06-10-12 07:18 PM
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  1. Marty_LK's Avatar
    It's not about Apple being smart, it's about people being dumb.
    I'm not saying everyone with an iPhone is dumb, there are people out there that bought one after concluding they want one all by themselves, unfortunately lots of iPhone owners just bought one cause "they're cool" or "my friend has one".

    Anyone ever seen Apple's first television ad for the macintosh?
    They unload some criticism on people following the masses like sheep and urge them not to.

    Look what they have become....

    I can only applaud Apple's marketing team changing their ethics and putting together ads that turn people into mindless zombies and leaves them thinking they need an iProduct or they're morons. The morons.

    As said, not everyone with an iPhone is a moron. If you own one and feel like I'm talking about you then I'm sorry but you are a.......
    All I can say is I bought an original iPhone because I was worn out by the horrendously terrible products that existed when the iPhone 1 was released. From all reports and research, there would finally be a reliable, simple and well-made cellphone in the iPhone. The reason Apple sits at the top is because they were first on the scene with a reliable smartphone and have been very careful and intelligent about maintaining that dominance.
    04-30-12 01:37 PM
  2. mikeplus1's Avatar
    I think everyone is tired of iPad/iPhone threads on a blackberry fan site...Face it people like apple products, it's not rocket science (or brain washing).
    Sent from my IPhone 4s using Tapatalk
    Actually a gf of mine saw my PB, played with it a little and then stated that she wanted an iPad, to which I asked "why?" only to be told because it is the best even though she knows absolutely nothing about them hardware or software wise, has never even tried one out and has only seen one on display, in print ads or on TV. It is sheer marketing genius on the part of Apple and the media to brainwash so many to the point that someday iPad will be like Kleenex and Xerox brands even though the term Tablet PC was coined years ago by another company, long before the iPad was born and I am not so sure that the same is not happening with the iPhone because I know people that just want one because of the ads and/or peer pressure that have never tried using one even though as a BB and PB fan myself I have to admit that the Apple products are beautiful pieces of glass, metal and plastic to hold in your hand, wait... it's happening to me now!
    Marty_LK and bigbmc26 like this.
    04-30-12 01:39 PM
  3. MountainProud's Avatar
    Actually a gf of mine saw my PB, played with it a little and then stated that she wanted an iPad, to which I asked "why?" only to be told because it is the best even though she knows absolutely nothing about them hardware or software wise, has never even tried one out and has only seen one on display, in print ads or on TV. It is sheer marketing genius on the part of Apple and the media to brainwash so many to the point that someday iPad will be like Kleenex and Xerox brands even though the term Tablet PC was coined years ago by another company, long before the iPad was born and I am not so sure that the same is not happening with the iPhone because I know people that just want one because of the ads and/or peer pressure that have never tried using one even though as a BB and PB fan myself I have to admit that the Apple products are beautiful pieces of glass, metal and plastic to hold in your hand, wait... it's happening to me now!

    Tru dat, my daughter saw my PB and asked 'Is that your iPad dad?'...
    mikeplus1 and Marty_LK like this.
    04-30-12 01:45 PM
  4. wout000's Avatar
    Tru dat, my daughter saw my PB and asked 'Is that your iPad dad?'...

    That's just bad parenting

    Haha joking
    mikeplus1 and joski like this.
    04-30-12 01:50 PM
  5. bigbmc26's Avatar
    I'd say the iPhone is great for non tech people. People who like to play on their phones.
    I completely agree with you. The problem is, that descibes the majority of people in the world...
    cleacy, mikeplus1 and joski like this.
    04-30-12 01:51 PM
  6. wout000's Avatar
    Good point; let's take a look at their recent reports. In their last report, RIM reported a GAAP net loss of $125 million:

    http://www.rim.com/investors/documen...ss_release.pdf

    In the previous report, they wrote down PlayBook inventory by $485 million:

    http://www.rim.com/investors/documen...nformation.pdf

    Neither of these results are healthy, and both were reported by RIM long before they appeared in "prechewed" media articles. So while the media has been piling on RIM, it's not completely without cause.
    I totally missed this post, my apologies.

