a walk on a now short Bridge - the River Kwai awaits them down below.

[sad_old_man]

I agree that BBRY should replace the lost functionality and I think that they should improve it.

Then why break it in the first place?

My workaround involed setting up my email

My workaround for a family calendar

Although I do understand what you are trying to say, you are having to admit that the only way to use your brand new phone that was launched only several weeks ago and is supposed to be the saviour of the company the way you want to use it is to find workarounds?

Well either RIM have got something seriously wrong, or you purchased the wrong phone for your usage?

[BuzzStarField]

But you would not begrudge the rest of us an OPTION to do it the old way. At the moment, Rim/bbry has blown it away totally. No option - crippled bridge. Poor execution. Speaking of execution - someone could take a walk on a now short Bridge - the River Kwai awaits them down below.

To repeat: I agree that BBRY should replace the lost functionality and I think that they should even improve it. Having said that, I think that you may be just a tad over-dramatic in suggesting that Bridge is totally and irrevocably removed and/or crippled. Some aspects have actually improved - e.g. the remote control widget on the Z10 allows you to execute bezel swipes on the PlayBook.

Rather than promoting the idea that the bridge has been blown, my optimistic nature makes me think that a better analogy would be that a lane has been temporarily closed while highway improvements are in progress. The highway on the BB10 side of the bridge is 10 lane freeway but the path on the PB side is still only a primary highway. It makes no sense to improve the bridge to BB10 standards until BB10 infrastructure arrives on the PB side.

[BuzzStarField]

I agree that BBRY should replace the lost functionality and I think that they should improve it.

Then why break it in the first place?

My workaround involed setting up my email

My workaround for a family calendar

Although I do understand what you are trying to say, you are having to admit that the only way to use your brand new phone that was launched only several weeks ago and is supposed to be the saviour of the company the way you want to use it is to find workarounds?

I'm not saying this at all. What I am saying is that my new phone is just fine. The link between my new phone and my PB doesn't work quite the way I want but this is not nearly the disaster that you claim it to be.It's a matter of perspective. You like to think that the bridge has been demolished; I prefer to think that it is under construction and therefore a slight detour is required. I know my blood pressure is not in the danger zone. How is yours?

[sad_old_man]

I'm not saying this at all. What I am saying is that my new phone is just fine. The link between my new phone and my PB doesn't work quite the way I want but this is not nearly the disaster that you claim it to be.It's a matter of perspective. You like to think that the bridge has been demolished; I prefer to think that it is under construction and therefore a slight detour is required. I know my blood pressure is not in the danger zone. How is yours?

The link between my new phone and my PB doesn't work quite the way I want but this is not nearly the disaster that you claim it to be.It's a matter of perspective.

You like to think that the bridge has been demolished; I prefer to think that it is under construction and therefore a slight detour is required.

I salute you sir. That's the exact type of thinking that the captain of the titanic had when he uttered the immortal words," Please remain calm, the ship is in no danger, now would anyone like more ice in their gin and tonic?".

My blood pressure is fine as I have to have it checked on a very regular basis. They don't let humans fly unless we are twice as fit as birds? How's yours? Oh sorry I forgot how remiss of me, the captain of the titanic is no longer with us so you will have very LOW blood pressure then?

Don't forget I have two Z10s so I know twice as much about how crap they are as you do!

[BuzzStarField]

[HL]
Don't forget I have two Z10s so I know twice as much about how crap they are as you do!

I humbly defer to your greater wisdom. While we are on the subject of BB Bridge and email, why do you suppose that there two sets of PIM apps on a bridged PlayBook? Why did one set only work over WiFi and the other, completely unconnected set, mirror our smartphones? I personally think that this arrangement was a complete mess and I think that BBRY's long term goal is to fix this problem. Furthermore, I believe that the email accounts on PB require a totally different mechanism in order to synchronize them with the smartphone side. I could be wrong but this seems like a major undertaking that will undoubtedly be part of migrating BB10 to the PB.. Do you think still that the launch of the Z10 should have been delayed in order to overhaul bridge email on the PB?

[sad_old_man]

I humbly defer to your greater wisdom. While we are on the subject of BB Bridge and email, why do you suppose that there two sets of PIM apps on a bridged PlayBook? Why did one set only work over WiFi and the other, completely unconnected set, mirror our smartphones? I personally think that this arrangement was a complete mess and I think that BBRY's long term goal is to fix this problem. Furthermore, I believe that the email accounts on PB require a totally different mechanism in order to synchronize them with the smartphone side. I could be wrong but this seems like a major undertaking that will undoubtedly be part of migrating BB10 to the PB.. Do you think still that the launch of the Z10 should have been delayed in order to overhaul bridge email on the PB?

No not at all!!! The playbook launch should have been delayed until the OS was finished and fit for purpose. It's only taken two years to achieve that. The, I can only say Z10 because even though they run the same bb10 OS, and RIM where only hitting the market with 2, yes only 2 bb10 handsets, they don't seem bright enough to launch them at the same time. It's probably a good thing because one handset out on the market with an unfinished OS is better than two!

