[Kerplunk17]

Accually, it's 64 bit and you would be surprised what XP programs won't run on it. And, not all versions of Windows 7 Get the XP mode. You have to be running Windows 7 Professional, Enterprise, or Ultimate editions to get it.
Install and use Windows XP Mode in Windows 7

I didn't compare the time between XP and 7, but look at the time between Vista and 7.

How long WAS the 9700 the flagship device?? You do realize it was replaced as the newest device LONG before the 9800 came out. What about the 9750? What about the 9100 series? What about the 9800 owners when the 9780 comes out? or the Clamshell version??

What about people like me that had their 8310 for less than a year when the 9000 came out?

You make think fantasy football ENHANCES the game. But, what ever happened to just enjoying the game? Not watching a game to see who did what, or worrying if your pick's for the week are going to pan out?? To me, trying to keep up with all that crap DISTRACTS me from the point of watching sports.... ENTERTAINMENT. If you have to put that much work into it, how can it be fun??

And, the only comparison I made to WoW was that they are both games, both deal with FANTASY environments/team configurations, and that many people get so focused and obsessed with BOTH they lose touch with reality.

I run 64 bit as well but the virtual machine for XP mode is 32 bit. Even the time between vista and 7 was 3 years, not less than a year here.

Well Fantasy isnt your thing if it distracts you. I happen to like to know whats going on with certain players and teams all over the league, not just the game I am eatching. Fantasy keeps me up on that.

Also, WoW is completely fantasy, and has nothing to do with reality. Fantasy football is all based on events in real life. There is very little "Fantasy" about it, except for the name.

[WolfmanRobby]

I run 64 bit as well but the virtual machine for XP mode is 32 bit. Even the time between vista and 7 was 3 years, not less than a year here.

But, as I said, not all versions of 7 get to run XP mode. I have home premium. No XP mode for me!
Perhaps I should pitch a temper tantrum on the Dell forums that MicroSoft won't let me have XP mode? After all, I bought the PC from Dell!

Oh, and it was not 3 years between Vista and 7. Consumer versions of Vista did not ship until Jan of 2008 (Pro versions did ship in the fall of 2007) and All versions of 7 were released in July of 2009. For Joe Consumer, it was just over a year (about a year and a half) between Windows versions. For Business users, it was just under 2 years. Given the scale involved, a year on phone OS development is no big deal.

So, are you saying you would be happier if RIM waited LONGER between OS releases? And, the 9700 is gonna get OS 6, at some point. Certainly not within a year of when 5 came out so your argument is pretty weak.

Want to really compare it, go look at release dates for versions of Linux (Like Ubuntu!)

Well Fantasy isnt your thing if it distracts you. I happen to like to know whats going on with certain players and teams all over the league, not just the game I am eatching. Fantasy keeps me up on that.

Also, WoW is completely fantasy, and has nothing to do with reality. Fantasy football is all based on events in real life. There is very little "Fantasy" about it, except for the name.

That does not dispute my comparisons....
1) They are both GAMES
2) Both deal with Fantasy environments/teams. In WoW, it's all fantasy, In FF, it's your made up (Fantasy) team against other made up (Fantasy) teams. It just happens to be based on real world stats. But, that's as real as it gets.
3) Both of them have players that get addicted and obsessed with them (You are rapidly proving my point here.)

[Jean-luc_Picard]

RIM and Yahoo, I hate you both, but I am only saying goodbye to Blackberry. I am counting the days until my plan is eligible for an upgrade.

If you really hated them both, you'd say goodbye to both of them, not the one who's not at fault...

In the comparison to windows 7, I have this to say: Computers are pretty much all the same in appearance, so they don't come out with new models multiple times a year. Smartphones are a small size, and not pre-defined, so some people want a touch screen smartphone, some people want a full keyboard, some people want to connect to that new network that's being set up, but the old phones can't connect to it so they have to make a new phone.

as for how fast the operating systems came out, are you actually complaining that RIM is improving their devices too fast?

Yahoo is the one at fault in this case because there's no way to make them make an app if they don't want to, short of giving them the materials and all the money needed, plus a few billion more.

To the person who complained that java is too slow and so blackberry apps suck: You can also get a plug-in for microsoft visual studio, which means you can make the apps in Visual Basic, Visual FoxPro, Visual InterDev, Visual J++, and Visual C++ (which is the standard language for most devices)

In short, I don't play fantasy football, but I think that if you're going to leave a company because a whole other company made a bad decision and blame it all on the first company, then you at least should start looking at apple fans for support, because blind obedience is pretty much your only hope for support (and you must want support if you posted here, because that's a stupid enough reason to quit that nobody will give you sympathy, but maybe their psychiatrists card.)