    So they reported a loss and wrote of inventory. While it's a good indicator of the recent health RIM is in, it's not instrumental in forming their overall or future health (nobody can predict the future can they).

    They're bleeding in the US and Canada. True.
    They brought in a new CEO to turn things around. True.
    The new CEO hired a firm to write a plan that will allow them to overhaul some departments and look at new business opportunities. True
    RIM has no debt and a healthy amount of cash burning a hole in their pocket. True

    While currently RIM is suffering from a bit of a burnout, the company itself is healthy and thanks to the new CEO taking actions it should be for years to come.

    Anyone remember Apple when they forced out Jobs....?
    Last edited by wout000; 04-30-12 at 02:19 PM.
    Marty_LK and joski like this.
    04-30-12 02:05 PM
  7. DX9's Avatar
    I completely agree with you. The problem is, that descibes the majority of people in the world...
    Why is it a problem? I own 2 businesses and the iPhone works perfect for both business and pleasure. My gmail with Exchange syncs perfectly along with my calendar and contacts. Email has come faster then my 9900. Full HTML email is also and no transcated email with all my large blueprints and photos. I love to web browse, listen to music, watch VEVO from my iPhone and maybe play some deer hunting Game in my spare time. Best of both worlds for me.
    Marty_LK likes this.
    04-30-12 02:11 PM
  8. MountainProud's Avatar
    Anyone remember Apple when they forced out Jobs....?
    I sure do. My family used Apple computers for several years, but switched to PC's early to mid 90's. Heck, in '97 I thought Apple had either 1) gone out of business or 2) was on their way out of business. Never saw any in stores around here, and there was virtually zero software to buy for them.
    Marty_LK likes this.
    04-30-12 02:11 PM
  9. wout000's Avatar
    I completely agree with you. The problem is, that descibes the majority of people in the world...
    I disagree. The iPhone is popular because of its image. BlackBerry and Android can provide the same gaming experience (provided the game is released on those platforms). The general feel I get when talking to people about smartphones is that they see BlackBerry as a business phone, while iPhone is being regarded as a familyphone.

    Example: A mother with 4 children working at a convenience store isn't going to buy a BlackBerry to keep in touch with work emails or because she cares about encryption, she'll buy an IPhone cause she knows it will do whatever she need it to do in such a way she can set it up herself without needing an IT department.

    BlackBerry needs to try harder in the consumer market because of their legacy in the business market. Apple just focused on consumers first.

    You've been reading it all day; well isn't that sweet <3
    I was sharing my views, I didn't invite anyone to read. Haters gon' hate
    I guess it's fair to asume posting your views on a public board will give you all kinds of reactions. Keeps it interesting to say the least.
    Last edited by wout000; 04-30-12 at 02:22 PM.
    torndownunit likes this.
    04-30-12 02:17 PM
  10. Marty_LK's Avatar
    I sure do. My family used Apple computers for several years, but switched to PC's early to mid 90's. Heck, in '97 I thought Apple had either 1) gone out of business or 2) was on their way out of business. Never saw any in stores around here, and there was virtually zero software to buy for them.
    Gives me hope for RIM and my beloved Playbook...and a future BB phone....and possibly more apps (high-profile apps). That's why the "Like".

    I remember those days and Apple was in the toilet. Jobs saved the day. If Hienz, or however his name is spelled, is another "Jobs", SWEET!
    04-30-12 02:21 PM
  11. 13echo4's Avatar
    I wouldn't mind that on my PlayBook. If my PlayBook dies in 3 hours that's okay. It's for entertainment. If my phones died I'd be in trouble.
    That's an understatement. Lol
    04-30-12 02:27 PM
  12. joski's Avatar
    Gives me hope for RIM and my beloved Playbook...and a future BB phone....and possibly more apps (high-profile apps). That's why the "Like".