Just like the playbook bb10 has been released unfinished and by the time it's sorted out the end users will not want to touch bb10 under any circumstances. Sound a bit like the pb scenario to you?

[BuzzStarField]

Just like the playbook bb10 has been released unfinished and by the time it's sorted out the end users will not want to touch bb10 under any circumstances. Sound a bit like the pb scenario to you?

I think that we can agree to disagree on this particular point. I believe that some lessons were learned from the truly disastrous PB launch. The twin CEOs of the day were not up to the job, no doubt about it. The delayed and botched implementation of stand-alone email on the PB is testament to their folly and (as we discussed in this thread) BBRY is still struggling to fix the mess. However, I cannot agree that z10's launch is nearly as bad as you claim and that the current state of the BB Bridge is proof of Thor's incompetence and evidence of BB10's ultimate failure.

[sad_old_man]

I think that we can agree to disagree on this particular point. I believe that some lessons were learned from the truly disastrous PB launch. The twin CEOs of the day were not up to the job, no doubt about it. The delayed and botched implementation of stand-alone email on the PB is testament to their folly and (as we discussed in this thread) BBRY is still struggling to fix the mess. However, I cannot agree that z10's launch is nearly as bad as you claim and that the current state of the BB Bridge is proof of Thor's incompetence and evidence of BB10's ultimate failure.

You can talk to me with the optimistic view of what you wish it would be if it could be all day long. If you think that the Z10 is a finished product and capable of standing up against its rivals like the DROID and iphones out there then fine. Please don't merely take my word for it, read the Z10 forum on this very site. Read any of the technical/gadget review sites out there on the net. Unless I'm wrong none of them are actually gushing with enthusiasm about the new company saving Z10 and I do hope, I seriously do hope that the Q10 is actually finished before release or that will be another one that falls flat on its face like the Z10 has. The only thing disastrous about the pb launch is the product was nowhere near ready for market. Design was perfect, hardware platform was perfect, os was potentially superb but unfinished and in their grubby greedy little money grabbing attempts to grab their share of the new tablet market they released an unfinished product just to get market presence and hoped that the BB name would carry them through. Well we the loyal pb owners did just that and two years later we are still here having conversations like this one. However the handset market and the new younger smart phone user generation are not as loyal and have already marked the bb10 handsets as crap and that even before the Q10 has taken its first steps in the world. I don't make the rules on retail marketing, I just play by them.

[FF22]

Well, we clearly have two sides of the coin. The ever optimistic Buzz (head in the clouds) Starfield and the cynical me looking for one nice hint from BB that more is coming rather than allowing us to persist on the wing-and-prayer route. I'm not satisfied with the "less is more" concept when it comes to Bridge. I want to open my Memos on the pb and not have to take up space with them on the pb or worry about syncing them with the pb. I want the same for my email.

Is that going to happen. Buzz is hopeful and I'm at sea - no idea if it will ever come or what time frame or anything.

[BuzzStarField]

You can talk to me with the optimistic view of what you wish it would be if it could be all day long. If you think that the Z10 is a finished product and capable of standing up against its rivals like the DROID and iphones out there then fine. Please don't merely take my word for it, read the Z10 forum on this very site. Read any of the technical/gadget review sites out there on the net. Unless I'm wrong none of them are actually gushing with enthusiasm about the new company saving Z10 and I do hope, I seriously do hope that the Q10 is actually finished before release or that will be another one that falls flat on its face like the Z10 has. The only thing disastrous about the pb launch is the product was nowhere near ready for market. Design was perfect, hardware platform was perfect, os was potentially superb but unfinished and in their grubby greedy little money grabbing attempts to grab their share of the new tablet market they released an unfinished product just to get market presence and hoped that the BB name would carry them through. Well we the loyal pb owners did just that and two years later we are still here having conversations like this one. However the handset market and the new younger smart phone user generation are not as loyal and have already marked the bb10 handsets as crap and that even before the Q10 has taken its first steps in the world. I don't make the rules on retail marketing, I just play by them.

You appear to be upset when people you that they rather like their Z10s and do not think that it is total crap. You then extrapolate that they will hate their Q10s even before it is ever released. There is noting that BBRY can do to redeem themselves. I understand you completely. But what I don't understand is exactly what part of my asking you to "agree to disagree" don't you understand?

[TheScionicMan]

What is with the concept that because BlackBerry didn't put something into the FIRST version of a BRAND NEW OS, that this means that they don't WANT people to have it and took those options away to spite the end user and make their experience bad. Was BBOS left at version 1 with no improvements? Was the PB? Then why do people act like what you've got now is all that BlackBerry decided that you needed and is all you're going to get.

Why anyone would put up with so much angst and anger over a particular brand of phone is beyond me. If EVERY other phone does everything that people WISHED a BlackBerry would do, why in the world would you buy a BlackBerry??? Why not quickly buy your way into the utopian nirvana that is Android and Apple?

