04-16-14 05:19 PM
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  1. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    It's not a mad tactic, it's a survival tactic. In an ideal world all BB customers should upgrade to BB10, the reality proved different, they choose BBOS experience over BB10 experience.



    #believeinfilm
    And unless this turns around, BlackBerry hardware is dead in about four quarters. Because BBOS sales are shrinking madly every quarter and BlackBerry 10 sales aren't rising.
    kbz1960 likes this.
    04-08-14 07:15 AM
  2. qbnkelt's Avatar
    I'll tell you what. In the past people took their time to learn new tech. Nowadays people want things right now with instant gratification. This generation is just now now now. When in reality it's not so simple.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2141
    You just made the argument for the existence of a learning curve.



    Posted from my awesome Q10 via CB10.
    04-08-14 07:17 AM
  3. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    As I've said MULTIPLE TIMES there are two problems ... how BlackBerry 10 is doing now; AND BlackBerry OS's decline that led them here.

    Not sure why you gloss over the latter and try to keep saying "Yeah well BlackBerry 10 isn't doing well". So what? Whether they went Android, or Windows Phone or BlackBerry 10 is not the point ... they are potential paths to a problem of a rapidly declining BBOS ... which has been declining quarter over quarter for years, BlackBerry 10 or no BlackBerry 10 because of issues.
    No, there was no BlackBerry OS decline, the user base kept growing up to 90 million, they sold more and more devices to well over 10 million a quarter.

    The decline was in profits and that's partly because the huge investment in BB10 at around the same time buying QNX and all other companies.

    Of course, eventually the bb7 line up got too old and started declining with no replacements in sight.


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 07:18 AM
  4. sixpacker's Avatar
    It's not a mad tactic, it's a survival tactic. In an ideal world all BB customers should upgrade to BB10, the reality proved different, they choose BBOS experience over BB10 experience.



    #believeinfilm
    A lot of BBOS phones are corporate issue, so choice doesn't come into it. I had to use a curve for a year, horrible thing.
    Problem with bb10 was they didn't ask their market what they wanted, they thought they knew best by turning out a me-too android /ios lookalike. The focus needed to be apps and ui innovation, it was neither, not even close.
    04-08-14 07:19 AM
  5. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    And unless this turns around, BlackBerry hardware is dead in about four quarters. Because BBOS sales are shrinking madly every quarter and BlackBerry 10 sales aren't rising.
    What do you expect from a 3+ year old OS and devices? A miracle? It's a miracle it still sells at all.


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 07:20 AM
  6. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    No, there was no BlackBerry OS decline, the user base kept growing up to 90 million, they sold more and more devices to well over 10 million a quarter.
    The userbase peaked at 80 million. When was the last time a quarterly shipment number went up and not down?

    Don't make things up to support your view ...
    04-08-14 07:22 AM
  7. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    A lot of BBOS phones are corporate issue, so choice doesn't come into it. I had to use a curve for a year, horrible thing.
    Problem with bb10 was they didn't ask their market what they wanted, they thought they knew best by turning out a me-too android /ios lookalike. The focus needed to be apps and ui innovation, it was neither, not even close.
    I disagree, choice does come into it, it's the employer's choice. If he only expects calls and emails from you why get you a more expensive device?


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 07:23 AM
  8. Shadowyugi's Avatar
    The world doesn't revolve around CrackBerry, most BlackBerry users never heard of it. If you read CB now there's hardly any mention of BBOS, yet they add up to 55+ millions vs barely 5 million BB10 subscribers (I'm being generous)

    #believeinfilm

    add up to. Yeah... I like how you forget to mention;
    1. The number is from the number of users who bought blackberry when blackberry was...well...number 1. They stayed with the phone for different reasons. Mostly money, for some, its technically a 'dumb' phone, for others, work phone. For the most, kid phones but even that's phasing out. Which then leads to...

    2. The fact that the number is free falling. And I'm talking terminal velocity free-falling.

    A lot of people I know hate the BBOS. It's what made my sister change to an iPhone 5S.
    And if you really want to blame anything/anyone regarding the failings of BB10... BlackBerry Marketing Dept. would kindly speak to you...
    kbz1960 likes this.
    04-08-14 07:25 AM
  9. Shadowyugi's Avatar
    And unless this turns around, BlackBerry hardware is dead in about four quarters. Because BBOS sales are shrinking madly every quarter and BlackBerry 10 sales aren't rising.
    It's like watching gravity at work in 3D glasses...
    *chews salty popcorn*
    04-08-14 07:28 AM
  10. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    The userbase peaked at 80 million. When was the last time a quarterly shipment number went up and not down?

