[fattyacid]

Insert:
R&D: We need more staff to develop BB10.
Chen: sorry no money for that.
R&D: So sell more phones.

Chen: We need to try building an Android phone and I want it done this year.
R&D: We could do it, but we're short staffed, so we'd have to take everyone to do it.
Chen: Fine. Do whatever it takes.
R&D: We'll have to freeze BB10.
Chen: Will the phones still work? Can we get back to it later?
R&D: Yes.
Chen: Do it.


Via the Crimson Passport

[RLTurn77]

Good read.

I believe they knew this was going to happen all along but it took time to get done.

I think that going android is critical because it's clear that whatever BlackBerry 10 had, as great of an OS it is, it wasn't enough and that is simply due to apps. It's always been about apps, ever since the bold 9900 days...

If they can give us apps and then throw on a BlackBerry skin on top that makes it feel like a BlackBerry, then why not. The BlackBerry experience suite appears to be just that.

If you get access to the android ecosystem and also get the BlackBerry experience like the HUB, Blend, Calendar, docs to go, etc everything that's part of the BlackBerry experience suite, why would you ever choose another android device.

The slider is going to be a game changer. It's giving us the best of both worlds and it'll be virtually without competition. Culture is looking for a renaissance and the physical keyboard is it, and BlackBerry owns this segment. Samsung is recognizing this thus look at their keyboard attempt...

I just hope BlackBerry will give us a killer camera as that is another critical element to the flagship space to which they will be entering.

Make no mistake, I think BlackBerry 10 is safe. Security focused enterprise and government will get BlackBerry 10 and the consumers, hopefully, will get a choice. BlackBerry 10 or Android. It's a good thing.

#CB10 #workwide #Silver

Interesting point of view. My dad is on Verizon with a work BB10. He also uses an iPhone (both paid for by work). He wanted a new all-touch BlackBerry, but there just wasn't any and he has decided to keep it for now.

To paraphrase what he said... the iPhone is for apps and I use my BlackBerry for phone calls, the Hub, and the calendar (all which he was unwilling to give up). I told him about the Slider which would include all of that and likely be running Android.

With BB10, it really has been an app story from the start. Appreciate your input.

Posted via CB10

[anon9347040]

I actually read your post in its entirety OP and as a former stockholder, I feel your pain. I inherited my shares from my grandfather as part of a larger portfolio and was devastated when RIM tanked.

My personal feeling is this. Based on my experiences, I don't really focus on the life stories of corporations anymore. You seem to be well versed on the company, its numbers and the politics within. I used to be involved with all that as well and I realize now that I just don't really care about it anymore.

I buy products based on my needs now. I really couldn't care about the future or future capability. Not with things like mobile phones. For my industrial PCB servicing and rework equipment, those things I care about. Future capabilities and upgradability is definitely important there with the cost of these machines running into the tens of thousands of dollars.

I like BlackBerry now. BB10 and BES works for us. If they go to Android, that's on them. If they stay in their lane, better for them and me.

Should their usefulness to me come to an end, I simply move on. There is no need for excessive company loyalty anymore. You'll only burn yourself out. You don't need business...business needs you. If they fail to provide quality products and services for your use...you move on and they lose.

If they move to Android, as long as the Hub functions are still there and security doesn't go into the drink...I'm in. If those things go, so do I.

Posted via BlackBerry Passport Red Edition

[RLTurn77]

I actually read your post in its entirety OP and as a former stockholder, I feel your pain. I inherited my shares from my grandfather as part of a larger portfolio and was devastated when RIM tanked.

My personal feeling is this. Based on my experiences, I don't really focus on the life stories of corporations anymore. You seem to be well versed on the company, its numbers and the politics within. I used to be involved with all that as well and I realize now that I just don't really care about it anymore.

I buy products based on my needs now. I really couldn't care about the future or future capability. Not with things like mobile phones. For my industrial PCB servicing and rework equipment, those things I care about. Future capabilities and upgradability is definitely important there with the cost of these machines running into the tens of thousands of dollars.

I like BlackBerry now. BB10 and BES works for us. If they go to Android, that's on them. If they stay in their lane, better for them and me.

Should their usefulness to me come to an end, I simply move on. There is no need for excessive company loyalty anymore. You'll only burn yourself out. You don't need business...business needs you. If they fail to provide quality products and services for your use...you move on and they lose.

