07-11-14 09:41 AM
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  1. dejanh's Avatar
    What happened to hugs all 'round?

    Posted via CrackBerry App
    lift likes this.
    07-07-14 01:18 PM
  2. 018125's Avatar
    Meh. I think you could be overstating things, but don't really care.
    I *will* say that you're treading pretty close to the line in terms of what's acceptable here.
    We're free to debate opinions all day long. It's *not* appropriate to call out users and make the discussions about them.
    The fact that you're actually targeting one of the moderators, who has volunteered countless hours here, just makes
    your line of reasoning even more questionable. ... You have every right to disagree with him, as I'm sure he would say.
    Calling him a liar ... Might be going a bit too far.
    Then it must have been a completely innocent mistake for him to continue to spew false information to back up his blind defence. Perhaps he just didn't notice the corrections.

    I would say that calling this out is entirely appropriate, and his motives probably worthy of investigation.

    I couldn't care less if he's a moderator or how many posts he has. The rules apply to him too.


    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 01:19 PM
  3. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Doesn't make sense. Being huge already makes it a whole lot different to a Q10, because the size is a main differentiating factor for smartphone segments.

    As is having a keyboard at this size.

    As is having a touch enabled hardware keyboard.

    As is having a 1:1 screen of this size, which makes the widest screen on the entire market by a long shot in a relatively compact device.
    Innovative =/= different
    Let's say I produce toasters made out of plastic. And you produce toasters made out of metal...
    Do you really think that even one of our toasters qualifies for being innovative?

    I know that marketing departments are using "innovation" as a buzz word for years and therefore changed the definition of the word, for someone who isn't that interested in the exact meaning of the word.
    It is however, semantically incorrect, in the case of the Passport.

    The Q10 has a 1x1 screen.
    It has a keyboard.
    It even has a touchpad (the screen).

    And now making that thing twice as big is innovating?
    No, it's not.
    It's as innovative as the 20 inch screen over the 17 one.
    Or the Note over the Galaxy.
    NOT AT ALL.

    Making something bigger, usually does not translate into making it an innovation.

    The only thing, that might be qualified as an innovation in the next few years is the keyboard.
    But even that is a very doubtful proposition as the keyboard currently qualifies for the status of "invention", not innovation.

    I agree with you, when you say that the size is a differentiator for smartphones. This is totally correct.
    But: difference =/= innovation.
    As I said with the Note.
    The Note was not innovative.

    Posted via CB10
    lift likes this.
    07-07-14 01:28 PM
  4. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    No, the Passport is not just "a huge Q10". The input system is a completely new hybrid physical/touch keyboard system that--if it works--could be revolutionary.

    And it's not just the larger screen, either. The Passport's screen is large enough and dense enough to display content in 16:9 vertically or horizontally. The vertical display will eliminate the scaling problems from the Q10 (a fair number of Android apps won't work on the Q10/Q5 just because UI elements wind up outside the window and can't be reached). This is also a fairly distinctive feature; I know I'VE never seen a phone that does this.

    And, finally, the Passport looks like no other phone out there right now. The style will certainly attract attention far more than the 9900-like Q10.
    Guys, honestly.
    Grab a dictionary (an Encyclopedia would probably be better), and learn the damn definition of the word Innovation.

    The screen is bigger ?
    Wow, Innovative.

    Letter boxing ?
    Magical!

    Looks different?
    Revolutionary!

    Marketing departments have really stepped up their game, if you guys actually believe what you say.
    Wow....

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 01:34 PM
  5. 018125's Avatar
    Guys, honestly.
    Grab a dictionary (an Encyclopedia would probably be better), and learn the damn definition of the word Innovation.

    The screen is bigger ?
    Wow, Innovative.

    Letter boxing ?
    Magical!

    Looks different?
    Revolutionary!

    Marketing departments have really stepped up their game, if you guys actually believe what you say.
    Wow....

    Posted via CB10
    Innovation could be a very very subtle change.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 01:44 PM
  6. CeCoQ's Avatar
    I think BlackBerry will fix the Passport keyboard.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 02:38 PM
  7. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Innovation could be a very very subtle change.

    Posted via CB10
    I think an example could clear some potential misunderstandings about the word.

    Do you think the iPhone was innovative?
    If yes, what part/s?

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 02:42 PM
  8. CeCoQ's Avatar
    I think an example could clear some potential misunderstandings about the word.

    Do you think the iPhone was innovative?
    If yes, what part/s?

    Posted via CB10
    IPhone reinvented the phone. Look at picture of phones before and after iPhone.

    IPhone was a breakthrough. It was a device 5 years ahead of technology at that time.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 02:57 PM
  9. Tim Heard's Avatar
    I don't understand how some won't acknowledge that the Passport keyboard is innovative, regardless of whether they like it.

    It's innovative enough that BlackBerry felt obliged to patent it to protect it from being copied. (Yes, some will ask why anyone would want to.) Regardless of whether it works, or how broadly it is accepted, the concept of having a keyboard that doubles as a touch pad is absolutely innovative. How could someone argue otherwise? What other device does that?