[Kerplunk17]

But, as I said, not all versions of 7 get to run XP mode. I have home premium. No XP mode for me!
Perhaps I should pitch a temper tantrum on the Dell forums that MicroSoft won't let me have XP mode? After all, I bought the PC from Dell!

Oh, and it was not 3 years between Vista and 7. Consumer versions of Vista did not ship until Jan of 2008 (Pro versions did ship in the fall of 2007) and All versions of 7 were released in July of 2009. For Joe Consumer, it was just over a year (about a year and a half) between Windows versions. For Business users, it was just under 2 years. Given the scale involved, a year on phone OS development is no big deal.

So, are you saying you would be happier if RIM waited LONGER between OS releases? And, the 9700 is gonna get OS 6, at some point. Certainly not within a year of when 5 came out so your argument is pretty weak.

Want to really compare it, go look at release dates for versions of Linux (Like Ubuntu!)



That does not dispute my comparisons....
1) They are both GAMES
2) Both deal with Fantasy environments/teams. In WoW, it's all fantasy, In FF, it's your made up (Fantasy) team against other made up (Fantasy) teams. It just happens to be based on real world stats. But, that's as real as it gets.
3) Both of them have players that get addicted and obsessed with them (You are rapidly proving my point here.)

"On January 30, 2007, Windows vista was released worldwide, and was made available for purchase and download from Microsoft's website."

Windows 7 was released to manufacturing on July 22, 2009, and reached general retail availability on October 22, 2009, less than three years after the release of its predecessor, Windows Vista.

Not sure where you get your dates from pal, I guess you just make em up as you go. You really thought Vista was released in 2008??

And Linux builds are completely different than what you are talking about here, its open source so I can edit and compile any program I want to work if they change their OS. Windows and Blackberry this is not the case.

I have known WoW nuts, and I have a lot of friends into Fantasy Football. We spend maybe 2 hours during the week checking up on out team, then a few hours Sunday watching out results. This is non-comparable to the time these WoW addicts are on their accounts.

I am not as addicted and obsessed as you are attempting to prove, I would say I am more interested about how ridiculous all the comparisons you have made to my situation thus far.

[Kerplunk17]

In short, I don't play fantasy football, but I think that if you're going to leave a company because a whole other company made a bad decision and blame it all on the first company, then you at least should start looking at apple fans for support, because blind obedience is pretty much your only hope for support (and you must want support if you posted here, because that's a stupid enough reason to quit that nobody will give you sympathy, but maybe their psychiatrists card.)

Again, I am not leaving solely on this issue, this has just been my most recent and frustrating issue. I have laid out my other issues, and this only solidified my decision, not make it. I am not blaming rim for this specific issues, but they are a big part of my overall decision. I even stated I know most people would not be as upset as I am over this issue.

I will still be on the site for a while since I will be with my 9700 for almost another year. I still will use it like I always have, find new apps, browse the site for updates, but I plan on leaving when I can.

I want noting to do with Apple, right now Android is looking nice.

[pkcable]

I deleted a couple off topic posts, but I left the interesting debate intact. I edited the title to made it a little more descriptive plus I moved the thread to 3rd Party Apps where I feel it is a better fit. I too think Yahoo dropped the ball on this one.

[WolfmanRobby]

I will admit, I looked at the dates wrong on the Vista release timeline... My bad.

As for being able to develop your own apps on Linux because it's "Open Source" have you NEVER looked at all the resources and tools RIM provides to developers??? Obviously not.

Really? Not OBSESSED with Fantasy football??? this thread is living proof of it. I mean, you are ready to just up and completely change mobile device platforms over one little app for Fantasy Football??

You claim there are other issues, but they are trivial! Expecting your phone to remain the newest, flagship, best for a year is laughable.
Being upset that there is a NEW OS coming out within a year. An OS that your phone WILL GET and you WON'T have to PAY for an upgrade to it! That's just pathetic.
And, if you are having that many errors and having to pull the battery that often on your 9700, I would bet money it's not the OS, and it's not the hardware. But, rather a poorly developed, 3rd party app/theme. Or, a theme/app that's not compatible with another app on the device. Something that can be fixed by removing the problem app as opposed to tossing the baby out with the dirty bath water.

[Kerplunk17]

I will admit, I looked at the dates wrong on the Vista release timeline... My bad.

As for being able to develop your own apps on Linux because it's "Open Source" have you NEVER looked at all the resources and tools RIM provides to developers??? Obviously not.

