[Resilience]

Simple...more screen. With the Motion, you get more screen than the KEYone with the same internals. And it's a BlackBerry. The camera is fair...nothing to write home about. If you have to have a really good camera, then the Motion isn't for you.

There are better valued phones instead of the motion which is why it puzzles me

[Elky64]

There are better valued phones instead of the motion which is why it puzzles me

Nothing to be puzzled about, either you are in or out for reasons OTHER than best valued cuz price/specs aren't defining factors for everyone.

[conite]

There are better valued phones instead of the motion which is why it puzzles me

Depends what you value.

[Bbnivende]

The Motion's camera is every bit as good as the KeyONE, and better in some areas.

If you want a top-tier camera you need one with OIS. Period. Prepare to spend US $700+ on the device.

I did a mini test comparison of the Keyone and the Motion. I had no difficulty in producing blurry pictures on the Motion. You really have to keep the phone steady. The pictures on the Keyone were not blurry and much better. It was if the Motion had a really slow shutter.

Test performed in the store.

[tickerguy]

The pairs of photos I've been sent from both have had nearly identical shutter speeds. The general rule is that with reasonable care you can hand-hold a shot at 1/fl (in 50mm equivalent) -- so if you have a 28mm lens, you can hand-hold a shot at 1/28th of a second. If you have a 50mm lens, then 1/50th, and so on. (This is why with a telephoto lens you need higher ISOs, more light to shoot at a higher shutter, or both -- or you get blurred shots!)

The KeyONE lens reports as 4.5mm (or 25mm in 50mm equivalent) so if you shoot at approximately 1/25th AND are careful you should be able to get good results. The Motion reports 3.8mm (or ~21mm in 50mm equivalent) so a 1/25th second exposure (roughly the same) should also produce good results, again, ASSUMING REASONABLE TECHNIQUE.

The pair of bike shots I have here show no motion shake problems. The Motion fired at 1/25th second, and the KeyONE at 1/33rd second. Both cameras ramped ISO to meet those shutter speeds (they were on "auto") so it appears the camera software is doing the appropriate thing with shutter speed -- and is making the reasonable assumption you will hold the camera with a rational degree of stability while pressing the button.

In higher light levels this matters MUCH less since the ISO will drop quickly and in levels roughly 4x as high the shutter will start to ramp quickly, which covers for many camera shake sins.

How you hold the phone matters. Both devices have their cameras on the top edge, but the KeyONE has its shutter button about a third of the way up the device because the PKB is on the bottom. This means that where you hit the button is likely on or near the axis where you are holding the device. If the button is directly on-axis it will create very little movement of the top end with the sensor. The Motion, on the other hand, likely has the button well below that axis, so if you are paying no attention to where your hands are you can expect motion about that axis as the button is pressed, which will be magnified by the lever arm difference (top and bottom distance from the pivot.)

If you look at this from a standpoint of lever arms (that is, basic physics) the problem that can arise becomes quite clear.

IMHO one solution would be to have the location of the "shoot" button configurable; if you could choose where it is then you could align it wherever you usually place your hands while holding the phone to take a picture, and this would do a LOT to limit shake. But then again everyone and their brother expects the button on an Android phone to be right at the bottom....

[Bbnivende]

Depends what you value.

Yes, that is correct. I want a phone that is not weak in any one area. If I were to buy a phone tomorrow, the Huawei P10 would interest me at $649 Cdn.


It I pounded out tons of emails and was an on the go business type, I might consider the motion for its battery and VKB or a Keyone.

If I want a phone that will be updated for a full three years and having after sales service, I would pay extra for an iPhone.

[conite]

Yes, that is correct. I want a phone that is not weak in any one area. If I were to buy a phone tomorrow, the Huawei P10 would interest me at $649 Cdn.

We all value what we value.

The P10 is very nice, but for those who value Integrity Detection, IP67, and a sturdier build, it may not be the right choice.

For the most part, every manufacturer brings something different to the table.

[Bbnivende]

Then there are show stoppers too. For me, it would be the large size and camera quality of the motion. The P10 may be too small for some and it has iPhone clone styling. Very difficult to find a working model of both of these phones to test.

Wouldn't be nice to have a brick and mortar store that sold all of the phones and with demo models to test. Currently, all you find are mall kiosks or larger stores having mainly Samsungs and iPhones to test.

If anyone here lives in Edmonton Canada, the Bell store at Kingsway Mall has a working Keyone and Motion. The staff does not bug you.

[jackcarr]

There are better valued phones instead of the motion which is why it puzzles me

Oh...I see where you're coming from. Yeah, could very well be. I buy BlackBerry though. I'm a BlackBerry fan. Sorry for the mystery.

