- sorry but I call BS on this, I have the RT which isn't as full OS as the pro and I am 1000000X more productive on my RT than I ever was with the Playbook! also just the user interface is more smooth and robust than the Playbook, and the reason why I like the RT so much is the fact that it's sorta like a QNX OS where you have those bezel swipes and stuff! So I can't fathom your Surface PRO not being better or more productive than your Playbook or that having a FULL Windows 8 on a tablet is half interested by MS. please don't be like the other people by spreading disinformation!
So RT allows legacy Windows programs to run? You may be right - the impression was that the RT needed specially programmed apps like other proprietary OS's like the pb, android and ipad.
But, for the moment I am over my looking for another tablet. That could change but I'll stick with the pb. I've got apps to allow it to serve reasonably well. Yes, I would certainly have loved it to be bb10-capable so that new apps would have been available and for the improved browser. I trust rim (bb will be reserved for when they do something right) as far as I can throw Thor - not very much, in other words.09-01-13 10:36 PMLike 0 - sorry but I call BS on this, I have the RT which isn't as full OS as the pro and I am 1000000X more productive on my RT than I ever was with the Playbook! also just the user interface is more smooth and robust than the Playbook, and the reason why I like the RT so much is the fact that it's sorta like a QNX OS where you have those bezel swipes and stuff! So I can't fathom your Surface PRO not being better or more productive than your Playbook or that having a FULL Windows 8 on a tablet is half interested by MS. please don't be like the other people by spreading disinformation!
My opinion on W8.1 + Pro 128 is not something for you to decide for me. It has not been a smooth or pleasant experience in many cases. It does do what I need it to do (otherwise I wouldn't use it) and under performs in ways I'd like to see resolved.
There are major bugs, especially in 8.1 (i.e. Skydrive is completely useless) which is a major issue for me (Skydrive is my 'temp' data mirror folder shared among all my PCs/laptops/tablets for development).
The tablet is very akward in many instances such as:
- non auto sensing api's for text entry (which should be automated as the OS registers you selected an input box)
- very limiting behaviors such as the OSK missing major btn functionality (requiring a separate OSK)
- weight
- heat of tablet
- poor build quality on some plastic components
- caps getting stuck 'on'
- constant browser crashes
- the sad attempt at bringing back a start menu (by not bringing anything at all)
- issues with apps not recognizing the touch space as proper mouse coordinates (making many apps unusable)
- the OS falsely detecting drivers as Os8 compatible that aren't
- very poor win store apps for 8.1 pro (FB and Twitter are worse than PB)
- directx full screen mode crashes the entire tablet (including open gl and dosbox)
- Problems with vmware due to the M$ virtualization
- random BSOD DPC_watchdog errors
- many issues with apps even m$ apps
- i can go on and on...
... Yes, I know this tablet very well, this is far from 'disinformation'.
Edited to try and tame my reply and break up the tl;dr.
Posted via CB from my LELast edited by KermEd; 09-02-13 at 12:55 AM.
FF22 likes this.09-02-13 12:33 AMLike 1 - Call it what you will. I did not say my Pro tablet is less productive than my PB - obviously I switched from (what is now) an MSRP 150 tablet to a 900+ tablet for a reason.
My opinion on W8.1 + Pro 128 is not something for you to decide for me. It has not been a smooth or pleasant experience in many cases. It does do what I need it to do (otherwise I wouldn't use it) and under performs in ways I'd like to see resolved.
There are major bugs, especially in 8.1 (i.e. Skydrive is completely useless) which is a major issue for me (Skydrive is my 'temp' data mirror folder shared among all my PCs/laptops/tablets for development).