[El Platanero]

You lost me at hello

Posted via CB10

[FF22]

What is with the concept that because BlackBerry didn't put something into the FIRST version of a BRAND NEW OS, that this means that they don't WANT people to have it and took those options away to spite the end user and make their experience bad. Was BBOS left at version 1 with no improvements? Was the PB? Then why do people act like what you've got now is all that BlackBerry decided that you needed and is all you're going to get.

Why anyone would put up with so much angst and anger over a particular brand of phone is beyond me. If EVERY other phone does everything that people WISHED a BlackBerry would do, why in the world would you buy a BlackBerry??? Why not quickly buy your way into the utopian nirvana that is Android and Apple?

They removed a very unique feature or set of features that set bbphone and their compatible tablet apart from the competition. A competition that others seem to be winning on their unique features - more apps or the first to the goals post or both.

They published a blog that seemed to strongly suggest that those features were removed because they were surpassed by the new z10's (bb10) feature set and were redundant or unnecessary. Whether that blog was intended to be so vague is as up for discussion as most stuff out of rim. But it was their blog and their README in place of Bridge apps that precipitated a lot of this conjecture or angst. They REMOVED features that were a strong link between their products. That does not sound like a move intended to give people confidence in the follow through. No phone does everything everybody wishes it did. But some phones did some of the things people liked they did and wished that they continued. While "we shall see" is all well and good, sometimes a crumb might make folks feel more confident.

Their motto could be:

"We promise to make future promises! No more, no less"

[BuzzStarField]

Well, we clearly have two sides of the coin. The ever optimistic Buzz (head in the clouds) Starfield and the cynical me looking for one nice hint from BB that more is coming rather than allowing us to persist on the wing-and-prayer route. I'm not satisfied with the "less is more" concept when it comes to Bridge. I want to open my Memos on the pb and not have to take up space with them on the pb or worry about syncing them with the pb. I want the same for my email.

Is that going to happen. Buzz is hopeful and I'm at sea - no idea if it will ever come or what time frame or anything.

Our outlooks are not all that different, F2. I do not know when or even if Bridge will be restored to its former functionality. I thought that if I tried to explain some of my own theories regarding the missing bridge, I could counter Sad_Old_Man's contention that Thor has it in for us. To accept his premise is to accept his underlying theory that the Z10 is total crap and that everyone knows it. I don't think this is even remotely true.

More likely, the missing bridge functions have to do with project management decisions made during the planning process. We don't like that the Q10 took a hit and that the bridge lost a coin toss and that we have to wait and wait some more for BB10 to come to the PlayBook. But the reality is what it is. Delivery of the Z10 hardware with an arguably finished OS was of paramount importance.

I stand by my position. The bridge has not been abandoned, it is in a state of flux. Improvements are likely on the way. If RIM has abandoned the concept of an integrated smartphone-tablet package, then they would not have gone to the effort of building all the slick sharing features into the (somewhat crippled) BB10 bridge. I wanted to correct the common misconception that the bridge was totally removed. I am sorry that I got sidetracked in a silly discussion with Sad_Old_Man but them's the breaks, I guess. I've moved on.

[sad_old_man]

Our outlooks are not all that different, F2. I do not know when or even if Bridge will be restored to its former functionality. I thought that if I tried to explain some of my own theories regarding the missing bridge, I could counter Sad_Old_Man's contention that Thor has it in for us. To accept his premise is to accept his underlying theory that the Z10 is total crap and that everyone knows it. I don't think this is even remotely true.

More likely, the missing bridge functions have to do with project management decisions made during the planning process. We don't like that the Q10 took a hit and that the bridge lost a coin toss and that we have to wait and wait some more for BB10 to come to the PlayBook. But the reality is what it is. Delivery of the Z10 hardware with an arguably finished OS was of paramount importance.

I stand by my position. The bridge has not been abandoned, it is in a state of flux. Improvements are likely on the way. If RIM has abandoned the concept of an integrated smartphone-tablet package, then they would not have gone to the effort of building all the slick sharing features into the (somewhat crippled) BB10 bridge. I wanted to correct the common misconception that the bridge was totally removed. I am sorry that I got sidetracked in a silly discussion with Sad_Old_Man but them's the breaks, I guess. I've moved on.

Just being a simple sort of person I struggle with the concept of any manufacturer that "enhances" an existing product by disabling, temporarily or not part of its functionality. It's a bit like a drunk walking home, one step forward and two steps backwards!

Come to think of it my new car is being delivered next week. I must remember to check if the manufacturers have temporarily disabled the electrically operated convertible roof which is fitted to my current model?

At least even you MUST admit that bb should have at least mentioned somewhere in their hyper blurb that buyers of the new Z10 would not be able to enjoy the benefits of BIS or the bridge functions! It would have been nice would it not. They might not have had as many Z10s returned if they had. I would dearly love to see the statistics of units sold since release date vs units returned since release date.