    When the Z30 came out, whatever it was that enabled the longer battery life was innovative. (Something about the antenna design?)
    jcarlos100, Banco and gokulesh like this.
    07-07-14 03:02 PM
  10. Carruthers's Avatar
    Oh we are definitely sure. Look at the polls, the Passport (controversial as it is) is set to the most exciting BlackBerry in ages. A Lot of ppl like the look of it and the minimalistic keyboard. From what everyone who's actually typed on one has said, it is actually more intuitive, Efficient and productive than standard physical or virtual keyboards. And the characters only take up screen when needed, which isn't too often. I would be more inclined to trust the good folks at BlackBerry who have designed world class keyboards for years over someone on this forum who can barely explain their ideas. We saw the patent application for this keyboard a year ago, maybe back then would have been a better time to air your grievances. Not two months before release.


    Sent from my Z10. Or was it my Q10? Either way, it was sent from an awesome phone.
    gokulesh likes this.
    07-07-14 03:03 PM
  11. Adif_70's Avatar
    I like the keyboard as it is now. Innovations takes a mind set to get past.
    07-07-14 03:06 PM
  12. 018125's Avatar
    I think an example could clear some potential misunderstandings about the word.

    Do you think the iPhone was innovative?
    If yes, what part/s?

    Posted via CB10
    Well I took your advice and looked up the definition of innovation:

    1 : the introduction of something new 2 : a new idea, method, or device

    By this definition:

    - the keyboard itself is innovative
    - the keyboard gestures on a physical keyboard are innovative
    - the size of screen for a keyboard phone is innovative.

    This phone stands alone. It's by definition innovative. Whether the innovations will be successful, meaningful or adopted are yet to be decided.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 03:17 PM
  13. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Haha
    I like interesting conversations and this is going there.

    I have the definition of Invention for you, as a counter
    Invention;(n-vnshn)
    n.
    1. The act or process of inventing: used a technique of her own invention.
    2. A new device, method, or process developed from study and experimentation: the phonograph, an invention attributed to Thomas Edison.
    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/_/d...word=invention

    That's basically the same definition as "innovation".
    But we know, that invention =/= innovation.

    That's why I said an encyclopedia would probably be better.

    "Innovation is about finding a better way of doing something.[1] Innovation can be viewed as the application of better solutions that meet new requirements, in-articulated needs, or existing market needs.[2] This is accomplished through more effective products, processes, services, technologies, or ideas that are readily available to markets, governments and society. The term innovation can be defined as something original and, as a consequence, new, that "breaks into" the market or society. A definition consistent with these aspects would be the following: "An innovation is something original, new, and important in whatever field that breaks in to a market or society".[3]

    While something novel is often described as an innovation, in economics, management science, and other fields of practice and analysis it is generally considered a process that brings together various novel ideas in a way that they have an impact on society.

    Innovation differs from invention in that innovation refers to the use of a better and, as a result, novel idea or method, whereas invention refers more directly to the creation of the idea or method itself.

    Innovation differs from improvement in that innovation refers to the notion of doing something different rather than doing the same thing better."
    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Innovation

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 03:47 PM
  14. jcarlos100's Avatar
    Them paragraphs lol

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 03:59 PM
  15. lift's Avatar
    Then why even bother commenting on this product? I don't get it. OF COURSE it's ugly then to you and OF COURSE there isn't any functionality in it you care about that could make up for its looks. OMG.
    Who made you the king of the forums? So your telling me I have no right to comment on something? I have no right to an opinion? I am voicing my concerns and opinions about the device in a DISCUSSION FORUM!! I have never said or even implied that my OPINIONS or SPECULATIONS about the device are right or wrong. I have an opinion, so does everyone else. Don't get yourself all huffy over a discussion forum. Oh by the way, don't sit there and try to imply that you have no opinion of a device you never used or never intended to buy. I care about BlackBerry as a company and maybe they will take all the discussion about this device seriously.
    07-07-14 04:00 PM
  16. Tim Heard's Avatar
    Honestly, I've given up on following which side of the debate individuals are on, but by this definition, the Passport still would be considered an innovation. It's a totally new way of using a keyboard. If it were simply changing the number of rows, or the sensitivity of the keys, that would be "change" or possibly improvement. Even just incorporating some sort of predictive spelling could be argued as *not* being innovative, because other QWERTY phones offer some variant of that, not to mention touch phones.
    Using a keyboard though as a touch pad definitely fits your definition below as innovation. It is using a keyboard differently than anyone thought about using one previously.


    Haha

    Innovation differs from invention in that innovation refers to the use of a better and, as a result, novel idea or method, whereas invention refers more directly to the creation of the idea or method itself.