The tablet is very akward in many instances such as:
- non auto sensing api's for text entry (which should be automated as the OS registers you selected an input box)
- very limiting behaviors such as the OSK missing major btn functionality (requiring a separate OSK)
- weight
- heat of tablet
- poor build quality on some plastic components
- caps getting stuck 'on'
- constant browser crashes
- the sad attempt at bringing back a start menu (by not bringing anything at all)
- issues with apps not recognizing the touch space as proper mouse coordinates (making many apps unusable)
- the OS falsely detecting drivers as Os8 compatible that aren't
- very poor win store apps for 8.1 pro (FB and Twitter are worse than PB)
- directx full screen mode crashes the entire tablet (including open gl and dosbox)
- Problems with vmware due to the M$ virtualization
- random BSOD DPC_watchdog errors
- many issues with apps even m$ apps
- i can go on and on...
... Yes, I know this tablet very well, this is far from 'disinformation'.
Edited to try and tame my reply and break up the tl;dr.
Posted via CB from my LE09-02-13 10:26 AMLike 0 - 8.1 affects two of the points above. 2. You don't think I know it's a beta? I spend as much time building for m$ as I do for bb10.
...I suggest moving back to win8 till all the bugs are worked out and when 8.1
... I'm pretty sure you don't use the app on your desktop top, so why use an APP on the Surface Pro? ...
By your argument, no tablet should ever need an app. As you can use VNC / RDP on any laptop to run desktop apps. The PB does this too
.. as for poor build quality, are you serious? ...
...I call BS on the cheap and your perpetuating the BS about the Surface! ...
...i5 chip is very powerful! (equivalent of an ultrabook) so what did you expect? the same thing happens with a laptop/ultrabook ...
Now, my ultrabook i5 isn't running Windows 8 and doesn't heat up in the slightest. As for my laptop, it's a 32GB 3xSSD in RAID0 i7 (desktop chip) w/ 4GB Nvidia from Mythlogic. I would expect it to get hot. Again though, my zenbook doesn't get hot. Proving you wrong in your own argument.
...Microsoft just added over 10,000...
It's one thing to be missing 10 or 12 apps. 90 percent of the standard app library are missing. And the 10 percent they have are poor attempts at best.
This is largely because their incentive programs are so terrible. Now as a developer, in truth I could do something about this. But because I'm replying on a forum to someone who thinks no one else should have an opinion - I won't have time (again) for wp8 app building this week.
...the web versions work and no need for "APPs" and as for you browser...
...I have NONE of that on my 2 RT's not one single crash! ....
... I don't know but these things your experiencing is only YOU...
These are only 'some' of the issues. This product is far from perfect and I'm tired of pointing this out to you. You called BS yet you dont even own the product.
I'm a supporter of the surface pro and wouldn't touch RT with a stick. The fact there is no real 4G model available clearly defines how Microsoft feels about the surface. If they won't fully commit to their own product...
Posted via CB from my LELast edited by KermEd; 09-02-13 at 12:42 PM.
09-02-13 12:26 PMLike 0 - haha there's so many holes in your reply that it isn't funny, first off in regards to 8.1 if you know its BETA then why the hell are you complaining about it? and the fact you won't go back to 8 just means it cant be that bad!
just because the Surface is a tablet doesn't mean you cant enjoy full robust apps! that's just ridiculous your just limiting the tablet then!
and as for the quality of the Surface again WHAT PLASTIC? also where is your facts to back up your claims on the kick out or STAND that it is warped on 6 out 6 devices? cuzz mine is not warped nor do I have any warped parts and neither does my wifes RT also! so maybe this is just on YOUR device?
and you telling me that an I5 is not powerful is just ignorant! the only higher more powerful chip is the i7 maybe your thinking of an i3 is not powerful? and if your Zenbook doesn't get hot on load time then your full of it! any notebook gets hot when you load it to the max or near max! surfing the net and using apps that don't load the cpu/gpu of course it wont get hot! same thing with the Surface Pro I'm sure!
yes the RT is a watered down version of win8 but it doesn't make it any less productive or fun, like I've said I use the RT for ALOT of things and it is like 90% of a full computer so please lets not exaggerate how bad the RT is.
and as for the 4g who cares? more than half the tablets don't support 4g and only a handful DO! also why would I want to pay for 2 data plans when all I gotta do is set wifi hotspot and connect the tablet to my phone and pay only 1 data plan! and that's the reason why only a handful of tablets support 4g! data plans are bloody expensive!
so say what you will about my replies cuzz they make more sense than yours!09-02-13 04:37 PMLike 0 - Times up for boring rants. Get a pro; use it for a month. And then we can discuss. An opinion from someone who doesn't own or use one - its just hot air.