Really? Not OBSESSED with Fantasy football??? this thread is living proof of it. I mean, you are ready to just up and completely change mobile device platforms over one little app for Fantasy Football??

You claim there are other issues, but they are trivial! Expecting your phone to remain the newest, flagship, best for a year is laughable.
Being upset that there is a NEW OS coming out within a year. An OS that your phone WILL GET and you WON'T have to PAY for an upgrade to it! That's just pathetic.
And, if you are having that many errors and having to pull the battery that often on your 9700, I would bet money it's not the OS, and it's not the hardware. But, rather a poorly developed, 3rd party app/theme. Or, a theme/app that's not compatible with another app on the device. Something that can be fixed by removing the problem app as opposed to tossing the baby out with the dirty bath water.

Maybe my issues are trivial to you, but not to me. Again, stating that you think I am leaving over one little app is incorrect, its more than that, as I have said. I know newer phones will come out all the time, but I want a phone that will be supported by the app community and Blackberry is not headed that direction.

As for all the tools RIM provides to its developers?? What does that have to do with Linux? Maybe if the Yahoo app from last year was open source, and I could then use that source code to compile an app that would work with OS5, that would be comparable.

I do not have the knowledge or time to make my own Fantasy App, therefore, my only recourse at this point is to pray someone someday will, or go to a platform that has what I want.

Also, the apps I have installed work fine, and I use the stock ATT theme, most of the uncaught exceptions have to so with visual voice mail, and phone calls to ATT have been no help. I can't even try a news version of OS5 from a different carrier, because when I do, I lose all connectivity to the blue tooth in my car, and issue that has been documented in a Blue tooth thread.

Again, you say I am obsessed with Fantasy Football since I am leaving because of it, when you know that I have many other issues, and that this one has only made me certain I am leaving.

[TheScionicMan]

It sounds like you're not using the right tool for the job you want to accomplish. I mean, I can drive a nail with a Crescent wrench, but it wasn't really designed for it and there are better tools to do it with.

Good luck with your fantasy game, maybe you'll win enough to buy an Android...

[infinus]

RIM has failed to make a mark in app/game developers world.
BB's are cool.
But the bad platform and very restrictive and unsupported nature of RIM make is to give up.
People don't buy apps on BB, as they buy on iphone/android/symbian
BB developers are costlier and due BB's corporate only nature, it feels more costlier.

most of the corporate house still hold old handhelds and live on 4.5 or 4.7.
BB hardware is a drawback,
it's not allowed to use third party apps/games on BB.
It's really not worth investing in small bunch of users.


Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[WolfmanRobby]

What the development tools have to do with it is that there is everything you need to compile your own program for the Blackberry, just like you said you could do on Linux since it's open source.
However, the Yahoo app not being open source to build from, again, that's a YAHOO issue, not RIM.

If you are so certian it's Visual Voicemail, remove it from your phone to verify. I can't stand VV, so I strip it from my phone with Shrink-a-os. I use the Free YouMail service (without installing the app) and have almost the same functionality, but a lot of cooler features you can't get on VV. There are always other ways around it.

I don't see you starting a thread called "Visual Voicemail Sucks, I'm leaving BB for it."
I don't see a thread from you about "There's a newer OS for my phone I've had less than a year, I'm leaving BB because of it"
I don't see a thread from you about "My phone is less than a year old and there's something newer, I'm leaving BB for it."

Yet, you start this thread, about this problem and make sure that you point out, THIS is the reason that makes it certain you are leaving.... Hmmmm.... You don't think that's a tad bit along the line of obsessive??

Just saying how it looks from the outside looking in.

[WolfmanRobby]

@infinus

While some of what you say is true, much of your info is outdated.

BB is probably the least restrictive, and least costly platform to develop for. Especially when you consider that the only way to get an app to iPhone users is paying Apple's developer fee's and listing fee to get your app listed in the Apple iTunes store. Where as a developer can download all the tools to build apps for a BB for free, and even post the program and distribute it for free, or sell it themselves without paying any one anything for it.

Yes, many companies still run some of the older 8300 series devices. But, it's not all about cost or compatibility. Many of them have to use them because they have been "Approved" by a 3rd party security vendor and the newer models have not been vetted through that process yet. Others, it's just lazyness on their part to not upgrade. And, yeah, there are a few that it is about cost.

But, as for the restrictions about 3rd party apps. Other than companies that require strict control over their units (Say because the employees have access to very sensitive data), most companies have relaxed their restrictions.