If they move to Android, as long as the Hub functions are still there and security doesn't go into the drink...I'm in. If those things go, so do I.

Posted via BlackBerry Passport Red Edition

Thanks for taking the time to read through. I have been hopeful for a BlackBerry "comeback" one way or another for a while which is why I refuted the statement above that I do not care about the company. You are definitely not alone in losing when it comes to RIM/BlackBerry.

I see your point though especially with knowing the inside and out of a company as best as possible. Why do I care? I don't know. Somehow and somewhere along the line I became passionate about BlackBerry. As a consumer I enjoy their unique devices and unique operating system.

My needs really didn't justify the Silver Edition Passport although I'd have likely purchased it if I knew BB10 was in full swing still; based mostly on loyalty which may be misplaced as you wrote. I already have the original Passport.

Since I have been a loyal customer beyond necessity to BlackBerry, I decided to write as to why I just couldn't do the blind loyalty right now with this Passport variant.

Too much going on behind the scenes and minimal transparency from BlackBerry to both the consumer and the shareholders. I was curious to see if I was alone with my train of thought and perception of what to make of the current situation with the handset division.

Posted via CB10

[akavbb]

Exceptional thread. The OP seems well educated and has a clear mind.
I have the same fears regarding buying a new device. I was thinking about buying the SE but I am triple thinking about it.
No need to add how difficult is for us non-(CA, US, UK, Italian , Germans, Spanish) to buy a device from BlackBerry.

I want to buy but in order to do it I have to overcome a ton of obstacles.

PS : the order of the countries is random.

Posted via my STL100-2 | Waiting for the mighty Squircle to return

[zlatno]

Yes, Windows OS sucks!!!!!!!!!

[rohan b]

Hi RLTurn77! First of all, kudos to your well thought-out and well written post. I'm in total agreement with your thoughts. One thing is for sure, I'm definitely not going back to Android!

I started out with the original black Passport and fell in love with BB10. I now have a Z30 in addition to the Passport. And I'm planning to buy a Q10 and one more of the Passport and Z30 each. And maybe one Z10 too.

It really pains me that BlackBerry would even think of putting Android on BlackBerry hardware. I find it ironic that the company whose USP is security, would want the hotbed of malware that is Android, to be associated with their phones.

I just hope that they don't kill off BB10. That would be such a pity and such a waste.

Posted from my  Z30 � STA100-2/10.3.1.2558

[crackbb10]

Nice thread on such a topic for a change. I understand OP's initial surprise. As to the OP, I understand your reasoning. And seeing you already have a Passport, there is no real incentive in the SE to upgrade from the original.

On the other hand, not buying there devices hurt BlackBerry more than the Android rumors. As long as BlackBerry is selling devices (that are good) they need people to buy them. Now I don't go around buying lots of devices, I stick to one a year. I haven't tried the Passport as daily driver, so I decided to give it a shot. Would not have done it if I had the original. I would have gotten me the Classic then.

In the long run, I think we'll be able to use BlackBerry 10 for quite some time to come. So buying a BlackBerry 10 device will not see you have it bricked in a few months because they went the Android route. I do agree that the ultimate silence from BlackBerry on all these rumours is devastating, unless the silence is crucial for an enormous wow factor release before the holidays. Who knows.

Only thing I'm really worried about with the Android move, is they kill the runtime. I only use the runtime for Netflix and Spotify and could do very well without (I'm not planning on installing apk's on the SE), but I know most of us can tolerate BlackBerry 10 because of the runtime. They will switch if it's killed off. Let's just hope that whoever switches away from BlackBerry 10 from now on switches to the BlackBerry Android and keep them in-house.

[Andy Wijaya]

Agreed with everything you've said. Now I am confused which phone should I upgrade to. I am considering a Windows Phone, because I do not like either Android or iOS. But since I am using a mac and an ipad already, I might have to reconsider about iPhone.. But I am really disappointed with Blackberry in this decision. I do not know why they went full Android. They can offer nothing to the market. Huge Android smartphone manufacturers like Samsung are innovating each year and giving us a top class hardware every year, which we know would not be done by the Blackberry. Let us see, and hope that they won't abandon Blackberry 10 entirely. I, for sure, would not buy a Blackberry-skinned Android smartphone.