    I remember those days and Apple was in the toilet. Jobs saved the day. If Hienz, or however his name is spelled, is another "Jobs", SWEET!
    I really hope Thorsten is nothing like Jobs - and I can kind of tell that he isn't already. I'd agree with you if you said "if he brings the same kind of success as Jobs brought Apple"... But it's all about HOW you get to that point, and I personally don't think that RIM has a single ounce of that toxic junk in them to do so in the same fashion... But we'll see I guess.
    mikeplus1 likes this.
    04-30-12 02:35 PM
  13. kennyliu's Avatar
    Anyone remember Apple when they forced out Jobs....?
    I do. But what makes you think that RIM will follow the path of one of a few outliers rather than the path of thousands of companies who do not manage to turn things around?

    You do understand that business failures are much much much more common than the miracles such as Apple's comeback?
    04-30-12 02:35 PM
  14. Marty_LK's Avatar
    I really hope Thorsten is nothing like Jobs - and I can kind of tell that he isn't already. I'd agree with you if you said "if he brings the same kind of success as Jobs brought Apple"... But it's all about HOW you get to that point, and I personally don't think that RIM has a single ounce of that toxic junk in them to do so in the same fashion... But we'll see I guess.
    That's actually what I meant. The success of Apple is all I care about for RIM. If Heinz is a visionary enough to bring success to RIM, outstanding.
    04-30-12 02:41 PM
  15. wout000's Avatar
    I do. But what makes you think that RIM will follow the path of one of a few outliers rather than the path of thousands of companies who do not manage to turn things around?

    You do understand that business failures are much much much more common than the miracles such as Apple's comeback?
    Believe me I do.
    But what makes you think it won't?

    I personally believe that their new OS will be instrumental, as will their ability to license off some parts of their portfolio.
    QNX is an established OS used in various fields. Their ability to translate that OS stability and performance to a phone will basically determine their path.

    Also, I don't believe that the RIM business model needs a miracle, it just needs some tweaks and a sound vision for the future.
    RIM isn't at the bottom like Apple was, they're just experiencing a market loss. Just as Google has for some years....
    Marty_LK likes this.
    04-30-12 02:44 PM
  16. JakePNEFC's Avatar
    If it wasn't for jailbreak, iPhone would be useless.
    04-30-12 02:44 PM
  17. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    No this is not a rant. I've just been thinking a lot about apps on the PlayBook and realized something profound: I don't need that many apps!!!!

    I just had a realization that Apple has brainwashed everyone on the planet into thinking that it is cool to have a tablet with a buttload of apps. Speaking for myself, my PlayBook has TONS of games, but I havent even opened them all, not even close. I've only every played Angry Birds, GLWG and Theme Hotel. THATS IT! And that was only recently; most of the time I've been using the internet for sites like NBA, CrackBerrry, etc. vs their respective apps. Sure I would love more apps, who wouldnt? But what I'm saying is that it isn't a dealbreaker anymore, and I just hope more people realize that and RIM would market it in that way.

    In closing, Apple's tactics truly lead me into thinking that they are one of the smartest companies on the planet. What do you guys think?
    You're right. But that's what business is all about: sell.
    If ever RIM could do the same they'd be fool to miss the train
    04-30-12 02:46 PM
  18. kennyliu's Avatar
    Believe me I do.
    But what makes you think it won't?

    I personally believe that their new OS will be instrumental, as will their ability to license off some parts of their portfolio.
    QNX is an established OS used in various fields. Their ability to translate that OS stability and performance to a phone will basically determine their path.

    Also, I don't believe that the RIM business model needs a miracle, it just needs some tweaks and a sound vision for the future.
    RIM isn't at the bottom like Apple was, they're just experiencing a market loss. Just as Google has for some years....
    Nothing makes me think it won't. If it does, it's great. One more miracle. If not, then it'll be one a many thousands of companies with similar fate.

    I just thought your argument that uses an outlier as an evidence doesn't sound utterly compelling


    It's just like saying "Well, Mr. X was poor and now he's a billionaire. I am not as poor as he was, which implies I have a very good chance of becoming a billionaire."
    Last edited by kennyliu; 04-30-12 at 02:59 PM.
    04-30-12 02:48 PM
  19. Marty_LK's Avatar
    I just hope if and when RIM becomes a market force and things are looking rosy, they don't decide to sell out. I suspect that might happen, though. A lot of companies do that, become really attractive and seemingly prosperous for the purpose of selling out at a good price.
    04-30-12 02:55 PM
  20. wout000's Avatar
    Nothing makes me think it won't. If it does, it's great. One more miracle. If not, then it'll be one a many thousands of companies with similar fate.