I acknowledge you know little about it because you don't own or use one. And I also acknowledge you are not a professional or expert in any way, shape or form.
If I want to chat with a fanboy - I'll visit the M$ pages. . This convo has no value or reason to continue.
Posted via CB from my LE09-02-13 06:35 PMLike 0 - ahaha what makes YOU an expert or professional? and what you say means nothing and holds no value, and so I don't own a Surface Pro, but I own an RT which is what like 98% same insides like a Pro, only 3things differ from the RT to a Pro, the OS, the CPU and the screen...that's it. and fanboy..really? I've owned every tablet out there (including 2 playbooks) so I think that doesn't make me a fanboy, it just makes me knowledgeable and when I see a good tablet I call it. and when I see people talking BS I call it09-02-13 07:25 PMLike 0
- ahaha what makes YOU an expert or professional? and what you say means nothing and holds no value, and so I don't own a Surface Pro, but I own an RT which is what like 98% same insides like a Pro, only 3things differ from the RT to a Pro, the OS, the CPU and the screen...that's it. and fanboy..really? I've owned every tablet out there (including 2 playbooks) so I think that doesn't make me a fanboy, it just makes me knowledgeable and when I see a good tablet I call it. and when I see people talking BS I call it
Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile appKermEd likes this.09-02-13 07:43 PMLike 1 - Give it up, dude. KermEd is well known in these parts as the developer of Secure Browser and a number of other Playbook apps, and my guess is that he's developed apps for other platforms. What's in your resume, other than that you've owned a few tablets? You made the statement in an earlier post that Windows 8.1 was a beta and therefore expectedly buggy, and that was the reason that you didn't load it on your Surface RT. Really? Is that even possible, and can you provide a link proving this so. If you can't, this suggests to me that your technical knowledge is limited.
KermEd was simply relating HIS experience with his Surface pro, and who are you to say that he's "spreading misinformation"? And, why would he do so? "Spreading misinformation" is simply a euphemism for lying- again, who are you to make this claim.KermEd likes this.09-02-13 07:43 PMLike 1 - Thanks for the positive feedback! I didn't know anyone payed much attention to my apps these days
In truth, I'm part at fault here too. I have been... encouraging his replies.
Ironically your absolutely right. I submitted two major updates today with SB about to 'go under the knife'. I have a few Android apps and some for WP8 working their way through (I'm actually beta'ing an SDK for M$ that requires 8.1 - which is why I'm on the beta OS).
Ah well - I don't think he knows how stubborn I am either.
Posted via CB from my LE09-02-13 08:11 PMLike 0 - Give it up, dude. KermEd is well known in these parts as the developer of Secure Browser and a number of other Playbook apps, and my guess is that he's developed apps for other platforms. What's in your resume, other than that you've owned a few tablets? You made the statement in an earlier post that Windows 8.1 was a beta and therefore expectedly buggy, and that was the reason that you didn't load it on your Surface RT. Really? Is that even possible, and can you provide a link proving this so. If you can't, this suggests to me that your technical knowledge is limited.
KermEd was simply relating HIS experience with his Surface pro, and who are you to say that he's "spreading misinformation"? And, why would he do so? "Spreading misinformation" is simply a euphemism for lying- again, who are you to make this claim.09-03-13 12:15 AMLike 0 - Lol,
Repairing electronics and knowing about tablets and operating systems is not the same thing . Palm apps? Are you serious, that's about as far from Windows architecture as you can get. And as for Apple IIe, some of my games may still exist on floppy from that era.