[jojo beaconsfield]

I bought BB stock just before the Z10 launched and was pumped with the possibility of millions returning to BB for a phone that could compete with the iPhone,to bad that didn't work out.Sold all my shares,and made $1000,since then the stock has tumbled and I'm ahead ,because I sold ,$8500.I love BB but I love $ more,the problem with BB and all their pillars is that others want their action and those are Giants.I can see them selling something soon to help their cash position,which surely can't last forever,thank god for BIS revenues that still exist but going down every Q.BBM I suspect will be sold, but for how much?I wouldn't touch BB stock in the future even at $5 which sounds like a bargain.These guys are shooting for $500 million a year in software revenue,down from $600 M,thier original goal,what a joke!Right now Bis is free money coming in and once that is gone so will BB be gone.I had 2550 shares,$31,000.I still have that money and my sanity,haha

[anon(5830442)]

If you really loved blackberry you should have just bought the SE and kept your comments to yourself. About the shares, for how long did you keep them? That is not supporting BB, selling them at the first indication of loss. Nice words, but totally shallow.

[motec bb]

If you really loved blackberry you should have just bought the SE and kept your comments to yourself. About the shares, for how long did you keep them? That is not supporting BB, selling them at the first indication of loss. Nice words, but totally shallow.

Still agree with Jojo, money before love (when it comes to BB)

Q10 on 10.3.2.2204

[wMarck90]

You has do a right choice
http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe.../#post11880745

Passport Silver is already a DOA Product.
- The framework that is based Cascades is EOL by end of year
- BlackBerry isn't able to giving you any motivation for developing for BB10
- Now the roadmap are also removed from their website

[Jon Hill67]

Are we all looking at this to hard. After all they didn't have to release the SE. Yet they did. Quite frankly it's a gorgeous device, and works really well. Mine is smooth as butter. I'm not following what the world says I should have. I've gone for what quietly and confidently gestures, you want me you need me. Let's just enjoy our Blackberry. Continue to buy and what will be will be. After all the phones are not going to stop working.

Hi Ho Silver

[Bluenoser63]

From what you wrote, you love BB10. You could care less about the company, BlackBerry. If BlackBerry were to sell off BB10 to Google and Google continued development, I'd say you'd move over to Google.

As for complaints about the stock, it hasn't been a winner for a long time now - under Mike and Jim, Heins, or Chen. Chen didn't wreck it, especially of late, when the whole market has been tanking.

When Chen came in, he probably felt that he could move 10 million units per year, especially after talking to his CEO buddies. That bet didn't work out. He could keep trying the same thing again, develop yet another BB10 device, but in the end, people will still criticize BB10 for the lack of apps. He could invest in making the Runtime better, but there's still the fundamental problem of not being 100% compatible - lack of Google Services. His consideration of Android is a reasonable response and conclusion to solving his hardware problem - just as much as Nokia making an Android phone despite spending years on Windows Phone to no avail. Nokia never had the chance to test their "we will save Nokia by releasing an Android phone". (Microsoft probably swept in to buy Nokia hardware to save themselves from embarrassment.) It looks like BlackBerry might get the chance to see if their Android addition might save their hardware.

As for why BB10 development might have stopped... I can picture a scenario like this:

Chen: We need to try building an Android phone and I want it done this year.
R&D: We could do it, but we're short staffed, so we'd have to take everyone to do it.
Chen: Fine. Do whatever it takes.
R&D: We'll have to freeze BB10.
Chen: Will the phones still work? Can we get back to it later?
R&D: Yes.
Chen: Do it.

The problem is that it isn't really the same skill set needed to design for Android and to design for BlackBerry 10. To stop work on one and learn the other and then switch back is inefficient and problematic. When I am programming for one platform/language, I try to stick with that until I am finished. When I switch back, it takes me some time to get back up to speed on the other platform/language. I very much doubt the scenario you mentioned.

[RLTurn77]

If you really loved blackberry you should have just bought the SE and kept your comments to yourself. About the shares, for how long did you keep them? That is not supporting BB, selling them at the first indication of loss. Nice words, but totally shallow.

Thanks for the mature comments. Wish I had time to address them all. Unfortunately for me, I have crazy hours today (healthcare), but I appreciate hearing other opinions as well even if they may or may not agree with what I initially wrote.

@TessoroDesoto - I purposely quoted your post because, quite honestly, it's far from the truth and based on false assumptions. If I really loved BlackBerry I would have bought the SE and kept my comments to myself? For one, I have multiple BlackBerry devices to the point that I'm just about to hit the maximum allowed on BlackBerry Protect. I do not need another device and wrote why I didn't just buy the SE.

