04-09-19 07:36 AM
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  1. skilas's Avatar
    I'm in Year 2 of my Motion, having got it Dec 2017. It's a good phone. But I find I won't be able to keep it going like my Z30 which was +4 years.

    The phone is very solid, and has been reliable. But I find a few quirks are pushing me to look at upgrading, or at least watch the Key2 for a price drop.

    Camera is the main one. As someone with young kids who takes photos of them all the time, I find the Motion camera just ok. I constantly have to switch it to manual mode to adjust the lighting, as the auto setting often washes out all the colours. Video has been hit and miss. Sometimes slightly blurry, other crystal clear. The microphone for videos has been terrible. My voice while holding the camera is good, but you can barely hear my kids on the other side of the room. I never noticed at the time, but I recently went through my videos from this past summer, and was surprised with the quality of some of them.

    Build Quality. I think the build quality is pretty good. I love the look of the alum trim, but hate holding it because I find it slides out of my hands easily. I still don't know why the top edge is rounded. and With plastic! It just feels cheap when compared to the nice alum trim. The Silver Key2 on the other hand looks so damn good.

    Finger print sensor. I started using this a couple months ago. I find it's ok. It's 50/50 whether it works the first time. And if it doesn't, it's often it will keep reading negative, and I will need to use the passcode. It's a small thing. but when technology doesn't work 100% of the time, it's just so frustrating.

    Battery. It's ok for me. But I'm worried an "upgrade" will get me less. I'm sitting at 45% at 3:30p. I need to charge every day. I'm sure moving to another device will likely get me less battery.

    Overall, everything else has been good, or has simply not contributed to me wanting to upgrade. The camera though is the biggest sticking point, since I use it every day. And from the reviews, the Key2 camera is just ok (often said to be not as good as the Key One). Unfortunately, I do not like the Key One's pkb, so picking up a cheap Key One is not an option. And also I would prefer a Silver Key 2, which unfortunately are not offered via carriers in Canada. I would have to buy one outright, which are currently still at $829.99.

    Anyway, those are my thoughts. Anyone else have opinions, or find themselves in a situation where they've had their Motion for a bit and are starting to consider upgrading?
    02-11-19 02:38 PM
  2. jackcarr's Avatar
    My Motion experience seems to be bit better than yours. Camera is fair, but I don't take pictures all the time with it nor do I take video. Fingerprint sensor has been good.

    Honestly, BlackBerry has to come out with another vkb device that has better specs than this. Was really hoping the Evolve X would be it, but will not be leaving the Asian market.

    Time will tell.
    skilas and Gajja like this.
    02-11-19 02:47 PM
  3. jagrlover's Avatar
    I love mine. The battery has diminished somewhat, but still gets me through any day. My fingerprint sensor also works great (I am very deliberate when placing my finger though). The camera definitely stinks. It's fine for work related things but is awful when I want good shots of my kids. I'd love an updated VKB from BlackBerry but am not very hopeful. If there isn't one within the next 6 months or so, I might have to move on. 😪
    skilas likes this.
    02-11-19 05:14 PM
  4. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I'm in Year 2 of my Motion, having got it Dec 2017. It's a good phone. But I find I won't be able to keep it going like my Z30 which was +4 years.

    The phone is very solid, and has been reliable. But I find a few quirks are pushing me to look at upgrading, or at least watch the Key2 for a price drop.

    Camera is the main one. As someone with young kids who takes photos of them all the time, I find the Motion camera just ok. I constantly have to switch it to manual mode to adjust the lighting, as the auto setting often washes out all the colours. Video has been hit and miss. Sometimes slightly blurry, other crystal clear. The microphone for videos has been terrible. My voice while holding the camera is good, but you can barely hear my kids on the other side of the room. I never noticed at the time, but I recently went through my videos from this past summer, and was surprised with the quality of some of them.

    Build Quality. I think the build quality is pretty good. I love the look of the alum trim, but hate holding it because I find it slides out of my hands easily. I still don't know why the top edge is rounded. and With plastic! It just feels cheap when compared to the nice alum trim. The Silver Key2 on the other hand looks so damn good.

    Finger print sensor. I started using this a couple months ago. I find it's ok. It's 50/50 whether it works the first time. And if it doesn't, it's often it will keep reading negative, and I will need to use the passcode. It's a small thing. but when technology doesn't work 100% of the time, it's just so frustrating.

    Battery. It's ok for me. But I'm worried an "upgrade" will get me less. I'm sitting at 45% at 3:30p. I need to charge every day. I'm sure moving to another device will likely get me less battery.

