[Nemzy]

I don't think you can say that price has not massively contributed to disparity between BBOS and BB10 sales. Belfast, you make a fair point in terms of service revenue but you cannot conclude whether it comes from the sale of new BBOS phones because there are old BBOS phone that are still in use in enterprise today.

Price is one of the main reason why BBOS have massively outsold BB10 phones.
Also marketing of BB10 has been horrible. People just don't know about BB10 so you can't buy something you don't know about.

Do I think going back to BBOS7 is a bad idea?

Yes, if they are designing new bold lines that will be sold at premium prices.
No, is they are putting existing resources to use to produce the existing bold line at a low price that will sell.

BB10 phone are good products that continue to improve but the market just does not recognise. BlackBerry have to find a way of changing the perception that people have of them which I must say is far from the easiest task. People when they hear BlackBerry think of BBOS and they just don't want to know so it is very misinformed to say that BBOS is the way forward.

It is a big task in front of Blackberry and i don't know how they will do it but it is possible.

BB10 is definitely the way forward.

[Chase_Manley]

Have you ever wondered maybe that's what BlackBerry customers want from BlackBerry?

Nobody seems to want BB10 after all, ok not nobody but very very few.


#believeinfilm

That's because not a lot of people know about BlackBerry 10. I feel like if they keep putting out new phones more and more ppl are going to start thinking about "trying out" Bb10. Once they try, they are going to want to buy.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

Do you think they would sell if it was a $500 flagship phone? I personally think the only way they can sell these things is if it was just a phone. No camera or any other bells and whistles. Would you buy a laptop with windows 98 when you can get the same laptop, at the same cost, with windows 8? It seems crazy to me. Price is going to be a huge factor. If they expect companies to pay a premium for os7, they are out of their minds. They should be using their resources to get all of the features from os7 into bb10. BB10 is slick and it has a lot if potential. All of the potential of os7 has been tapped. It doesn't have a future. There will be the stubborn diehard legacy fans that won't give it up but it isn't going to attract new customers. I guess this would be a good idea if the plan was only to keep existing legacy users.

Posted via CB10

Change that to Windows 7 vs Windows 8 laptop at the same price and most people do choose W7, fact!

Some would even take W XP over W8.

BB10 had failed in every aspect, did not attract developers, did not attract new users or existing users, did not make money.

As bad as BB7 was BB was better off when they only had BB7 devices to sell.


#believeinfilm

[redlightblinking]

That's not my point. My point was that the Q20 was supposed to bring those people over. Everyone on crackberry was defending the Q20 down to their last breath because it had a little ball and belt to play with. And now BlackBerry is like. Let's just waste money on the Q20 and go backwards five years.

Posted via 10.3 on Verizon

How many people do you see drinking "new" Coke? I'm pretty sure they did better by going back to classic Coke.

I'm pretty sure people still by paper for their printers even though we have ways to electronically communicate.

I'm pretty sure people still drive gas sucking cars even though you can buy one that is a plug-in.

"Backwards" and "forwards" are completely relative terms. If you go "forwards" and make a product that people don't buy and/or is incomplete....did you really go "forwards"?

[KiLuMaNaTi]

Change that to Windows 7 vs Windows 8 laptop at the same price and most people do choose W7, fact!

Some would even take W XP over W8.

BB10 had failed in every aspect, did not attract developers, did not attract new users or existing users, did not make money.

As bad as BB7 was BB was better off when they only had BB7 devices to sell.


#believeinfilm

Well yes but os7 feels a little more dated in comparison to BB10 than windows 7 compares to 8. How about xp and Vista instead.


Posted via CB10

[cgk]

he didnt say bb7 he said bold. They may just call their new keyboard phones by their old classic names.

No I listen to the call, the Bold is a BB7 device, the first of the new keyboard BB10 devices has been renamed from Q20 to "Classic" (just to confuse things).