    Don't make things up to support your view ...
    Yes, I know, that was a typo. The point still stands though


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 07:28 AM
  11. kbz1960's Avatar
    As I've said MULTIPLE TIMES there are two problems ... how BlackBerry 10 is doing now; AND BlackBerry OS's decline that led them here.

    The problem is not just that people are choosing BlackBerry OS still. it's that they aren't choosing BlackBerrys of any flavor in numbers that are increasing.

    Not sure why you gloss over the latter and try to keep saying "Yeah well BlackBerry 10 isn't doing well". So what? Whether they went Android, or Windows Phone or BlackBerry 10 is not the point ... they are potential paths to a problem of a rapidly declining BBOS ... which has been declining quarter over quarter for years, BlackBerry 10 or no BlackBerry 10 because of issues.
    Exactly. People staying on BBOS weren't leaving in the first place. And if they do it was to BB10 or a different platform. With no BB10 it would all be to different platforms.
    Shadowyugi likes this.
    04-08-14 07:40 AM
  12. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Exactly. People staying on BBOS weren't leaving in the first place. And if they do it was to BB10 or a different platform. With no BB10 it would all be to different platforms.
    Except if there was no BB10 there would've been a new generation of BBOS devices, perhaps BB8.


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 07:43 AM
  13. Shadowyugi's Avatar
    Except if there was no BB10 there would've been a new generation of BBOS devices, perhaps BB8.


    #believeinfilm
    So basically a re-hash of BB7? BB7.1.1?

    Really?
    04-08-14 07:49 AM
  14. Shadowyugi's Avatar
    What do you expect from a 3+ year old OS and devices? A miracle? It's a miracle it still sells at all.


    #believeinfilm
    All the more reason we should have done a funeral pyre and laid the phone/os at rest... But nah!! Chen wants to be Victor Frankenstein!
    04-08-14 07:52 AM
  15. web99's Avatar
    No, there was no BlackBerry OS decline, the user base kept growing up to 90 million, they sold more and more devices to well over 10 million a quarter.

    The decline was in profits and that's partly because the huge investment in BB10 at around the same time buying QNX and all other companies.

    Of course, eventually the bb7 line up got too old and started declining with no replacements in sight.


    #believeinfilm
    The userbase peaked at 80 million. But lets look at why there was a decline in profits.

    1. Consumers started switching away from BlackBerry in favour of ios and android devices around 2010, so there was a steep decline in marketshare and BB's percentage of new phone sales kept on declining. Some of the reasons for this had to do with BBOS problems - ie. Spinning clock, phone freezing, inadequate browsing, truncated emails, bad camera, lack of functionality and apps that were available on ios and android, etc. Basille and Lazaridis failed to react until it was too late and that "tools not toys" dismissive comment by the CEO's did not help.

    2. BlackBerry had to write off billions in unsold inventory of BBOS phones. All you have to do is to google articles from 2012.

    3. The rise in BYOD meant that there is a reduction in BlackBerry phones sold at the enterprise level as workphones no longer had to be made by BlackBerry.

    The above 3 reasons had a much bigger impact on BBRY's profit than either the purchase of QNX or the development of BB10.
    04-08-14 07:58 AM
  16. kbz1960's Avatar
    Except if there was no BB10 there would've been a new generation of BBOS devices, perhaps BB8.


    #believeinfilm
    I would've went elsewhere if there was only BB8 or whatever BBOS. I don't think I'm alone. I was tired of lag, spinning clocks and everything else that foes along with it. Not saying I hated it because I didn't. It does have it's good points but the bad is just not acceptable to most people. If they didn't change the 9850 would have been my last BB.
    Shadowyugi likes this.
    04-08-14 07:59 AM
  17. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    The userbase peaked at 80 million. But lets look at why there was a decline in profits.

    1. Consumers started switching away from BlackBerry in favour of ios and android devices around 2010, so there was a steep decline in marketshare and BB's percentage of new phone sales kept on declining.

    2. BlackBerry had to write off billions in unsold inventory of BBOS phones. All you have to do is to google articles from 2012.

    3. The rise in BYOD meant that there is a reduction in BlackBerry phones sold at the enterprise level as workphones no longer had to be made by BlackBerry.

    The above 3 reasons had a much bigger impact on BBRY's profit than either the purchase of QNX or the development of BB10.
    Did bb10 fix any of the above problems? No, it accelerated them.