    Overall, everything else has been good, or has simply not contributed to me wanting to upgrade. The camera though is the biggest sticking point, since I use it every day. And from the reviews, the Key2 camera is just ok (often said to be not as good as the Key One). Unfortunately, I do not like the Key One's pkb, so picking up a cheap Key One is not an option. And also I would prefer a Silver Key 2, which unfortunately are not offered via carriers in Canada. I would have to buy one outright, which are currently still at $829.99.

    Anyway, those are my thoughts. Anyone else have opinions, or find themselves in a situation where they've had their Motion for a bit and are starting to consider upgrading?
    Are you saying the Z30 is better than Motion in any or all of these categories?
    skilas likes this.
    02-11-19 05:23 PM
  5. Elky64's Avatar
    Bought my Motion in Nov 2017. If we remove its camera from the equation it is hands down the best Android device I have ever used and still is today. Sadly though, bringing the camera back into the picture is the exact reason we recently switched to another device (already owned)... have to go all the way back to 2012 to find something we owned that was worse and ironically it was the Bold 9900.

    More than happy with Motion's build quality yet we always adorn our devices in a case so that's somewhat of a mute point for me. Fingerprint sensor is stellar, exceptionally good and best I've used. Haven't owned anything to-date that can compete with its battery so that's another big plus. Consistency & reliability have been spot on. Speed wise it chugs right along without so much as a whimper. No complaints w/display at all either even when compared to my other devices having much higher res ones. Speaker is nothing to write home about but definitely does the trick for me. BB software has worked well enjoying using what it has to offer.

    So at the end of the day, I am very glad we chose to give the Motion a go as it just proves high $$$ devices aren't necessarily a prerequisite in achieving a good experience. I'm sure at some point (99.99999% certain) we'll be switching back to the Motion but for now a phone with a good camera is tops on our list.

    Oh ya... no plans to upgrade just quite yet as in reality I see no need, our wants though might have a different opinion.
    Last edited by Elky64; 02-11-19 at 08:37 PM.
    skilas and Gajja like this.
    02-11-19 08:25 PM
  6. skilas's Avatar
    Are you saying the Z30 is better than Motion in any or all of these categories?
    As of right now, definitely not. But at the time, back in 2013, yes. I feel that the Z30 in it's own era in 2013 was a better phone than the Motion it's it's era of late 2017.

    But obviously if you were to compare them side to side now, the Motion is much better.
    Gajja likes this.
    02-11-19 10:13 PM
  7. skilas's Avatar
    Bought my Motion in Nov 2017. If we remove its camera from the equation it is hands down the best Android device I have ever used and still is today. Sadly though, bringing the camera back into the picture is the exact reason we recently switched to another device (already owned)... have to go all the way back to 2012 to find something we owned that was worse and ironically it was the Bold 9900.

    More than happy with Motion's build quality yet we always adorn our devices in a case so that's somewhat of a mute point for me. Fingerprint sensor is stellar, exceptionally good and best I've used. Haven't owned anything to-date that can compete with its battery so that's another big plus. Consistency & reliability have been spot on. Speed wise it chugs right along without so much as a whimper. No complaints w/display at all either even when compared to my other devices having much higher res ones. Speaker is nothing to write home about but definitely does the trick for me. BB software has worked well enjoying using what it has to offer.

    So at the end of the day, I am very glad we chose to give the Motion a go as it just proves high $$$ devices aren't necessarily a prerequisite in achieving a good experience. I'm sure at some point (99.99999% certain) we'll be switching back to the Motion but for now a phone with a good camera is tops on our list.

    Oh ya... no plans to upgrade just quite yet as in reality I see no need, our wants though might have a different opinion.
    I can definitely relate to your comment. My main caveat is that the Motion was my first Android device. But I've been happy with the transition. I also had a 9900. I loved that phone. Yes, camera sucked. But I did not have kids at the time, so I rarely used the camera.

    Just to piggy back on a couple points, I also do not like the Motion's speaker. But I was spoiled with the Z30 stereo speakers. And I find the Motion mostly fast. But I think I overload it with photos, so it tends to slow down sometimes. I put in a 128 GB (Extreme) Sandisk Microsd card, and it's getting full...
    02-11-19 10:20 PM
  8. Invictus0's Avatar
    If the camera is your main complaint then it's probably best to avoid the KeyTwo. BB Mobile devices are lacking as far as cameras go.