    I just thought your argument that uses an outlier as an evidence doesn't sound utterly compelling
    I can't predict the future. I can however give my opinion be it my professional opinion or my personal opinion. And that opinion says that if you look at the history its not impossible for RIM to turn things around and RIM isn't nearly as far as some of the companies that 'came back' ever were.

    It's all about the interpretation.
    Last edited by wout000; 04-30-12 at 03:03 PM.
    kennyliu and hpjrt like this.
    04-30-12 02:56 PM
  21. bigbmc26's Avatar
    Why is it a problem? I own 2 businesses and the iPhone works perfect for both business and pleasure. My gmail with Exchange syncs perfectly along with my calendar and contacts. Email has come faster then my 9900. Full HTML email is also and no transcated email with all my large blueprints and photos. I love to web browse, listen to music, watch VEVO from my iPhone and maybe play some deer hunting Game in my spare time. Best of both worlds for me.
    That's great for you. The problem, as I see it, is that Apple has created this mindset that iOS and their ecosystem is the only platform in the world that is GOOD for everyone by dumbing done the general user, by making the user feel like that are technically superior, lol! To the point where they call BlackBerry users stupid! That's a huge problem for me, haha. I proceed to school them on actually technology and how it works. Apps CAN be written for all the platforms, they're ONLY written for the popular ones. That's a GIGANTIC problem. IMO
    04-30-12 03:10 PM
  22. torndownunit's Avatar
    That's great for you. The problem, as I see it, is that Apple has created this mindset that iOS and their ecosystem is the only platform in the world that is GOOD for everyone by dumbing done the general user, by making the user feel like that are technically superior, lol! To the point where they call BlackBerry users stupid! That's a huge problem for me, haha. I proceed to school them on actually technology and how it works. Apps CAN be written for all the platforms, they're ONLY written for the popular ones. That's a GIGANTIC problem. IMO
    The problem is actually that people on the forum seriously believe this problem exists. Use what devices you want to use, and don't worry about what others are using. It's a pretty common sense solution.

    There is a middle ground as well in all of this. I am a 15 year Apple product user, and I like my Playbook quite a bit. I simply buy what I feel is a good product. And setting aside people's paranoia, that is actually what the majority of people do. No one needs to be told by someone else the reason why they chose to buy what they bought. Their reason is their reason.
    Last edited by torndownunit; 04-30-12 at 03:18 PM.
    04-30-12 03:14 PM
  23. mikeplus1's Avatar
    Anyone remember Apple when they forced out Jobs....?
    I remember those days and Apple was in the toilet. Jobs saved the day. If Hienz, or however his name is spelled, is another "Jobs", SWEET!
    Does that mean that they have to force him out first and then bring him back to be successful, or does that mean they have to bring back the founder that resigned to be successful again like Apple did? I think neither as this is a different, yet seemingly similar set of circumstances in my opinion. BTW, if I told you what the future will bring it would spoil the surprise not to mention ruin the stock market and Vegas.
    04-30-12 03:17 PM
  24. Chrisy's Avatar
    I haven't figured it out yet and I've been literally reading it all day...
    I had to go to work so I missed a lot since I last posted! Getting caught up.

    The fact is, BlackBerry has something people want. Even Android and iPhone users.

    Why else would so many non BlackBerry users be here!?

    Because they want to come back to BlackBerry.
    Marty_LK and abramadhi like this.
    04-30-12 03:20 PM
  25. Marty_LK's Avatar
    Does that mean that they have to force him out first and then bring him back to be successful, or does that mean they have to bring back the founder that resigned to be successful again like Apple did? I think neither as this is a different, yet seemingly similar set of circumstances in my opinion. BTW, if I told you what the future will bring it would spoil the surprise not to mention ruin the stock market and Vegas.
    I think they already did that. Or maybe they are just now doing it. Maybe Heinz will be similar to Scully and Lazaridas will return some day as a savior of RIM. Who knows. I just hope the PB prospers and more apps arrive.
    04-30-12 03:22 PM
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