I spent 5 years as a Senior Technical Analyst at a touch company, who's sole job was to trace root product failures and issues (including UI complaints) to core M$, HP, etc software and system bugs. Where I would work hand in hand with the company to fix the OS bug. When ever you use Tablet PC features in Windows, your using something I helped develop.
Add another 8 years doing Software Development and architecture for UI and cross platform development. Where my specialty has been operating system analysis and frameworks... I've even had to fly out to several companies to prep their staff on building for Windows 8 as a new platform.
I'm actually probably the closest thing in the world TO an expert, as I worked for touch companies before.
I will stay standing before you proudly declaring the Microsoft Surface Pro as a 'needs improvement' item until it gets where it needs to be. There are plenty of gaps they need to fill, and the few friends I have who are still at Microsoft know just as well as I do what the gaps are. I get your a fan and angry that someone doesn't have this perfect opinion of the surface - but you need to learn to live with that.
Edited to reduce content.
Posted via CB from my LELast edited by KermEd; 09-03-13 at 07:28 AM.
09-03-13 07:14 AMLike 0 - Lol,
Repairing electronics and knowing about tablets and operating systems is not the same thing . Palm apps? Are you serious, that's about as far from Windows architecture as you can get. And as for Apple IIe, some of my games may still exist on floppy from that era.
I spent 5 years as a Senior Technical Analyst at a touch company, who's sole job was to trace root product failures and issues (including UI complaints) to core M$, HP, etc software and system bugs. Where I would work hand in hand with the company to fix the OS bug. When ever you use Tablet PC features in Windows, your using something I helped develop.
Add another 8 years doing Software Development and architecture for UI and cross platform development. Where my specialty has been operating system analysis and frameworks... I've even had to fly out to several companies to prep their staff on building for Windows 8 as a new platform.
I'm actually probably the closest thing in the world TO an expert, as I worked for touch companies before.
I will stay standing before you proudly declaring the Microsoft Surface Pro as a 'needs improvement' item until it gets where it needs to be. There are plenty of gaps they need to fill, and the few friends I have who are still at Microsoft know just as well as I do what the gaps are. I get your a fan and angry that someone doesn't have this perfect opinion of the surface - but you need to learn to live with that.
Edited to reduce content.
Posted via CB from my LE09-03-13 11:52 AMLike 0 - Your right, I did come across harsh on the surface.
Just to clarify (because I should have said this sooner) : I do love the tablet - sadly even more than I loved my PB. I use it daily and the full Win 8 OS can be a real life saver. In fact I was at a conference this past week where it saved the show thanks to having Office 2013.
My worry though - is people who expect it to be a tablet... it's not like the RT. It really can struggle to be a tablet itself. It's a good laptop alternative - but not something you want to sit and play PvZ.
I can respect your opinion and am happy to just say we disagree on some of it.
Posted via CB from my LE09-03-13 02:03 PMLike 0 -
- I guess no-one can really advise you on this. You would have to make your own decision whether to buy or not. I would say though that one (or maybe two - I think someone else in this thread had a similar problem) example of a faulty device (and we are not even sure that it is yet) is not enough to prove that all Playbooks now on sale are going to have a similar problem... But like I say, don't buy if you are not confident.09-05-13 11:50 AMLike 0
- I think I've had 12 PlayBooks. Of those 1 was faulty - bad motherboard. But RIM made it easy to replace. (easier and faster than our faulty ipad where 1 of 2 failed - bad SIM reader).
If I had to pick between those two, ipad or PB, I'd probably still go PB. *except* PvZ2 is kinda fun.
Posted via CB from my LE09-09-13 02:57 PMLike 0 - Well to end this, for anyone who cares, after stack charging for hundreds of cycles and sacrificing a chicken, as well as singing Himalayan derges over it for several days, I finally called BB and just sent it off on its FedExed way to the great PlayBook hospital in Lavergne, TN.
Perhaps there is a PlayBook that cant be fixed by us mortals by stack charging after all!! Who knewFF22 likes this.10-03-13 09:38 PMLike 1
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