    I'd recommend waiting until MWC in case BB Mobile announces new devices. Best case scenario is they announce a device with a better camera, worst case scenario you might be able to get a KeyTwo for cheaper if a successor is announced.
    Gajja and skilas like this.
    02-11-19 11:26 PM
  9. pjh248's Avatar
    I'll wait till motion 2 years old if nothing from BlackBerry I'll look elsewhere can't get on with PKB
    02-12-19 04:08 AM
  10. Elky64's Avatar
    I can definitely relate to your comment. My main caveat is that the Motion was my first Android device. But I've been happy with the transition. I also had a 9900. I loved that phone. Yes, camera sucked. But I did not have kids at the time, so I rarely used the camera.

    Just to piggy back on a couple points, I also do not like the Motion's speaker. But I was spoiled with the Z30 stereo speakers. And I find the Motion mostly fast. But I think I overload it with photos, so it tends to slow down sometimes. I put in a 128 GB (Extreme) Sandisk Microsd card, and it's getting full...
    Yeah this isn't our first Android experience as that started in 2009/10, today's devices are definitely an improvement over those of then. Started getting into digital cameras in or abouts 1999 and ever since a decent shooter has always been high on my list although it's not always a guarantee (even today) that's what you.

    That's the thing I find quite unexpected about my Motion, it's consistency in the performance/speed department has been well above average. I also use a 128GB card although Samsung branded, got lots of photos etc. on it yet nowhere near full... have enough devices and we're a chronic switcher so each takes up a portion of the slack LOL. Still though, our Motion has been our daily driver 95% of the time since purchasing.
    Gajja likes this.
    02-12-19 05:01 AM
  11. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    As of right now, definitely not. But at the time, back in 2013, yes. I feel that the Z30 in it's own era in 2013 was a better phone than the Motion it's it's era of late 2017.

    But obviously if you were to compare them side to side now, the Motion is much better.
    So I’m confused then. If Z30 lasted 4 years and Motion is better, why can’t you continue using 4 years too? Z30 lacked features and lagged behind advancements of flagship Android devices in the history of the device and it’s ecosystem...

    People convinced themselves how great BB10 was and made excuses to stay with it’s hardware and limitations. I’m merely curious why the desire to jump into the Android high turnover cycle. I’m a fan of technology and get bored easy.... but I realize that changing my devices every year isn’t necessary.. I do so voluntarily...
    02-12-19 07:22 AM
  12. scorpio11's Avatar
    I could not agree with you more regarding the camera. I've been a loyal BB user for 13 years and this is the first time I'm seriously considering leaving. I love the Motion, except for the camera. I shouldn't have to work that hard to take a decent picture of my kid. And half the time, they still look crappy. If they upgraded the camera, it would be the perfect personal/business device for me.
    Elky64 and StJohnSmythe like this.
    02-12-19 10:15 AM
  13. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I could not agree with you more regarding the camera. I've been a loyal BB user for 13 years and this is the first time I'm seriously considering leaving. I love the Motion, except for the camera. I shouldn't have to work that hard to take a decent picture of my kid. And half the time, they still look crappy. If they upgraded the camera, it would be the perfect personal/business device for me.
    I'm curious the same way to ask same thing? What BB phone did you use that had great camera or took great pictures? My BB devices always provided what I considered phone camera picture with phone camera quality... I use the camera for scanning documents to PDF format to email when on the road.

    Since BB10 lacked basic ecosystem in 2013, I depended on iPad Mini and iPhone 5 to accomplish task until PRIV, DTEK and KEYone. Seriously, are you saying no decent pictures of your kid or have you upped your standards?

    Mind you, I’m just not the picture taker in my family.... my daughter’s confirmation was Saturday and I grabbed my KEYone for a quick shot. It seemed ok to me. I have a XR as well. I reached into pocket and the KEYone came out first. I’m surprised at the quality of phone camera pictures from all devices. The professionals at the front of the church were using digital equipment on tripods and neck-straps. Not a single professional was using a phone.

    I’m saying this as regarding mobile phones, even the best Flagship doesn’t meet professional standards. Are we not just comparing tallest midgets??
    Gajja likes this.
    02-12-19 10:32 AM
  14. skstrials's Avatar
    Blackberry motion was a great value at $310 I paid for it with Koodo one year ago. so far it is not showing its age at all. it is just as fast as the first year I got the phone.

    The only reason I would get a different phone in 2019 would be because I get bored, which is not a good reason at all!

