07-06-13 09:37 AM
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  1. FF22's Avatar
    I know quite a few Playbook (pb) users are pretty disappointed (understatement) with last week's announcement that bb10 would not be coming to the PB. Others are indifferent and quite happy with the existing situation.

    Be that as it may, they did announce that there would be Continued Support for the PB but that phrase was not defined.

    Does this just mean that warranty and out-of-warranty repair will be available?

    Does this mean that BBWorld will remain open and selling apps that work on the PB?

    Does this mean that they will fix some existing (eye of beholder) bugs?

    Does this mean that there might actually be upgrades to the existing OS 2.x operating system and some enhancements?

    I'm sure I am not alone in desiring a bit more information on what that statement meant.
    07-04-13 11:46 AM
  2. Hirazi Blue's Avatar
    It's a valid question, but I'm afraid Blackberry will not want to be too specific about this at this point (and sort of understandably so). But even if they were to define their "continued support" better, would you - at the moment - be able to actually believe them?
    Last edited by Hirazi Blue; 07-04-13 at 01:16 PM.
    07-04-13 11:54 AM
  3. kraschute's Avatar
    They will tell us because of 1GB Ram only, all they can provide is the most basic support and provide 1 or 2 little security fixes i the next year... And the CB fanboys will find it totally understandable because who can expect more if it is 2 years old and has just 1GB.
    Last edited by kraschute; 07-05-13 at 04:31 AM.
    victorshikhman likes this.
    07-04-13 01:10 PM
  4. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Great post F2!

    I suspect this is "yes" for some time:

    Does this just mean that warranty and out-of-warranty repair will be available?
    Does this mean that BBWorld will remain open and selling apps that work on the PB?
    I suspect this is "maybe", particularly if there are critical issues or security issues ... or a big client asks. :-)

    Does this mean that they will fix some existing (eye of beholder) bugs?
    It would be nice, but I doubt it.

    Does this mean that there might actually be upgrades to the existing OS 2.x operating system and some enhancements?
    07-04-13 01:13 PM
  5. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    They will tell us because of 1GB Ram only, all they can provide is the most basic support and provide 1 or 2 little security fixes i the next year... And the CB fanboys will find it totally understandable because who wants more if it is 2 years old asks just has 1GB
    Again, I think people make too much of the ram thing. Let's pretend we're in the twilight zone for a second.

    If Walmart came to BlackBerry and said,

    "we will buy 10 million PlayBooks from you at the original distribution price from April 2011 and they are ours to keep with no chance of us returning and asking for our money back or any mark downs in price... if BlackBerry 10 runs solidly on it", BlackBerry's engineers would probably find a way to make it work well with BlackBerry 10. And in the process, probably refactor and optimize a bunch of stuff that would make our Z10s and Q10s work better too.

    But that isn't happening. They're likely almost out of inventory, cannot stock retail store shelves any more at the volumes that would be needed and building new inventory would come at a loss.
    bob_tn likes this.
    07-04-13 01:18 PM
  6. Cynycl's Avatar
    I think any future notification on my playbook of any form of update/bugfix/new wallpaper would be a welcome and pleasant supprise.

    I still would like the simple ability to prevent the damn unit from going into standby (screen shutting off) every five minutes. To me, this would be a leaps and bounds, over the top, I can't hardly believe that is possible ...... update.
    EchoesFX and FF22 like this.
    07-04-13 01:21 PM
  7. lexluthorxx's Avatar
    God whatever you do....no one ask Thor. He will just guarantee that playbook will be continually supported....Then a week from now he will say 'We plan to continually support the playbook'......a week after that.....He will announce that 'we have no plans at this time to support the playbook'......
    07-04-13 01:30 PM
  8. victorshikhman's Avatar
    If we leave it up to BB, we will get nothing. If we push them, complain and demand an update, we might get something.
    07-04-13 01:30 PM
  9. Gooseberry Falls's Avatar
    Again, I think people make too much of the ram thing. Let's pretend we're in the twilight zone for a second.

    If Walmart came to BlackBerry and said,

    "we will buy 10 million PlayBooks from you at the original distribution price from April 2011 and they are ours to keep with no chance of us returning and asking for our money back or any mark downs in price... if BlackBerry 10 runs solidly on it", BlackBerry's engineers would probably find a way to make it work well with BlackBerry 10. And in the process, probably refactor and optimize a bunch of stuff that would make our Z10s and Q10s work better too.