As for keeping my comments to myself... I have pretty much done that for a long time now. At this point, I figured I'd write out my thoughts and see some other viewpoints as well. Is that not what this forum is for?

As for the shares that I purchased, I am no investment genius. I liked what I saw and believed that the company was undervalued back at $10. I opened an account to specifically just purchase bbry shares. Yes, I did put all of my eggs in one basket. In a weird way I wanted to "own" a piece of the company that I'm passionate about.

I really shouldn't have to divulge so much personal information, but I will. I held onto my shares for a while. Was not a short-term trader by any means. Was up for a few months then down for a few months, but I kept holding.

After being up considerably on several rumors I still held for that one day that BlackBerry would show its greatness and the shorts would get burned. Then this silence became worse and I questioned whether or not, in my personal situation, I wanted to play games with the money I was able to save.

As I wrote, I thought about it and decided to take a small loss for my own sanity. Just to add... I'm not advising anybody to do anything as far as their investments. Please do your own DD. With the current stock environment, I'm not touching a thing.

In reality, I've only ever purchased bbry shares anyway. I don't see how any of this or what I have written leads you to "Nice words, but totally shallow."

I do want to point out that I have every intent to continue using my devices and am aware that they're not going to turn into coasters (at least not in the foreseeable future) regardless of what BlackBerry does.

I just struggled with buying the SE and wrote why I ultimately just cancelled the order. Do I still love my original Passport? Yes. Am I using it right now? Yes. It is a great device. I don't see how I should keep my comments on BlackBerry to myself when I'm on a BlackBerry forum unless I was just trolling in which case a mod would have likely closed this thread already.

Posted via CB10

[duboisstephane0]

Good read.
I am on the fence about this android thing on BlackBerry devices.
I'm trying to keep an open mind.
Let's see what happens before expecting the worse.

Posted via BlackBerry Passport

[Zeratul57]

Go over to android central and read the comments in the article Blaze posted about the slider. People are hyped up about android and BB10 slider. Lots of people coming back to Blackberry and it will sell big from the five minutes I spent looking at it. I dont see how you could use the android version and then not convert to BB10. I see this as something that is working, the stock people have to see results and they are coming in software and hardware.

I made money with BB stock I bought at $7.40 BBRY is a solid investment but the stock needs buying volume to go up instead of being a trading vehicle for the paper movers that Donald Trump talks about.

The thinking that Blackberry is abandoning BB10 IMHO is the dumbest thing I have seen on mobile nations.

[james h jackson jr]

I'm relieved that the initial comments have been favorable! Was truly expecting to be bashed as I typed that out. I will hold on to all of my BB10s and sit on the sidelines as well until we have some clarity.

May end up using them all until they're dead depending on the future of BB10. I really appreciate everything that went into this operating system and hope BlackBerry is working on its future which does not include "maintenance mode" or "EOL".

I have also thought Windows 10 may be better suited for us that love BB10, but really don't know much about Windows OS. Just know that I've tried both Android and iOS and am not a fan of either.

Posted via CB10

Jolla sailfish that could be a viable os for you it's not android either native sailfish os apps it runs as well as android runtime you can install if you want

Posted via CB10

[james h jackson jr]

Thanks for the mature comments. Wish I had time to address them all. Unfortunately for me, I have crazy hours today (healthcare), but I appreciate hearing other opinions as well even if they may or may not agree with what I initially wrote.

@TessoroDesoto - I purposely quoted your post because, quite honestly, it's far from the truth and based on false assumptions. If I really loved BlackBerry I would have bought the SE and kept my comments to myself? For one, I have multiple BlackBerry devices to the point that I'm just about to hit the maximum allowed on BlackBerry Protect. I do not need another device and wrote why I didn't just buy the SE.

As for keeping my comments to myself... I have pretty much done that for a long time now. At this point, I figured I'd write out my thoughts and see some other viewpoints as well. Is that not what this forum is for?

As for the shares that I purchased, I am no investment genius. I liked what I saw and believed that the company was undervalued back at $10. I opened an account to specifically just purchase bbry shares. Yes, I did put all of my eggs in one basket. In a weird way I wanted to "own" a piece of the company that I'm passionate about.

I really shouldn't have to divulge so much personal information, but I will. I held onto my shares for a while. Was not a short-term trader by any means. Was up for a few months then down for a few months, but I kept holding.