    The Motion is part of the Google recommended Android enterprise phone, so it should get another two years of security patches as well.
    Gajja likes this.
    02-12-19 06:30 PM
  15. jackcarr's Avatar
    Blackberry motion was a great value at $310 I paid for it with Koodo one year ago. so far it is not showing its age at all. it is just as fast as the first year I got the phone.

    The only reason I would get a different phone in 2019 would be because I get bored, which is not a good reason at all!

    The Motion is part of the Google recommended Android enterprise phone, so it should get another two years of security patches as well.
    This! Right now, because my experience with the Motion has been so good, I have no desire to upgrade at all. Got mine in November 2017 and it still runs great. There's really no reason for me to upgrade right now.

    If BlackBerry came out with another vkb that was an upgrade, I would consider it...but no such phone currently exists.
    Gajja and CuriousFellow like this.
    02-12-19 07:39 PM
  16. Gajja's Avatar
    I’m surprised at the quality of phone camera pictures from all devices. The professionals at the front of the church were using digital equipment on tripods and neck-straps. Not a single professional was using a phone.

    I’m saying this as regarding mobile phones, even the best Flagship doesn’t meet professional standards. Are we not just comparing tallest midgets??
    I'm totally in agreement with this. While I can see the reason an "always in our pocket convergent device" gets pulled out at every photo opportunity, just because it's there. I also know that before such convergent devices existed people who were enthusiastic photo takers would just carry a very small and very good quality CAMERA. Such devices have got smaller and better in pretty much every way. Lenses, sensors, memory, everything. If someone is really looking for regularly taking lots of great photos just don't use a phone use a camera. The tallest midget is a humorous way of saying it. Made me smirk anyway :-)
    02-13-19 04:11 AM
  17. Elky64's Avatar
    I’m saying this as regarding mobile phones, even the best Flagship doesn’t meet professional standards.
    Has nothing to do with "meeting professional standards" and not sure why this is always brought up when a mobile phone's camera comes into question.
    02-13-19 07:04 AM
  18. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Has nothing to do with "meeting professional standards" and not sure why this is always brought up when a mobile phone's camera comes into question.
    Sure it does..... smartphones are devices of compromise by their very nature. Debating the best camera on a smartphone is like debating best acceleration or top speed performance in a hybrid car vs luxury gas model and race car.
    02-13-19 07:51 AM
  19. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    All that any OEM has to do with smartphone is meet the “good enough for me” requirement of it's targeted demographic at it's optimal price offering that maximizes profits....
    02-13-19 07:58 AM
  20. lou2969's Avatar
    I'm very pleased with my Motion, the only caveat is the camera... if only I could buy the camera and replace it..
    otherwise it's a solid phone ,
    no problem at all..
    yes I will buy and upgrade in the future.
    02-13-19 10:39 AM
  21. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I'm very pleased with my Motion, the only caveat is the camera... if only I could buy the camera and replace it..
    otherwise it's a solid phone ,
    no problem at all..
    yes I will buy and upgrade in the future.
    See this illustrates the point. OEM has you upgrade and the camera was probably good enough or you have solution.....

    What is the reason to stick with BB even though not a premium camera?
    02-13-19 10:46 AM
  22. skilas's Avatar
    So I’m confused then. If Z30 lasted 4 years and Motion is better, why can’t you continue using 4 years too? Z30 lacked features and lagged behind advancements of flagship Android devices in the history of the device and it’s ecosystem...

    People convinced themselves how great BB10 was and made excuses to stay with it’s hardware and limitations. I’m merely curious why the desire to jump into the Android high turnover cycle. I’m a fan of technology and get bored easy.... but I realize that changing my devices every year isn’t necessary.. I do so voluntarily...
    The way I described it is that the Motion is better in 2019 than the Z30 in 2019. But if we compared the two phones in their own eras, I preferred the Z30.

    So at the time I was using the Z30, it had a lot more going for it and lasted me much longer before I felt any need to upgrade.

    Right now, when using the Motion, I'm already started to feel disappointed with some of the features just into my 2nd year.

    Also, my needs have changed. Mostly the camera. The Z30 had an ok camera. But it was way better than the 9900 I was using before. One thing I rarely needed to do was correct the white balance in manual mode. And the video microphone did a great job. So coming to a Motion where both have been constant problems for me, has really affected my desire for an upgrade. Like a lot of people in this thread, if the Motion had a better camera, I would not be looking for a new device for at least another year or two.
    02-13-19 10:59 AM
  23. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    The way I described it is that the Motion is better in 2019 than the Z30 in 2019. But if we compared the two phones in their own eras, I preferred the Z30.