    But that isn't happening. They're likely almost out of inventory, cannot stock retail store shelves any more at the volumes that would be needed and building new inventory would come at a loss.
    OK. Twilight Zone again. Say BBRY engineers could get BB10 to work on PB by "lightening it up". Say they had 2.7 MM BB10 users (all shipped BB10 phones were in use). Now they instantly double the BB10 user base with PB users and more Z/Qs with all of the "lost" loyalty sales. Developers say, Hey, maybe this platform is worth developing for. An ecosystem starts to develop. Bridge is restored and people are happy again. They tell other people about BB10, e.g. how great the OS is and how it integrates with the PB. They sell more stuff...OK, Twilight Zone off and picture is now scrambled. Reality, 2MM PB users bad mouthing BBRY to everyone they meet, those 4MM bad mouthing, etc. etc. Good or bad decision?
    Last edited by Gooseberry Falls; 07-04-13 at 01:46 PM.
    07-04-13 01:34 PM
  10. jpash549's Avatar
    Dream zone comes after twilight zone. It's seemingly not practical to cram the basic BB10 OS, an emulator for another OS, and a phone stack into 1 GB of RAM and still allow enough RAM for multitasking several applications let alone operating at the pace we expect using a relatively slow processor. As far as eliminating parts of the system, i.e.lightening up, what would you do? Maybe the suggestion to add to the current PB OS is the way to go.

    Answers to questions posed in this thread need to be given at the 7/9 meeting even if outright promises are avoided.
    .

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile app
    SEAWARRIOR likes this.
    07-04-13 02:01 PM
  11. june282013's Avatar
    Continued support means that they are counting the days until the warranties expire.
    kraschute, cwalt2166 and dannykavs like this.
    07-04-13 02:04 PM
  12. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Again, the update was likely killed more due to business / developer issues than due to technical ones. There is ample reason to believe that it was possible to implement a functional version of BB10 on the PlayBook. It could even be something as simple as Nokia refusing to allow the timeshift camera to be implemented or something of that nature.

    I believe we'll see another "dot" update to the PBOS but that is strictly my own opinion.

    From the awesome virtual keyboard of my Z10
    07-04-13 02:08 PM
  13. Hirazi Blue's Avatar
    Why does everyone discount the hardware problem so easily? If they could have made BB10 work on PB nothing would have realistically stopped them from releasing it on some earlier date. Success (and praise from the community) does not necessarily have to wait for fiscal quarters to end.
    07-04-13 02:23 PM
  14. victorshikhman's Avatar
    Why does everyone discount the hardware problem so easily? If they could have made BB10 work on PB nothing would have realistically stopped them from releasing it on some earlier date.
    Unless they had decided much much earlier that no update for PB would be coming, and all efforts would instead be focused on the Z10/Q10 effort. Which makes perfect sense, but then don't lie to your customers in order to clear inventory.

    Remember, it's not just this latest BB10 upgrade to PB that was continually delayed and finally cancelled. We had been promised a series of updates, all of which were delayed, and then they told (and the developer community) "don't worry, those updates will be rolled into BB10 update".
    FF22, SEAWARRIOR and kraschute like this.
    07-04-13 03:03 PM
  15. Hirazi Blue's Avatar
    Remember, it's not just this latest BB10 upgrade to PB that was continually delayed and finally cancelled. We had been promised a series of updates, all of which were delayed, and then they told (and the developer community) "don't worry, those updates will be rolled into BB10 update".
    That part I actually didn't know about (PB owner for 3 months now). That does indeed change things "ever so slightly"!
    07-04-13 03:14 PM
  16. playbook_swiper1's Avatar
    Yup. The support page will remain on the 'net. BBRY rep's will continue to monitor but not respond to inquiries. Then, when all is said and done. One day we will wake up and Playbook will be under legacy device...no longer supported.
    07-04-13 03:25 PM
  17. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Dream zone comes after twilight zone. It's seemingly not practical to cram the basic BB10 OS, an emulator for another OS, and a phone stack into 1 GB of RAM and still allow enough RAM for multitasking several applications let alone operating at the pace we expect using a relatively slow processor. As far as eliminating parts of the system, i.e.lightening up, what would you do?
    Without having seen the source code, the architecture documents etc, it's not really a question to be answered. :-) Even in BlackBerry right now, I'm sure there's a batch of "How we can" engineers debating this with the "why we can't!" engineers.

    Every technical team I've ever worked in in every company I've worked at has had this dynamic ... the "how we can" engineers who relish a challenge and problem to be solved ... debating the "why we can't" engineers who are cautious and resistant to solving the problem and often do so kicking, screaming and protesting.

    BBJeep had a really good post the other day on how both have their place, which I really liked!
    07-04-13 03:51 PM
  18. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Why does everyone discount the hardware problem so easily? If they could have made BB10 work on PB nothing would have realistically stopped them from releasing it on some earlier date.
    There's an old adage that my old CTO used to use, which was "anything is possible given time and money". The question becomes, how much time and how much money are you willing to spend? As I've said in other threads, I have seen too many engineers, do too many cool things that were allegedly "impossible" before they did it. They got clever about refactoring, optimizing, changing how things worked, and surprised the hell out of people. I've also worked with plenty who give a thousand reasons why something can't be done, why it's hard etc ... only to be completely shown up by the first group.