    Innovation differs from improvement in that innovation refers to the notion of doing something different rather than doing the same thing better."
    Innovation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Posted via CB10
    That said, I'd still probably prefer to have a Passport screen with a Classic keyboard. :-)
    gokulesh likes this.
    07-07-14 04:05 PM
  17. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    Innovative =/= different
    Let's say I produce toasters made out of plastic. And you produce toasters made out of metal...
    Do you really think that even one of our toasters qualifies for being innovative?

    I know that marketing departments are using "innovation" as a buzz word for years and therefore changed the definition of the word, for someone who isn't that interested in the exact meaning of the word.
    It is however, semantically incorrect, in the case of the Passport.

    The Q10 has a 1x1 screen.
    It has a keyboard.
    It even has a touchpad (the screen).

    And now making that thing twice as big is innovating?
    No, it's not.
    It's as innovative as the 20 inch screen over the 17 one.
    Or the Note over the Galaxy.
    NOT AT ALL.

    Making something bigger, usually does not translate into making it an innovation.

    The only thing, that might be qualified as an innovation in the next few years is the keyboard.
    But even that is a very doubtful proposition as the keyboard currently qualifies for the status of "invention", not innovation.

    I agree with you, when you say that the size is a differentiator for smartphones. This is totally correct.
    But: difference =/= innovation.
    As I said with the Note.
    The Note was not innovative.

    Posted via CB10
    Um.....I never called it an innovation. But then on the other side of the coin you're even downplaying it.
    07-07-14 04:05 PM
  18. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    Who made you the king of the forums? So your telling me I have no right to comment on something?
    NO I F'KNG DON'T.

    But now knowing you were never a keyboard guy at all makes pretty much all of your 50 posts and 15 threads on the Passport totally......not worth reading them. I mean.....if I don't like wine I won't comment on wine in wine forums, at least not to this extent and that generally speaking, right? Now your entire opinion on the product is totally irrelevant for anyone who considers buying one.

    "Hey, liking keyboard phones? Thinking of getting one? Seek that guy who never liked keyboards at all to begin with for advice and I'm sure you'll find the right device."
    07-07-14 04:10 PM
  19. lift's Avatar
    NO I F'KNG DON'T.

    But now knowing you were never a keyboard guy at all makes pretty much all of your 50 posts and 15 threads on the Passport totally......not worth reading them. I mean.....if I don't like wine I won't comment on wine in wine forums, at least not to this extent and that generally speaking, right? Now your entire opinion on the product is totally irrelevant for anyone who considers buying one.
    Being a keyboard guy or not has no relevance. I'm a BLACKBERRY guy. If you didn't like wine you wouldn't post on a wine forum? Good. But the Passport is a BlackBerry. I like BlackBerry and this is a BlackBerry forum so you are making no sense.
    You can get mad at me and all the others here that don't like the device, but it doesn't give you the right to tell us we have no right to comment on it.
    So you like the passport. Good, buy it when it comes out. Give us your opinions of it. This is a BlackBerry forum!
    07-07-14 04:16 PM
  20. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    IPhone reinvented the phone. Look at picture of phones before and after iPhone.

    IPhone was a breakthrough. It was a device 5 years ahead of technology at that time.

    Posted via CB10
    Windows Mobile Family
    HTC XDA 2002


    HP iPAQ 2005


    HTC Touch, June 2007


    Other OS

    Nec N500 2004


    Sony Ericsson P910


    LG Prada 2006



    I ask again, what would you qualify as the innovation?
    Because all of those phones have a touchscreen and are rectangularly shaped.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 04:19 PM
  21. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    If you didn't like wine you wouldn't post on a wine forum? Good. But the Passport is a BlackBerry. I like BlackBerry and this is a BlackBerry forum so you are making no sense.
    Whoa that's awesome! Know why? Because thanks to you I just realize that wine is still something to drink and I certainly like drinking.

    Now heading to the next wine forum.
    07-07-14 04:37 PM
  22. lift's Avatar
    Whoa that's awesome! Know why? Because thanks to you I just realize that wine is still something to drink and I certainly like drinking.

    Now heading to the next wine forum.
    Hey that's pretty good. Have a great time.
    07-07-14 04:50 PM
  23. 018125's Avatar
    Did someone say wine?

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 05:21 PM
  24. calivol's Avatar
    I thought this was the whine forum.

    Posted via CB10
    07-07-14 05:29 PM
  25. BB75's Avatar
    Damn. Honestly, I went through this entire thread to get a full understanding of what the OP is trying to say as well as those of you opposing his point of view.
    We all have opinions fortunately even this forum is a democratic one. Therefore, respect each other's opinions...whether we agree or disagree with them.

    That said, I like the passport but detest the LOOK of the keyboard. However, I reserve my detailed personal opinions thus far until I actually get my HANDS on it.

    I will decide then if the passport is the "one" for me or not. Until then, I continue to enjoy my current relationship with my beloved Z10...FYI, just celebrated my one year anniversary with it.


    Keep the discussion going....trust me, BlackBerry actually listens to its people.

    Later!
    CeCoQ and lift like this.
    07-07-14 06:14 PM
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