    So at the time I was using the Z30, it had a lot more going for it and lasted me much longer before I felt any need to upgrade.

    Right now, when using the Motion, I'm already started to feel disappointed with some of the features just into my 2nd year.

    Also, my needs have changed. Mostly the camera. The Z30 had an ok camera. But it was way better than the 9900 I was using before. One thing I rarely needed to do was correct the white balance in manual mode. And the video microphone did a great job. So coming to a Motion where both have been constant problems for me, has really affected my desire for an upgrade. Like a lot of people in this thread, if the Motion had a better camera, I would not be looking for a new device for at least another year or two.
    Follow up question would be, how much have your camera needs changed that you tolerated Z30 for so long before moving to Motion? There are plenty of VKB Android devices available before the Motion, that have better cameras.

    What is the most important upgrade to keep you upgrading each year or two in keeping with a successful Android business model that OEMs strive for?
    02-13-19 11:06 AM
  24. mrsimon's Avatar
    great VKB that stands out in the slab crowd. brilliant battery and nice feel in general.
    to be improved.
    the Camera in low light .
    the finger print sensor. hit and miss.
    add an extra speaker and upgrade the performance a little.
    keep the industrial design andthe convenience key. if not, it's just another android slab like the Evolve.
    02-13-19 12:07 PM
  25. skilas's Avatar
    Follow up question would be, how much have your camera needs changed that you tolerated Z30 for so long before moving to Motion? There are plenty of VKB Android devices available before the Motion, that have better cameras.

    What is the most important upgrade to keep you upgrading each year or two in keeping with a successful Android business model that OEMs strive for?
    In terms of my camera needs, basically having kids. I was childless for most of my Z30 days. So the photos I took were mostly for records, or work. I take a lot of photos of stuff just to keep a record of it. And for that, camera can be just ok. Also, I really don't think the Z30 was terrible. As with most cameras, it's all about lighting. I'm looking through my photos from 2014, and obviously they were a mixed bag. Daytime photos were great. Indoors photos just ok. Evening and night photos bad.

    But that was 5 years ago. And it's all about expectations.

    Now, phone cameras seem to have made huge leaps and bounds. Of course the Motion is not a Flagship phone. It's a mid range phone. So I'm not expecting Pixel quality or anything.

    A year ago when I got the Motion, I was concerned about the White Balance in Auto. I was currently using a Priv from work, and transitioning from Z30 to Motion for personal. Here's a link to that thread where I was posting comparison photos. The summary was that Motion consistently took cooler photos, and I started adjusting the White Balance in Manual to get shots closer to reality.
    https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...12/index2.html

    As for the most important upgrade for me would be the camera. But the next model needs to have what I'm looking for. Right now, I don't know what I'm upgrading to. I'm really considering the Key2, but one of the biggest negatives with people have been the camera. I would consider the KeyOne (since people say it has a better camera, and it's cheaper), but I dislike the keyboard on it. So my hope is something gets announced at MWC, I wait for a Key2 price drop (and hope the camera is simply better than the Motion), or start looking somewhere outside the BlackBerry world.

    If a company wanted me to keep to an upgrade cycle, I would suggest releasing new products on a reliable cycle (for that specific audience). I get my phones (usually) through my carrier. And because of that, after my 2 year pay back of the phone, financially makes sense to upgrade my phone as long as my monthly bills do not change. So it's disappointing for me that it's not planned that 2 years after my phone was released, a "follow up" is not released to capitalize on people like me. The Z30 lasted me 4 good years. But that contract was 3 years for me. So I was happy to upgrade after the 3 years. But there was nothing for me as a big Z30 fan. The Motion was the logical step for a vkb loving BB fan. And, it would make sense that Nov/Dec a follow up to the Motion would be release for those fans. Of course I find this unlikely, since the Motion was not a big seller. This is why I think Apple's cycle of yearly releases is so smart. It's predictable, and you can budget yourself accordingly. If I were an Apple fan, I would upgrade consistently. Never to the latest and greatest, simply due to ridiculous cost, but I would be happy lagging behind by a year or two. As a BlackBerry fan, I would hope a new vkb device and pkb device could be released yearly. Just 1 each would be fine. Right now vkb fans are missing an option for 2018. DTEKs in 2016. Motion in 2017. Nothing 2018. Hopefully something in 2019.

    My current situation would be an anomaly for me, because I'm only 14 months into my 2 year contract, but I'm already itching to upgrade. And that's because of the camera (and video microphone).
    CuriousFellow likes this.
    02-14-19 10:43 AM
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