[Kerplunk17]

I don't see you starting a thread called "Visual Voicemail Sucks, I'm leaving BB for it."
I don't see a thread from you about "There's a newer OS for my phone I've had less than a year, I'm leaving BB because of it"
I don't see a thread from you about "My phone is less than a year old and there's something newer, I'm leaving BB for it."

Yet, you start this thread, about this problem and make sure that you point out, THIS is the reason that makes it certain you are leaving.... Hmmmm.... You don't think that's a tad bit along the line of obsessive??

Just saying how it looks from the outside looking in.

I started this thread on the day the news came that we are not getting an App, hence why that is my main gripe at the moment. I don't need to start threads for the other topics, as they already exist.

I happen to enjoy fantasy football very much, you don't. That's fine, and I understand how this is no where near a big deal to most people. However, all the issues I was content on living with and waiting for OS 6 to hopefully alleviate some of the problems.

Since it has been confirmed I will not be getting my Fantasy App, which I have wanted and been looking forward to because of my enjoyment of the game, and the fact other platforms have very streamlined apps for it, has all but made my decision.

This isn't a deal breaker for most, it is for me. And I suppose if that fits your definition of "obsessed", than I guess I am.

[WolfmanRobby]

It shows that the game is so important to you that you are going to let it control what phone you choose to use.

Especially considering that NONE of the other problems you list have been important enough to force you to change. But, this is that important to you.

So, if someone lets something like a GAME control decisions they make.... Well... think about it.

[Kerplunk17]

It shows that the game is so important to you that you are going to let it control what phone you choose to use.

Especially considering that NONE of the other problems you list have been important enough to force you to change. But, this is that important to you.

Exactly, just like folks who want a PC for gaming chose Windows, and those who are more inclined to work with video and photo editing go with Macs. Its all preference.

I was content when a Yahoo app was developed for blackberry, now that it is not, I must find another option. Any phone I pick will make phone calls, text, get email...ect. But if it does not do something I really want it to, and other options out there do, then what choice and I left with....

[matteds]

I will admit, I looked at the dates wrong on the Vista release timeline... My bad.

As for being able to develop your own apps on Linux because it's "Open Source" have you NEVER looked at all the resources and tools RIM provides to developers??? Obviously not.

Really? Not OBSESSED with Fantasy football??? this thread is living proof of it. I mean, you are ready to just up and completely change mobile device platforms over one little app for Fantasy Football??

You claim there are other issues, but they are trivial! Expecting your phone to remain the newest, flagship, best for a year is laughable.
Being upset that there is a NEW OS coming out within a year. An OS that your phone WILL GET and you WON'T have to PAY for an upgrade to it! That's just pathetic.
And, if you are having that many errors and having to pull the battery that often on your 9700, I would bet money it's not the OS, and it's not the hardware. But, rather a poorly developed, 3rd party app/theme. Or, a theme/app that's not compatible with another app on the device. Something that can be fixed by removing the problem app as opposed to tossing the baby out with the dirty bath water.

If this thread is "living proof" of anything, it's that you never leave these damn forums and defend Research In Motion to the end. I wanna wait a few months to get my Nokia N900 and be done with smartphones for a while, but when I compare my 9700 to a Vibrant/Captivate or a Droid Incredible, I feel the urge to upgrade early, again. If only I had waited, I would have early upgraded to a Vibrant, but no, I needed the 9700 cause I thought OS 5 would be different than OS 4.5 or 4.3, but it's not, just looks nicer.

On a side note, another reason I can't stand this phone is that no application other than Google Maps knows how to use my GPS. That, and at one point I removed BB Maps to save some MBs, but there's no damn way to get it back. RIM's site only downloads a 10 KB file called LBS_Ribbon, it's non-existent in App World, and it's not in Desktop Manager - which is how I removed it. On a G1, which I can buy on Craigslist for about $90, Google Maps includes turn by turn navigation and takes roughly 40 seconds to download and install.

[Jean-luc_Picard]

On a side note, another reason I can't stand this phone is that no application other than Google Maps knows how to use my GPS.

go to settings -> application settings then select the application you want (menu at the top to switch between third party/add ons/built-in) then press the bb key and select application permissions (I forget what it actually was called but it was something like that). Here you have the permissions, find the GPS permissions (you may have to press the bb key to open some of the drop-down menus) then switch it to "allow" (or "prompt" if you think you ever might not want it to use the GPSr) OR, when you download the apps and it asks to set the permissions, SET THEM instead of ignoring the warning and telling it not to show again...

[WolfmanRobby]

If this thread is "living proof" of anything, it's that you never leave these damn forums and defend Research In Motion to the end.

If RIM had done something wrong here, I wouldn't be defending them.