[HigherThanMars]

There are better valued phones instead of the motion which is why it puzzles me

Then don't buy the Motion? I think the more options we have as a consumer, the better. If the phone doesn't appeal to you, buy something else.

[tickerguy]

Yep.

I would like to buy a Motion. However, if BlackBerry Mobile doesn't make it available in the US soon I'll either stick with my DTEK60 or buy something else.

The LG V20 looks interesting; refurb they can be had for $200. That's a hella nice price, and it has a removable battery --- which means when away from a charger you can pocket an extra BATTERY and have the same life (maybe plus some) as a Motion.

[Invictus0]

Then there are show stoppers too. For me, it would be the large size and camera quality of the motion. The P10 may be too small for some and it has iPhone clone styling. Very difficult to find a working model of both of these phones to test.

Wouldn't be nice to have a brick and mortar store that sold all of the phones and with demo models to test. Currently, all you find are mall kiosks or larger stores having mainly Samsungs and iPhones to test.

If anyone here lives in Edmonton Canada, the Bell store at Kingsway Mall has a working Keyone and Motion. The staff does not bug you.

I think OmegaCell has retail stores in Edmonton, they sell imported devices so they should have more options than mall/carrier stores.

https://www.omegacell.com/

[quizm]

My guess is that the motion is simply an enterprise offering. At least it must be the cheapest BlackBerry ever offered, but as such as a number of great features. Camera isn't one of them and I personally think this was a huge mistake by bbmobile. Why, because what BlackBerry never really learned is that those who were given BlackBerrys from work learned to hate the brand in comparison to others. The camera was one reason. One would have thought the best marketing decision would have been to use the same camera as the KEYone.. it simply escapes me that this is not the case. It almost seems as if Google itself did not like the reference to the Pixel camera....

[Robert22]

There is only one another option for me, if I would not buy the Motion. It is the Google Pixel 2 XL. It will get all the security upgrades very soon as well as Blackberry. I know, it is another league as the Motion and for the double price, but I really like to have a phone, which is great in each aspect, even in the camerat. I want a device, which will cover all my needs. Unfortunatelly, the camera on the Motion is really very bad.

[skilas]

Not sure how the colour is supposed to match. Here are photos from my Motion, and my Z30. The lighter colour is the Motion. The Z30 seems to capturing some warmer colours.

[skilas]

Not sure how the colour is supposed to match. Here are photos from my Motion, and my Z30. The lighter colour is the Motion. The Z30 seems to capturing some warmer colours.

[Robert22]

You should compare the camera of a 2017 phone with a camera of other 2017 phones, not with a 4 years old Z30 ;-)

[aecgda]

Looks like you need to get your washing-up done rather than take photos!

[skilas]

You should compare the camera of a 2017 phone with a camera of other 2017 phones, not with a 4 years old Z30 ;-)

Lol, Agreed. Except the warmer colours are closer to reality. I taking photos in the kitchen, and wondering why the photos looked so washed out. Grabbed my Z30, took the same photo. Quality is obvious better in Motion. But the colour will always bug me if I can't change it.

[skilas]

Looks like you need to get your washing-up done rather than take photos!

to be fair, that is the clean side of the sink.

[Robert22]

Lol, Agreed. Except the warmer colours are closer to reality. I taking photos in the kitchen, and wondering why the photos looked so washed out. Grabbed my Z30, took the same photo. Quality is obvious better in Motion. But the colour will always bug me if I can't change it.

Generally, unfortunately the camera is the weakest point of the otherwise perfect Motion. I can't understand, why TCL always tries to save money somewhere. The original KEYone it was only 3 GB RAM which was not enough, in the Motion it's an not ideal camera sensor. Really pitty, I would pay without problem 50 bugs more when it would be better.

[tickerguy]

Lol, Agreed. Except the warmer colours are closer to reality. I taking photos in the kitchen, and wondering why the photos looked so washed out. Grabbed my Z30, took the same photo. Quality is obvious better in Motion. But the colour will always bug me if I can't change it.

White balance is trivially adjustable before you shoot from the camera app; depending on the lighting source it's somewhat of a crap shoot on "auto" with most cameras and they all have their tendencies to shift in one direction or the other under certain conditions.

[BBd00d]

I'm predicting they release a motion version of the keyOne Black edition, where they give it a kicka$$ camera and charge $100 more...no other spec bump though

Posted via CB10

[Bbnivende]

Depends if they have an Alcatel phone they can sister with.

[mrsimon]

Simple...more screen. With the Motion, you get more screen than the KEYone with the same internals. And it's a BlackBerry. The camera is fair...nothing to write home about. If you have to have a really good camera, then the Motion isn't for you.

Except when u r typing.