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 08:04 AM
  18. David Murray1's Avatar
    I noticed very little lag or spinning clock on my beloved 9900. I'd still take that device over and iDroid and doubly so for work purposes. I sometimes still think about ditching this Z10 to go back to 9900 but I'll wait for the Q20 instead.

    Posted via CB10
    04-08-14 08:13 AM
  19. qbnkelt's Avatar
    The bricking and nuking 99xx and the horrible camera killed BlackBerry for me. I kept my work issued 9930 because there is no choice there, I had to use what they gave me.

    It took the Z10 to get me back, and my complaints there were the random reboots, the horrible battery life, and the lack of apps. Now, with the Q10, I'm happy with my BlackBerry again. I still lack apps since I will not put Android apps on a BlackBerry, I've got my SGIII for Android apps. And I've got my iPhone 5s. I use all three platforms and I love all three.

    But I came back to BlackBerry because of the Z10 and I'm staying because of the Q10.

    And, ironically, my agency has now deployed Note 2s, iPads, and iPhones.
    Posted from my awesome Q10 via CB10.
    Shadowyugi, kbz1960, web99 and 2 others like this.
    04-08-14 08:43 AM
  20. CHIP72's Avatar
    Except if there was no BB10 there would've been a new generation of BBOS devices, perhaps BB8.

    #believeinfilm
    I'm looking at this thread from a smartphone, but didn't you say up thread that BB7 was really intended to be BB6.1 but was marketed as BB7 because BB10 devices weren't ready yet in Q3 2011?

    The phrase "blood from a stone" comes to mind when BB8 (or more accurately a variation of BBOS) is presented as a viable alternative path into the future for Blackberry circa 2012-2014.



    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums mobile app
    04-08-14 09:09 AM
  21. CHIP72's Avatar
    I disagree, choice does come into it, it's the employer's choice. If he only expects calls and emails from you why get you a more expensive device?

    #believeinfilm
    BB7 devices, or at least high-end BB7 devices, weren't (and amazingly still aren't) exactly cheap.

    On a related note, many companies have switched to alternative mobile operating systems because they do e-mail and calls well enough for the employers' purposes.



    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums mobile app
    kbz1960 likes this.
    04-08-14 09:14 AM
  22. badiyee's Avatar
    The bricking and nuking 99xx and the horrible camera killed BlackBerry for me. I kept my work issued 9930 because there is no choice there, I had to use what they gave me.

    It took the Z10 to get me back, and my complaints there were the random reboots, the horrible battery life, and the lack of apps. Now, with the Q10, I'm happy with my BlackBerry again. I still lack apps since I will not put Android apps on a BlackBerry, I've got my SGIII for Android apps. And I've got my iPhone 5s. I use all three platforms and I love all three.

    But I came back to BlackBerry because of the Z10 and I'm staying because of the Q10.

    And, ironically, my agency has now deployed Note 2s, iPads, and iPhones.
    Posted from my awesome Q10 via CB10.
    Doesn't matter if we're looking at "per handset" issue. If your agency actually pushes for BES 12 adoption, the money that BlackBerry earns off that BES 12 adoption would surpass all the margins of selling a phone in matter of 3-6 months. Assuming EVERY, SINGLE, phone, inclusive of Windows devices, on BES 12 MDM.
    04-08-14 09:20 AM
  23. qbnkelt's Avatar
    Doesn't matter if we're looking at "per handset" issue. If your agency actually pushes for BES 12 adoption, the money that BlackBerry earns off that BES 12 adoption would surpass all the margins of selling a phone in matter of 3-6 months. Assuming EVERY, SINGLE, phone, inclusive of Windows devices, on BES 12 MDM.
    They are not. They are moving away from BlackBerry hardware and services entirely.

    Posted from my awesome Q10 via CB10.
    Shadowyugi likes this.
    04-08-14 09:22 AM
  24. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    I'm looking at this thread from a smartphone, but didn't you say up thread that BB7 was really intended to be BB6.1 but was marketed as BB7 because BB10 devices weren't ready yet in Q3 2011?

    The phrase "blood from a stone" comes to mind when BB8 (or more accurately a variation of BBOS) is presented as a viable alternative path into the future for Blackberry circa 2012-2014.



    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums mobile app
    No, that's not what I said, go back and read it again.


    #believeinfilm
    04-08-14 09:24 AM
  25. badiyee's Avatar
    They are not. They are moving away from BlackBerry hardware and services entirely.

    Posted from my awesome Q10 via CB10.
    Guess too bad for both BlackBerry and the agency.
    04-08-14 09:30 AM
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