    Regardless though, it's not a quick easy effort to make it work well on that hardware ... and they likely didn't want to keep throwing cash at the project to make it work well. It's not a "will" or "won't work" kind of thing.

    It's more likely a "we could get it to work well if we doubled the team and worked for a year to do it" thing.
    Last edited by RubberChicken76; 07-04-13 at 09:54 PM.
    07-04-13 03:54 PM
  19. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Remember, it's not just this latest BB10 upgrade to PB that was continually delayed and finally cancelled. We had been promised a series of updates, all of which were delayed, and then they told (and the developer community) "don't worry, those updates will be rolled into BB10 update".
    Can you give some examples?
    07-04-13 03:55 PM
  20. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Can you give some examples?
    Well, he does have a point. Things like restoring Bridge function, updating the browser, and Adobe Reader. The Air runtime is pretty stale by now, too.
    07-04-13 04:12 PM
  21. FF22's Avatar
    That part I actually didn't know about (PB owner for 3 months now). That does indeed change things "ever so slightly"!
    They knew the pb was limited on release. They promised a series of quick updates to move things along. Then they even issued an update that was intended to ease issuing smaller, faster updates. Then they pulled back saying that they would rather issue one "fix-it-all" update to OS 2.x and so that no small updates until then. That took forever, okay, not quite but still longer than initially suggested, possibly up to 4-6 months. Then they again dribbled out updates and then slowed suggesting bb10 would be coming and coming and it was coming soon and sooner and ..........

    One really terrific upgrade was adding Airplane Mode. It really made the pb a success. Still can't find on a web page. Still can't edit or move around bookmarks. Still can't search in the adobe pdf reader but we can employ Airplane Mode.

    The rest is history.

    So, yes, the pb has been one delay after another delay....................... One taunt after another taunt after another ..........
    07-04-13 05:13 PM
  22. victorshikhman's Avatar
    What makes it worse, for me, is that I was out there defending RIM and patiently waiting for the promised updates this entire time. To have pulled the rug out from under us like this, after so many promises, so many months that they spent saying they were fixing the issue or working the problem... It boggles the mind. JUST GIVE US WHAT YOU'VE BEEN WORKING ON FOR THE LAST YEAR! Unless they've been lying to us this entire time.

    This is why I am urging Kevin to speak up at the shareholder meeting July 9th. We lose nothing by shaming Blackberry's CEO into giving us a substantial PBOS update. It would cost them practically nothing to upgrade the Android runtime, or push Cascades (which was DEVELOPED FOR THE PLAYBOOK!), etc.

    Email Kevin and urge him to speak up on our behalf: kevin@mobilenations.com
    07-04-13 05:40 PM
  23. bambinoitaliano's Avatar
    I know quite a few Playbook (pb) users are pretty disappointed (understatement) with last week's announcement that bb10 would not be coming to the PB. Others are indifferent and quite happy with the existing situation.

    Be that as it may, they did announce that there would be Continued Support for the PB but that phrase was not defined.

    Does this just mean that warranty and out-of-warranty repair will be available?

    Does this mean that BBWorld will remain open and selling apps that work on the PB?

    Does this mean that they will fix some existing (eye of beholder) bugs?

    Does this mean that there might actually be upgrades to the existing OS 2.x operating system and some enhancements?

    I'm sure I am not alone in desiring a bit more information on what that statement meant.
    Ha! Good luck trying to get information from BB. The statement mean what the company want it to mean and whenever. As fas as I'm concern inability to communicate is the company archilles heels.
    SEAWARRIOR likes this.
    07-04-13 06:25 PM
  24. axllebeer's Avatar
    I know quite a few Playbook (pb) users are pretty disappointed (understatement) with last week's announcement that bb10 would not be coming to the PB. Others are indifferent and quite happy with the existing situation.

    Be that as it may, they did announce that there would be Continued Support for the PB but that phrase was not defined.

    Does this just mean that warranty and out-of-warranty repair will be available?

    Does this mean that BBWorld will remain open and selling apps that work on the PB?

    Does this mean that they will fix some existing (eye of beholder) bugs?

    Does this mean that there might actually be upgrades to the existing OS 2.x operating system and some enhancements?

    I'm sure I am not alone in desiring a bit more information on what that statement meant.
    Does this mean that they will continue to update the Flash Player.....

    These are all important questions that need to clarified. If all support is stopping for maintenance updates then this really is the end
    Attached Thumbnails Can BBRY define what they mean by Continued Support for the Playbook?-playbook-graveyard.jpeg  
    07-04-13 07:12 PM
  25. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Well, he does have a point. Things like restoring Bridge function, updating the browser, and Adobe Reader. The Air runtime is pretty stale by now, too.
    Wasn't debating the need. Just don't remember them ever saying, "we'll do this for PlayBook in BlackBerry 10". Could be wrong, but they always seemed pretty mum on the topic except to say, "it's coming"
    07-04-13 09:52 PM
45 12

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