But, when they are taking heat and blame for something YAHOO did, yeah.

Sorry, I don't get on the "Bash [insert innocent company name here] for the he11 of it" bandwagon.

I wanna wait a few months to get my Nokia N900 and be done with smartphones for a while, but when I compare my 9700 to a Vibrant/Captivate or a Droid Incredible, I feel the urge to upgrade early, again. If only I had waited, I would have early upgraded to a Vibrant, but no, I needed the 9700 cause I thought OS 5 would be different than OS 4.5 or 4.3, but it's not, just looks nicer.

What's stopping you? Go, have fun. The N900 is a nice device, for a Nokia.

On a side note, another reason I can't stand this phone is that no application other than Google Maps knows how to use my GPS. That, and at one point I removed BB Maps to save some MBs, but there's no damn way to get it back. RIM's site only downloads a 10 KB file called LBS_Ribbon, it's non-existent in App World, and it's not in Desktop Manager - which is how I removed it. On a G1, which I can buy on Craigslist for about $90, Google Maps includes turn by turn navigation and takes roughly 40 seconds to download and install.

Interesting, let's see what I have on my 9700 that uses my GPS without any kind of configuration...
-Google Maps
-Garmin
-Foursquare
-UberTwitter
-BBWeather
-BIM Active
-CacheBerry

I think at the most, I had to GRANT them permission to the GPS when they asked for it.

Maybe the other programs you have that can't access your GPS are just crappy programs???? That, or you didn't give them permission when they asked.

As for BB Maps.... put the COD files back with BB Master Control Program.
Or, reload the OS without removing it from the Java folder.

[WolfmanRobby]

Exactly, just like folks who want a PC for gaming chose Windows, and those who are more inclined to work with video and photo editing go with Macs. Its all preference.

I was content when a Yahoo app was developed for blackberry, now that it is not, I must find another option. Any phone I pick will make phone calls, text, get email...ect. But if it does not do something I really want it to, and other options out there do, then what choice and I left with....

Well, for the record, all 3 of our graphics guys have disconnected their G5's and moved to Alienware PC's running Windows 7 for Graphics and Video editing.

But, I maintain my point. You are letting a GAME control your decision on a phone. The other complaints you have are just a way of trying to justify this.

That being said, justification is often a sign of addiction.

[matteds]

Uh, what's stopping me? I said I wanna wait, that's what's stopping me. And crappy programs? I use half the ones in your list in addition to Weather Channel and Flixster, yeah, the ultimate guides to weather and movies are real "crappy".

And I'm well aware of application permissions, please.

Quit telling people a "game" shouldnt let people decide their phone. It's their phone, if they wanna switch, they're allowed. By the by, this game can and usually involves large amounts of money. Please, instead of telling people their reason to leave RIM and the Blackberry line is weak, or defending against their reason, just say "Okay, best of luck to ya." Don't tell people they're addicted to anything on this forum, you don't know **** (sh!t) about these people, you know how dumb you sound when you try to tell someone they're addicted to something on a forum?

[WolfmanRobby]

Quit telling people a "game" shouldnt let people decide their phone. It's their phone, if they wanna switch, they're allowed. By the by, this game can and usually involves large amounts of money. Please, instead of telling people their reason to leave RIM and the Blackberry line is weak, or defending against their reason, just say "Okay, best of luck to ya." Don't tell people they're addicted to anything on this forum, you don't know **** (sh!t) about these people, you know how dumb you sound when you try to tell someone they're addicted to something on a forum?

Dude - QUOTE me saying ANYONE is addicted to anything.

I'm not telling people what they should and shouldn't do. (AGAIN, QUOTE ME!!) I'm just saying, when you let a GAME control your decisions, then, well, you have to look at WHY you are letting that game control your decisions.

There are good reasons, and there are bad reasons to let a GAME control you. I'm just saying that someone might want to make sure they are doing it for a GOOD reason.

Please, go back and READ what I actually posted and stop putting words in my mouth.

Oh, and online Poker can involve lots of money... what does it say when someone lets online poker influence their decisions? How is letting FF and it's money influence their decisions any different?

[WolfmanRobby]

Uh, what's stopping me? I said I wanna wait, that's what's stopping me.

Fine, you WANT to wait, then why are you complaining about your BB? You choose to wait, then you choose to put up with it.

You want to HAVE your cake, or to eat it???

And crappy programs? I use half the ones in your list in addition to Weather Channel and Flixster, yeah, the ultimate guides to weather and movies are real "crappy".

And I'm well aware of application permissions, please.

You obviously don't if you can't figure out how to make them talk to your GPS.