[gokulesh]

Background:

1. I listened to the entire call and QA.

2. My company as of a month ago was still buying the 9900 and have just recently approved the BB10 devices; all 3 as in Q and Z10 and Z30.

3. Every upgrade at my company has been to a bb10 device as they became available. Not ONE person has asked for the legacy device.

Facts:
- They are restarting the bold 9900 line.
- Buying on a cost variable model versus previously it was firm commitment. Chen specifically said they will not lose money on the hardware in this setup.
The deal is with Wisteron(?) not Foxconn

My thoughts:

- enterprise wants bes 12 before moving to BB10 and so staying with 9900. Chen's comments lead me to believe this + experience in my company.
- bulk of BB10 sales are consumer. Why? Announced enterprise #s are small and companies like mine are just starting to move to bb10. It took between BlackBerry and our IT department a year to test and roll out BES10. The reason we did it is because we were on an older bes then 5 and we were in a need of an upgrade. If we were on bes 5 we would have waited until Nov for bes 12 before going to bb10 devices.

- Chen has probably been hearing that the enterprise transition will likely begin in earnest once bes 12 is out. And he needs to keep his clients happy till then with device replacement when they break

- couple this with the good deal they have struck from a cost perspective for producing 9900 and it's a win win for BlackBerry

My conclusion is that until upcoming Q4 legacy will outsell bb10. Z3 and Q20 in consumer space will accelerate (how much is anyone's guess hoping for a lot)

And that Q1 is when the tide will turn decisively as bes 12 and bb10 accelerate.

G

Posted via CB10

[Shadowyugi]

Change that to Windows 7 vs Windows 8 laptop at the same price and most people do choose W7, fact!

Some would even take W XP over W8.

BB10 had failed in every aspect, did not attract developers, did not attract new users or existing users, did not make money.

As bad as BB7 was BB was better off when they only had BB7 devices to sell.


#believeinfilm

True. But now they have BB10 to sell. BB7 should have seen off and ended. Everyone who truly used that OS and phone to their potential loved it, including me. But the aim is to move onwards and forward. That cannot happen if they are trying to hold on to the past. I find it weird that BB7 phones are still in shops while BB10 phones are lacking.

BlackBerry looks like they are trying to coast on past success. It's not going to work. And that's the scary thing.

[Shadowyugi]

I really, really do pray so. I don't want this company to fail!

[playbookster]

No I listen to the call, the Bold is a BB7 device, the first of the new keyboard BB10 devices has been renamed from Q20 to "Classic" (just to confuse things).

Oh lovely

The GIF Exchange C001B7B16?

[22mchan]

This is so truue. I always see them currves on the bus. BlackBerry, you need a low end device

Posted via CB10

[RubberChicken76]

Why do we keep assuming it's the price? In UK the Z10 was the same price as the Curve 9720, why isn't it selling?


#believeinfilm

Why do you keep assuming it's BIS?


Familiarity?

Availability in region?

Data plan cost?

Corporate issued standard for their company?

Cost of device in region?



Posted via CB10

[gokulesh]

Oh lovely

The GIF Exchange C001B7B16?

I wouldn't despair. I think it is a smart strategic move. Read my earlier comment.

Posted via CB10

[gokulesh]

.

BlackBerry looks like they are trying to coast on past success. It's not going to work. And that's the scary thing.

I do not believe this to be the case. The new management team is 95% new and outside of BlackBerry. They have no emotional attachment to the success or failures of the past.


Posted via CB10

[KiLuMaNaTi]

Change that to Windows 7 vs Windows 8 laptop at the same price and most people do choose W7, fact!

Some would even take W XP over W8.

BB10 had failed in every aspect, did not attract developers, did not attract new users or existing users, did not make money.

As bad as BB7 was BB was better off when they only had BB7 devices to sell.