After being up considerably on several rumors I still held for that one day that BlackBerry would show its greatness and the shorts would get burned. Then this silence became worse and I questioned whether or not, in my personal situation, I wanted to play games with the money I was able to save.

As I wrote, I thought about it and decided to take a small loss for my own sanity. Just to add... I'm not advising anybody to do anything as far as their investments. Please do your own DD. With the current stock environment, I'm not touching a thing.

In reality, I've only ever purchased bbry shares anyway. I don't see how any of this or what I have written leads you to "Nice words, but totally shallow."

I do want to point out that I have every intent to continue using my devices and am aware that they're not going to turn into coasters (at least not in the foreseeable future) regardless of what BlackBerry does.

I just struggled with buying the SE and wrote why I ultimately just cancelled the order. Do I still love my original Passport? Yes. Am I using it right now? Yes. It is a great device. I don't see how I should keep my comments on BlackBerry to myself when I'm on a BlackBerry forum unless I was just trolling in which case a mod would have likely closed this thread already.

Posted via CB10

that's the jolla phone with sailfish os and has a sailfish app store and you can dl a android run time for it and run android version of bbm on it

Posted via CB10

[wincyUt]

I am completely agree with OP, and not buying SE because I am not sure what BlackBerry is doing next and if they are committed to develop BB10. I will go with Window phone if there is no BB10 phone available and I have started browsing wpcentral.com to get used to Windows phone.

You guys don't know what you are missing, if you haven't owned or tried an SE. The SILVER ED truly rocks IMHO!
Anyway, it's your money and your pursuit of happiness. Goodluck to you and OP.

[RLTurn77]

Go over to android central and read the comments in the article Blaze posted about the slider. People are hyped up about android and BB10 slider. Lots of people coming back to Blackberry and it will sell big from the five minutes I spent looking at it. I dont see how you could use the android version and then not convert to BB10. I see this as something that is working, the stock people have to see results and they are coming in software and hardware.

I made money with BB stock I bought at $7.40 BBRY is a solid investment but the stock needs buying volume to go up instead of being a trading vehicle for the paper movers that Donald Trump talks about.

I agree regarding the stock. It is completely manipulated, but I really tried to stay away from this just being about the stock. If the Android BlackBerry sells much more the stock will follow. I'm more concerned now with BB10 because I really do love the OS. The comment that I replied to basically said that I don't support BlackBerry because, in my situation, it was best to just sell my shares.

Posted via CB10

[xtremesniper]

I'm kind of in the same boat as you, as I was about the order the SE before deciding against it only because I want some more clarity before making a $650 + tax investment in a phone that should theoretically be supported for at least a year or two.

I, too, converted my entire immediate family to BB10 phones as they are all on Z30s now and they love it. But as you said, with no immediate upgrade path there will eventually be questions about where to go next. Luckily they are rather new to these phones so I have some time to figure things out before then.

I suspect we'll know more within a month. At that time I can finally decide if I'll continue to buy into the BB ecosystem or if it's time to move on.

Having said that, I took the time to look into "the best" Android phones on the market right now and I can say that I'm not terribly impressed. The latest Android updates are still introducing features that have been on BB10 ages ago and I would have assumed they already had as well.

I will wait and see, but it's pretty much this exact reasoning that may also be killing BB as they're taking away from their own prospective buyers who are not clear about the future of the platform. Now we're not talking about if the company will survive, we're just wondering if BB10 will.

[W1ck3D86]

I don't get where all this theory on BB10 going for good is coming from because the reasoning you guys keep presenting makes zero sense. Why should BlackBerry stop with BB10 updates? They have invested millions and made millions through government contracts so now BlackBerry just ups and leaves the OS to die? Right.

 вιaсĸвεггч� PP Silver Edition via CB10 (AT&T OS 10.3.2.2339)

Playbook...

Posted via CB10

[medic22003]

Personally I hope that bb10 continues to be supported and improved. Bb10 is my first BlackBerry experience, but in my mind it blows android out of the water. I love my z30 and will use it as long as it works well. With that said, and being on verizon, I'll be forced to st least look at the slider if it hits verizon, even if it is android. My hope is, that if I have to go android, I can get one from BlackBerry, that makes me feel like I'm using bb10. It will HAVE to have the BlackBerry vkb. The android kb are enough to drop a man into depression. I'm like you though, I really like the bb10 experience.

Posted via CB10