#believeinfilm

I guess my point is they will not sell os7 at a premium to anybody other than existing users. There could be a few that move from BB10 back to os7 but not many. Oh and BB10 only failed because nobody knows about it. Most people who have used it will tell you it is a great and certainly superior to os7 in most aspects. As a modern os, os7 fails in almost every aspect and is why BB10 was a must. They could have just kept selling os7 phones but they would just be dying a slower death with no chance to recover. BB10 was their chance and still could be.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

I guess my point is they will not sell os7 at a premium to anybody other than existing users. There could be a few that move from BB10 back to os7 but not many. Oh and BB10 only failed because nobody knows about it. Most people who have used it will tell you it is a great and certainly superior to os7 in most aspects. As a modern os, os7 fails in almost every aspect and is why BB10 was a must. They could have just kept selling os7 phones but they would just be dying a slower death with no chance to recover. BB10 was their chance and still could be.

Posted via CB10

They don't need to sell it at a premium, they need to sell it a t a decent margin.


#believeinfilm

[imz]

This is so truue. I always see them currves on the bus. BlackBerry, you need a low end device

They do...

The Q5 IS a low end device. That was supposed to be the saviour according to some on here, a low end "cheap" BB10 device to finally put the nail in the coffin for OS7 for those who were shy of purchasing a Q10, a high-end high-priced "flagship".

No, sorry, its the Z3 that will launch sooner or later, thats the low end device that will finally kill off OS7 because the Z10/Z30 was too high in price.

No no, its next quarter, we need two more quarters, three?

No no no, 10.3 is the game changer

[igor10000]

Spinning clock and battery pulls will not save BlackBerry.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

Well yes but os7 feels a little more dated in comparison to BB10 than windows 7 compares to 8. How about xp and Vista instead.


Posted via CB10

It doesn't matter how it feels, it's the last generation vs the current generation.

Windows 8 has faced the same problem as BB10, most users don't want it and out of the ones that do buy it they're mostly forced into it.


#believeinfilm

[Bla1ze]

So the real question, are you going to load up on BBOS Bold's Belfast? Hoard them. Sounds like an idea for a show.. 'Tech Hoarders' lol

[blackmoe]

Did I ever say it was? Lol, why are you picking and twisting everything? It's happening, deal with it, legacy OS lives on on at least a new device and so is BIS.


#believeinfilm

Not a new device. They are restocking an old device. See the difference?

[KiLuMaNaTi]

They don't need to sell it at a premium, they need to sell it a t a decent margin.


#believeinfilm

This is true and I really hope they are around the 250-300 range.

Posted via CB10

[propeller10]

Chen seems to only care about legacy keyboard users. I don't think I agree with his device strategy. He is essentially continuing the failed strategy of the RIM co-founders instead of aggressively pushing OS 10. I am certain Blackberry will be acquired by another company before the end of 2015.

[trsbbs]

I guess my point is they will not sell os7 at a premium to anybody other than existing users. There could be a few that move from BB10 back to os7 but not many. Oh and BB10 only failed because nobody knows about it. Most people who have used it will tell you it is a great and certainly superior to os7 in most aspects. As a modern os, os7 fails in almost every aspect and is why BB10 was a must. They could have just kept selling os7 phones but they would just be dying a slower death with no chance to recover. BB10 was their chance and still could be.

Posted via CB10

I like BlackBerry 10 but it still does not have all the security or is as configurable that the legacy OS is.

Cost is also a factor in several parts of the world market. High end cutting edge is also a large world wide market. The later is having the BlackBerry enterprise market for breakfast.









Posted via Verizon Z10 - OS v10.1.2.2174

[belfastdispatcher]

Not a new device. They are restocking an old device. See the difference?

I don't think you understand, legacy users want to maintain the experience, they don't want something completely new again, the 9900 was beautiful and solid.

Think about it 9700 to 9780 to 9790, 9800 to 9810, iphone 5 to iPhone 5s, nothing new here, I expect the difference to be on then inside.


#believeinfilm